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Holland Content with Current Roster


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#121 crispychris

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 06:53 PM

You know what? I like the situation we are in, here is why. We are going to find out just how good we are. How good of a GM is Ken? Were going to find out. How good are all of our prospects? Lots of young guys are going to get a real chance to play this year. Our true depth will be exposed this year, good or bad. How good of a coach do we have? Babcock is going to have to coach his ass of this year. How big time are Datsyuk, Z, and the mule? Thoes guys must have monster years. Can they do it? We are going to find out. I f@cking pumped to find out. I think this is exactly what this club needs, a chance to prove them selves. This is great motivation, something we have been lacking. The Red Wings are going to see just how good they are and I feel good about it.

#122 gcom007

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 06:55 PM

What if it is Ilitch who decided to stop spending up to the cap seeing that the "parity" is indeed there and "any team" (not "can" but "must") must win? Have you thought about that? It is business and if you know you're not winning anyway why to spend up to the cap?


I'd be shocked if Illitch had anything to say about conserving money at the expense of the team's ability to win.
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#123 gcom007

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:06 PM

You know what? I like the situation we are in, here is why. We are going to find out just how good we are. How good of a GM is Ken? Were going to find out. How good are all of our prospects? Lots of young guys are going to get a real chance to play this year. Our true depth will be exposed this year, good or bad. How good of a coach do we have? Babcock is going to have to coach his ass of this year. How big time are Datsyuk, Z, and the mule? Thoes guys must have monster years. Can they do it? We are going to find out. I f@cking pumped to find out. I think this is exactly what this club needs, a chance to prove them selves. This is great motivation, something we have been lacking. The Red Wings are going to see just how good they are and I feel good about it.


Maybe, but how fun will it be if it blows up in our faces? And what's more likely to happen at this point? And some of these guys have had time to prove themselves and have continually fallen short. Others are getting older despite still being elite players. And in some of these cases, it's not necessarily a matter or effort or ability so much as chemistry and balance, and that's something that needs to be addressed by bringing in the right parts and selling off what isn't working or what you can afford to lose. That's not to say that the season doesn't have potential to be exciting and rewarding, but you also can't say that we've had more than a bit of time to observe this team and many of these players in moments of adversity the last few years. We had holes then and terrible injury luck at times, and now we just have more holes, as well as the biggest hole we've had in the modern era, and still more players getting older. I'll cheer the team on no matter what, but this is just an ugly situation any way you shake it.
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#124 beachwing

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:18 PM

Im very alarmed at much of the content in these threads.....you see what I did there!

#125 Carman

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:26 PM

Maybe, but how fun will it be if it blows up in our faces? And what's more likely to happen at this point? And some of these guys have had time to prove themselves and have continually fallen short. Others are getting older despite still being elite players. And in some of these cases, it's not necessarily a matter or effort or ability so much as chemistry and balance, and that's something that needs to be addressed by bringing in the right parts and selling off what isn't working or what you can afford to lose. That's not to say that the season doesn't have potential to be exciting and rewarding, but you also can't say that we've had more than a bit of time to observe this team and many of these players in moments of adversity the last few years. We had holes then and terrible injury luck at times, and now we just have more holes, as well as the biggest hole we've had in the modern era, and still more players getting older. I'll cheer the team on no matter what, but this is just an ugly situation any way you shake it.


It is a better situation to have it blow up, with room to change. Than have it blow up when you are spending to the cap and have to buy out contracts.

Holland is being smart.

#126 stevkrause

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:29 PM

I picked a bad time to end my hiatus from LGW... it seems like the vast majority here have lost their damn minds...

It is a better situation to have it blow up, with room to change. Than have it blow up when you are spending to the cap and have to buy out contracts.

Holland is being smart.

I wanted to like this, but I've used my quota for the day...

You know what? I like the situation we are in, here is why. We are going to find out just how good we are. How good of a GM is Ken? Were going to find out. How good are all of our prospects? Lots of young guys are going to get a real chance to play this year. Our true depth will be exposed this year, good or bad. How good of a coach do we have? Babcock is going to have to coach his ass of this year. How big time are Datsyuk, Z, and the mule? Thoes guys must have monster years. Can they do it? We are going to find out. I f@cking pumped to find out. I think this is exactly what this club needs, a chance to prove them selves. This is great motivation, something we have been lacking. The Red Wings are going to see just how good they are and I feel good about it.

This too

All I have to say about Holland and our off-season:

Here in this thread

Here in this one as well

Here in this one too

and finally

Here


Holland is a damn good GM. period.


