40 replies to this topic

[RusDRW]

Same thing happened in 2010 when the Sharks beat the Wings and then bowed out in the Conference Finals in 4 straight games against the Hawks.

didn't they lose last year to Vancouver in 4 games as well after beating us?

We can call it "detroit syndrome"

[sherwood40]

No he is not getting exposed. What we are watching now is a team that REALLY wants to win and get to that next level. The team we all saw from our Wings team, was someone just trying to get ready for a long summer. The Coyotes are showing Detroit the WILL to win. We had loose pucks in front of the net with them, but no one wanted to crash the net. I am rooting for the Coyotes to win because they are working hard in all aspects of the game. They aren't a great team, just a hard working team with a really good Goalie right now.

[joesuffP]

coyotes are taking the middle of the ice in the offensive zone... flippula doesn't play there

[Jasper84]

This!

The series is really taking on a life of its own. In the series against Detroit, Nashville was allowing nothing but perimeter shots and bad angle chances. In this series, Phoenix has been capitalizing on odd man rushes and prime scoring opportunities. I remember this goal for instance....



Can you remember Detroit getting prime chances like this? I really can't.

Now you can blame that on Detroit not being hungry enough, but I look at how hard Nashville played that series. In this series, they appear to be on cruise control while Phoenix is fired up and ready to play.

You're right, I don't remember Detroit getting chances like this. But I think one of the biggest problems is, Phoenix has been shooting high on Rinne. The Wings would shoot from bad angles and always low. Rinne will always stop those low shots.

[haroldsnepsts]

My intent when I started this thread was just to see if anyone else thought that Rinne got way to much credit for the pred's success against us. I know the preds had stiffling defense, and our forwards appeared to be out if gas most of the series. I am just sick of all the credit and hype Rinne gets.

Rinne played very well, but I do think he was getting more credit than he probably deserved. I don't remember him stealing a game or even a period like Quick did for LA in the first game against the Blues.

As I said in another thread, he was leaving some juicy rebounds lying around but the Predators did a great job cleaning it up for him and keeping the Wings out of the area.

[Rhah]

Rinne played very well, but I do think he was getting more credit than he probably deserved. I don't remember him stealing a game or even a period like Quick did for LA in the first game against the Blues.

As I said in another thread, he was leaving some juicy rebounds lying around but the Predators did a great job cleaning it up for him and keeping the Wings out of the area.

What's sad is there were periods that Howard seriously stole the game from Nashville for us... he came up huge stopping several great chances that would have made the series look a LOT more lopsided. Maybe Howard outplayed Rinne

[Manny>Ozzie(by a long shot)]

Just like many young hot goalies of playoffs gone by, Rinne is cursed from winning the cup this year. Maybe the Preds will lose the finals in 7 games :-)

[MabusIncarnate]

You make a really good point here. I remember having those nightmares filled with "Save Giguere, Save Roloson" after pummeling them with 40+ shots to no avail and dropping out in the first round.

There were plenty of instances when one of our guys was in really tight, wide open for a great scoring chance and they pass it just to have it blocked or broken up. So many times in the series against Nashville I thought "Why didn't he shoot it?" It was too much fancy play when in close, too many passes that turned into dead plays, and a lot of shots from the distance.

What we really need is a guy like Hornqvist, someone who plays with the grit of Holmstrom in front of the goalie, an annoyance to screen the opposing tender and give us more opportunities to get some goals. Holmstrom is worn and torn, and a younger replacement who can play on a higher line would benefit this team tremendously and bring our PP back to success.

[dobbles]

the wings definitely made him look good. thats not to say he isnt a very good goalie though.

the yotes have crashed the net better and also had a better transition game. someone mentioned the wings always pulling up on the rush and setting up, i thought that was a great point. in addition to that deficiency, the yotes have also just been better at outlet passes and stretch plays and turnovers on the forecheck to generate chances. i have no idea on the official stats, but it seemed like odd man chances favored the preds like 50-3 in our series. i think the yotes probably have more odd man rushes in 2 games than we did in 5.

