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What's Kenny Holland's Offseason Plan?


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#481 FlashyG

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 10:39 AM

Datsyuk and Zetterberg's games also transferred well to the NHL based on skill set alone.



Thats not what people said before Datsyuk came over to North America. His best season in his days back home was 26 pts and he was a long shot to make the team. Maybe Jarnkrok and Pulkkinen will take their game to another level next year. All I'm saying is wait until these guys move over to North America before you judge them.

I'll shy away from comparing those two to Jarnkrok and Pulkkinen. And by come out of nowhere I was referring to draft position. 6th and 7th rounders who surprised everyone. We don't have that now. We know what the majority of our prospects have to offer. Like I said, I'm not saying every prospect we have is bad or anything. But most of them are average with a ceiling that we have a pretty good idea of already because we've seen what they can do in the minors for years and knowing that numbers drop even lower once you get to the highest of the high in terms of leagues (the NHL), it's pretty plain to see that there aren't any Datsyuk's or Zetterbergs to be had. And it's not surprising.. Those are rare.. rare players to be had. We've been blessed to have guys like that but eventually they were going to get old and lose production.. That's the cycle of life in the NHL and in all pro sports.. Save maybe for MLB where it's a money based league IMO. It's just time I think. It will do us good to rebuild in a few years.



I agree superstars are rare, especially when you don't get to pick in the top 20 picks but how can you tell that none of those guys I mentioned wont turn into superstars? Unless you're talking about different prospects than me, none of them have played a single game in the minors. They are playing in Junior or in Europe and all of them are putting up better numbers than Datsyuk did in his development. I'm not saying these guys will become better than or even as good as Datsyuk but the potential is there.

Oh.. and I followed the link to the poll I saw Chicago and Detroit. Then I saw Montreal and Toronto and I laughed and clicked the red 'x' lol.


So you disregard the opinion of even NHLers when you don't agree with it? Its not like CBC made up the results, that's the opinion of the players




#482 xtrememachine1

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 11:26 AM

Oh.. and I followed the link to the poll I saw Chicago and Detroit. Then I saw Montreal and Toronto and I laughed and clicked the red 'x' lol. But yes, Parise has said he admires the organization and all that. He's also said it about Minnesota and NJ.. It's all talk. In the end it means very little, if anything.


All this talk about teams prospects came up because you said "I don't see why either one would sign with the wings", yet here is a poll done by the players this past year where the 2nd most desired place to play is Detroit and you disregard it. Whatever the players reasons may be, actual NHL players said they would like to play in Detroit. The consensus among the players seem to think Detroit is still a good destination to play and have a chance to win the Stanley Cup and they're right. We still have Datsyuk and Zetterberg in their primes, a good, young, up and coming goaltender, possibly the greatest defenseman of all time, strong ownership, good coaching, smart front office, great scouting and a long history of winning.

#483 centcougar07

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 01:26 PM

All this talk about teams prospects came up because you said "I don't see why either one would sign with the wings", yet here is a poll done by the players this past year where the 2nd most desired place to play is Detroit and you disregard it. Whatever the players reasons may be, actual NHL players said they would like to play in Detroit. The consensus among the players seem to think Detroit is still a good destination to play and have a chance to win the Stanley Cup and they're right. We still have Datsyuk and Zetterberg in their primes, a good, young, up and coming goaltender, possibly the greatest defenseman of all time, strong ownership, good coaching, smart front office, great scouting and a long history of winning.


Yeah and it was only 13 percent of all players. That's all well and good, and of course Detroit is a good destination.. But it isn't the one and only place. And it looks like a lot of those votes are based on history alone which is why Toronto and Montreal made the list I assume because they are terrible right now. History and tradition are great things to have but when you're not winning and you're franchise clearly is not built for the future.. You're going to have a tough time attracting top guys who can go anywhere they want. Especially if they get offered more money there.

You can have your head in the clouds about all these prospects and think that UFA's are destined to come here all you want but it's going to be a cold slap in the face this summer when none of it materializes.

Edited by centcougar07, 04 May 2012 - 02:46 PM.


#484 Crymson

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 05:25 PM

Yeah and it was only 13 percent of all players. That's all well and good, and of course Detroit is a good destination.. But it isn't the one and only place. And it looks like a lot of those votes are based on history alone which is why Toronto and Montreal made the list I assume because they are terrible right now. History and tradition are great things to have but when you're not winning and you're franchise clearly is not built for the future.. You're going to have a tough time attracting top guys who can go anywhere they want. Especially if they get offered more money there.

