319 replies to this topic

[Aussie_Wing]

I like this deal.

Sure a 1st is steep, but Quincey is young, and will re-sign so we'll get money's worth eventually.

I will be VERY upset if Kindl is moved though, especially given how good he looked last night.

[Firsov]

Kindl shouldn't be traded at all. He has needed at least 3 years at every level to develop properly (getting better pointwise and his +/- stats), so the Wings shouldn't let him go before evaluating his real worth next year. Unless they want to trade for him in about two years time

http://www.hockeydb....y.php?pid=71295

[Wing Across The Pond]

I have a sneaking suspicion we might move Brad Stuart. He's been great, but he's an unrestricted free agent after this year and I've heard his wife has basically told him he has to sign with a West Coast team. Might as well get something for his value before we lose him. Perhaps Stuart and someone else in a deal for Selanne?

I'd like to get a cup for his worth. Might be set up to trade him, but just let him go in the summer and take a shot at someone else, thank him for his time with a second cup.

And whilst a lot of people are saying a 1st is far too steep, it's not really a 1st... More like a 2nd + a finders fee for Yzerman. He's obviously a smooth negotiator. I'm sure the draft pick had a lot to do with Yzerman wanted the highest possible pick, considering he didn't really have to help out. He saw an opportunity and took it.

Sorry didn't click the quote, but someone also said to trade Stuart in the off-season, which (if I'm not mistaken) cannot happen. Hence 'trade deadline'. Either trade him before the deadline or he goes out of contract. Far as I know there is no opportunity to trade him after the season.

[Majsheppard]

giving him away for nothing was the stupidest move ever....

also if their is a lockout next year that first round pick could turn out to be first overall...

uhhh no. The following year it would be the year where there would be a lotto... and there will not be another lockout. The league is running really smoothly.

[EastonWings]

Kindl shouldn't be traded at all. He has needed at least 3 years at every level to develop properly (getting better pointwise and his +/- stats), so the Wings shouldn't let him go before evaluating his real worth next year. Unless they want to trade for him in about two years time
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=71295

[Majsheppard]

There's always that chance, but Kindl at least has gotten almost 100 games on the Wings for them to evaluate him. Quincey got what less than 30? Kindl should be much more of a known quantity.

I had forgotten because he hasn't been here in a few seasons, but even if Kindl turns out to be as good of a player, Quincey is only a year older than Kindl.

Plus we haven't gotten rid of Kindl yet or anything, though it seems unlikely he'll play much now.

Two things about this...

13 games for Quincey were in the playoffs.

Other thing... we eventually have to move a player... we have 24 players on the roster and we can only have 23 total... I am guessing Pavel is on IR now... otherwise we would be in violation of the limit. We have to expose someone to waivers or move a player off the roster... This is what makes me so very angry. This could cost us Kindl, or Mursak, or Emmerton, or whatever.

What if they waive Commodore? I mean what then? the whole point was to get depth at d and we end up with an offensive d man instead of a defensive one? Shrugs. I fear we will regret this even more when it ends up that we lost another player on top of the first round pick...

[EastonWings]

Exactly. Kindl has a huge upside. He needs tp develope. The wings made that mistake a couple years ago in quincy. Fans need to relax. Holland made a great deal. Our first rounder was gonna be a late anywAys. The draft class this year is really poor and in the wings system most guys drafted dont make our club for four tp five years anyways. Holland made this deal cause the defensman he targeted were traded. Thank god we didn't trade for kubIna who's old.

[Majsheppard]

I don't get how people don't like this trade. We got a player we can win now with over a pick who may not even play, and of it does, it won't be for another 4 years. Kindl and Tatar for a top six winger and then we win the cup with ease. Throw in a mid level prospect and pick for a gritty third liner and things gett hat much easier.

Okay the level of stupidity in this thread is reaching epic proportions.

Quincey doesn't make us a shoe in, nor does a trade for a top six winger. It matters WHO YOU GET. Not just that you get someone.

Moving Kindl and Tatar for a top six winger... okay WHO?!?!?!

There is no one that is worth a price that high. Morrow? No. Semin? No. Nash? Wouldn't do it. Selanne? That would be over payment.

