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unsaddleddonald

Ray Shero making the NHL his *****

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In the last week or so, there have been really only 3 higher end trades made and all of them include Pittsburgh.

If there was one team that DIDN'T need to make a move, it was probably Pittsburgh.

He has added one big defenseman and two long time captains and what has he given up? One top prospect (none of their top 5 prospects) and crap picks. NO roster players given up.

Ray Shero is the best GM in hockey. Granted Sidney Crosby fell into his lap and if the 04-05 lockout didn't happen Crosby most likely would have been drafted somewhere else, but that is a different argument.

Uhh, OK. Malkin fell into his lap also. So he started off with Malkin and Crosby to begin with, and also had the 2nd-overall pick in his first draft as Penguins GM. He used that pick to draft Jordan Staal instead of Toews, Backstrom, Giroux, or Kessel.

Whatever the case, anyone who starts off with Malkin and Crosby will be successful. Neither the fact that he made a bunch of trades this season nor the ripoff he pulled on Dallas last season qualify him as the best GM in the league.

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I am still trying to figure out how Fleury is a weak goalie. He has won a Stanley Cup before. Its not like he choked against the Wings in 2009.

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Neal - Crosby - Iginla

Morrow - Malkin - Kunitz

Cooke - Sutter - Dupuis

Glass - Kennedy - Adams

Letang - Orpik

Niskanen - Martin

Despres - Murray

Even if we make the finals against PIT, we can't compete with that.... although u never know these days

The Wings' 2009 team would have been absolutely unbeatable without injuries. Anything can happen.

A lot of people said that about Chicago too after their Cup Fire Sale, and they are still hanging around OK. (surprisingly). I have a feeling the Pens will survive just fine. (Unfortunately).

They very, very nearly missed the playoffs in 2011.

I am still trying to figure out how Fleury is a weak goalie. He has won a Stanley Cup before. Its not like he choked against the Wings in 2009.

I don't remember another goalie ever having as bad a playoff series as he had in 2012.

edicius likes this

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Ya if he goes for top dollar, which I expect he will, Pittsburgh will have to let Iggy walk. The funny thing about Malkin is he's a much better player when Crosby is out of the lineup. Hopefully this factor will make him want to play somewhere out of the golden bitchs shadow. Either way Iggy is probably a rental for them, so we can only hope that Fleury flopes in the playoffs again and they fall short this year. After this season, there's no way they will be this deep.

The other thing I find interesting is that it would seem Iggy said no to Boston, which kinda screwed that Flames out of what I think was a better deal. I always admired Iggy for his greatness and his work with the Canadian national team, but his decision pisses me off! I hope him and the Pens get beat up by boston and he regrets the day he made this decision.

Malkin will resign for $8.7?

Those that are saying this DO realize that the market for him will be at least $10, right?

If he resigns with Pittsburgh he will be taking less money if he indeed signs for less than $10. That is a fact.

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They can make it work. They need to sign a few scrubs (2 fwds, 1 dman) in this scenario and they amnesty Vokoun:

Pitt can address its D for the future with the outstanding D prospects they have, and bringing rookies in will help them stay under the cap for the near future.

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER

My Custom Lineup

FORWARDS

Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Jarome Iginla ($6.000m)

James Neal ($5.000m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.500m)

Beau Bennett ($0.900m) / Brandon Sutter ($2.067m) / Anthony Stewart ($0.900m)

Matt Cooke ($1.500m) / Joe Vitale ($0.550m) / Tanner Glass ($1.100m)

DEFENSEMEN

Paul Martin ($5.000m) / Brooks Orpik ($3.750m)

Kris Letang ($3.500m) / Matt Niskanen ($2.300m)

Simon Despres ($0.840m) / Deryk Engelland ($0.567m)

GOALTENDERS

Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)

Joey MacDonald ($0.550m)

OTHER

Buyout: Tomas Vokoun ($0.000m)

------

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)

(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)

SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,148,333; BONUSES: $0

CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $2,151,667

LOL @ the idea that Dupuis will sign for $1.5m next season.

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I am still trying to figure out how Fleury is a weak goalie. He has won a Stanley Cup before. Its not like he choked against the Wings in 2009.

He is either unbeatable, or unplayable. He is very inconsistent. He has played pretty well this year though so far.

