The Abdelkader hate

[Buppy 1,720]

Honestly, who 'hates' Abby? Pretty much every player will have one or two guys that want to get rid of them, but I haven't noticed any particular dissatisfaction on the boards regarding him; no prevailing sentiment toward trading him or benching him...

I think a thread like this is inviting negative comments about him by comparing him to Helm. I don't think that means anyone dislikes him. Yeah, everyone loves Helm, probably more than he really deserves. He's exciting and his speed has an impact almost every shift. Abby just isn't very exciting. He'll get an occasional point, or fight, or big hit... nothing to get too excited about.

I think the sentiment regarding Abby is what it should be for a 4th-liner. He's there, he does his job, yay...but I'm not buying his jersey. Helm is exciting, Miller is having a career year (albeit, that's not a very high standard for him), so they earn some praise. Miller started the season expecting to rotate with Eaves and Homer. Playing on the 4th line while Abby played with Helm and Bert, then Helm and Hudler, then Helm and Cleary. Miller and Cleary while Helm was out. Miller moved ahead of Abby based on his play. He's been better than Abby so far. But I don't think anyone is saying that Abby has been bad. Indifference isn't hate.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

The good news with the penalties Abdelkader took last playoffs is that they are typically easily avoidable and rarely the norm. He's obviously done nowhere near that this year.

Nothing wrong with him. Wish we could see more offensive numbers from him but 6 goals on a 3rd/4th line role isn't bad at present. Works hard and busts his rear end every game, is one of the more phyiscal Wings, drops the gloves every now and then when necessary.

[jollymania 162]

How is Helm a far better hitter? I cannot recall many big hits he has thrown since becoming an NHL regular. He was a big hitter as a call-up years ago, but he is not anymore. Despite his injury, Helm has more minutes on ice than Abby and still is 30+ hits behind. Abby has had many big hits this year, Helm has not.

Further, other than speed, how exactly is Helm a better all around player? See that stats Newfy posted. Helm is very noticeable because of his speed, but how does that make him an 'all around better player' if that speed doesn't translate to the other areas of his play?

Abby has spent much of the year on the fourth line with Emmerton and Homer, while Helm has played much of the year with Cleary. Cleary has regularly produced 40 points, while Homer and Emmerton aren't nearly as relevant offensively 5v5.

IMO this post is evident of the general feeling about Abby. He has more hits/min than anyone on the team, he has as many or more points/min as Helm, he has a better FO percentage than Helm, he fights, and he has a better plus-minus than Helm. I'm not saying he's better, but how exactly is Helm at another level, outside of speed, if he isn't on another level with regards to any stat outside of minutes/game?

for one he koed Martinek for a year with a big hit this year and has had several others. Abdelkader has had a few nice hits most most of his hits are just rub outs. Helm is a better puck handler and better at ragging the puck, he is tougher in the corners. He should be scoring more but I feel like he is snake bitten.

Abdelkader doesn't fill his role as good as he could, if he started to fight regularly and destroy someone night in and night out then people would accept him more, he isn't playing to his potential.

See thats not right though. I gotta agree with workingovertime here, youre just proving that theres no real seasoning behind it. Hes definitely not a far better hitter, Abdelkader is much more consistent physically and also a heavier hitter. Helm is no slouch physically but Abdelkader throws harder hits and throws them more often.

Helm has speed for sure and is a great PKer, but Abdelkader isnt far behind on the PK and I would say is better defensively 5 on 5 for sure. He is always back helping out the D. He was also made the second line center in the playoffs last year to shut down Doan against the Yotes and he did a great job.

Has Miller been that much more clutch? Hes scored some goals this year sure, but he has a total of 4 more points while playing on the third line with Cleary. Miller has been pretty invisible when the playoffs role around but somehow he has the "clutch" factor on Abdelkader lol.. Youre just proving how there is no basis in the Abdelkader hate.

GMR: I can agree with that sentiment of yours as well. But I would say if this team is lacking in toughness why would you want to get rid of Abdelkader? Instead why wouldnt you just bring in another version of Abdelkader and play them together?

nobody hates him, my rational or 'basis' was that people expect more which is absolutely correct, he should be like ott but clearly isn't. Helm is a better hitter, I would like to think you know i pay more attention to these things.

Miller hasn't been as good in the past as he is this year so you can't really use his playoff performances in his current play.

[Z and D for the C 712]

Abdelkader hasn't played as well has he could be, but out of Helm, Miller, Abdelkader and Eaves, I think he has the highest offensive potential. Because of that, Abdelkader would be the last I let go of him, Miller and Eaves. I think he'll break out a little in the next few seasons.

[WorkingOvertime 536]

for one he koed Martinek for a year with a big hit this year and has had several others. Abdelkader has had a few nice hits most most of his hits are just rub outs. Helm is a better puck handler and better at ragging the puck, he is tougher in the corners. He should be scoring more but I feel like he is snake bitten.

Abdelkader doesn't fill his role as good as he could, if he started to fight regularly and destroy someone night in and night out then people would accept him more, he isn't playing to his potential.

nobody hates him, my rational or 'basis' was that people expect more which is absolutely correct, he should be like ott but clearly isn't. Helm is a better hitter, I would like to think you know i pay more attention to these things.

Miller hasn't been as good in the past as he is this year so you can't really use his playoff performances in his current play.

The hit you are referring to is at 40sec in this video. It is a big hit, but it is no bigger than Abby's hit on Hall. Further, it looks like Helm's shoulder hits Martinek's head. That is why he was injured. What other hits are you referring to? Abby certainly has more than one big hit on the season.

