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Biggest mistake Red Wings have done


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#41 Carman

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 11:31 AM

If you get rid of all the old guys who do you call up in case of injuries? Depth is importmant and having young guys on two way deals insures that you won't be dressing crap players when it matters. Much like helm played mor playoff games then regular season games, when playoffs come, or the wings are struggling for more then a couple games the best players will be on the ice, or at least should be and have been in the past.

#42 The Axe

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 11:50 AM

 
the fact is hes still been there for 4 years now and hes ready to play in the nhl so we can see what kind of future he can have .... i dont think he will crack the lineup but what if jarnkrok makes the team next season ?? nyquist tatar and andersson are all out of waiver options next year are we suppose to add in jarnkrok nyquist tatar and andersson all next year???
 
Unfortunetly i think tatar and/or nyquist will be traded by the deadline so we wont ever have to deal with that problem
 
i do hope holland comes to his senses in this case and buys out samuelsson next year and lets guys like bertuzzi miller walk ... the kids need to play


Holland would essentially be signing his own pink slip doing that. He made the moves to get these guys.

#43 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 12:50 PM

Something tells me that you are hot for Nyquist, perhaps a bit too much so. It's like, you think he is our future, even though he is relatively unproven at the NHL level. Can't quite put my finger on what gives me that impression.  ;)

 

Samuelsson, Miller, and Bertuzzi have all proven themselves. All three are tougher than Nyquist. It's not like we have a lack of small skilled forwards on the team.

 

bertuzzi isnt nearly as tough as his size would indicate , ever since the moore incident hes never been the same player and he like samuelsson are injury prone and getting close to 40 ... as for miller i like him but he will never be more than a 4th liner  ... we got andersson whos 24 yrs old 6'2 200+ pds who i think will be better and has been showing some offense in grand rapids but we'll never know because he never gets a fair shot ... although he is up now but it wont be for long



#44 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 01:00 PM

If you get rid of all the old guys who do you call up in case of injuries? Depth is importmant and having young guys on two way deals insures that you won't be dressing crap players when it matters. Much like helm played mor playoff games then regular season games, when playoffs come, or the wings are struggling for more then a couple games the best players will be on the ice, or at least should be and have been in the past.

 

well you could leave one of tatar or andersson down for the rest of this year incase and we also have sheahan ....we also have alot of bottom forwards i doubt we would be able to get rid of them all anyways .....

 

franzen zetterberg brunner

 

filppula datsyuk nyquist

 

tatar helm(when he returns) cleary

 

thats what the top 3 lines i personally wish looked like and for the 4th line it would be abdelkader and tootoo and then id keep half of ...

 

bertuzzi samuelsson miller emmerton mursak eaves



Holland would essentially be signing his own pink slip doing that. He made the moves to get these guys.

 

a great gm is also someone who recognizes he made a mistake  ... no one will ever convince me bringing samuelsson back was a good move  .... never liked carlo coliacovo either (seen him in toronto) i realizes hes been hurt but i think we'll regret that one



#45 Red Crazy

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 01:42 PM

Franzen over Hossa is probably one that Holland would like back. Bringing Sammy back and Coliacovo in does not make any sense to me. Coliacovo is made of glass and is not that great of a D- man to take the chance on. I think he was brought in because Holland shot for the moon on Suter and when he missed there was nobody else left. Sammy on the other hand must be a golfing buddy of Kennys because I can't see any other reason to bring him back.

Letting Stevie go to TB was a huge mistake. Holland has done nothing since Yzerman left anyways.



#46 shoobiedoobin

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 01:45 PM

Franzen over Hossa is probably one that Holland would like back. Bringing Sammy back and Coliacovo in does not make any sense to me. Coliacovo is made of glass and is not that great of a D- man to take the chance on. I think he was brought in because Holland shot for the moon on Suter and when he missed there was nobody else left. Sammy on the other hand must be a golfing buddy of Kennys because I can't see any other reason to bring him back.

Letting Stevie go to TB was a huge mistake. Holland has done nothing since Yzerman left anyways.

If we don't see a reason, it must not exist. It can't be that there are things we just don't know.

 

That's not possible.



#47 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 01:48 PM

Franzen over Hossa is probably one that Holland would like back. Bringing Sammy back and Coliacovo in does not make any sense to me. Coliacovo is made of glass and is not that great of a D- man to take the chance on. I think he was brought in because Holland shot for the moon on Suter and when he missed there was nobody else left. Sammy on the other hand must be a golfing buddy of Kennys because I can't see any other reason to bring him back.

Letting Stevie go to TB was a huge mistake. Holland has done nothing since Yzerman left anyways.