[55fan]

Not to say that he's bad or anything like that, because he's a very good goalie, but we made him look better than he is.

He would give up rebound after rebound and the Wings would all stand there and think, "Hey. There's the puck. It would have been really cool if someone would have been standing there to take another shot. Is someone going to get that? No? Oh, we're on defense now? Ok, I'll just skate to the other end. Unless my shift is over..."

[SouthernWingsFan]

You are probably right, but I would like to point out that the reason Zetterberg takes those weak backhanders is to set up plays and second chance opportunities. The problem is, we had no one on that line to take advantage of it.

Pretty much it. Sometimes getting it on net as quick as possible or with a 100 mph slapshot with barely any traffic isn't always the best thing. Heck, the only goal in the final game in Nashville came off what wasn't the hardest of shots/passes, it got banged in because people eventually were able to get to the net.

Rinne is one of the best goaltenders in the league at present, but I don't know of any goalie, good or average, that loves traffic or possibility for defelected pucks. So that's the standard usual talk of getting traffic/screens in front of the net. Ian White's goal to open up game 2, Emmerton provided a moving screen more/less. Stuart's shot/goal off Franzen's leg, traffic in front. Holmstrom's PP goal late in game 1, traffic in front/driving the net. You get the drill.

[joshy207]

Pretty much it. Sometimes getting it on net as quick as possible or with a 100 mph slapshot with barely any traffic isn't always the best thing. Heck, the only goal in the final game in Nashville came off what wasn't the hardest of shots/passes, it got banged in because people eventually were able to get to the net.

Rinne is one of the best goaltenders in the league at present, but I don't know of any goalie, good or average, that loves traffic or possibility for defelected pucks. So that's the standard usual talk of getting traffic/screens in front of the net. Ian White's goal to open up game 2, Emmerton provided a moving screen more/less. Stuart's shot/goal off Franzen's leg, traffic in front. Holmstrom's PP goal late in game 1, traffic in front/driving the net. You get the drill.

Agreed. Zetterberg's play doesn't work if there's nobody there for screens, tips, or rebounds. The bad part is, they kept shooting like that and not going hard to the net.

[Nightfall]

You're right, I don't remember Detroit getting chances like this. But I think one of the biggest problems is, Phoenix has been shooting high on Rinne. The Wings would shoot from bad angles and always low. Rinne will always stop those low shots.

The defense of Nashville was all over Detroit, which was a mean reason why the Wings were shooting it from bad angles. The shots came low and high, but bad angle shots are still bad angle shots.

This series has really shown another side of the Nashville team. The Nashville team that played Detroit was stifling defensively. They didn't really press up and take risks. They always had 2-3 people back. They kept the shots to the outside. So far, in this series, they have been playing reckless. The Yotes have taken advantage of many of their odd man rushes and opportunities to score. I believe its less about being "exposed" and more about just not playing what made them successful in the first round.

Just like many young hot goalies of playoffs gone by, Rinne is cursed from winning the cup this year. Maybe the Preds will lose the finals in 7 games :-)

The preds don't look like they are going to make it out of the 2nd round.

[dat's sick]

I know it's frowned upon to mention "luck" when you've lost a game/series, but imo Rinne was lucky in that series.

Wings could have tested him more by driving the net, shooting high, getting to rebounds etc.. but man Rinne was saved by his d-mens sticks countless times, saved by the post, saved by the clock running out, saved by Wings players fanning on open net chances and so on.

He is not unbeatable and that kind of luck could not continue 2 series in a row.

Also there might be a fatigue factor, he plays a lot and faced a TON of shot against Detroit. Gotta wear on him.

[Hatethedrake!]

