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Throw the bank at RFA Shea Weber?


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#1 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 09:59 AM

It's clear that we needed more defensive depth even with Nick Lidstrom. So now that Nick has hung up the skates, obviously the need is that much stronger. It sounds likely that we'll sign Ryan Suter, and I am all for that. But if we want any chance of replacing that laser shot at the point that Nick had, we should seriously consider throwing an offer to Weber despite his RFA tag. I know that's generally not the Red Wings style. But we did lose arguably the best defenseman of all time. And with having the most cap room in the NHL, we could easily overpay and still have enough $ left over to sign anyone else we're interested in (including a backup goaltender). Not that I think it's a must to overpay, but Nashville doesn't have a ton of cap space so it seems unlikely they will match a very high offer.

No one will ever be able to replace Nick Lidstrom. But Shea Weber would be a nice consolation prize with his rocket shot and overall toughness. Plus he's still in his 20s so obviously he has many good years left in him. I think it's at least worth trying, considering how much money we have to spend, and our dire need for help on the back-end.

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#2 LeftWinger

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:22 AM

No....not that he is not worth the money, but there is no way Holland gives up 4 first round picks for him...

Now, if he only signs a 1 year with Nashville and he becomes a UFA next July? Yes...throw the bank at him...especially if we already have Suter!

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#3 e_prime

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:27 AM

No.

Echoing Leftie, we cannot afford to give up 4 draft picks for Weber.
QUOTE
(AtomicPunk @ February 4, 2010 - 12:16AM)

Imma let you finish, and your cap numbers are all good and all that, but imma let Kenny figure it out. Kenny's cap numbers were the best cap numbers this year.

#4 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:35 AM

No.

Echoing Leftie, we cannot afford to give up 4 draft picks for Weber.


Wouldn't that only be possible through a trade scenario? I always thought RFA's worked the same way as UFA's except the players current team has the right to match any offer. I didn't realize giving up picks would be a part of the equation. I am definitely not willing to give up picks for him. But I would be fine if we threw him an offer and even overpayed a little.

Edited by TheDetroitRedWings, 03 June 2012 - 10:36 AM.

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#5 e_prime

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:46 AM

No, it works a bit different with RFAs. In both cases the teams are able to match the offer, but in the case of restricted agents... if the player signs with the team making the offer the current team gets draft pick compensation. The number and "level" of picks depends on the salary the player signs for. I'll find you a link for the draft compensation for RFA offer sheets.

Here you go: http://en.wikipedia....iki/Offer_sheet

Edited by e_prime, 03 June 2012 - 10:49 AM.

QUOTE
(AtomicPunk @ February 4, 2010 - 12:16AM)

Imma let you finish, and your cap numbers are all good and all that, but imma let Kenny figure it out. Kenny's cap numbers were the best cap numbers this year.

#6 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:51 AM

No, it works a bit different with RFA's. In both cases the teams are able to match the offer, but in the case of restricted agents... if the player signs with the team making the offer the current team gets draft pick compensation. The number and "level" of picks depends on the salary the player signs for. I'll find you a link for the draft compensation for RFA offer sheets.


Ahhhh I see. And yeah I knew either way the player's team can match all offers, actually what I meant to say was I thought the difference between RFA's and UFA's were if the player's current team matches any offers the player can't sign with any other team. But yeah I didn't realize we had to give up picks as well. Waiting till next season looks like the only true option now.

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#7 vladdy16

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 11:08 AM

I was completely on the Weber bandwagon until he manhandled Hank. Even if he were a Wing and did that to a Pred, I'd still lose all respect for him. And if Hank's captain, what would Weber do to make things right? Hank can say all is forgiven, but Hank's only human; what would it take to actually work well together?
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#8 puckloo39

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 11:19 AM

I was completely on the Weber bandwagon until he manhandled Hank. Even if he were a Wing and did that to a Pred, I'd still lose all respect for him. And if Hank's captain, what would Weber do to make things right? Hank can say all is forgiven, but Hank's only human; what would it take to actually work well together?


It offended me, as well, that Weber and the Pred-no-necks thought attacking Hank in that manner was fine and dandy. However, justice was served and they disappeared off the playoff radar rather ignominiously. Hank and Weber are grown men... well, Hank is, anyway. If they can work it out, then I say go with what makes the team better.

If that means Weber, then fine. But don't break the bank on him. While we need D, I am not sure he's Wing material. Convince me.

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#9 esteef

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 11:25 AM

Rather have Suter.

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#10 Pasha 13

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 11:26 AM

TBH, I realize it's an emotional game but after what weber did to z, is weber really on kenny's wishlist? I'm of the mind that if a player of that magnitude becomes available, you get the brinks truck ready. But still, it would be awkward seeing our captain(Z) and weber in the starting lineup together. Now if a few years had passed maybe you let bygones be bygones but for it to happen in the next few months or next year when he's a ufa, it just seems like an uncomfortable situation. I can't imagine the guys in the locker room would be too pleased either. Not that it's anywhere near the same outcome nor are they the same calibur of player, but can you imagine "the turtle" in a wings uni?