 

Sammy and Coliacovo definitely felt like patchwork moves at best after the Suter/Parise madness. 

 

Some of them have certainly worked out but Holland's penchant for bringing back former wings is almost pathological.  I don't know if it's a lack of imagination or he's just overly fond of former Wings. 

 

I mean, Jason Williams.  Really?



#48 GoWings1905

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 02:03 PM

If we don't see a reason, it must not exist. It can't be that there are things we just don't know.
 
That's not possible.


What is there to know? Holland signed an aging veteran for multiple years when the team already had a glut at forward. What is Samuelsson's role when he comes back? He's not fit for the bottom six and he's a plug at best with Datsyuk and Filppula, just like Bertuzzi and Cleary are playing there. I liked or was neutral on the guys Holland brought in over the summer, but the Samuelsson move is puzzling and IMO pointless still.
 
 
"To whom much is given, much is expected."
 
 

 

 

 

 


#49 shoobiedoobin

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 02:24 PM

What is there to know? Holland signed an aging veteran for multiple years when the team already had a glut at forward. What is Samuelsson's role when he comes back? He's not fit for the bottom six and he's a plug at best with Datsyuk and Filppula, just like Bertuzzi and Cleary are playing there. I liked or was neutral on the guys Holland brought in over the summer, but the Samuelsson move is puzzling and IMO pointless still.

What's there to know? Exactly. We wouldn't know everything, we don't see everything Holland sees and we sure as hell don't take everything into account when we overreact to something our entitled asses don't agree with. All we see is HAHA LOGO KILLER and we love that, so we lean towards it. We don't bother to think about the fact that we just lost Jiri Hudler and Brunner wasn't a sure thing at all. Not to mention Sammy doesn't take bad penalties, he's pretty disciplined. He also can put up 40-50 points, work the PP, and has experience. He's proven himself, on a team where we were about to bring up a lot of kids who haven't yet. Better to sign Sammy and let them work their way up gradually. What if they didn't work out? There's also the intangibles that we pretend to care about in other scenarios but really don't when it denies us our new toy-how he works with the team, how good it makes the team look that we'll take a guy back, etc.

 

If we traded for him, that'd be one thing. But we signed him. All it did was deny one AHL kid a spot for the majority of one season, maybe two. What it got us was a proven smart, good player with experience who can score well and plays better in the playoffs. And it's 3 mil, it's not a lot. Look at some other players making that much (I don't mean young underpaid guys due a raise). Joel Ward. Nah no thanks. Chris Kelly, Tomas Kopecky, and a few others. Then you have some decent guys like Dustin Brown, Radim Vrbata, Weiss, Jokinen, etc. You can debate who is better but none of them are leaps above Sammy. We just can't admit that part of the hate came from his undeserved status as whipping boy. And we don't like ex players coming back who we didn't like before, that's boring. You combine those two things and Sammy didn't stand a chance. But it's not a bad deal.


Edited by shoobiedoobin, 13 February 2013 - 02:24 PM.


#50 ogreslayer

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 02:33 PM

 
Something tells me that you are hot for Nyquist, perhaps a bit too much so. It's like, you think he is our future, even though he is relatively unproven at the NHL level. Can't quite put my finger on what gives me that impression.  ;)
 
Samuelsson, Miller, and Bertuzzi have all proven themselves. All three are tougher than Nyquist. It's not like we have a lack of small skilled forwards on the team.


I still hold the opinion that if there would have been a full season with a full training camp & pre-season with it, the team would look significantly different. Instead of ragging on Kenny, I think he deserves credit for bringing in some known-qualities veteran players to in essense enhance the organizational depth they'll need to make it through the season.

#51 Nightfall

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 04:59 PM

The Devils have 3 cups and 5 cup appearances since 1995. Not too far behind.

 

We can also nitpick the crappy mistakes they have made as well.  Trust me, there are just as many as the Wings have.



Franzen over Hossa is probably one that Holland would like back. Bringing Sammy back and Coliacovo in does not make any sense to me. Coliacovo is made of glass and is not that great of a D- man to take the chance on. I think he was brought in because Holland shot for the moon on Suter and when he missed there was nobody else left. Sammy on the other hand must be a golfing buddy of Kennys because I can't see any other reason to bring him back.

Letting Stevie go to TB was a huge mistake. Holland has done nothing since Yzerman left anyways.

 

Hrm, Holland made the team that won the cup in 2008 and his decisions helped take the team to the finals in 2009.  Yzerman was an influence, but not the decision maker.



I still hold the opinion that if there would have been a full season with a full training camp & pre-season with it, the team would look significantly different. Instead of ragging on Kenny, I think he deserves credit for bringing in some known-qualities veteran players to in essense enhance the organizational depth they'll need to make it through the season.