Edited by Carman

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Yeah, the Hawks are a horrible team... :eh:

I'm going to take a wild guess and say that you're one of those who said that the Wings' regular season achievements made no difference if they couldn't win in the playoffs. Did you consider the 2005-2006 season a great success?

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I am still trying to figure out how Fleury is a weak goalie. He has won a Stanley Cup before. Its not like he choked against the Wings in 2009.

He is either unbeatable, and unplayable. He is very inconsistent. He has played pretty well this year though so far.

his regular seasons have been fine. it's in the playoffs that he hasn't done so great.

he actually reminds me a lot of jimmy howard. some nights he can be the best goalie in the league, other nights he would barely qualify as an nhl backup

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By the way, found this Tweet from Brett Hull interesting:

Pitt starting to remind me of 2002 Wings #wholebunchofhallofamers!

Yep, all two of them, both of whom were on the team before these trades were made. Jarome Iginla MIGHT make it into the HHoF.

his regular seasons have been fine. it's in the playoffs that he hasn't done so great.

he actually reminds me a lot of jimmy howard. some nights he can be the best goalie in the league, other nights he would barely qualify as an nhl backup

When compared to Fleury's performance against the Flyers, Howard's series against the Predators---which wasn't half bad to begin with---made him look like Ken Dryden.

He is going to be re-signed for the 8.7 he is making now.

Oh, so you're his agent?

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I'm going to take a wild guess and say that you're one of those who said that the Wings' regular season achievements made no difference if they couldn't win in the playoffs. Did you consider the 2005-2006 season a great success?

Nope, I don't remember that season to be anything at all for me. So for me, point taken.

Though I don't like talking in futures like this. This Hawks team is better than a lot of Wings teams we have seen in the recent past.

He is either unbeatable, and unplayable. He is very inconsistent. He has played pretty well this year though so far.

This.

I know this has been said about a lot of goalies in the past, but Fleury really fits the bill. He is either a brick wall or a sieve.

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Nope, I don't remember that season to be anything at all for me. So for me, point taken.

Though I don't like talking in futures like this. This Hawks team is better than a lot of Wings teams we have seen in the recent past.

Were you aware that Shero already had Malkin, Crosby, and the 2nd-overall pick when he assumed his duties with the Penguins?

Edited by Crymson

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Well Shero is right there with Holland and Chiarelli these three are really the top of the top, close are Lombardi and Poile.

I would put Glen Sather and Paul Holmgren on the bottom :lol::lol::lol::lol:

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Were you aware that Shero already had Malkin, Crosby, and the 2nd-overall pick when he assumed his duties with the Penguins?

He's also made two really outstanding moves with getting Sutter, a top 10 pick(Pouliot), and Dumoulin for Staal. That trade is huge, Dumoulin and Pouliot are both top pairing defenseman prospects, and are both very highly rated.

Add in getting James Neal, and Niskanen for Goligoski. This trade is a home run, Goligoski is a good puck mover, but Pittsburgh had that already with Letang. James Neal is a young 30 goal at least power forward, there is no way in the world Neal would be trade for Goligoski, not to mention Niskanen which has really settled right in on the Penguins and is actually not that far of a drop of with what Goligoski provided, less offense, but better contract and decent defense.

The Morrow trade doesn't look great, as Joe Morrow was pretty high regarded, but Pittsburgh has a pretty big cupboard with Despres finally showing flashes of the prospect he is thought to be add in the gluttony of very good defensive prospects Pouliot, Maatta, Harrington and Dumoulin.

The Iginla trade is huge, they landed at least a 20 goal scorer(on pace for more), for a late first round pick, and 2 unsigned NCAA free agents, neither were ranked highly for the Pens, they didn't trade any of their top 8 prospects, and an argument can be made none of their top 10. The equilvent for the Wings would be Athanasiou, and Tvrdon. Maybe Sheahan, but Sheahan has more value because of his deal and has some more AHL experience.

Then think back to the Hossa trade where they got Hossa and Dupuis for Colby armstrong, Christensen, Angelo Esposito and a first round pick(Daultan Leveille). This trade in the long run isn't as big because they couldn't keep Hossa, but what it did do was provide the team with experience in the playoffs, and an attitude that they knew their GM wasn't afraid of making a move, and then the next year they win a cup.

Yeah, he's had the advantage of getting great players, but he's also done some very good moves outside of no brainer draft picks.