#127 Danielsm

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:34 PM

I figure Smith will become a dynamite offensive defenseman this coming season which Lidstrom has not been in the past few seasons. We may be worse on defense losing Lidstrom, but it's a team game and everyone will have to step in defensively in his departure. I think we'll get some firepower back we've been missing by adding Quincey and Smith to the roster and our defense, will only continue to improve with experience. Not a great situation, but not a terrible one either. This year will be exciting to see our prospects finally given a chance to succeed.

#128 LeftWinger

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:37 PM

Ilitch will not go back to the 80's...if Holland fails to spend money to make this team a playoff team, and they miss the playoffs or worse yet become a lottery team, Holland will be dealt with swiftly and accordingly...He does still have Scotty's phone number...

Holland MUST get a top 6 forward....MUST. He needs to let go of his manlove for Franzine or go ahead a trade Fil for Ryan.


EDIT: That being said, he still has a over a month left until September, and if he doesn't trade for a Nash or Ryan before then, and they struggle, he WILL by the end of December.

Still he can certainly afford Doan and Semin right now....BTW, if ya haven't heard, Anaheim wants Filppula...

Edited by LeftWinger, 12 July 2012 - 07:41 PM.

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#129 Frozen-Man

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:55 PM

That's why you sometimes have to trade people to bring talent in, especially when you're talking about replacing one of the best players to ever live.

But March was fun and all; like a trailer. And maybe, like a trailer, we saw the "highlight" (if we're previewing the low points of a Red Wings team without Lidstrom…), but either way, the Wings without Lidstrom was an ugly, ugly, scary site.

Now we've lost Stuart too don't forget, and Holland hasn't addressed that loss, which arguably should have been easier to do! No cakewalk in this day and age, but more of an attainable goal than replacing one of the best who was still playing great hockey.



I think Holland thought he was addressing Stuart when he got Quincy, he has not been an acceptable replacement yet but still might turn out to be. As for trading pieces in anticipation of Lids retiring, I think the mentality was to make a push for another cup before he retired. My understanding is that is one of the things Holland and Lidstrom discussed each offseason, whether or not they were going to push for a Cup that year. I don't think Lids would have stuck around as long as he did if Holland was trading away present talent in order to shore up the future when Lidstrom would be gone. Puts Holland in a catch 22.

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#130 GMRwings1983

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:58 PM

Same old s*** from Holland.

He's done nothing of significance the last several deadlines and offseasons.

This offseason, his big accomplishment is signing a 4th liner that any GM could have signed and that old goof Samuelsson, who we don't need at this point. And that's coming off three early playoff exits in a row and the retirement of your best player for the last decade.

I don't know what our record will be next season, but the offseason up until now has been a disaster. But Holland's mentality is, "All is well"

This is smart from Kenny. What were people expecting him to say?
"Well the current roster isn't good enough, this team has no chance", can you imagine what message that sends to a player?

I am tired of reading about Semin, if he doesn't want to sign for one year, he won't be Wing, period.
The roster needs indeed work but there is nothing outthere, so staying pat is smart, panic signings are kneejerk!


Honesty is a b****.

Edited by GMRwings1983, 12 July 2012 - 07:58 PM.

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#131 Frozen-Man

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:59 PM

You know what? I like the situation we are in, here is why. We are going to find out just how good we are. How good of a GM is Ken? Were going to find out. How good are all of our prospects? Lots of young guys are going to get a real chance to play this year. Our true depth will be exposed this year, good or bad. How good of a coach do we have? Babcock is going to have to coach his ass of this year. How big time are Datsyuk, Z, and the mule? Thoes guys must have monster years. Can they do it? We are going to find out. I f@cking pumped to find out. I think this is exactly what this club needs, a chance to prove them selves. This is great motivation, something we have been lacking. The Red Wings are going to see just how good they are and I feel good about it.


I agree. People have been complaining since the 2008 cup that the Wings lack motivation, well they should have it now. This is the first time in a long time that they actually have something to prove and hopefully it motivates them.

"Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience." - Mark Twain


#132 GMRwings1983

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:01 PM

I agree. People have been complaining since the 2008 cup that the Wings lack motivation, well they should have it now. This is the first time in a long time that they actually have something to prove and hopefully it motivates them.


But unfortunately, unlike the last few years, we no longer have enough talent for the motivation to help us win anything major.

Edited by GMRwings1983, 12 July 2012 - 08:02 PM.

According to my profile, my reputation is excellent. LOL.

#133 Frozen-Man

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:05 PM

But unfortunately, unlike the last few years, we no longer have enough talent for the motivation to help us win anything major.


I don't know, I think a pretty good signing this off-season (maybe Doan) and then a nice pick up at the trade deadline (maybe someone set to be a FA at the end of the season) and I think they might compete with any team in the NHL. They look as good as either NJ or LA did last offseason.

