74 replies to this topic

[bob]

While I confess to having watched a streamed game or two after losing the battle for control of the family TV, I don't "blame" the NHL for anything in the C&D letter. Let's not kid ourselves, unauthorized streaming of copyrighted programming is blatantly illegal. It doesn't matter if it's "for profit" or done as a service for fellow fans. I'm sorry that you no doubt had the daylights scared out of you when you opened the letter, but could you really not see this coming? You registered a domain that screams "Hey, free illegal streaming of Red Wings games over here!!!!" I mean, dude......!

It's also not a Crosby-lovin'-Bettman thing. Show me one major sporting body that doesn't defend their broadcasts in such a manner.

Actually, it does. Copyright infringement for profit is a criminal issue; copyright infringement not-for-profit is traditionally a civil issue. This is an important distinction because the OP wouldn't get arrested, he would get sued.

[wingslogo19]

Thank you so much for doing this as long as you did. I watched many games on this feed Good luck with your little one an again thank you

[Red Wings Addict]

At least we still have drumnj.

For now. I hope his site survives.

Is it because of all this SOPA and PIPA and FIFA business?

[Jeff6851]

For now. I hope his site survives.

Is it because of all this SOPA and PIPA and FIFA business?

No, it's been illegal to stream games forever

[Gizmo]

Oh, you're a creator of copyrighted material? Good thing you don't let personal bias effect your opinions and decision making.

We all often "read things" based on our personal perspectives (or "bias", if you will) and I already said that I interpreted the comment as someone that's been accused of being the person dumping the turd in the copyright punch bowl in the past.

That's my point or did I take your unnecessary insults out of context?

Rick, you're free to feel whatever you want... Saying something wasn't a good idea isn't equated with calling it "stupid" and not seeing something coming can also be due to naivety which, again, isn't a form of stupidity.

[Gizmo]

Actually, it does. Copyright infringement for profit is a criminal issue; copyright infringement not-for-profit is traditionally a civil issue. This is an important distinction because the OP wouldn't get arrested, he would get sued.

It doesn't make a difference in terms of the actions being illegal. Either way it's a violation of copyright law. The only difference is the venue of redress available to the copyright holder: criminal vs. civil complaint. The reason I mentioned this is that "It's OK to give out copies as long as I don't make money off of it" seems to be the single largest copyright myth on the Internet.

[rrasco]

The reason I mentioned this is that "It's OK to give out copies as long as I don't make money off of it" seems to be the single largest copyright myth on the Internet.

Try telling that to a professor!

[vladdy16]

While I see the reason why this thread has taken this turn, it's still not quite the place for this discussion. Please debate the legalities in PD. Thanks.

[S.H.M.B.]

I was in the same boat as some others, the 'other' stream stopped working for me, and I enjoyed yours ever since. Thanks to both of you, your hard work and sticking your necks on the line for us was appreciated.

[AusWing40]

Thanks a lot for providing the streams. Living in Australia I only ever get NBCSN games and 2-3 a week at best, so I was regularly using your site and really appreciated it while it lasted.

[ami]

nhl ® is doing poor job providing viewers with best options. that's why there are 'pirating'.
and worse, nhl will NOT learn, they have pretty dumb lawyer running the organization and first they will ban, sue, put in jail, and then they have no incentives to make it better for fans...

well, i don know if it has been posted, if yes sorry, here is what other thinks about nhl's poor job: http://sports.yahoo....-145003578.html

[korrowan]

I don't know why you got hit with a lot of negative reviews for something that is just so obvious. I for one also thank the OP for his efforts. At the same time, I have to agree with you. This kind of thing wasn't going to last forever. The NHL is a big business, and every major sport out there is looking to squash these free streaming sites. Its a shame when it happens, because all they are doing is making this content available to those of us who don't have cable TV or don't have access to the game. At the same time, we shouldn't be surprised.

Thanks again for your efforts! It was good while it lasted.

The thing is if someone can watch a stream they can toss down the 170 bucks a year to watch all the games via the NHLs stream. 82 games for 170 bucks is pretty darn good if you ask me.

