Howard = Average

[Jonas Mahonas 1,872]

Guest TheAxe was right.. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

21 minutes ago, gcom007 said:

Oh if he’s a UFA nah, but he’d be an upgrade over our s***suation in net. And Zadina is washed up. Cut him loose already. 

"Washed up"? You do realize he's a 19 year old prospect, not a 39 year old vet, right?

"Cut him loose already"? That's really smart asset management for a former (one year ago) 6th overall pick, that hasn't even played 10 games in the show yet...

Stop reading all the bulls*** online and actually watch the kid play. Pay attention to what he's doing on the ice, not just on the score sheet. Will he be elite? Maybe not, but he will be a very good top six winger, at the very least. He's not a "bust". You don't throw a kid with his potential in a trade as an addon, just to mildly improve our goaltending situation. 

Howard has been bad. Really bad. But let's be honest, he hasn't gotten much help. Do you really think Holtby would be THAT much better? I don't.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

46 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

"Washed up"? You do realize he's a 19 year old prospect, not a 39 year old vet, right?

"Cut him loose already"? That's really smart asset management for a former (one year ago) 6th overall pick, that hasn't even played 10 games in the show yet...

Stop reading all the bulls*** online and actually watch the kid play. Pay attention to what he's doing on the ice, not just on the score sheet. Will he be elite? Maybe not, but he will be a very good top six winger, at the very least. He's not a "bust". You don't throw a kid with his potential in a trade as an addon, just to mildly improve our goaltending situation. 

Howard has been bad. Really bad. But let's be honest, he hasn't gotten much help. Do you really think Holtby would be THAT much better? I don't.

Zadina has Brendan Smith disease. The good news is we were able to catch it and diagnose him very early, so there is a chance we can still get good value for him.

And Yzerman has no commitment to Holland's draft picks.

So this is the perfect time to sell him.

Personally I'd do my normal TDL deals, then call up Zadina for the remainder of the season. Give him only sheltered minutes on the PP and top line with only offensive zone starts. Build up his perceived value. Then on draft day flip him for a 1st rounder. Then we can take a forward like Lafren or Byfield, and scoop up Askarov with our new acquired Zadina flip pick.

IRL I'm a little cautious about Holtby. That man has already played a lot of hockey in his career and he's starting to project downward. Also his rise and now decent coincides pretty closely with the arrival and departure of Mitch Korn. And we don't have a Mitch Korn. We have a Jeff Saladjokeo or however you spell his name, who's coached: an aging Jimmy Howard, Mrazek, Bernier, Coreau, McCollum, Cal Heeter, Jeff Palmer, Edward Pasquale, and Jake Paterson... a real fine list of quality products there Jeff. We should have never have canned Bednar IMO.

We gotta remember that in front of Howard right now is Patrik Nemeth (Colorado's #6 Dman), Madison Bowey (Washington's #7 Dman), Cholowski (Should arguably still be in the AHL), Joe Hicketts (AHLer), McIlrath (AHLer) Biega (AHLer), and finally Hronek (the only decent Dman).

If I was Howard I would accuse Yzerman of trying to abotage my career by iceing that defence.

Greener coming back tonight should help a lil

Also look at Howard's game-by-game. The first 7 games of the season he has expected normal Howard numbers. Only the last 3 games have the wheels completely come off. I think he's just going through the same confidence crisis the entire team is in right now. I would be pretty upset and frustrated in his shoes right now. The state of the team is unacceptable.

I don't think it's time to panic on Howard just yet. The eternal Howie never dies.

 

Edited November 8, 2019 by ChristopherReevesLegs

[Jonas Mahonas 1,872]

3 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Zadina has Brendan Smith disease. The good news is we were able to catch it and diagnose him very early, so there is a chance we can still get good value for him.

And Yzerman has no commitment to Holland's draft picks.

So this is the perfect time to sell him.

Personally I'd do my normal TDL deals, then call up Zadina for the remainder of the season. Give him only sheltered minutes on the PP and top line with only offensive zone starts. Build up his perceived value. Then on draft day flip him for a 1st rounder. Then we can take a forward like Lafren or Byfield, and scoop up Askarov with our new acquired Zadina flip pick.

