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Bring Back The Bruise Bros

List of Divers

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A few months back, the players were talking about making a list of known divers. It was proposed that lists of divers be posted in every locking room to embarrass the mentioned players and force them to stop the exaggeration.

1. How should the NHL tackle the problem of diving and general exaggeration?

2. Create a league-wide list of known divers.

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What's the point? Everyone knows who these people are anyway. No secret.

I think the league just needs to return to regularly calling diving. They went away from it since the lockout, and it's created more divers.

Wings3:16 likes this

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<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="GMRwings1983" data-cid="2336978" data-time="1356745011"><p>

What's the point? Everyone knows who these people are anyway. No secret. <br />

<br />

I think the league just needs to return to regularly calling diving. They went away from it since the lockout, and it's created more divers. </p></blockquote>

Since the lockout/since Crosby entered the league.. How convenient.

Edit: i don't know what happened with the quote..?

Edited by amato
Marty Barry likes this

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I like how the linesman swooped in to stop Franzen from unleashing any fury. Another mouthguard removal might have ended Thornton's career.

Hockeymom1960 and 55fan like this

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<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="GMRwings1983" data-cid="2336978" data-time="1356745011"><p>

What's the point? Everyone knows who these people are anyway. No secret. <br />

<br />

I think the league just needs to return to regularly calling diving. They went away from it since the lockout, and it's created more divers. </p></blockquote>

Since the lockout/since Crosby entered the league.. How convenient.

Edit: i don't know what happened with the quote..?

This. DUH!

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Forsberg, Kariya,...Oh you mean current players. Any player with a Canucks or Sharks logo on it.

Hockeymom1960 likes this

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Anyone else remember when this was proposed by the League? I do. The timing of it was, in a word, impeccable.

The on-ice officials have to made aware of what goes on (if they aren't already), recognize who the guilty parties are and talk quietly amongst themselves in order to solve this problem. Would the League appreciate it if a list was published of the worst on-ice officials?

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Yes the league should crack down on divers, but it happens so fast I don't know that you can rely on refs to handle it in games.

I think the best way is to have a video official reviewing questionable plays after a game. The on ice refs could even let them know which plays they want looked at it.

But even then only the most extreme cases will get punished. The stick not actually hitting Carcillo's face. Kesler's ridiculous flop.

Fining those guys even after games though should help. They embarrass the refs and league with their antics, so they should be publicly embarrassed too.

Hockeymom1960 likes this

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Anyone with kids should know how much trouble the officials have seeing everything as it happens. They have to watch for a zillion things at once and try to catch it all.

Divers are like little kids. Maybe they should have to sit in a corner for a couple of games if two minutes isn't enough. When they can act like big boys, they can play with the big boys.

Hockeymom1960 likes this

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1. Call it and not the 'false offense'.

2. Can they post GIFs in the locker rooms instead?

violent-recently.gif

This is my favorate "F'n Ridiculous" moment from Joe Thornton. Thanks for posting it!

Hockeymom1960 likes this

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Fining those guys even after games though should help. They embarrass the refs and league with their antics, so they should be publicly embarrassed too.

Agreed. It's solution so simple and elegant that I'm sure the NHL will never implement it.

Hockeymom1960 likes this

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Yzerman used to flop a bit. Not as bad as Forsberg though.

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Franzen embellishes too. I do wish the NHL would try and clean up the diving. It has become soccer-like embarrassing from certain players and teams lately.

Edited by GoWings1905

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If we're going to let the game police itself when it comes to guys taking runs at one another, spot picking, dirty hits, etc. why not do the same thing with diving. If you're playing a team with a notorious diver and he does it in the game, send a tough guy out to deal with it. Every time Kessler or someone else on Vancouver dives I'd make it Jordin Tootoo's mission to punish someone, and let it be known what the reason was.