 

I agree.  Its a shame that a majority of fans here won't.


Edited by Nightfall, 13 February 2013 - 05:00 PM.

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#52 Red Crazy

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 05:32 PM

If we don't see a reason, it must not exist. It can't be that there are things we just don't know.

 

That's not possible.

That is true we don't know what Holland is thinking but this is a topic about bad moves. Bringing Sammy back appears to be just that. I hope I am wrong.



#53 Red Crazy

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 05:38 PM

Sammy and Coliacovo definitely felt like patchwork moves at best after the Suter/Parise madness. 

 

Some of them have certainly worked out but Holland's penchant for bringing back former wings is almost pathological.  I don't know if it's a lack of imagination or he's just overly fond of former Wings. 

 

I mean, Jason Williams.  Really?

LOL I had forgot about Williams! I could see Sammy on a one year deal if Holland was still unsure on the development of Gus and Tatar but for 2 years? 


Edited by Red Crazy, 13 February 2013 - 05:38 PM.


#54 Playmaker

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 06:06 PM

That is true we don't know what Holland is thinking but this is a topic about bad moves. Bringing Sammy back appears to be just that. I hope I am wrong.

 

My guess is Sammy was brought in to be a depth forward who can chip in 10-15 goals per year and can play the point on the PP.  How is it that this deal is already doomed to be a failure when he has only played one game? 

 

Every GM on every team in every sport has made what looks to be bad moves.  Its the nature of the business.  I think the Red Wings' success speaks for itself.  Deals that look like no brainers can be utter failures and deals that look totally ridiculous can turn out to look absolutely brilliant. 

 

I mean really, who thought trading for Jimmy Carson would be a bad move?  We rid ourselves of underacheiver Joe Murphy, aging malcontent Petr Klima and some nice kid, but destined to be career 4th liner Adam Graves.  We got a hometown kid who was a proven 50 goal scorer and still very young.  The Wings looked set for years to come.Well, we all know how that turned out.   It's soooo easy to make trades and moves on paper.


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#55 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 06:51 PM

My guess is Sammy was brought in to be a depth forward who can chip in 10-15 goals per year and can play the point on the PP.  How is it that this deal is already doomed to be a failure when he has only played one game? 

 

Every GM on every team in every sport has made what looks to be bad moves.  Its the nature of the business.  I think the Red Wings' success speaks for itself.  Deals that look like no brainers can be utter failures and deals that look totally ridiculous can turn out to look absolutely brilliant. 

 

I mean really, who thought trading for Jimmy Carson would be a bad move?  We rid ourselves of underacheiver Joe Murphy, aging malcontent Petr Klima and some nice kid, but destined to be career 4th liner Adam Graves.  We got a hometown kid who was a proven 50 goal scorer and still very young.  The Wings looked set for years to come.Well, we all know how that turned out.   It's soooo easy to make trades and moves on paper.

 

The two Adam trades were probably the most painful in all my years of watching the Wings.  Graves and Oates. 



#56 The Axe

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:33 PM

 
The two Adam trades were probably the most painful in all my years of watching the Wings.  Graves and Oates. 


Funny thing is when you think about scenarios where you get every good player in a lot of successive moves and dont miss out on opportunity. The Oilers might be still developing, but damn. They are not meshing all their fortune well at all.

#57 Playmaker

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:37 PM

Funny thing is when you think about scenarios where you get every good player in a lot of successive moves and dont miss out on opportunity. The Oilers might be still developing, but damn. They are not meshing all their fortune well at all.

Understood the reasoning with the Graves trade...but when the real reason came out about the Oates trade, that was unforgivable...



#58 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 09:08 PM

absolutely loving tonights game ! the kids are everywhere tonight! its unfortunate that it took all these injuries for them to get a chance but im hoping its opening up holland and babcock's eyes



#59 LeftWinger

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 12:02 AM

Our desire for new toys doesn't negate the fact that the loyalty we show is very appealing to players. We don't treat our players like video game characters or trading cards and that makes us look very good. We take care of our guys.

 

Obviously not anymore...it is not as appealing to UFA's when you don't Have Lidstrom's, Shanahan's, Yzerman's or Hasek's on your team anymore...that was well apparent this off season. NOT ONE top UFA signed here. Not one. Used to be, everyone had Detroit on their short list...those days are gone.  Long gone.


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Nestrasil, yes...Cleary....No!

Dump Q and K Now!


#60 mjtm77

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 01:11 PM

waste the last couple of years of the greatest d-man of this generation with a middling roster.

!


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