IRL I'm a little cautious about Holtby. That man has already played a lot of hockey in his career and he's starting to project downward. Also his rise and now decent coincides pretty closely with the arrival and departure of Mitch Korn. And we don't have a Mitch Korn. We have a Jeff Saladjokeo or however you spell his name, who's coached: an aging Jimmy Howard, Mrazek, Bernier, Coreau, McCollum, Cal Heeter, Jeff Palmer, Edward Pasquale, and Jake Paterson... a real fine list of quality products there Jeff. We should have never have canned Bednar IMO.

We gotta remember that in front of Howard right now is Patrik Nemeth (Colorado's #6 Dman), Madison Bowey (Washington's #7 Dman), Cholowski (Should arguably still be in the AHL), Joe Hicketts (AHLer), McIlrath (AHLer) Biega (AHLer), and finally Hronek (the only decent Dman).

If I was Howard I would accuse Yzerman of trying to abotage my career by iceing that defence.

Greener coming back tonight should help a lil

Also look at Howard's game-by-game. The first 7 games of the season he has expected normal Howard numbers. Only the last 3 games have the wheels completely come off. I think he's just going through the same confidence crisis the entire team is in right now. I would be pretty upset and frustrated in his shoes right now. The state of the team is unacceptable.

I don't think it's time to panic on Howard just yet. The eternal Howie never dies.

 

Queue up Billy Madison meme...

[gcom007 1,465]

Bernier is the new Howard is the new Average is the new trade bait that will never be. 

[Jonas Mahonas 1,872]

20 hours ago, gcom007 said:

Bernier is the new Howard is the new Average is the new trade bait that will never be. 

Bernier > Average?

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

11 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Bernier > Average?

Yes. It's been discussed already.

[chaps80 1,591]

Bernier just sucks. He should make league minimum.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

On 10/28/2019 at 10:19 AM, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

2019 save percentage game-by-game:

Petr Mrazek

• .917 - good
• .769 - awful
• .895 - average
• 1.00 - amazing
• .692 - awful
• .871 - below average
• 1.00 - amazing

Update since:

• .966 - amazing
• .857 - awful
• .833 - awful
• .931 - good
• .871 - below average
• .938 - good
• .818 - awful
• .913 - good
• .880 - average
• .893 - average

Up n down and all around. And he's losing his job to James Reimer currently. He's momentarily better than Howard, but we really did not miss the boat with this guy.

[chaps80 1,591]

GP   GS    W     L    T   OT    SA    GA     GAA    Sv%  SO     MIN

Mrazek:

20

20

13

6

0

1

528

51

2.60

.903

2

1,177

 

Reimer:

11

10

5

5

0

0

328

27

2.58

.918

1

629

 

Mrazek hasn't lost his job. I wouldn't even say it's his job, it's almost a tandem system like it was with McIllenney last season. He's been thriving since he signed in Carolina and he's a fan favorite...good for him. I know some around here had him pegged to be out of the NHL by now. As for Detroit missing the boat with him, who knows..doesn't really matter. He's long gone, and probably glad he's not part of the current s***show where no goalie has played well, and there's already been four that have seen ice time this season. When Howard comes back Stevie has a choice to make. Comrie has to clear waivers to get sent to GR, and he probably won't clear. I'd like to see Bernier put on waivers instead. I don't see him getting claimed, but i sure wouldn't mind if he was. He is what he is at this point, and what he is is s***ty. 

Edited December 9, 2019 by chaps80

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

13 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

GP   GS    W     L    T   OT    SA    GA     GAA    Sv%  SO     MIN

Mrazek:

20

20

13

6

0

1

528

51

2.60

.903

2

1,177

 

Reimer:

11

10

5

5

0

0

328

27

2.58

.918

1

629

 

Mrazek hasn't lost his job. I wouldn't even say it's his job, it's almost a tandem system like it was with McIllenney last season. He's been thriving since he signed in Carolina and he's a fan favorite...good for him. I know some around here had him pegged to be out of the NHL by now. As for Detroit missing the boat with him, who knows..doesn't really matter. He's long gone, and probably glad he's not part of the current s***show where no goalie has played well, and there's already been four that have seen ice time this season. When Howard comes back Stevie has a choice to make. Comrie has to clear waivers to get sent to GR, and he probably won't clear. I'd like to see Bernier put on waivers instead. I don't see him getting claimed, but i sure wouldn't mind if he was. He is what he is at this point, and what he is is s***ty. 

