150 replies to this topic

[nyqvististhefuture]

if we can get the last pick of the draft for miller id do it any 4-7th round pick id do it and give andersson a few shots and hope for the best

 

as for trading abdelkader yes hes having a rough season but he just turned 26 and plays a gritty game its far too early to give up on him just yet

[JasonNewEra]

I'll try to dissect this. Abby, Eaves, and Miller haven't been pulling their contract weight?

 

Abby (4th line center) 1.8m this season, while filling in on the top 6 while we're injured as hell. Works on the forecheck, tries to disrupt to corners, and is one of the only people that can win a puck battle and get it back to the D on the powerplay. Previous seasons of 19pts/22pts for a 4th line center. Certainly isn't pulling his weight....

 

Eaves (4th line winger) 1.2m this season, coming off of an injury that held him sidelined for a year. Comes back, and fits in good. Works the forecheck, can work as an energetic winger and one of our BEST penalty killers. Previous seasons of 26pts/14pts. Certainly isn't pulling his weight....

 

Miller (4th line winger) 837,500 this season. Outstanding penalty killer, role player, and occasionally pots em. Previous seasons of 19pts/18pts/25pts with an upward trajectory. Certainly isn't pulling his weight

 

So you're telling me you would roll out under 4m within 3 outstanding role players and just let them crawl away to waivers... thank GOD you're not GM of ANY team. 

 

Next point with the East. Stiffer competition? What the HELL? Where have you been? The West has been dominate of the East. We have closer playoff races, the point totals are closer, the skill level is elevated. The West is the rougher conference, and we'll be moving to the East that will cut travel down significantly. So magically, going to an weaker conference and getting less travel is going to equate to stiffer competition? Just doesn't add up.

 

Okay, so let's try the, "What have you done for me lately?" angle.

 

Danny Cleary - $2.8 Mil - 26 GP / 5 G/ 2 A / 7 PTs / -4 / 2nd LINE

 

Abdelkader - $1.8 Mil - 26 GP / 1 G / 1 A / 2 PTs / -3 / 2nd LINE

 

Eaves - $1.2 Mil - 18 GP / 1 G/ 5 A / 6 PTs / +5 / 3rd LINE

 

Miller - $837,500 - 26 GP/ 2 G / 3 A / 5 PTs / 0 / 4th LINE

 

Tatar - $840,000 Cap hit / NHL Salary - $600,000 - 18 GP / 4 G / 3 A / 7 PTs / +2 / 3rd LINE (Now gone.)

 

I understand the things they do on the ice count into it, but it ISN'T WORKING, the numbers don't lie. Are they on the wrong lines? Oh yes, I agree but, we needed a change and I personally don't think this was the right one is all.

Edited by JasonNewEra, 12 March 2013 - 11:22 PM.

[HIFI_canadian]

That was a really stupid response from Babcock on Mlive. You're sending Tatar down because he wouldn't get enough powerplay time? Did I read that correctly? Yes, I get it Flipps is better however keep him on the 3rd line and he will develop with Tootoo and Miller. 

 

All this talk of Tatar not good defensively is true however does anyone remember how awful Zetterberg was defensively in his rookie year? What about Datsyuk? it took him more then one season to become a 2-way forward. He needs more time to develop, heck Brunner is probably the worse when it comes to forechecking. 

 

I think it's something more then "Powerplay time". It has to be a trade bait thing with Nyquist or Flippula because I cannot think of any other reason.

[number9]

Mike Brown is a great fighter, though.  Edmonton must have felt they needed some toughness.  So he had some value to them.  Pretty solid hitter too.    

 

I can see some team coughing something up for Cleary based on past playoff performances, but they wouldn't be doing their homework if they did.  Abby is young, which is the only thing I can envision a team seeing in him.  

 

I know I'm no GM, but I wouldn't trade any picks for those players if I'm running another team.  I'd call up my own guys from the minors instead.     