You can have your head in the clouds about all these prospects and think that UFA's are destined to come here all you want but it's going to be a cold slap in the face this summer when none of it materializes.


Thank goodness we've got you around to protect us from our own hopes.

#485 Dabura

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 05:43 PM

Parise
Penner
Prust
Konopka
Wideman

Do-able, $$$-wise? (Too lazy to do the math myself. Apologies.)

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#486 MabusIncarnate

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 05:53 PM

Parise
Penner
Prust
Konopka
Wideman

Do-able, $$$-wise? (Too lazy to do the math myself. Apologies.)


A big :thumbup: for Parise, Prust, Wideman.

Penner doesn't interest me much, and Konopka is just a flat out goon who will put us on the PK more than we'd like. I like the idea of Prust because he will put up a decent amount of points on top of grinding, hitting, and fighting. Konopka offers no scoring depth whatsoever, he might get lucky with a small handful of assists but that's about it. I'm more into guys like Prust, Neil, Clutterbuck who can contribute offensively on top of being rough and intimidating.

Hartnell, Backes or Marchand would be ideal adds if it were even a possibility, which it isn't.

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#487 Dabura

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 06:15 PM

A big :thumbup: for Parise, Prust, Wideman.

Penner doesn't interest me much, and Konopka is just a flat out goon who will put us on the PK more than we'd like. I like the idea of Prust because he will put up a decent amount of points on top of grinding, hitting, and fighting. Konopka offers no scoring depth whatsoever, he might get lucky with a small handful of assists but that's about it. I'm more into guys like Prust, Neil, Clutterbuck who can contribute offensively on top of being rough and intimidating.

Hartnell, Backes or Marchand would be ideal adds if it were even a possibility, which it isn't.


I'm not so keen on Penner myself, but...6'4, doesn't adequately utilize his frame, underachiever - though was once a force...the prototypical Detroit Red Wings power-forward. Point being, I can see Holland signing him. (To be fair, it's hard to argue with his size. And he does have good hands. And he's having a pretty good run right now.)

I'm not sure why I listed Konopka. Brain fart on my part, honest.

So -

Parise
Penner
Prust
Wideman

I don't see us signing both Parise and Suter. I don't know why so many of us are treating it like a done deal. No GM who isn't named Ken Holland wants to see the Wings pick up this summer's two marquee men. The Universe will not allow it, IMHO.

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#488 Drake_Marcus

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 06:19 PM

A big :thumbup: for Parise, Prust, Wideman.

Penner doesn't interest me much, and Konopka is just a flat out goon who will put us on the PK more than we'd like. I like the idea of Prust because he will put up a decent amount of points on top of grinding, hitting, and fighting. Konopka offers no scoring depth whatsoever, he might get lucky with a small handful of assists but that's about it. I'm more into guys like Prust, Neil, Clutterbuck who can contribute offensively on top of being rough and intimidating.

Hartnell, Backes or Marchand would be ideal adds if it were even a possibility, which it isn't.


Konopka's face-off percentage is top 6 in the entire league during the regular season and top 2 in the playoffs. He'd instantly be our best face-off option.
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#489 Dabura

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 06:23 PM

I think the thing I like about Konopka is, simply, that he's a center. He'd be an upgrade over Emmerton or Abdelkader, IMO. Unless I'm way off in my assessment of him.

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#490 esteef

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 06:37 PM

Konopka punches in the face and I'd want something better than Wideman on D.

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#491 Dabura

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 06:44 PM

Konopka punches in the face and I'd want something better than Wideman on D.

esteef


...Rozsival?

Babs says Holland probably won't be engineering any trades. So, it's Suter - and then a steep drop-off....

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#492 pucktividi

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 06:52 PM

Konopka's a center who hits,fights,skates,wins face-offs(70% vs.Rangers :ph34r: ),plays hard and brings experience.
All that for cca. $1mil.