Just pointing out that Mrazek is basically a B level goalie. Not a legit starter. Glad we got picks for him instead of riding that roller coaster.

[F.Michael 4,590]

All we need to do is drop back a few spots like we always do at the draft lotto, and all our netminding woes will be solved.

[chaps80 1,591]

16 hours ago, F.Michael said:

All we need to do is drop back a few spots like we always do at the draft lotto, and all our netminding woes will be solved.

Can't gamble a 1st on a goalie. There will be UFA options if Yzerman wants to move on from Howard. Gotta see how Comrie fairs and go from there, but playing on this team really isn't a fair evaluation for anyone. Bernier only has one year left, try waivers and if he clears, buy him out. Howard/Comrie or UFA/Comrie. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

2 hours ago, chaps80 said:

Can't gamble a 1st on a goalie. There will be UFA options if Yzerman wants to move on from Howard. Gotta see how Comrie fairs and go from there, but playing on this team really isn't a fair evaluation for anyone. Bernier only has one year left, try waivers and if he clears, buy him out. Howard/Comrie or UFA/Comrie. 

I was with you until you said to buyout Bernier and re-sign Howard... Neither have been very good, but Bernier has been better. Bernier is also 4 years younger with 1 year left on his deal. Regardless how this season plays out, it would be dumb to buyout Bernier. Keep him for one more season, let Howard walk, see how Comrie looks at the end of the season, and either go with Bernier / Comrie, or UFA / Bernier.

I'm hopeful that Comrie can develop into the goaltender he was once projected to be, just a few short years ago.

[chaps80 1,591]

22 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I was with you until you said to buyout Bernier and re-sign Howard... Neither have been very good, but Bernier has been better. Bernier is also 4 years younger with 1 year left on his deal. Regardless how this season plays out, it would be dumb to buyout Bernier. Keep him for one more season, let Howard walk, see how Comrie looks at the end of the season, and either go with Bernier / Comrie, or UFA / Bernier.

I'm hopeful that Comrie can develop into the goaltender he was once projected to be, just a few short years ago.

Yeah, i'd be happy with letting Howard walk and keeping Bernier as well or letting Howard walk and buying out Bernier and picking up a UFA. It really is time for this team to move on from Howard. He's injured every season, came into this one out of shape..i think he might just be going through the motions now with the state of the team in front of him. Finish out the year then part ways. I just don't want to see Comrie as the odd guy out in order to keep either Howard or Bernier. Comrie needs some starts soon, I don't see him being any worse. Pickard doesn't seem to be in Yzerman's plans beyond the AHL and use as an emergency call up, as he traded for Comrie after Pick had one start and shipped him back down. Probably no real confidence in him, not that i blame Stevie on that. Pick is on his 6th NHL team and has barely played since Vegas took him in Expansion draft. 19 NHL games split between 4 teams. He was solid in Colorado, but never got it together after, shame.

19 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Just pointing out that Mrazek is basically a B level goalie. Not a legit starter. Glad we got picks for him instead of riding that roller coaster.

Well, Holland could have qualified him at $4 million for a season or two instead of turning around and giving Bernier $3 million for three seasons. Wouldn't be worse off, but past is the past. Holland didn't like him anyways.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

13 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

Well, Holland could have qualified him at $4 million for a season or two instead of turning around and giving Bernier $3 million for three seasons. Wouldn't be worse off, but past is the past. Holland didn't like him anyways.

Sure, "could've" in a philosophical sense. But I'm pretty certain Mraz wanted off the team anyway.

Holland's mistake with Bernier is independent of Mrazek, but yeah Berns sucks, just not sure what if any alternative was available to Holland at the time.

I know you're a goal guy, I think you and I will be synced up in the next few years on this. I am adamant about addressing the net at this point. Berns sucks and Howie is aging out. If we are to play this smart we have to assume Larsson/Petruzzelli/Eliason/Brattstrom/VPB/Gylander are all big fat mistakes. Address a need until it is no longer a need, and their exists a large need in net.

Edited December 10, 2019 by ChristopherReevesLegs

[chaps80 1,591]

2 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Sure, "could've" in a philosophical sense. But I'm pretty certain Mraz wanted off the team anyway.

Holland's mistake with Bernier is independent of Mrazek, but yeah Berns sucks, just not sure what if any alternative was available to Holland at the time.