Brown over his last 66 games (2 seasons): 6 pts, 153 hits
Cleary last years 75 games: 33 pts, 90 hits
Abby last years 81 games: 22 pts, 148 hits
Miller: last years 80 games: 25 pts, 79 hits

Abby looks identical minus the fighting. Cleary is a great secondary scorer with half the hits. Miller had only 79 hits but he more than quadrupedal Brown's scoring.

Cleary can PK, PP, skate, add work ethic, and a little scoring (thought he's been slow to start this year)
Abby can PK, hit, and skate
Miller, can PK and skate

just to say all 3 can PK effectively is worth a 7th rounder to someone out there IMO

I'll say I would never have asked a 4th rounder for brown though. great fighter, but that's overpriced

[Euro_Twins]

Brown over his last 66 games (2 seasons): 6 pts, 153 hits
Cleary last years 75 games: 33 pts, 90 hits
Abby last years 81 games: 22 pts, 148 hits
Miller: last years 80 games: 25 pts, 79 hits

Abby looks identical minus the fighting. Cleary is a great secondary scorer with half the hits. Miller had only 79 hits but he more than quadrupedal Brown's scoring.

Cleary can PK, PP, skate, add work ethic, and a little scoring (thought he's been slow to start this year)
Abby can PK, hit, and skate
Miller, can PK and skate

just to say all 3 can PK effectively is worth a 7th rounder to someone out there IMO

I'll say I would never have asked a 4th rounder for brown though. great fighter, but that's overpriced

 

cleary can skate?

[darkmanx]

That was a really stupid response from Babcock on Mlive. You're sending Tatar down because he wouldn't get enough powerplay time? Did I read that correctly? Yes, I get it Flipps is better however keep him on the 3rd line and he will develop with Tootoo and Miller. 

 

All this talk of Tatar not good defensively is true however does anyone remember how awful Zetterberg was defensively in his rookie year? What about Datsyuk? it took him more then one season to become a 2-way forward. He needs more time to develop, heck Brunner is probably the worse when it comes to forechecking. 

 

I think it's something more then "Powerplay time". It has to be a trade bait thing with Nyquist or Flippula because I cannot think of any other reason.

 

It was just a lame excuse. They could fit him on the 2nd line but Babcock wants Abby there so he can turn over the puck and not stand in front of the net half the time. They should have kept Tatar up and went with

 

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Franzen

Brunner - Kronwall

 

Tatar - Flip - Nyquist

Smith - Kindl

 

Now that is a lot better than having a career 4th liner with 2 points on it that has proven he hasn't done a damn thing with that time already this year.

[WINGS & FLOW]

cleary can skate?

 I was wondering about that too.  Maybe 3 years ago

[Z Winged Dangler]

It was just a lame excuse. They could fit him on the 2nd line but Babcock wants Abby there so he can turn over the puck and not stand in front of the net half the time. They should have kept Tatar up and went with

 

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Franzen

Brunner - Kronwall

 

Tatar - Flip - Nyquist

Smith - Kindl

 

Now that is a lot better than having a career 4th liner with 2 points on it that has proven he hasn't done a damn thing with that time already this year.

 2014 is gonna rock ass if we use our assets like that and don't bring back tampons like Cleary and White.  I'm excited for the future of this team.

[NyquistianDeke]

What do you think we could get in return now for Miller, Abdelkader or Cleary?  I have a hard time seeing GM's giving up anything for those plugs.

 

I don't think we should waive all those players (because of injuries), but from a talent standpoint, it will hardly be a loss.  Would a guy like Callahan really do worse than Miller has on the 4th line this season?  How many fewer points could he produce? 

 

Therein lies the problem. To many people think hockey is simply about the points.  A player like Miller has value because of the little things he does that don't show up in stat lines

 

Of course Tatar is the better player. Of course Tatar deserves to be up.. but as was said this was a business move.  We now know what we have in Tatar, its time to see what we have in Nyquist.  While that takes place a few other pieces will be moved and either later this season or next year Tatar will be up for good.