#11 luvmnger

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 11:26 AM

ya know...shea weber has lost his credibility with me, and not just for the Z hit.

the wings run a classy organ-i-zation and i dont think he is worthy.

yea, yea, he is good, big shot ,tough, etc... but i dont think he is Wing material.

he is a pronger, a ulf sammuelsson, a meat head with a good stick.

he is my list that i would pick over him to put in the wings lineup.

in no particular order...each one brings something to the table that trumps the idea of weber. (to me)

suter
seabrook
ekman larsson ( my personal favorite)
chara
volchenkov
streit
mcdonagh
enstrom
bogozian
hedman
wideman
pietrangelo
j.johnson
doughty
burns
yandle
garrison (to me he is a future top 2)

i would even go out on a limb and insert schultz in that list, but he is yet unproven.


so my personal answer to the weber situations is....NO. no draft picks, no offer, no free agent, no trade.
Dino Ciccarelli will always be #1

#12 dirtydangles

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 11:36 AM

No way we give up the compensation. Our style is not to mortgage the future for the present. Suter and weber would be overkill and u dont want to be that gm that offersheets players to handicap their team cause its gonna come back to bite you.

Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#13 sleepwalker

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 12:21 PM

To play devils advocate:

To the people saying "Oh, no way the Wings would even give up multiple picks for a player like Weber", lets not forget that the Wings gave up a first for Kyle Quincy this season, so you can't really predict what the Wings org will do when it comes to trading picks...

#14 heikks86

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 12:25 PM

To play devils advocate:

To the people saying "Oh, no way the Wings would even give up multiple picks for a player like Weber", lets not forget that the Wings gave up a first for Kyle Quincy this season, so you can't really predict what the Wings org will do when it comes to trading picks...


theres a difference between giving up one 1st rounder compared to giving up four possible 1st rounders or 2 firsts a 2nd and 3rd

Edited by heikks86, 03 June 2012 - 12:26 PM.


#15 sleepwalker

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 12:33 PM

theres a difference between giving up one 1st rounder compared to giving up four possible 1st rounders or 2 firsts a 2nd and 3rd



There is also a difference (a pretty big one) between Kyle Quincy and Shea Weber, not to mention its a different situation altogether as well. ;)

#16 MrBest7

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 12:46 PM

This is the year Brendan Smith hasto show something. Holland needs to structure the budget to either sign BrendanSmith to a big contract in 2013, or have room to sign a big unrestricteddefenseman like Weber in 2013. If Brendan doesn't show anything special, I'dsign him to a comparable salary to Johnathan Ericsson. Then I would haveseveral million to go after Weber. With this strategy, Quincey, Bertuzzi andKindl are toast in 2013.



I really like a T.J. Oshie and EvanderKane because they are very young, tough to play against and have outstandingskills...plus you have room for the best defense in the NHL.

Oshie STL.

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E. Kane WIN. (20 years old) 30 GOAL SCORER ON A POOR TEAM!!
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FORWARDS

Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Johan Franzen ($3.955m)
Evander Kane ($4.200m) / Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / T.J. Oshie ($4.000m)
Justin Abdelkader ($1.200m) / Darren Helm ($1.200m) / Danny Cleary ($2.800m)
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Jan Mursak ($0.550m) / Cory Emmerton ($0.533m) / Patrick Eaves ($1.200m)


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#17 Echolalia

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 12:46 PM

Suter is fine for now, I think. We do have a fair bit of cap space, but not an infinite amount, and there are also needs amongst our forwards. I think if we can land Suter (which is still a big if), and get Smith up to work on his defensive game some more, we should be in good shape.
Now that Lids is out of the picture, I would prioritize landing Suter first, then picking up Zach Parise or Semin (only if he takes ~3M/year, which I'm not sure he will accept). Any player who can put the puck in the net on a regular basis is something we need right now.
Third, we need a reliable back-up goaltender. MacDonand wants to compete for the position, but I read that he's not ideal because of his back issues. Vokoun, Clemenson, Hedberg. Somebody who can play at least 20 games/season consistently but won't break the bank either.
Fourth, we need to add a little more size to the team. We have a skilled bottom six with Helm, Abby, Miller and Eaves, but they're capabilities I think would really be complimented with someone who can out-muscle the opposition and come up with the puck in the corners and in front of the net. I don't care if he fights or puts up 200+ PIM a year, as long as he can consistently wear down on opponents and win the battles and feed the pucks to his teammates from nasty areas where someone like Eaves or Miller isn't as effective. I see that going a long way, especially after the 82nd game is played.
And of course, we need to re-sign our free agents, Helm and Abdelkader each deserve good raises. Quincey should be brought back, as much as everyone doesn't want that to happen (although is someone plucks him from us, I wouldn't be against getting the compensation as he is a RFA). If we can't find an upgrade for Hudler who doesn't want 6M/season, it might be beneficial to keep him around for scoring support.
After all that, I think we'll be close to the cap limit again.
Weber is a commodity we would be better off passing on, at least for now.

#18 sleepwalker

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 12:51 PM

then picking up Zach Parise or Semin


Hey, theres that enforcer that everyone is always complaining that we need.

BONGO SOLO!!!



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#19 Crymson

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 02:49 PM

To play devils advocate:

To the people saying "Oh, no way the Wings would even give up multiple picks for a player like Weber", lets not forget that the Wings gave up a first for Kyle Quincy this season, so you can't really predict what the Wings org will do when it comes to trading picks...


I'm going to assume that you're doing this facetiously, but just in case, I'll note that giving up four first-rounders is rather different from giving up one first-rounder in a weak draft year.

#20 Dimaline312000

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 04:35 PM

SCREW WEBER!!!!





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