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Ryan Kesler

Sidney Crosby

Max Lapierre

Brad Marchand

Alexander Semin

Max Talbot

Devin Setoguchi

Joe Thornton

Alex Burrows

Sedin sisters

Dustin Brown

P.K. Subban

Joe Pavelski

Patrick Kaleta

Mike Ribeiro

Franzen does too, although not nearly as often as those mentioned above. Tootoo used to one of the worst, but has cut down on the diving in the last few years. It would be just plain inaccurate to say he doesn't do it at all anymore, though. Samuelsson needs to be mentioned, as well.

There needs to be a return of suspensions handed out for blatant embellishment and diving.

Edited by Bring Back The Bruise Bros

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Yes the league should crack down on divers, but it happens so fast I don't know that you can rely on refs to handle it in games.

I think the best way is to have a video official reviewing questionable plays after a game. The on ice refs could even let them know which plays they want looked at it.

But even then only the most extreme cases will get punished. The stick not actually hitting Carcillo's face. Kesler's ridiculous flop.

Fining those guys even after games though should help. They embarrass the refs and league with their antics, so they should be publicly embarrassed too.

I agree something needs to be done. However, the post-game analysis by the refs I'm not so sure about. Except in cases where major known injury inducing moves/plays are being reviewed by the league office for disciplinary action, I don't believe post game analysis of diving wouldn't result in the desired effect. For one, infractions and penalties must apply to the current game being played, not future games or penalties (e.g. suspensions, fines, etc...). In reality, it's all moot after the game is completed.

For example, take a huge playoff game 7. Player on Team A dives and gets a penalty called on Team B for a phantom penalty. Team A scores on the power play and wins the game and series. How would that post game ref analysis help the team that lost? Series is over...there is no going back and replaying that game. The point is always to get the call right regardless of time or method taken to do so during the game (i.e. NFL fumble or reception reviews).

In addition, I don't think the "public shaming" would be that big of deal to the players as suggested. I've heard players talk about "getting away" with hits/calls/embellishments as if it were a thing of bravado....especially when the plays result in a victory or a goal. As in...."I did everything in my power to help my team win....did it for the team." For example, players who tenaciously argue that they didn't have a "kicking motion" for a goal that went off their skate. Or jamming at puck that is under a goalie and play is whistled dead? Why aren't they shamed or embarrassed about breaking the rules on these plays?

Maybe it's because diving is viewed as soooo "bush league" and against the "code", I don't know. I just know that post game penalties/fines/suspensions don't help a team that suffered a loss due to the call. The penalties on divers must apply to the current game. Video review by the War Room in Toronto (that reviews goal calls) could be an option though.

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I would implement a rule in which teams can send the NHL video of obvious dives by their opponents after the game. Offenders would be automatically suspended for the next game and the number of games doubles with each subsequent offence.

I agree something needs to be done. However, the post-game analysis by the refs I'm not so sure about. Except in cases where major known injury inducing moves/plays are being reviewed by the league office for disciplinary action, I don't believe post game analysis of diving wouldn't result in the desired effect. For one, infractions and penalties must apply to the current game being played, not future games or penalties (e.g. suspensions, fines, etc...). In reality, it's all moot after the game is completed.

For example, take a huge playoff game 7. Player on Team A dives and gets a penalty called on Team B for a phantom penalty. Team A scores on the power play and wins the game and series. How would that post game ref analysis help the team that lost? Series is over...there is no going back and replaying that game. The point is always to get the call right regardless of time or method taken to do so during the game (i.e. NFL fumble or reception reviews).

In addition, I don't think the "public shaming" would be that big of deal to the players as suggested. I've heard players talk about "getting away" with hits/calls/embellishments as if it were a thing of bravado....especially when the plays result in a victory or a goal. As in...."I did everything in my power to help my team win....did it for the team." For example, players who tenaciously argue that they didn't have a "kicking motion" for a goal that went off their skate. Or jamming at puck that is under a goalie and play is whistled dead? Why aren't they shamed or embarrassed about breaking the rules on these plays?