The main thing I see is Nashville being unable to handle Phoenix's overall team speed. While the Yotes are attacking the middle of the ice and getting to the rebounds which the Wings did not seem to be able to do, the Yotes are exposing their team defense moreso than Rinne. The Wings made the Preds look better than they are with those long distance perimeter shots which are easy saves for any NHL goalie. LA plays a style of game where they use their size and skill and defenses can't handle it and become worn down. We don't have forwards which can make a team pay a price so teams do not fear us anymore. Our PP use to bury other teams but not anymore. Puck possession is great but you still have to have guys who will get in the muck and bang and force their dmen to have their heads on a swivel . When the Wings won the Cup in 2008 we had guys like Dallas Drake who would make the dmen pay a price and it made our opponents dmen make panic moves which resulted in turnovers where then our skill guys like Dats and Hank could go to work. It opened up space for Mule to rip off his shots. Without the trench work being done first, the skill game cannot happen effectively. It takes guts, hard work and total team dedication with everyone buying in with a clear structure adhered by all players for team success. LA's players have bought in. It took them awhile to GET IT but you see it now paying off. Look how Hunter has his PKers attacking the Rangers dmen. They have no time and space to move. Look how Phoenix gets the puck in the corners and wins the 1 on 1 battles down low against the Preds. Look how quick the Flyers dmen get the puck to their forwards so their skill game can create mismatches against the other team's dmen. The Wings used to have an identity but since 2008 it has become less prevalent. We need to get back to doing what we do best. Handle the puck, getting the puck to our skill guys to win 1 on 1 match-ups. Instill our vaunted 4 line depth and wear our opponents down and most importantly, get back our crash and bang game once the puck is in the offensive zone. It all plays together. Our dmen are skilled and mobile and do an excellent job of getting the puck to our forwards. But once we have the puck, we need to have a plan to do what we have to do to create scoring chances. We need to get back that blend of puck possession and heavy forechecking which made us Cup champs in 2008.

Edited by Hatethedrake!, 01 May 2012 - 08:31 AM.

[Rhah]

I know it's frowned upon to mention "luck" when you've lost a game/series, but imo Rinne was lucky in that series.

Wings could have tested him more by driving the net, shooting high, getting to rebounds etc.. but man Rinne was saved by his d-mens sticks countless times, saved by the post, saved by the clock running out, saved by Wings players fanning on open net chances and so on.

He is not unbeatable and that kind of luck could not continue 2 series in a row.

Also there might be a fatigue factor, he plays a lot and faced a TON of shot against Detroit. Gotta wear on him.

Saved by players picking the puck up out of the crease and taking it to the bench.

Sad part is all we got out of the series was the d-man a lot of us wanted to get acquired in FA was exposed as a d-bag.

Edited by Rhah, 01 May 2012 - 07:42 PM.

[Dabura]

Agree with so much said in this thread.

- Rinne's good, not great. He's being exposed
- Wings made him look great; we're being exposed
- Throw a wrench in the Wings' system and they fall apart. We're not especially physical, not especially fast. We're not good enough on the back end to play true shutdown, lockdown D. Our top 6 isn't dangerous enough to ever win a game for us on offense alone. Howard can't be counted on to steal games for us. We're skilled with the puck. That's it, really.

[haroldsnepsts]

Agree with so much said in this thread.

- Rinne's good, not great. He's being exposed
- Wings made him look great; we're being exposed
- Throw a wrench in the Wings' system and they fall apart. We're not especially physical, not especially fast. We're not good enough on the back end to play true shutdown, lockdown D. Our top 6 isn't dangerous enough to ever win a game for us on offense alone. Howard can't be counted on to steal games for us. We're skilled with the puck. That's it, really.

Agreed.

Add to that losing Helm and Eaves and our bottom six completely crumbles.

[Nightfall]

Add to that losing Helm and Eaves and our bottom six completely crumbles.

I have said it before and I will say it again....

The team that wins the Stanley Cup will typically be healthy as well as get some puck luck. We got neither of those things in the Nashville series. It was going to be an uphill climb for the Wings, especially when Helm went down with injury. That is like Nashville losing Legwand, who is a 2nd or 3rd line player who has scored a few game winning goals for them in the playoffs.

[Manny>Ozzie(by a long shot)]

EXPOSED!