Then a third liner?!?!?!?

DO YOU REALIZE YOU ARE SUGGESTING MOVING NO LESS THAN THREE PEOPLE OFF OF THIS TEAM?!?!?! WHO WOULD YOU MOVE? KINDL, EMMERTON, MURSAK, CLEARY, HELM, ABS, MILLER?!?!?!?!? WHO?!?!?! DO YOU NOT GET THAT THERE ARE CHEMISTRY ISSUES?!?!?!?!?!

OKAY HOW MANY TIMES DOES IT HAVE TO BE SAID BEFORE PEOPLE READ IT!!! WE ARE GOING TO LOSE VALUABLE PIECES DUE TO THIS OR ANY OTHER ADDITION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

we already are at 24 players, and that means someone has to go. This is a horrible trade because it affirms itself.

IT DOES THIS BY US SAYING A PLAYER COULD END UP BEING WORTH MORE THAN WE THOUGHT, SO WE WILL OVERPAY TO GET THEM BACK AND IN THE PROCESS WE MIGHT UNDERVALUE SOMEONE ELSE AND LET THEM GO!!!!!!!!

I FEEL LIKE I AM GOING MAD HERE SAYING THIS OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND GETTING ONLY SHORT SIDED RESPONSES THAT ALSO INCLUDE STATEMENTS THAT ARE JUST ABSURD!

I don't get how we can talk about someone who slipped through our fingers becoming solid enough for us to spend a high pick on them, while also talking about moving young players like we are 100% sure they won't become more. IT IS A FALLACY AND A HYPOCRITICAL JOKE FOR US TO TALK THIS WAY!!!!

Why can't anyone see this?!?!?!?!?!

This kind of irrational behavior seems borderline psychotic.



Just remind me of this thread if we waive Mursak, Kindl, or Emmerton and they end up being really effing good for someone else, that this trade in essence included giving them up.


sigh end rant/

[wingfan1991]

You're worried about losing Emmerton? Have you seem him play? He's going nowhere and we are going nowhere with him as 4th line center... We need some grit there.

[GoalieManPat]

Im ok with this trade. Its not a blockbuster by any means but nobody can deny the the Wings are better today than they were yesterday. In the end thats all that matters when your aiming for a Cup in the near future instead of rebuilding. Im just glad this deal was done early. Had this been deadline day the price probably would have been a 1st and 2nd.

[xtrememachine1]

I like this trade and don't like it at the same time. When Quincey was here as a rookie, he was thrown into the playoff fire and actually did well. He didn't rack up points, but he did a lot of little things right. He was solid and you didn't notice him (unless you were looking for him) when he was out there, which is good for a defenseman. I always felt, even then, that letting him go was a mistake. Maybe I'm way off base here, but I expect him to be like another Ian White. Good skater, good puck mover, good shot from the point, solid defensively.

What I don't like is that we gave up a 1st round pick to get him. I'm okay with trading 1st round picks, but I was hoping to package up our 1st round pick to get someone a little more established or a bigger impact player. Quincey is good, but he'll be a 5th or 6th defenseman this year.

Maybe this can be our new thing, make a trade with Stevie Y and win a Cup. Here's hoping.

[F.Michael]

He couldn't even beat out Chelios

With Chelios it was loyalty (even though he wasn't playing that much)...IMO it was Holland who preferred keeping Meech over Quincey.

[Tim.D]

Heard he'll play right side D, which he's been able to do.

[Nightfall]

I don't get how we can talk about someone who slipped through our fingers becoming solid enough for us to spend a high pick on them, while also talking about moving young players like we are 100% sure they won't become more. IT IS A FALLACY AND A HYPOCRITICAL JOKE FOR US TO TALK THIS WAY!!!!

Why can't anyone see this?!?!?!?!?!

Once again, its very easy to look in hindsight and see that it was a mistake.