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#134 GMRwings1983

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:13 PM

I don't know, I think a pretty good signing this off-season (maybe Doan) and then a nice pick up at the trade deadline (maybe someone set to be a FA at the end of the season) and I think they might compete with any team in the NHL. They look as good as either NJ or LA did last offseason.


I was talking about the team as they are now.

That's kind of what this thread is about. Holland being content if we don't add anything else.
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#135 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:22 PM

I was talking about the team as they are now.

That's kind of what this thread is about. Holland being content if we don't add anything else.

I'm hoping that's just lip service. It wouldn't be good for anyone if he said "we've taken a big step backwards" no matter what he actually thinks.

But losing Lidstrom and Stuart, letting Hudler and his 50 points go and replacing him with Sammy. About the only steps forward so far are potentially in goal and the bottom lines with the addition of Tootoo (I still don't like him but am trying to be optimistic about something).

The Wings won 1 playoff game last season.

The real question is by the trade deadline this coming season, will they be in a position to make the playoffs and win more than one game?

#136 ShanahanMan

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:23 PM

Same old s*** from Holland.

He's done nothing of significance the last several deadlines and offseasons.

This offseason, his big accomplishment is signing a 4th liner that any GM could have signed and that old goof Samuelsson, who we don't need at this point. And that's coming off three early playoff exits in a row and the retirement of your best player for the last decade.

I don't know what our record will be next season, but the offseason up until now has been a disaster. But Holland's mentality is, "All is well"



Honesty is a b****.


We always seem to be on the same page with these matters, yet for whatever reason, you never get ripped apart like I do.

What's your secret?


I HATE JASON WILLIAMS

#137 GMRwings1983

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:30 PM

We always seem to be on the same page with these matters, yet for whatever reason, you never get ripped apart like I do.

What's your secret?


I've had more than my share of arguments around here. People are just tired of debating me, I guess. :shifty:
According to my profile, my reputation is excellent. LOL.

#138 LeftWinger

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:34 PM

But unfortunately, unlike the last few years, we no longer have enough talent for the motivation to help us win anything major.


But also unlike the last few years, we have tons of Cap space to spend....yet still Holland is content with his lack of top 6 talent or motivation on his current club....time to go Franzine....time to go....

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#139 Frozen-Man

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:40 PM

I was talking about the team as they are now.

That's kind of what this thread is about. Holland being content if we don't add anything else.

I think they are serviceable now and Holland will continue to try and make improvements. I didn't mean to imply you were saying something you weren't, I didn't think anyone thought Holland wouldn't try to make moves like I suggested especially considering Holland has stated he has been in contact with Doan's agent. My statement was entirely in line with what this thread has been about.

"Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience." - Mark Twain


#140 gcom007

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:54 PM

I think Holland thought he was addressing Stuart when he got Quincy, he has not been an acceptable replacement yet but still might turn out to be. As for trading pieces in anticipation of Lids retiring, I think the mentality was to make a push for another cup before he retired. My understanding is that is one of the things Holland and Lidstrom discussed each offseason, whether or not they were going to push for a Cup that year. I don't think Lids would have stuck around as long as he did if Holland was trading away present talent in order to shore up the future when Lidstrom would be gone. Puts Holland in a catch 22.


I liked the move and still do but I don't think Babcock would agree with this analysis. And I don't think we would be foregoing our Cup chances by trading pieces and prospects to get a top-tier defenseman to play alongside Lidstrom before retiring. I also think we likely hurt our Cup chances by not shaking this team up a bit more. New blood might've added more urgency, and if guys saw that the front office wasn't above shipping out players (that have likely felt untouchable for awhile now, unhealthy...) it might motivate them to perform better day in, day out. We also have had an incredibly unbalanced offense since the summer of 2009 and Holland has failed to address that time and again. In my mind, and I think many others, Babcock's included last summer, Holland didn't address the needs of this team to get them ready to make a run for the Cup. No matter what he told Lidstrom, Holland's been dropping the ball again and again on this team for 3-4 years now.

It is a better situation to have it blow up, with room to change. Than have it blow up when you are spending to the cap and have to buy out contracts.

Holland is being smart.


Like I said before, I'm not talking about Holland's performance this off-season. I'm talking about 3-4 years of Holland utterly and completely fumbling to address the needs of this team in the present and in the future, as in, being set up for right now. Do you see me saying anything about signing lower-middle tier guys to excessive contracts just for the sake of doing something? No. It would be dumb to go crazy right now, but that would be about the only thing dumber than what Holland did the last 3-4 years to help land us in this position in the first place.
-Elliot...does not panic.





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