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An interesting point about our apparent deadline strategy


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#1 DetroitRedWings1993

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:30 PM

If anyone here believes Twitter, Dave Waddell and George Malik, do yourself a favor and sleep through the rest of today and all of Wednesday.

 

I saw a very interesting comment on one of Malik's blog posts today.  Not only that, but I totally agree with it.

 

From PaulInMiamiBeach:

I’m so sick of this “you can’t fix it all at once, so don’t fix any of it at all” attitude.  That is a recipe for failure.

 

He hit it right on the head for me.

 

Not only that, but I believe it was kipwinger who shared pretty much the same sentiment.  Doing nothing makes us just as worse as making a bad deal does.  This team is full of bad deals.  Cleary, Bertuzzi, Sammuelsson, Quincey, Colaiacovo, Gustavsson, the list goes on.  If we emerge from this trade deadline the same team, this team is going nowhere.  Not even to the playoffs.  Nowhere.  But, we already knew that, didn't we?

 

This season wasn't always a "rebuilding/transitional" year.  Off the topic, but transitioning to what?  Mediocrity?  Becoming an awful team for several decades?  What's the end result?  It honestly frightens me to think about it.  Anyways, this season only became such when the team failed to do much of anything in free agency.  At that point, management cut off their own collective manhood, threw their hands in the air, and gave up.  At least, that's the way I see it.

 

Also, I'd like to address some ridiculous and false optimism.  People cite the lowering of the cap next season and say how many great players will be available because of cap-compliance buyouts.

 

Sorry, but that's the biggest crock on Earth.

 

Do people really think that quality players will be bought out?

 

That's hilarious.  No one is going to buy out key pieces, people.  Certainly not a top-6 scoring forward who can consistently score goals.  That's the reality of it.  People think all these players are going to fall right into our lap.

 

Not only that, but wasn't that the mantra last summer?  See how that turned out.

 

So, by all means Kenny, do nothing.  I just hope your prepared for another firestorm from everyone around you afterwards.  I would've thought you'd be sick of that already.

 

Our prospects aren't nearly as good as everyone seems to think.  I've seen Tatar and Nyquist...and I'm not impressed.  They've fallen victim to scouting.  Teams know them, and I'd say that's about it for them.  Our farm system is almost entirely boom-or-bust.  See the dramatic peaks and valleys of a lot of their past performances.  Jarnkrok and Pulkinnen, especially.

 

So, I guess tomorrow's a waste of time.  Great.  It'll be fun watching this team spiral out of control and crash in a flaming heap outside the playoff window.


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#2 F.Michael

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:39 PM

Can't wait to see what Crymson has to say...



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#3 Donohue75

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:39 PM

Did you break your keyboard typing this lol

 

www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFnFr-DOPf8
 
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#4 DeGraa55

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:39 PM

Ya I love our middle of the road strategy. Holland lives doing nothing and is OK with a mediocre team.

Rather he goes all in or sells IDC but HD needs to do something. He is quickly falling out of favor with me.

Like I've said before up until this season he has been great but this is his first time with a situation like this. And he is doing horrible. Signing injury prone worthless guys and failing to do the trades that need to be done.

He has the heart of a fan and uses it more than his brain.

#5 Nyquistfan14

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:43 PM

Kenny is the king of doing absolutely nothing. I can guarantee this will be basically te exact same team minus fil ( who holland will let go for free). Nyq and Tatar will play 4th line or get waived will cleary will be re-signed to ride shotgun with pav in his final season as a wing

#6 DetroitRedWings1993

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:44 PM

Ya I love our middle of the road strategy. Holland lives doing nothing and is OK with a mediocre team.

Rather he goes all in or sells IDC but HD needs to do something. He is quickly falling out of favor with me.

Like I've said before up until this season he has been great but this is his first time with a situation like this. And he is doing horrible. Signing injury prone worthless guys and failing to do the trades that need to be done.

He has the heart of a fan and uses it more than his brain.

If he had the heart of a fan, he would've done something to fix this f*cking train wreck.


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#7 stillwater

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:44 PM

What's the "interesting point"?



#8 DetroitRedWings1993

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:45 PM

Kenny is the king of doing absolutely nothing. I can guarantee this will be basically te exact same team minus fil ( who holland will let go for free). Nyq and Tatar will play 4th line or get waived will cleary will be re-signed to ride shotgun with pav in his final season as a wing

If I were Datsyuk, I'd walk into Kenny's office and demand a trade off this sinking ship.  But, Pav would never do that.  He'll just deke Kenny out and go back to work.  He'll carry this whole organization by himself, if he has to.  That's just so unfair to him.


