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Jedi

Holland says those dreaded words, "Our Deadline Addition"

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Holland, Stan Bowman and Paul Holmgren sat down for a conversation with ESPN's Pierre LeBrun regarding possible trade mindsets for their respective teams.

When the conversation came around to the Red Wings needs, Kenny Holland says the phrase we all know we LOVE to hear... (emphasis mine)

Just getting healthy, if that ever happens, will be like making a few trades for Detroit, which has yet to play with a fully healthy lineup this season.

"If we can get all our guys back, that’s almost like a deadline addition or two," Holland said.

LeBrun wraps up the Wings section nicely by pointing out the Wings would like a top-4 D man, but that might be hard to get come deadline time. I'd recommend giving the full story a read.

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Holland is a broken record.

"The powerplay is our enforcer"

"We like our team"

"Getting our injured guys back is our deadline addition"

"Our prospects are overripe in the minors"

Edited by GMRwings1983
Hockeymom1960, Ally, esteef and 4 others like this

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I did, and I threw up in my mouth a little. Anyone who thinks we'll be just fine when our injury list clears out is living in La-La Land. Filpulla isn't producing, Bert's not going to do much coming off of a major back injury, Franzen is useless, Sammy's constantly hurt, Cleary just sucks, Abby sucks in a 2nd-line role, and Tatar and Andersson are making the most of their time but not getting enough of it. This team has a REAL need at forward. We have no consistent scorer. Not one. We haven't since Hossa left. No one that has proved they can score goals night-in and night-out. Brunner has been a nice surprise, but he hasn't gotten on the scoresheet in a little while. No one has, to be honest. How Holland can sit there and sit on his hands when this team cannot score goals consistently is beyond me.

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I just hope he is trying to play mind games.

But history has shown otherwise.

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Holland is a broken record.

"The powerplay is our enforcer"

"We like our team"

"Getting our injured guys back is our deadline addition"

"Our prospects are overripe in the minors"

He hasn't said the first one in years. All season long he's called our current team a work in progress and even hinted at missing the playoffs, so I doubt he "likes his team". Getting Helm, Bertuzzi, and Sammuelsson back IS like a deadline acquisition. And many of our prospects ARE over ripe in the minors, hence they're (Tatar, Mrazek, Lashoff, and Andersson) having a real positive impact while being injury call ups.

Whether Holland makes a move or not (I hope he does), you're being wildly reactionary with this statement, presumably because you're frustrated at the lack of success this team is encountering. I share that frustration and think there are many things to criticize Holland about, but these statements aren't really very legitimate criticisms.

Travis likes this

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I just hope he is trying to play mind games.

But history has shown otherwise.

Scary, isn't it? That not only may he be serious, he probably is?

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Mrazek is what 19 20? That's not overripe lmao.

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Funny, I was recently joking with a friend of mine who's a Flyer fan that Holland would say this garbage again.

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I think trade prices have steadily been growing steeper and steeper. I'm almost scared at the possibility of Holland making a deal, because I'm worried about what may be going the other way.

Additionally, I wish we were able to see our team play completely healthy, just so we could get a realistic assessment of where our team stands. It's tough to assume what the Wings will look like, even when we know what style of play each injured player has.

redwings15, kipwinger and Nev like this

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Kenny reminds me of Michigan Governer's....everytime they want to raise taxes on stuff it's always for "The Roads."

Kenny, the only reason I have no big issue this season is because you really don't have anyone to trade that would bring back a star player... Flip and Franzine would get you a nice pick and that is about it. But please, PLEASE, find another phrase to use...

I see no addition(s) at the deadline. Helm is done for the season, Bertuzzi possibly until playoffs (if we make it) and Sammy makes no difference.

hey, at least he said "almost like a deadline addition"

but anyhow:

post-2879-0-39826200-1362517641_thumb.png

Edited by LeftWinger

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The parity era has, as was made obvious last season, made deadline prices prohibitive to most teams.

With that, I'm done with this thread, because the level of negativity herein is overwhelming.

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Kenny reminds me of Michigan Governer's....everytime they want to raise taxes on stuff it's always for "The Roads."

Kenny, the only reason I have no big issue this season is because you really don't have anyone to trade that would bring back a star player... Flip and Franzine would get you a nice pick and that is about it. But please, PLEASE, find another phrase to use...

I see no addition(s) at the deadline. Helm is done for the season, Bertuzzi possibly until playoffs (if we make it) and Sammy makes no difference.

Why do you always think that we need star players? When you have star centers you don't also need star wingers, you need quality wingers who can support Datsyuk and Zetterberg and provide supplemental scoring.