#493 centcougar07

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 07:05 PM

If NJ beats Philly in this series there might not be any Parise FA sweepstakes as it is. I'm of the belief that they (the Devils) will have a hard time signing him to the kind of contract he will demand and just convincing him to stay there in general when the ownership thing is going down the tubes fast. But certainly getting to the conference finals would make it a little more difficult to leave NJ so quickly. So.. Lets go Philly

#494 Dabura

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 08:39 PM

Howzabout Chris Kelly as our fourth line pivot?

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#495 GMRwings1983

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 08:55 PM

Konopka's a center who hits,fights,skates,wins face-offs(70% vs.Rangers :ph34r: ),plays hard and brings experience.
All that for cca. $1mil.


Meaning we won't get him.

We've had opportunities to get him and others like him before. Holland and company don't like these kinds of players. Whether they can contribute offensively or not, we just don't sign guys like Konopka. It's pretty sad.
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#496 Doc Holliday

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 09:14 PM

Yeah and it was only 13 percent of all players. That's all well and good, and of course Detroit is a good destination.. But it isn't the one and only place. And it looks like a lot of those votes are based on history alone which is why Toronto and Montreal made the list I assume because they are terrible right now. History and tradition are great things to have but when you're not winning and you're franchise clearly is not built for the future.. You're going to have a tough time attracting top guys who can go anywhere they want. Especially if they get offered more money there.

You can have your head in the clouds about all these prospects and think that UFA's are destined to come here all you want but it's going to be a cold slap in the face this summer when none of it materializes.


This is why nobody cant take you seriously. You are making it seem like people wanting to get Suter and/or Parise is them assuming they are going to come here because it is simply Detroit. Nobody believes that.

And last time I checked, the Wings CAN offer more money than anyone else without hurting their roster. They have a lot of room to retool and make themselves better.

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#497 centcougar07

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 10:14 PM

This is why nobody cant take you seriously. You are making it seem like people wanting to get Suter and/or Parise is them assuming they are going to come here because it is simply Detroit. Nobody believes that.

And last time I checked, the Wings CAN offer more money than anyone else without hurting their roster. They have a lot of room to retool and make themselves better.



Clearly you haven't read this and other threads all the way through. There have been several people claiming that Suter and Parise are locks to come here. And even more people who have put up future rosters including the two of them.

The Wings CAN offer AS MUCH as anyone but not more.. There are plenty of teams with 18-20 mil in cap space that will make offers. And my point is that Ken Holland never overpays for players so why would he start now? I know they are going to go hard after Parise and Suter but what happens when other teams offer Parise 8-8.5 Mil? You think Holland will go that high? No chance. Same deal with Suter. The only reason you dislike my opinion is because I don't agree with you and others who think that both of the most sought after FA's in this years class are both going to land here.

Edited by centcougar07, 04 May 2012 - 10:15 PM.


#498 Doc Holliday

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 01:22 AM

Clearly you haven't read this and other threads all the way through. There have been several people claiming that Suter and Parise are locks to come here. And even more people who have put up future rosters including the two of them.


You are way over exaggerating.

The Wings CAN offer AS MUCH as anyone but not more.. There are plenty of teams with 18-20 mil in cap space that will make offers. And my point is that Ken Holland never overpays for players so why would he start now? I know they are going to go hard after Parise and Suter but what happens when other teams offer Parise 8-8.5 Mil? You think Holland will go that high? No chance. Same deal with Suter. The only reason you dislike my opinion is because I don't agree with you and others who think that both of the most sought after FA's in this years class are both going to land here.


Most teams can't spend as much and ice a full roster of players, not to mention stay competitive.

Also, no way Parise and Suter command that much in free agency.

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#499 centcougar07

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 03:01 AM

You are way over exaggerating.



Most teams can't spend as much and ice a full roster of players, not to mention stay competitive.

Also, no way Parise and Suter command that much in free agency.


Perhaps a little. But not as much as you think.

And Parise and Suter may not command that much, but they sure as hell will be offered that much by at least a couple teams IMO. That's what happens when you mix a lot of desperate teams with a thin FA class.

#500 Doc Holliday

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 07:42 AM

Perhaps a little. But not as much as you think.

And Parise and Suter may not command that much, but they sure as hell will be offered that much by at least a couple teams IMO. That's what happens when you mix a lot of desperate teams with a thin FA class.


I sincerely doubt that.

And even if they don't nab those two, they still have cap space to improve the roster in other ways. They are the ideal situation, but it isn't over if either or both of those two come here.

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