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#9 Nyquistfan14

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:49 PM

If I were Datsyuk, I'd walk into Kenny's office and demand a trade off this sinking ship.  But, Pav would never do that.  He'll just deke Kenny out and go back to work.  He'll carry this whole organization by himself, if he has to.  That's just so unfair to him.


Pav is my favorite player of all time. He deserves to have someone to play with. The guy is still so dominant. Get him someone really good to play with and who knows maybe he re-signs for a couple more years.

I'd rather lose a first and a good prospect for a star player plus two more years of pav playing with that star player

#10 DetroitRedWings1993

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:53 PM

Pav is my favorite player of all time. He deserves to have someone to play with. The guy is still so dominant. Get him someone really good to play with and who knows maybe he re-signs for a couple more years.

I'd rather lose a first and a good prospect for a star player plus two more years of pav playing with that star player

I just want them to do something.  But, they won't.  I can guarantee this team misses the playoffs without an addition or two.


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#11 dats13owns

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:55 PM

Is there any good way to go about this? How close are the Wings right now to being contenders? If they do make a big splash at the deadline, is it going to be big enough for them to have a chance against Chicago, Pittsburgh or Boston in the playoffs? I love the excitement of a trade as much as the next person, but if there is nothing out there that is going to take you to the next level then why force something just to do so? This is a deep draft coming up, so no one is going to want to part with picks either. The Wings do have a bunch of bad contracts on their hands right now, so why would anyone want to take them on? No one wants to give up any decent prospects to get anything and if they do, especially for a rental, it's going to be meltdown city on here. There is no winning here. I'm not in love with the 2012 offseason, but Holland tried... bringing Sammy back was absolutely unnecessary and the Coca sign was high risk/low reward and that's what it ended up being, and Monster has been just bad... but Brunner and Tootoo have both been great for the Wings.

 

Everyone is on Bert and Sammy's asses, but why is everyone okay with Helm constantly being injured? He's not even the age of these guys. Maybe they should try to move Helm.

 

I'm not trying to be a contrarian here, but people complain just to complain. I don't think there is enough the Wings can do to become legit contenders, so if they can't find a deal... let them go into the offseason and see when they can do there. It's a short season, few teams are out of it at this point so it's not like everyone is going to be shopping everyone like they would in a full season.

 

My hopes are that the Wings make it to the playoffs for a 22nd straight year and give me extra Wings hockey to watch into hopefully the second round.



#12 Dabura

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:57 PM

We like our team.


 

Everyone is on Bert and Sammy's asses, but why is everyone okay with Helm constantly being injured?

 

Because Helm is awesome.


Edited by Dabura, 02 April 2013 - 09:50 PM.

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#13 ben_usmc

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:57 PM

I just want them to do something.  But, they won't.  I can guarantee this team misses the playoffs without an addition or two.

I bet they do something, probably won't be a huge move, but they WILL do something 


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#14 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 03:59 PM

wings should get rid of some players who wont come back and get some picks while they can rather then losing them for nothing

 

put tatar nyquist andersson in some playoff games and let them get some experience


Edited by nyqvististhefuture, 02 April 2013 - 04:01 PM.


#15 Nev

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:01 PM

I love it - one thread bemoaning Hollands passivity.  Another thread praising it.

 

Man, this board is getting as bi-polar as our team.  I haven't seen it split like this since the Great Enforcer Wars of 4-5 years ago.


"If I can be totally honest, it's not a lot of guys you get impressed by. Actually, it's no one else but him. From the bench, to see what move he makes -- you're like, 'I wish I could do that.' Sometimes you sit on the bench and just think, 'wow,' and you look over to the other bench and they sit there and shake their heads, too. He has great, great skills. I'm probably not going to play with another player who has the kind of skills he has." Mikael Samuelsson on Pavel Datsyuk

#16 DetroitRedWings1993

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:02 PM

Is there any good way to go about this? How close are the Wings right now to being contenders? If they do make a big splash at the deadline, is it going to be big enough for them to have a chance against Chicago, Pittsburgh or Boston in the playoffs? I love the excitement of a trade as much as the next person, but if there is nothing out there that is going to take you to the next level then why force something just to do so? This is a deep draft coming up, so no one is going to want to part with picks either. The Wings do have a bunch of bad contracts on their hands right now, so why would anyone want to take them on? No one wants to give up any decent prospects to get anything and if they do, especially for a rental, it's going to be meltdown city on here. There is no winning here. I'm not in love with the 2012 offseason, but Holland tried... bringing Sammy back was absolutely unnecessary and the Coca sign was high risk/low reward and that's what it ended up being, and Monster has been just bad... but Brunner and Tootoo have both been great for the Wings.