I know you're a goal guy, I think you and I will be synced up in the next few years on this. I am adamant about addressing the net at this point. Berns sucks and Howie is aging out. If we are to play this smart we have to assume Larsson/Petruzzelli/Eliason/Brattstrom/VPB/Gylander are all big fat mistakes. Address a need until it is no longer a need, and their exists a large need in net.

Yeah, I think Mrazek wanted off the team as well, move was mutual. The trade to Philly and Holland signing Bernier aren't related, but Holland not wanting to qualify one for a million more than he signed the other for was a weird move. That was Holland's excuse for the trade on his end at the time, the money. I dunno what other options were available other than Bernier at the time either.

The net issue is a huge one. When you have 4 goalies that have seen ice already this season, there's a problem. Don't want to become another Philly with mistake after mistake passing through the system for years and years. None of the guys in the system are close to ready, if they ever will be. Larsson was looking great until this season. Other than him, there's not much promise down there. The team will move on from Howard and Bernier soon enough, and the only option is a reliable UFA starter. Hopefully the backup role can be filled in house, but the team will have to look outside for immediate help going forward. Hopefully no long term big money deals, but if it has to happen then it does. Having a goalie that can steal games for a rebuilding team is pretty key for development of the other players. When 6 pucks cross the line (absolutely unacceptable however you look at it) every night, it just leads to frustration and regression. Seeing Larkin act like he has been is disappointing and he needs to man up and deal with it, but winning games and not losing by 4 or 5 many nights wouldn't hurt. He can't be the only young player that's frustrated, the others just do a better job of hiding it.

 

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

Yeah, I think Mrazek wanted off the team as well, move was mutual. The trade to Philly and Holland signing Bernier aren't related, but Holland not wanting to qualify one for a million more than he signed the other for was a weird move. That was Holland's excuse for the trade on his end at the time, the money. I dunno what other options were available other than Bernier at the time either.

The worst thing that ever happened to Mraz IMO was going to arbitration and getting awarded $4 mil... and then not living up to it. His fate was sealed after that. He basically humiliated his GM.

4 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

The net issue is a huge one. When you have 4 goalies that have seen ice already this season, there's a problem. Don't want to become another Philly with mistake after mistake passing through the system for years and years. None of the guys in the system are close to ready, if they ever will be. Larsson was looking great until this season. Other than him, there's not much promise down there. The team will move on from Howard and Bernier soon enough, and the only option is a reliable UFA starter. Hopefully the backup role can be filled in house, but the team will have to look outside for immediate help going forward. Hopefully no long term big money deals, but if it has to happen then it does. Having a goalie that can steal games for a rebuilding team is pretty key for development of the other players. When 6 pucks cross the line (absolutely unacceptable however you look at it) every night, it just leads to frustration and regression. Seeing Larkin act like he has been is disappointing and he needs to man up and deal with it, but winning games and not losing by 4 or 5 many nights wouldn't hurt. He can't be the only young player that's frustrated, the others just do a better job of hiding it.

I 100% agree. This team is going to be forced to look outside the organization, which is not a good thing, it's a last resort really. We have zero goalie prospects that will be ready anytime soon by all indications, and anyone we draft this year will only take longer...

Except...

There is one...

 

 

 

Askarov

DUN DUN DUNNNNNNN

[chaps80 1,591]

2 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

The worst thing that ever happened to Mraz IMO was going to arbitration and getting awarded $4 mil... and then not living up to it. His fate was sealed after that. He basically humiliated his GM.

I 100% agree. This team is going to be forced to look outside the organization, which is not a good thing, it's a last resort really. We have zero goalie prospects that will be ready anytime soon by all indications, and anyone we draft this year will only take longer...

Except...

There is one...

 

 

 

Askarov

DUN DUN DUNNNNNNN

The thing with Mraz is his overall numbers in Detroit are solid, but he was inconsistent. He flew through the minors and stole the starting job with the big club, at one point in the 2015-16 season he was the best in the league stats wise and in the early Vezina convo. Then something happened. I think opposing teams figured him out, his habit of trying to be a show off and caught out of position, and they capitalized on that. Then he'd just get pissed, and when coaches tried to work with him to correct his erratic style, he'd get even more pissed and blow them off. He'd never really faced adversity in his career till that point. I think Holland not being able to move Howard contributed to his s***ty attitude too. It was all entitlement. He earned that money he got in arbitration, but your right, he never really lived up to it after making a fuss. Then Holland said screw it, your gone. But worse contracts have been handed out. Look at Scott Darling, Carolina signed him to be their number 1 guy after his great play in Chicago, but he never lived up to it. At all. Horrid first season, then banished to the minors for the second and traded in the summer for Reimer. Florida bought him out and made him a UFA no one wanted. He had to go to Austria to take a backup job. Mrazek/Detroit just wasn't in the cards.