If you take speed out of the equation, I would disagree that Helm is a better puck handler. Helm keeps the puck because he uses his speed to avoid defenders. Helm has more giveaways than Abby throughout the season. Helm isn't a great puck handler, and he smartly uses his speed to avoid defenders.

Why does Abby need to fight and hit more and not Helm? They are similar statistically, except for blocked shots and hits- which Abby has substantially more. I don't expect either to fight, just to stick up for themselves and their teammates. Why use the fact that Abby fights and Helm doesn't as a negative against Abby? Again, I don't have a problem with Helm not fighting, but I don't see why fighting is a negative to Abby.

It seems that you judge Abby on the player you want him to be. Why not judge him on the player that he is?

Abdelkader hasn't played as well has he could be, but out of Helm, Miller, Abdelkader and Eaves, I think he has the highest offensive potential. Because of that, Abdelkader would be the last I let go of him, Miller and Eaves. I think he'll break out a little in the next few seasons.

I think Abby's offensive potential is largely dependent on his line-mates. He doesn't have the hands or speed to create plays himself, but he has a well rounded 'supporting' skill-set. I see his potential to be like Cleary. He doesn't do many things exceptionally well, but he is solid overall.

[saven 48]

I think it's cause people think he's a secret Muslim . His last name is really abdul Qadir and people just can't let that go. Lol.

[RedTydes 5]

Abby took some bad penalties in the series against San Jose last year, other than that, I've enjoyed watching him develop from a Spartan to a Wing.

[jollymania 162]

The hit you are referring to is at 40sec in this video. It is a big hit, but it is no bigger than Abby's hit on Hall. Further, it looks like Helm's shoulder hits Martinek's head. That is why he was injured. What other hits are you referring to? Abby certainly has more than one big hit on the season.

If you take speed out of the equation, I would disagree that Helm is a better puck handler. Helm keeps the puck because he uses his speed to avoid defenders. Helm has more giveaways than Abby throughout the season. Helm isn't a great puck handler, and he smartly uses his speed to avoid defenders.

Why does Abby need to fight and hit more and not Helm? They are similar statistically, except for blocked shots and hits- which Abby has substantially more. I don't expect either to fight, just to stick up for themselves and their teammates. Why use the fact that Abby fights and Helm doesn't as a negative against Abby? Again, I don't have a problem with Helm not fighting, but I don't see why fighting is a negative to Abby.

It seems that you judge Abby on the player you want him to be. Why not judge him on the player that he is?

I think Abby's offensive potential is largely dependent on his line-mates. He doesn't have the hands or speed to create plays himself, but he has a well rounded 'supporting' skill-set. I see his potential to be like Cleary. He doesn't do many things exceptionally well, but he is solid overall.

that helm hit was better than the hit on hall, helm has alot of turnovers after ragging the puck on the pk then just giving it up.

Abdelkader is clearly a fighter and agitator, and helm is clearly not, 2 different players, 1 meeting his potential greater than the other.

and my count is around 13 big hits from helm this year, only around 7 for abs

I am judging him for what he is, a poor man's ott, I would take Helm over that any day.

Edited February 12, 2012 by jollymania

[WorkingOvertime 536]

that helm hit was better than the hit on hall, helm has alot of turnovers after ragging the puck on the pk then just giving it up.

Abdelkader is clearly a fighter and agitator, and helm is clearly not, 2 different players, 1 meeting his potential greater than the other.

and my count is around 13 big hits from helm this year, only around 7 for abs

I am judging him for what he is, a poor man's ott, I would take Helm over that any day.

What count is this? Please let me know which hits are worthy of this count from each player.

Abby is not a fighter or an agitator. He does not run his mouth and he does not often look for fights. He also does not goad other players into penalties with fake glove drops, cheap tricks, etc. This is what I mean by judging Abby by his play, not by comparing him to other players. As I said, why have Abby fighting as a negative for him, when you're comparing him to players that don't/won't fight?

I'm not saying Abby is better than Helm- I just use their statistics to show that Abby, despite less ice time, has performed as well or better than Helm this season on paper. Helm is exciting and noticeable because of his speed, but Abby is producing just as well (with more hits and more blocked shots) playing a solid defensively minded game.

[jollymania 162]

What count is this? Please let me know which hits are worthy of this count from each player.

Abby is not a fighter or an agitator. He does not run his mouth and he does not often look for fights. He also does not goad other players into penalties with fake glove drops, cheap tricks, etc. This is what I mean by judging Abby by his play, not by comparing him to other players. As I said, why have Abby fighting as a negative for him, when you're comparing him to players that don't/won't fight?

I'm not saying Abby is better than Helm- I just use their statistics to show that Abby, despite less ice time, has performed as well or better than Helm this season on paper. Helm is exciting and noticeable because of his speed, but Abby is producing just as well (with more hits and more blocked shots) playing a solid defensively minded game.

The count of how many big hits from each that I have observed. Pretty simple, i am not the bible but like I stated earlier I pay far more attention than most. The ones that are bigger than the average check ie the hits on hall or martinek.

Abby is a ton like Ott, they are supposed to be energy players that can chip in some points. Obviously Ott is more talented and a better hitter/agitator, but Abby could be more involved in the game like Ott. And abdelkader draws penalties with his antics whether you want to believe it or not.

And like I said it seems like Helm is just snakebit, his offensive numbers should be way better than what they are at. HE creates a lot of great scoring chances.