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2012 Lockout Watch

cba lockout

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#321 Nightfall

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:25 PM

Yeah, Fehr is apparently meeting with his constituents, but I'm not sure about what exactly. The most important thing that should be happening is him and Bettman and their crews in a room working on the deal. Instead it seems like a stall tactic on both their parts.

I am definitely impressed with how Fehr conducts himself in front of the media though. He's very articulate and clear about where he disagrees with the league, but I haven't heard do any of the passive aggressive crap Bettman likes to pull.



For the money they're paid and the millions of dollars at stake, they should be negotiating a lot longer than 8 hours a day if necessary. But it's the game of chicken.

I agree with you. I wasn't all high on Fehr or Bettman when this started. After watching Fehr's speeches on Youtube, I have respect for Fehr. A lot more than Bettman. Still, no bargaining for a week? Both of these guys are in my doghouse right now.
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#322 FlashyG

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 10:35 PM

Well even if the dwarf is the mouthpiece of the owners, he is still acting like a complete idiot. Reminds me on a butthurt child because her dad didn't buy the new Malibu Stasy with a hat...

I think if we are going to have another lockout, the media will be calling for his head and finally force the owners hand. Fehr and the NHLPA has done a great job so far, I am really impressed with them and no, they won't roll over again the league is showing record revenues so why not keep the status quo?


As much as I hate Bettman from a fan's perspective I think the Owners love him. He's delivered on everything he's promised them and even another lockout won't bother them as long as in the end they get to keep a larger piece of the pie.

I think the smartest thing Fehr did with his proposal was to include a large amount of revenue sharing into the deal. By doing that he can potentially create a wedge between the teams with big payrolls and those hovering near the floor. That kind of dissension will do more damage to Bettman's reign at the top than anything the media or we as fans can do to him.

#323 Barrie

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Posted 16 August 2012 - 11:17 PM

Seriously, if there's a lockout I'm starting to wonder how many fans are going to come back? I'm at the point where I'm starting to look for other things to watch and spend my money on starting in October. It's really not worth worrying if a CBA will get done in time, how many games will be missed, if we'll even have a season.

If the NHL is going to lockout players every 8 years, I really don't have to follow it. The Lions are going to have an exciting season, I'll follow the NFL more instead, and just wait out that couple months between the Superbowl and the start of the MLB season. I play the outdoor sports anyway, so Bettman can suck it!
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#324 Hockeymom1960

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 06:43 AM

If there is a lockout, start supporting your local high school teams, OHL teams, USHL teams, etc. I'm a big Saginaw Spirit fan and that just means I have more money to spend on attending those games.

#325 cusimano_brothers

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:10 AM

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#326 Z Winged Dangler

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:47 AM

I will admit that I am becoming more of a fan of Fehr's as time goes on. The proposal that they put forward seemed to be a good one to me. Its not surprising that the NHL owners turned it down. Still, I just cannot fathom why Fehr is traveling around right now at this critical junction. I know why people are rising as one against Uncle Gary, and rightfully so. At the same time though, I cannot give a pass to Fehr. Both of these guys should be in a room hammering out a deal. When I see these sides meeting for a couple hours and then breaking for the day or waiting for a week before sitting down again with a month left in the season, it just seems to me that both sides don't want to get a deal done in time. I don't care if both sides are posturing. Its going to be bad for the game if there is another lockout, and no one can say without a doubt that it was all Gary's fault. Both parties have got to be available and working towards a deal, and so far, it just feels half assed at this point.

especially when it was the NHL, not the NHLPA that waited until a couple weeks ago to finally table the initial proposal, which was basically insulting to the NHLPA.

If there is a lockout, start supporting your local high school teams, OHL teams, USHL teams, etc. I'm a big Saginaw Spirit fan and that just means I have more money to spend on attending those games.

CHL is awesome. Go to Brandon from time to time to watch the Wheat Kings.