Yep, outside the org is really the only way to get someone capable. But with Howard gone that opens up 4 million. If they decide to buy out Bernier, that frees up more to shop with. We'll see how it works out in the offseason, but for now Howard/Bernier/Comrie should finish out the season. I'd rather have it that way. Team isn't doing anything, may as well bottom right out and get the guaranteed top 4 pick. This season is a write off, Yzerman seems to just be using it for evaluation to see what he has to work with.

[F.Michael 4,590]

10 hours ago, chaps80 said:

Can't gamble a 1st on a goalie. There will be UFA options if Yzerman wants to move on from Howard. Gotta see how Comrie fairs and go from there, but playing on this team really isn't a fair evaluation for anyone. Bernier only has one year left, try waivers and if he clears, buy him out. Howard/Comrie or UFA/Comrie. 

I would usually agree - however I expect us to be outta the top 2 - as in 3rd, or 4th after the lotto...That said - is there any other potential 'generational', or 'hi-end' talent other than the Russian kid?

[krsmith17 7,191]

22 minutes ago, F.Michael said:

I would usually agree - however I expect us to be outta the top 2 - as in 3rd, or 4th after the lotto...That said - is there any other potential 'generational', or 'hi-end' talent other than the Russian kid?

Definitely not generational, but high end for sure. Unless we somehow climb the standings and drop back to 6th, I'd be picking one of the forwards or defenseman...

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

Outside of the two goons going top 2, I'll take these goons - in this order:

- Askavov

- Stutzle

- Drysdale

- Raymond

 

[LeftWinger 4,959]

1 hour ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Outside of the two goons going top 2, I'll take these goons - in this order:

- Askavov

- Stutzle

- Drysdale

- Raymond

 

What about Perfetti? I like your list, but man its dangerous taking a G that high...but we must trust Steve if he does!

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

8 hours ago, chaps80 said:

The thing with Mraz is his overall numbers in Detroit are solid, but he was inconsistent. He flew through the minors and stole the starting job with the big club, at one point in the 2015-16 season he was the best in the league stats wise and in the early Vezina convo. Then something happened. I think opposing teams figured him out, his habit of trying to be a show off and caught out of position, and they capitalized on that. Then he'd just get pissed, and when coaches tried to work with him to correct his erratic style, he'd get even more pissed and blow them off. He'd never really faced adversity in his career till that point. I think Holland not being able to move Howard contributed to his s***ty attitude too. It was all entitlement. He earned that money he got in arbitration, but your right, he never really lived up to it after making a fuss. Then Holland said screw it, your gone. But worse contracts have been handed out. Look at Scott Darling, Carolina signed him to be their number 1 guy after his great play in Chicago, but he never lived up to it. At all. Horrid first season, then banished to the minors for the second and traded in the summer for Reimer. Florida bought him out and made him a UFA no one wanted. He had to go to Austria to take a backup job. Mrazek/Detroit just wasn't in the cards.

Yep, outside the org is really the only way to get someone capable. But with Howard gone that opens up 4 million. If they decide to buy out Bernier, that frees up more to shop with. We'll see how it works out in the offseason, but for now Howard/Bernier/Comrie should finish out the season. I'd rather have it that way. Team isn't doing anything, may as well bottom right out and get the guaranteed top 4 pick. This season is a write off, Yzerman seems to just be using it for evaluation to see what he has to work with.

I'd like to see Steve throw money at the position or draft Askarov. It's gonna be depressing for us and for the players to have Howie/Bern in the net again next year. Like you said, it would do a lot for the teams confidence if we went out and got a goalie who can legit backstop the team so they can play.

I think Steve knows he has to address this, and based on his aggressiveness I think he will. He's got a lot of time to scheme between now and July 1st so we'll see what happens. I hope he's a mad man at the TDL this year.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

Another Tuuka tantrum. During a practice sheesh.