Maybe it's because diving is viewed as soooo "bush league" and against the "code", I don't know. I just know that post game penalties/fines/suspensions don't help a team that suffered a loss due to the call. The penalties on divers must apply to the current game. Video review by the War Room in Toronto (that reviews goal calls) could be an option though.
.

The penalties don't have to apply to the current game as it is hard to determine without video aid if a player is actually diving or not. If they get suspended for diving, divers will stop diving, solving the problem

Edited by Johnz96

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I agree something needs to be done. However, the post-game analysis by the refs I'm not so sure about. Except in cases where major known injury inducing moves/plays are being reviewed by the league office for disciplinary action, I don't believe post game analysis of diving wouldn't result in the desired effect. For one, infractions and penalties must apply to the current game being played, not future games or penalties (e.g. suspensions, fines, etc...). In reality, it's all moot after the game is completed.

For example, take a huge playoff game 7. Player on Team A dives and gets a penalty called on Team B for a phantom penalty. Team A scores on the power play and wins the game and series. How would that post game ref analysis help the team that lost? Series is over...there is no going back and replaying that game. The point is always to get the call right regardless of time or method taken to do so during the game (i.e. NFL fumble or reception reviews).

In addition, I don't think the "public shaming" would be that big of deal to the players as suggested. I've heard players talk about "getting away" with hits/calls/embellishments as if it were a thing of bravado....especially when the plays result in a victory or a goal. As in...."I did everything in my power to help my team win....did it for the team." For example, players who tenaciously argue that they didn't have a "kicking motion" for a goal that went off their skate. Or jamming at puck that is under a goalie and play is whistled dead? Why aren't they shamed or embarrassed about breaking the rules on these plays?

Maybe it's because diving is viewed as soooo "bush league" and against the "code", I don't know. I just know that post game penalties/fines/suspensions don't help a team that suffered a loss due to the call. The penalties on divers must apply to the current game. Video review by the War Room in Toronto (that reviews goal calls) could be an option though.

I agree with what you're saying, but as Johnz96 points out, it's just too hard to determine during game play at times.

So it's certainly not a perfect solution, but hitting them with increasing fines after each infraction and then a suspension seems like it could help. And the video review would make it a lot harder to argue that it wasn't a dive because it wasn't based on some refs viewpoint at the time.

Shanny could even release one of his videos reviewing the dive and stating the fine to that player.

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I would implement a rule in which teams can send the NHL video of obvious dives by their opponents after the game. Offenders would be automatically suspended for the next game and the number of games doubles with each subsequent offence.

The penalties don't have to apply to the current game as it is hard to determine without video aid if a player is actually diving or not. If they get suspended for diving, divers will stop diving, solving the problem

Maybe...maybe not. I don't think so though. Hasn't stopped players from taking head shots. Hasn't stopped players from leaving their feet on hits. Hasn't stopped serious boarding infractions. BTW....still does nothing to get the call right on the spot. I believe in any officiating the ultimate goal has to be to get the call right at that time at least the NFL believes so as they will take as much time needed for refs to get the call right before play proceeds. Is it perfect, no, but it's a lot better than it was without on-field video review. Getting the call right at that time is the key. How is a post game video or player penalty any conciliation to a team that just lost a playoff series due to this?? "Don't worry guys...we're sending a video to the league about that dive....so hopefully the player will get a suspension or fine...season over and have a great summer!". Ask any player this question..."Game 7 of a playoff series, late in the third period, the game is tied....would you risk a one/two game suspension to get a two minute power play?" I bet every player say Yes!

Also, do you know how many "videos" the league office would get daily....OMG, every team would send multiple videos of the other teams players for even the slightest of questionable embellishments for every game in hopes that they actually may get an opposing player penalized which could be a future advantage ("squeaky wheel gets the grease").

Also, I think goalies are the biggest violators embellishment of contact....this has been accepted for years...why no outrage on this (kind of like punters in the NFL).

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