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#327 dirtydangles

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:22 AM

Anyone trying to blame Bettman fully is overreaching. Anyone saying Bettman is just a mouthpiece with no blame is understating. Gary Bettman makes 8M dollars a year to be a mouthpiece? I don't think so. From wiki:

"6.1 Office of Commissioner, Election and Term of Office The League shall employ a Commissioner selected by the Board of Governors. The Commissioner shall serve as the Chief Executive Officer of the League and is charged with protecting the integrity of the game of professional hockey and preserving public confidence in the League. The Board of Governors shall determine the term of office and compensation of the Commissioner. The Commissioner shall be elected a majority of the Governors present and voting at a League meeting at which a quorum was present when it was convened.“[1]
In Section 6.3, his duties are spelled out as having "responsibility for the general supervision and direction of all business and affairs of the League", co-ordinates matters between member clubs and serves as the principal public spokesman for the League. The Commissioner also has authority over dispute resolution, League committees, interpretation of League rules, appointment of League staff, NHL financial matters, contracting authority, scheduling, officials and disciplinary powers.[2] The Commissioner also determines the date and places of Board of Governor meetings."

Bettman has a HUGE influence on the league and isn't just some puppet to be controlled. He is providing a vision for the owner's and furthermore has FAILED at protecting the integrity of the game and preserving confidence in the league.
The worst part of Bettman is the smug look he has on his face when he tells bad news to the fans. He LOVES playing the villain it seems. He isn't bothered by fans booing and doesn't seem to care too much for the sport of hockey at all, which is part of his job description. This is one of the main reasons I hate Bettman so much but all the rest stands alone too.


P.S. if there is a lockout it would be cool if Z went to Brynas to play with Jarnkrok and groom him/develop a friendship. Fil could go play with Pulks in Jokerit to develop chemistry for the future.

Edited by dirtydangles, 17 August 2012 - 08:20 AM.

Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#328 Z Winged Dangler

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:25 AM

Anyone trying to blame Bettman fully is overreaching. Anyone saying Bettman is just a mouthpiece with no blame is understating. Gary Bettman makes 8M dollars a year to be a mouthpiece? I don't think so. From wiki:

"6.1 Office of Commissioner, Election and Term of Office The League shall employ a Commissioner selected by the Board of Governors. The Commissioner shall serve as the Chief Executive Officer of the League and is charged with protecting the integrity of the game of professional hockey and preserving public confidence in the League. The Board of Governors shall determine the term of office and compensation of the Commissioner. The Commissioner shall be elected a majority of the Governors present and voting at a League meeting at which a quorum was present when it was convened.“[1]
In Section 6.3, his duties are spelled out as having "responsibility for the general supervision and direction of all business and affairs of the League", co-ordinates matters between member clubs and serves as the principal public spokesman for the League. The Commissioner also has authority over dispute resolution, League committees, interpretation of League rules, appointment of League staff, NHL financial matters, contracting authority, scheduling, officials and disciplinary powers.[2] The Commissioner also determines the date and places of Board of Governor meetings."

Bettman has a HUGE influence on the league and isn't just some puppet to be controlled. He is providing a vision for the owner's and furthermore has FAILED at protecting the integrity of the game and preserving confidence in the league.
The worst part of Bettman is the smug look he has on his face when he tells bad news to the fans. He LOVES playing the villain it seems. He isn't bothered by fans booing and doesn't seem to care too much for the sport of hockey at all, which is part of his job description. This is one of the main reasons I hate Bettman so much but all the rest stands alone too.


Love this post. You forgot to bold that part though. Push the meeting up Gary! We want to watch hockey. Football has too many idiots celebrating when they run for 2 yards, Baseball is really boring aside from home runs, and Basketball...I will not even comment on. Get me somef****** hockey in October. I hate the offseason!