James Neal and Alex Burrows aren't star wingers in their own right, they're quality wingers who have big success because they play with elite centers. That's what we need here. The equal but opposite is also true, if you've already got star wingers, then you can use quality centers to support them. In the salary cap world it's nearly impossible to have both of any length of time. Teams that have both, like Chicago, are an anomaly.

Edited by kipwinger
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Why do you always think that we need star players? When you have star centers you don't also need star wingers, you need quality wingers who can support Datsyuk and Zetterberg and provide supplemental scoring.

James Neal and Alex Burrows aren't star wingers in their own right, they're quality wingers who have big success because they play with elite centers. That's what we need here. The equal but opposite is also true, if you've already got star wingers, then you can use quality centers to support them. In the salary cap world it's nearly impossible to have both of any length of time. Teams that have both, like Chicago, are an anomaly.

I am just saying that they won't bring you what was once expected in return...I think we could hope for a pick at best. I agree with you about the stars, but we do need another winger that can twitch the twines... I am not expecting much this year, but next year I hope that Tatar is on the top 6 and a 40-50 goal scorer as well...

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The parity era has, as was made obvious last season, made deadline prices prohibitive to most teams.

With that, I'm done with this thread, because the level of negativity herein is overwhelming.

Why so negative on negativity? ;)

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He hasn't said the first one in years. All season long he's called our current team a work in progress and even hinted at missing the playoffs, so I doubt he "likes his team". Getting Helm, Bertuzzi, and Sammuelsson back IS like a deadline acquisition. And many of our prospects ARE over ripe in the minors, hence they're (Tatar, Mrazek, Lashoff, and Andersson) having a real positive impact while being injury call ups.

Whether Holland makes a move or not (I hope he does), you're being wildly reactionary with this statement, presumably because you're frustrated at the lack of success this team is encountering. I share that frustration and think there are many things to criticize Holland about, but these statements aren't really very legitimate criticisms.

Just Helm. This team misses him more than anyone.

Bertuzzi plays well once every 7 games or so. He's an old man and not part of the future anyway. People are forgetting how often he floats and how frequently half the forum complains about his play.

Samuelsson was a bad signing to begin with. I still don't know where he fits in on this roster.

Carlo Coca-Cola wouldn't crack the top 6 anyway.

Filppula being out hurts, but he hasn't been out long-term.

Edited by GMRwings1983

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I am just saying that they won't bring you what was once expected in return...I think we could hope for a pick at best. I agree with you about the stars, but we do need another winger that can twitch the twines... I am not expecting much this year, but next year I hope that Tatar is on the top 6 and a 40-50 goal scorer as well...

We have plenty enough assets to get what we need, IMO. Which is, a big minute stay at home d-man to play with Kronwall on the top pair, and a big(ish) winger who can chip in supplemental scoring. For the sake of argument I'll say Blake Wheeler and Ladislav Smid. You could also swap these guys for Nino Niederreiter, Troy Brouwer, Sam Gagne on offense, and Mark Stuart, Henrik Tallinder, Robyn Regehr, or Anton Volchenkov on defense. And best of all, pretty much any of these guys could be had for a combination of prospects, picks, and lower level roster players. Then you simply move our throw away guys like White, Colaiacovo, Sammy, Eaves, Kindl, Miller, Abby, Cleary, etc. for the picks you lose landing the impact players.

Wheeler-Datsyuk-Flip

Brunner-Z-Franzen

Kronwall-Smid

Smith-Ericsson

To me this looks a hell of a lot better than what we're fielding right now. Fill in the bottom six/bottom defensive pairings however you want.

Just Helm. This team misses him more than anyone.

Bertuzzi plays well once every 7 games or so. He's an old man and not part of the future anyway. People are forgetting how often he floats and how frequently half the forum complains about his play.

Samuelsson was a bad signing to begin with. I still don't know where he fits in on this roster.

Carlo Coca-Cola wouldn't crack the top 6 anyway.

Filppula being out hurts, but he hasn't been out long-term.

If you honestly think we're a better team with Cleary and Abby in the top six rather than Sammy and Bert then I'm not going to argue with you. I still maintain that while Holland should make a move or two, the addition of those guys makes our team considerably more competitive than it is now. And given that the point of trading is to make your team better than it is now, there's nothing misleading about Holland's comments.

Edited by kipwinger

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We have plenty enough assets to get what we need, IMO. Which is, a big minute stay at home d-man to play with Kronwall on the top pair, and a big(ish) winger who can chip in supplemental scoring. For the sake of argument I'll say Blake Wheeler and Ladislav Smid. You could also swap these guys for Nino Niederreiter, Troy Brouwer, Sam Gagne on offense, and Mark Stuart, Henrik Tallinder, Robyn Regehr, or Anton Volchenkov on defense. And best of all, pretty much any of these guys could be had for a combination of prospects, picks, and lower level roster players. Then you simply move our throw away guys like White, Colaiacovo, Sammy, Eaves, Kindl, Miller, Abby, Cleary, etc. for the picks you lose landing the impact players.