[akustyk]

tough call to make, I'd say Tatar > Andersson and Emerton, but that's just my $0.02

I don't  necessary agree with him being the best forward, but the kid has pure offensive talent, something this team badly needs

[akustyk]

 I was wondering about that too.  Maybe 3 years ago

I don't get this Cleary hate. the guy is a tiger along the boards and one of the hardest working Wings players, absolutely invaluable on forecheck. he's like total opposite of Franzen: few points but huge game without the puck. 

[Euro_Twins]

I don't get this Cleary hate. the guy is a tiger along the boards and one of the hardest working Wings players, absolutely invaluable on forecheck. he's like total opposite of Franzen: few points but huge game without the puck. 

 

He only seems that way cause he is using the boards and the players to hold himself up from falling

[number9]

Cleary's no Helm but his skating is definitely not a liability. He holds his own.

[Z Winged Dangler]

I don't get this Cleary hate. the guy is a tiger along the boards and one of the hardest working Wings players, absolutely invaluable on forecheck. he's like total opposite of Franzen: few points but huge game without the puck. 

 Cleary has 100% tunnel vision.  When he shoots it's usually from the side boards directly into the bread basket and his hands are made of stone.  Someone with zero offensive creativity should be on the 2nd line, and if someone like that is put on a line with Pavelf****** Datsyuk, you expect more than a few points in like 13 games.  I'd rather see Cleary get picked up off waivers than Tatar go down to GR again.

[Opie]

I think it will be real interesting when the roster expands who actually plays and who is a black ace!

 

I think Babs likes the young guys and if up to him would play them more.

[WINGS & FLOW]

I don't get this Cleary hate. the guy is a tiger along the boards and one of the hardest working Wings players, absolutely invaluable on forecheck. he's like total opposite of Franzen: few points but huge game without the puck. 

Do you even watch the Wings games?  Just because he works hard doesnt meen he worth 2.8mil or blongs in the NHL. 

If hes so great on the forecheck, why doesnt he create turn overs and set up his line mates all the time? Helm does.

[Detroit # 1 Fan]

Helene St. James ‏@HeleneStJames

Am hearing Gustav Nyquist is on the chopping block for lineup tonight if Jordin Tootoo does play. #RedWings #Flames

 

Strange tweet by Helene St James a short while ago, what exactly does chopping block mean in this sense? Trade bait?

[evilzyme]

Helene St. James ‏@HeleneStJames

Am hearing Gustav Nyquist is on the chopping block for lineup tonight if Jordin Tootoo does play. #RedWings #Flames

 

Strange tweet by Helene St James a short while ago, what exactly does chopping block mean in this sense? Trade bait?

 

Chopping block is usually meaning they're on the hot plate... aka they're the one to get cut. Trading block would be the term you're referring to. In that context, Helene is just saying if Tootoo does play, Goose is the odd man out, which is dumb.

[FlashyG]

I think it will be real interesting when the roster expands who actually plays and who is a black ace!

 

I think Babs likes the young guys and if up to him would play them more.

 

I couldn't disagree more its 100% up to Babcock who plays and who doesn't. Babcock is the reason Tatar didn't get any top 6 time, He's the reason Nyquist was in the minors for the majority of this season, and he's the reason Abdelkader is still in the top 6 tonight.

 

Babcock doesn't trust younger players like he does guys like Cleary. So I wouldn't hold my breath hoping for him to all the sudden have a change of heart.

[Barrie]

I think I understand how with Nyquist called up, Tatar is the one sent down. I'm sure the decision isn't based on Tatar's play, but it's to help Grand Rapids. Add to that Tatar can get top line minutes again.

 

With that said I don't agree with it, but I understand. I am looking forward to watching Nyquist play.