"I play hockey, but I am not very good.  Can someone please tell me what it would take to sign with the Wings ? I can use a million or two."  ~ arag

 

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#329 toby91_ca

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:26 AM

Anyone trying to blame Bettman fully is overreaching. Anyone saying Bettman is just a mouthpiece with no blame is understating. Gary Bettman makes 8M dollars a year to be a mouthpiece? I don't think so. From wiki:

"6.1 Office of Commissioner, Election and Term of Office The League shall employ a Commissioner selected by the Board of Governors. The Commissioner shall serve as the Chief Executive Officer of the League and is charged with protecting the integrity of the game of professional hockey and preserving public confidence in the League. The Board of Governors shall determine the term of office and compensation of the Commissioner. The Commissioner shall be elected a majority of the Governors present and voting at a League meeting at which a quorum was present when it was convened.“[1]
In Section 6.3, his duties are spelled out as having "responsibility for the general supervision and direction of all business and affairs of the League", co-ordinates matters between member clubs and serves as the principal public spokesman for the League. The Commissioner also has authority over dispute resolution, League committees, interpretation of League rules, appointment of League staff, NHL financial matters, contracting authority, scheduling, officials and disciplinary powers.[2] The Commissioner also determines the date and places of Board of Governor meetings."

Bettman has a HUGE influence on the league and isn't just some puppet to be controlled. He is providing a vision for the owner's and furthermore has FAILED at protecting the integrity of the game and preserving confidence in the league.
The worst part of Bettman is the smug look he has on his face when he tells bad news to the fans. He LOVES playing the villain it seems. He isn't bothered by fans booing and doesn't seem to care too much for the sport of hockey at all, which is part of his job description. This is one of the main reasons I hate Bettman so much but all the rest stands alone too.


P.S. if there is a lockout it would be cool if Z went to Brynas to play with Jarnkrok and groom him/develop a friendship. Fil could go play with Pulks in Jokerit to develop chemistry for the future.

Yes, he does a lot and has a lot of control, but that can easily be taken away if the owners are not happy with the job he is doing. He's like the president of a corporation....if the Board doesn't like the direction the president is taking, he will be fired by the Board. Bettman doesn't have the ultimate control over things, the board of govenors do. They are happy with him and what he is doing, that's why he is around and being compensated nicely. As soon as the owners feel he is damaging their product or doing something they don't like, he's gone. It's pretty simple.

#330 dirtydangles

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 08:30 AM

Yes, he does a lot and has a lot of control, but that can easily be taken away if the owners are not happy with the job he is doing. He's like the president of a corporation....if the Board doesn't like the direction the president is taking, he will be fired by the Board. Bettman doesn't have the ultimate control over things, the board of govenors do. They are happy with him and what he is doing, that's why he is around and being compensated nicely. As soon as the owners feel he is damaging their product or doing something they don't like, he's gone. It's pretty simple.

I never said Gary had control. But in spite of the financials, Bettman has failed in his other duties. NHL reffing and rules have been under huge scrutiny and the integrity of the game being questioned. He HAS failed to preserve public confidence. You always see Bettman providing threats in interviews to fans or owners or players etc rather than calmly saying that he hopes there can be an agreement or whatever. Look at his statement in Winnipeg where he called out the fanbase in an extremely negative way when they got their team back. He lacks the ability to make both sides happy. The job description isn't only to make the owners happy, the game as a whole must please the fans as well.

Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#331 Nightfall

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 09:10 AM

especially when it was the NHL, not the NHLPA that waited until a couple weeks ago to finally table the initial proposal, which was basically insulting to the NHLPA.

Just the fact that both sides waited until the final hour to start negotiations, and now one party leader is traveling the US which prevents any real work from being done. As I said, no sense of urgency. I have taken the time to watch a lot of video on Fehr and I like how articulate he is. That doesn't help though if he is out traveling while a lockout is 3+ weeks away. We really are in trouble.
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#332 dirtydangles

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 09:31 AM

Just the fact that both sides waited until the final hour to start negotiations, and now one party leader is traveling the US which prevents any real work from being done. As I said, no sense of urgency. I have taken the time to watch a lot of video on Fehr and I like how articulate he is. That doesn't help though if he is out traveling while a lockout is 3+ weeks away. We really are in trouble.

Its all a game of chicken. Who panics first. Its going to have to be the owners this time. They have the most to lose in this scenario.

Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#333 55fan

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 10:08 AM

Remember when they piped Janet Jackson music into a compound to force the people inside to surrender?

Just sayin'.