Edited by Carman

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He could have asked the Flames to talk to him and offered more. I would have.

I don't understand all the fartin around signing redundant and disposable players and not going after difference makers and filling needs.

Our biggest need is a power forward who can contribute on the top 2 lines. We get pushed around and to the perimeter especially in the playoffs.

Doesn't matter what Holland offered. It wasn't the Flames/Feaster's choice, it was Jerome Iginla's choice.

We might have been on an expanded short-list, but Iggy wanted Pittsburgh.

i like the morrow and iginla trades but murray is god awful and does nothing to improve their defense. the dude is slow as molasses. think of him as a slower version of brad stuart in his last year here. yea not good

The Pens do like their pylons when it comes to winning Stanley Cups. (See: Hal Gill See also: SCF I'd like to forget)

Whether he is slow or not, he punishes people in the defensive zone and that is an improvement for Pittsburgh.

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This is why I like what Shero is doing... there was a time it seemed like Kenny made moves to show the team he believed in them and wasn't afraid to go all in to win.

This trade in the long run isn't as big because they couldn't keep Hossa, but what it did do was provide the team with experience in the playoffs, and an attitude that they knew their GM wasn't afraid of making a move, and then the next year they win a cup.

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Shero's moves are solid moves, if you don't believe so you are jealous. Yes he is loading up but he still has the safety net of malkin and crosby, embarrassment of riches. Wait til Murray and Orpik are just laying waste in the playoffs.

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I agree with almost everything else you've said in this thread, but you're smoking crack if you think Iginla isn't a sure-fire HOFer

Yep, all two of them, both of whom were on the team before these trades were made. Jarome Iginla MIGHT make it into the HHoF.

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I agree with almost everything else you've said in this thread, but you're smoking crack if you think Iginla isn't a sure-fire HOFer

You'll find that a lot of people are "smoking crack," then. If Iginla gets in, it'll likely be quite a few years after he retires.

The only active players who are assured a spot in the HHoF are Jagr, Selanne, and Brodeur. In case you hadn't noticed, only three players are inducted per year.

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If Holland had made these moves and the Wings didn't win the Cup, everyone would be bellyaching that he traded away our future. But in Shero's case, he gets credit for giving it the old college try? Many good talented teams end the season empty handed. Pittsburgh may or may not win the Cup and whether they made the deals or not.

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If Holland had made these moves and the Wings didn't win the Cup, everyone would be bellyaching that he traded away our future. But in Shero's case, he gets credit for giving it the old college try? Many good talented teams end the season empty handed. Pittsburgh may or may not win the Cup and whether they made the deals or not.

I am glad, Holland didn't make those deals Wings are not a Morrow, Iginla and Murray away from contending for the cup. Penguins are easily a better team right now, but at some point they have to go the rebuild route too. The only difference is, the Wings are going through it now, while the Pens are riding their hotguns for a few more years.

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The thing is, the actual players Pittsburgh traded only have an outside shot of even making it to the NHL and I think the others were a 1st round pick (probably 30th overall) and a 5th I think. They really didn't give up much of the future.

If Holland had made these moves and the Wings didn't win the Cup, everyone would be bellyaching that he traded away our future. But in Shero's case, he gets credit for giving it the old college try? Many good talented teams end the season empty handed. Pittsburgh may or may not win the Cup and whether they made the deals or not.

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Yeah, go root for a team that actually wants to win Stanley Cups.

Yea, the Pens have won 3 in the last 20 years while the Wings have won 4. The Pens also tanked for 4 straight losing seasons and drafting Crosby and Malkin as a result. Meanwhile, the Wings have made the playoffs all those years.

Wanting to win the cup and actually winning it are two different things. We shall see if this gamble pays off.

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Back in 1999, Kenny acquired Chris Chelios, Wendel Clark, Ulf Samuelsson and Bill Ranford to compliment such players as Steve Yzerman, Brendan Shanahan, Sergei Fedorov, Nick Lidstrom, Slava Kozlov, Igor Larionov, Larry Murphy. The Wings were huge favourites to win another Cup even though they had a mediocre regular season after having won back-to-back Cups.

It turned out to be Fool's Gold however as the Wings were bounced out in the 2nd round to the Avs.

My point is that nothing is guaranteed. Are the Pens the prohibitive Cup favourites? Yes. Does this mean they will win it? No.

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