Wheeler-Datsyuk-Flip

Brunner-Z-Franzen

Kronwall-Smid

Smith-Ericsson

To me this looks a hell of a lot better than what we're fielding right now. Fill in the bottom six/bottom defensive pairings however you want.

If you honestly think we're a better team with Cleary and Abby in the top six rather than Sammy and Bert then I'm not going to argue with you. I still maintain that while Holland should make a move or two, the addition of those guys makes our team considerably more competitive than it is now. And given that the point of trading is to make your team better than it is now, there's nothing misleading about Holland's comments.

Filppula and Tatar should be in the top 6. Not old man Sammy and old man Bertuzzi.

I don't think Cleary and Abdelkader should be on the team, period. We can find cheap crap on the market that puts up similar numbers with similar icetime that those players are getting.

Edited by GMRwings1983
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Filppula and Tatar should be in the top 6. Not old man Sammy and old man Bertuzzi.

I don't think Cleary and Abdelkader should be on the team, period. We can find cheap crap on the market that puts up similar numbers with similar icetime that those players are getting.

So you think the top six and be stabilized by players already on the roster, but who are either injured (Flip) or could be freed up to play in the top six once an injured player returns (Tatar)? That sounds almost exactly like what Holland was saying to Pierre LeBrun in the conversation linked above.

For the record, I agree with you about Abby and Cleary, and I do believe Holland should make a move (see my post to Leftwinger above) to solidify the top six. But barring that, I still think that the return of Bert and Sammy makes us a better team than we are right now. Even if you have to put Bert and Sammy on the third line after you promote Tatar and Andersson goes back to GR.

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So you think the top six and be stabilized by players already on the roster, but who are either injured (Flip) or could be freed up to play in the top six once an injured player returns (Tatar)? That sounds almost exactly like what Holland was saying to Pierre LeBrun in the conversation linked above.

For the record, I agree with you about Abby and Cleary, and I do believe Holland should make a move (see my post to Leftwinger above) to solidify the top six. But barring that, I still think that the return of Bert and Sammy makes us a better team than we are right now. Even if you have to put Bert and Sammy on the third line after you promote Tatar and Andersson goes back to GR.

Not really. That's what I'd do if Holland doesn't make any moves (like I anticipate).

But I still think we need a top 6 winger and a top 4 defenseman. But who's going to give us those? We have nothing to trade really. Holland has set this team back with unnecessary signings, a poor trade last season, and not getting any significant signings coming back.

Now we're in this position, where getting Sammy and Bertuzzi back is supposed to excite us somehow, because we're unlikely to get anything better from another team. Yikes.

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Not really. That's what I'd do if Holland doesn't make any moves (like I anticipate).

But I still think we need a top 6 winger and a top 4 defenseman. But who's going to give us those? We have nothing to trade really. Holland has set this team back with unnecessary signings, a poor trade last season, and not getting any significant signings coming back.

Now we're in this position, where getting Sammy and Bertuzzi back is supposed to excite us somehow, because we're unlikely to get anything better from another team. Yikes.

I disagree that we don't have anything to trade, we've got a lot to trade in terms of picks and prospects, and considering the cap is going down next year picks and prospects (that have shown something) are more valuable than ever. Take a team like New Jersey for example, they have to resign Elias, Zidlicky, Clarkson, Henrique, Ponikarovsky, Liktionov, and they're going to have less cap space to do it. Surely, they'd consider moving Volchenkov and his 4.5 million dollar cap hit in order to facilitate that. Especially considering they've already got a glut of NHL ready defensemen. Tatar and a 3rd would come close to getting it done. They'd get a pick and a cheap winger who can contribute immediately, we'd get a top four defenseman to play with Kronwall, and we'd lose a good prospect but not one who's integral to the future of this team. Then we move White or whoever to replace the pick we lost.

Edited by kipwinger
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"We like our team."

Won one playoff game with Nick Lidstrom.

As stated above, Holland has been saying all year that this team is a work in progress and that it might not even make the playoffs. Not once has he said "we like our team". Your criticism is noted yet completely erroneous and misguided. If you want to criticize Holland focus on things like how he lacked a long term vision for how we'd transition into the post Lidstrom era, or how he consistently lowballs helpful free agents because he's cheap and afraid of the cap. It's pointless to keep parroting something he said years ago when we were frequently competing for cups.

Edited by kipwinger
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