Ken Holland even said it was a mistake to have let him go. Nevertheless, Detroit had a decision to make back then and they took the best defenseman at the time that they thought was going to have the best upside. No team was going to make a deal with Detroit because they all knew that the Wings were going to have to release someone and expose them to waivers. It was just a matter of time, so why deal with a team that is going to have to make that choice? Every team is going to get a shot at claiming the player anyway, and no team thought it was worth dealing for one of the players either. Los Angeles

Sure, its a fallacy and hypocritical to say things like that. At the same time, no one can tell the future. Not even you. If you can predict how players are going to do, maybe you should put your resume in with the Wings?

Its not that more people don't see your point, but you are making all these calls based on what has happened and trying to look like a prophet.

Edited by Nightfall, 22 February 2012 - 08:24 AM.

[VM1138]

This puts the Wings in an interesting spot. I just read an article where it says Commodore is likely to be waived. What are the chances he gets claimed? I feel he's played well for the Wings and adds a role we don't really have. I realize they don't want to just dump Kindl, but I'd hate to lose Commodore with the playoffs coming up.

[uk_redwing]

This puts the Wings in an interesting spot. I just read an article where it says Commodore is likely to be waived. What are the chances he gets claimed? I feel he's played well for the Wings and adds a role we don't really have. I realize they don't want to just dump Kindl, but I'd hate to lose Commodore with the playoffs coming up.

Not sure what exactly Kindl's done that Commodore hasn't anyway. Commodore's been steady, physical and always had a positive effect on Ericsson's performances as well. Win win situation surely?

Obviously not. Don't think the issue with Commodore has anything to do with hockey. One of those things.

[haroldsnepsts]

With Chelios it was loyalty (even though he wasn't playing that much)...IMO it was Holland who preferred keeping Meech over Quincey.

Exactly.

If memory serves, it was bringing back Chelios for another year that forced the Wings into making this premature decision with Quincey and Meech. And Chelios ended up not playing much that season anyway. He stuck around a year too long.

Not sure what exactly Kindl's done that Commodore hasn't anyway. Commodore's been steady, physical and always had a positive effect on Ericsson's performances as well. Win win situation surely?

Obviously not. Don't think the issue with Commodore has anything to do with hockey. One of those things.

He's a little more offensively talented but pretty much nothing. Other than the hope that his game is still improving.

Every game I've seen Commie play he's done exactly what you'd expect him to do. Be a physical bottom pairing guy who plays a fairly simple defensive game.

[GoalieManPat]

He's a little more offensively talented but pretty much nothing. Other than the hope that his game is still improving.

I agree with you that Kindl is a bit better offensively but hes also a lot more prone to turnovers. For the third pairing give me the safe defensive guy every time over someone who might get 10 points or so more a season. Kindl's time is definitely limited with the Wings unless he does a complete 180 in how hes played recently. With how Smith has been progressing if Kindl is not traded at the deadline or off-season he probably loses his spot to Smith coming out of camp or sometime next year. I dont think they are going to let Smith "overripe" like they do with most prospects. I can see them pulling him up early to at-least get one years tutoring with Lidstrom should he come back next year.

[dat's sick]

There is a comical overestimation of the value of a Detroit Red Wings 1st round pick in this thread.

It's not like other teams GMs go blind at the sound of someone saying "1st round pick". They know Detroit will finish top 3 in the league and the pick will basically be a 2nd.

It has very little value. No one will line up to give us their best player for a pick in the 25-30th range.

Holland usually trades away our 1st anyway, and usually only for other, later, picks. Quincey is a good return. Hell, he's an upgrade over Kindl who IS a 1st round pick.

[Nev]

Okay the level of stupidity in this thread is reaching epic proportions.

Moving Kindl and Tatar for a top six winger... okay WHO?!?!?!

There is no one that is worth a price that high. Morrow? No. Semin? No. Nash? Wouldn't do it. Selanne? That would be over payment.

If you wouldn't trade Kindl and Tatar for Nash, then you my friend are the one with stupidity of epic proportions. Kindl is a borderline NHLer who isn't going to get any better, and has continued to display all the faults that he had in the AHL. Tatar is a prospect who may or may not turn out to be a top-6 winger.

You talk like this team is perfect and cannot be improved - you really think we can't do better than the likes of Kindl and Emmerton?