I honestly think that they should send each other a list of the issues they want discussed, then compile it into one list so that every issue gets addressed, then each side gets to submit their position/stance/demands for each request, and then, if they don't agree in 2 weeks, send it to arbitration.

The arbitrated contract is good for each year until the sides agree on a mutual contract.

No hockey lost. If they don't like what the arbitrator says, or if they don't think they'll like it, then have a squirrel convention (aka get your nuts together).

#334 dirtydangles

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 10:11 AM

Remember when they piped Janet Jackson music into a compound to force the people inside to surrender?

Just sayin'.

I honestly think that they should send each other a list of the issues they want discussed, then compile it into one list so that every issue gets addressed, then each side gets to submit their position/stance/demands for each request, and then, if they don't agree in 2 weeks, send it to arbitration.

The arbitrated contract is good for each year until the sides agree on a mutual contract.

No hockey lost. If they don't like what the arbitrator says, or if they don't think they'll like it, then have a squirrel convention (aka get your nuts together).

the only problem is that Bettman would be considered the arbitrator as commissioner in all likelihood. and we all know what he wants.

Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#335 55fan

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 10:18 AM

Oops. Meant to quote the person above me. :blush:

I figure it would have to be a neutral third party. Someone who knows little to nothing about the situation. Maybe a committee of the Spice Girls, Mr. Bean, and the Pope.

Edited by 55fan, 17 August 2012 - 10:19 AM.


#336 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 11:40 AM

I never said Gary had control. But in spite of the financials, Bettman has failed in his other duties. NHL reffing and rules have been under huge scrutiny and the integrity of the game being questioned. He HAS failed to preserve public confidence. You always see Bettman providing threats in interviews to fans or owners or players etc rather than calmly saying that he hopes there can be an agreement or whatever. Look at his statement in Winnipeg where he called out the fanbase in an extremely negative way when they got their team back. He lacks the ability to make both sides happy. The job description isn't only to make the owners happy, the game as a whole must please the fans as well.

Exactly.

That's the point I've been trying to make. Yes Bettman has to answer to the owners, but that's not the limits of his job. He is responsible for the long term health and success of the NHL, which surprising as it may seem, some of these idiot owners down always have that same interest.

He ignored clutch and grab hockey that was ruining the game and hindering the most talented players in the world, saying fans love the game and there wasn't a problem. Then during the lost year of the lockout, suddenly there's all these adjustments being made to fix a problem Bettman wouldn't even acknowledge existed for ten years.

And I've reached the point in my life where I'm busy enough and there's enough other ways I could spend my time that refusing to watch or spend money on the NHL isn't just an idle threat, it's a definite option. As much as I love the sport, why follow a league that could give a crap about its fans?

#337 drwscc

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 11:53 AM

No league really gives a crap about its fans. They're big corporations. They could care less. As long as money keeps rolling in, they'll do what they want. When the money stops coming in, they'll make just enough changes to get the cash coming back in. To think anything else is really naivete.

The owners don't care about what you want. The executive offices of the NHL don't care about what you want. The players don't care about what you want. They all just want to make as much money as possible.
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#338 cusimano_brothers

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:01 PM

What will NBC do?
I know, I know...it doesn't matter.

"Mess up tomorrow, don't mess up now".

- Harry James Benson, CBE.


#339 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:09 PM

No league really gives a crap about its fans. They're big corporations. They could care less. As long as money keeps rolling in, they'll do what they want. When the money stops coming in, they'll make just enough changes to get the cash coming back in. To think anything else is really naivete.

The owners don't care about what you want. The executive offices of the NHL don't care about what you want. The players don't care about what you want. They all just want to make as much money as possible.

I don't expect them to care about me as a person. But any business should pay attention to its customers and their wants and needs.

The NHL is counting on the fact that its customers love hockey more than they hate the way they're being treated and will come crawling back to continue supporting a business that has little regard for them.

#340 cusimano_brothers

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 12:10 PM

“The industry’s grown a billion dollars since (the lockout) and basically they just want more money,”

Chris Campoli, a member of the NHLPA’s negotiating committee

, said Thursday.


Facts don't lie.

"Mess up tomorrow, don't mess up now".

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