Edited by korrowan, 20 February 2012 - 06:51 PM.

[WorkingOvertime]

The thing is if someone can watch a stream they can toss down the 170 bucks a year to watch all the games via the NHLs stream. 82 games for 170 bucks is pretty darn good if you ask me.

If I had GameCenter Live I wouldn't get close to 82 regular season Wings games a year. Without cable, I wouldn't be able to watch any of the CBJ-Wings games or any of the games on NBCSN. IMO the NHL would gain a lot of subscribers if the blackout restrictions were lifted- how many people would choose to watch via the internet over cable for those games?

This problem is furthered during the playoffs, when most games after the first round are on national tv.

I don't mind paying the NHL for full access to Wings games. Unfortunately, the NHL does not provide that option for users without cable.

[MulesWillFly93]

Thank you! It came in handy for those times when Ducks games are blacked out on Center Ice yet not shown on local TV, or when I'm away from home. Bummer it has to stop, but we understand.

[korrowan]

If I had GameCenter Live I wouldn't get close to 82 regular season Wings games a year. Without cable, I wouldn't be able to watch any of the CBJ-Wings games or any of the games on NBCSN. IMO the NHL would gain a lot of subscribers if the blackout restrictions were lifted- how many people would choose to watch via the internet over cable for those games?

This problem is furthered during the playoffs, when most games after the first round are on national tv.

I don't mind paying the NHL for full access to Wings games. Unfortunately, the NHL does not provide that option for users without cable.

You can watch them 2 days later.

[WorkingOvertime]

You can watch them 2 days later.

As someone who watches 75+ games a season live, that is not a compelling option.

My complaint is that I am required to spend $800+ a year between cable fees (NBCSN requires the additional fee of a box and another teir) and GameCenter fees to see every Wings live. For that price, I can afford to see every CBJ home game in person. As someone without cable, it is not merely a $200 fee to see every game (that would be an easily acceptable price for me). I don't mind the $200 fee, it is the additional $500+ fee for cable that I don't agree with.

For that reason, I thank the OP for his service and I certainly understand the stop of the stream.

[Barrie]

That sucks, but I understand where the NHL is coming from and that you don't want trouble from them.

I only used your site once, and it was for the record setting home win. I appreciated it!

[wingfanatic4alltime]

Like so many of you im very thankful to freeredwings.tv. My girlfriend isnt a big sports fan so the site came of use to me I watched the wings on my computer and she could watch what she wanted on tv. Now im assuming we have to alternate lol.

[frwtv]

I would have loved to continue providing the service, but you can thank the NHL for ruining the party.

To everybody who is curious about the intent of this sentence:

I am definitely not oblivious to the copyright laws and this isn't the first cease and desist letter I have received - not even the first from the NHL. I knew about the SOPA and PIPA resolutions months before they ever got to be big news and protested across the web. I knew before I started the site that it was both illegal / unauthorized copyright infringement and its days were numbered. I streamed nearly all of last season's games on a daily basis on a private justin.tv stream that I passworded and provided to about 100 fans. I have recorded games and uploaded them to torrent sites.

I was not "blaming" the NHL like I was a victim or upset or anything like that. My intent for the comment was directed at any viewers of the site who might get upset. If they want somebody to be upset at, don't look at me. I don't blame the NHL for protecting their copyrighted works , but I also don't always trust everybody on the internet to think rationally. Just trying to avoid people getting upset at me, that's all.

I hope everybody that used my site is able to find alternative streams for Red Wings games. With a little searching, they're not difficult to find

[drumnj]

on a private justin.tv stream that I passworded and provided to about 100 fans.

uploaded them to torrent sites.

Hmm I might know who you are, more than I thought.

So....will you be selling one of your Blackmagics?


Holy s***, I just got your email....I can't believe I didn't figure it out sooner who you were. Damn dude, you should of said something when you started. Again good luck to ya, it's always good to walk away before things take a turn for the worst. You should add me to google chat or something, to keep in touch.

Edited by drumnj, 21 February 2012 - 12:33 AM.