 

Everyone is on Bert and Sammy's asses, but why is everyone okay with Helm constantly being injured? He's not even the age of these guys. Maybe they should try to move Helm.

 

I'm not trying to be a contrarian here, but people complain just to complain. I don't think there is enough the Wings can do to become legit contenders, so if they can't find a deal... let them go into the offseason and see when they can do there. It's a short season, few teams are out of it at this point so it's not like everyone is going to be shopping everyone like they would in a full season.

 

My hopes are that the Wings make it to the playoffs for a 22nd straight year and give me extra Wings hockey to watch into hopefully the second round.

A team that is a combined 4-1 against Anaheim and Vancouver isn't a contender?  A team that has beaten L.A., Minnesota, San Jose, and St. Louis isn't a contender?  A team that has stayed in the playoffs virtually all season without most of their regular lineup isn't a contender?  A team that has an improving defense and solid goaltending isn't a contender? A team with Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Zetterberg in the top-6 isn't a contender?

 

You see where I'm going.  And no.  People don't complain just to complain.  They complain because when they see s***, they point it out.

 

There ARE players available.  Drew Stafford could help.  Fleischmann, Pominville and Gaborik could all help.

 

The playoffs are a guaranteed bust even if we make it.  And with what's happened lately, I see us crashing and burning FAR outside the playoff bubble.


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#17 SDavis35

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:02 PM

Not only that, but I believe it was kipwinger who shared pretty much the same sentiment.  Doing nothing makes us just as worse as making a bad deal does.  This team is full of bad deals.  Cleary, Bertuzzi, Sammuelsson, Quincey, Colaiacovo, Gustavsson, the list goes on.  If we emerge from this trade deadline the same team, this team is going nowhere.  Not even to the playoffs.  Nowhere.  But, we already knew that, didn't we?

 
Cleary, Bertuzzi can only be considered bad deals if you look at it with a hindsight perspective (both have factored in well to our team prior to their current deals); Sammy and Colaiacovo are bad deals only due to their long injury time (they've played less than 10 games between them if I'm not mistaken); and Gustavsson has played perfectly fine as far as being a backup goalie goes, he's had bad games but I blame lapses from the team as a whole rather than him as an individual. I don't see how we are not going to the playoffs with the team we have... we currently sit 7th and 3 points out of 4th, 4 points ahead of 9th. We can go up or down depending on how the players play, even with this team as is. 
 
 

Our prospects aren't nearly as good as everyone seems to think.  I've seen Tatar and Nyquist...and I'm not impressed.  They've fallen victim to scouting.  Teams know them, and I'd say that's about it for them.  Our farm system is almost entirely boom-or-bust.  See the dramatic peaks and valleys of a lot of their past performances.  Jarnkrok and Pulkinnen, especially.

Our "prospects" made up a good chunk of our team if you didn't notice. Andersson has been great in his role, Tatar scored a few on a team that severely lacks in offense, Emmerton has done fine, Nyquist needs size but he's fine; Lashoff and Smith are a huge part of the reason we aren't bottom dwellers. Sure they're not superstars ala Zetterberg and Datsyuk, but I am not so sure they were ever expected to be the next "Euro Twins" 

 

Basically, we don't stand a chance at winning a cup if we don't add to our team, but there is absolutely no reason in the world why we should trade away our future and just delay a rebuilding phase another year, maybe even making it worse in the process. I doubt Holland will be able to make anything big happen tomorrow, but that doesn't mean we won't be making the playoffs. 



#18 DetroitRedWings1993

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:02 PM

I bet they do something, probably won't be a huge move, but they WILL do something 

Technically, they already did something.  They traded Huskins to the Flyers for a draft pick we might not even get.


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#19 Serratoni

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:04 PM

Holland admitted at the start of the season that the team might not make the playoffs. Of course this is a rebuilding year. The GM brass just won't come right out and say it because the team has so many fans who would balk at the idea. A lot of posters call Wings fans spoiled. I'm not one of them. Instead, I think Wings fans are impatient. Many have been watching the team since 2000 or so and think they're veteran fans. They've never experienced a rebuild. They've never developed the patience it can sometimes take to follow a franchise. As a result, the organization is rebuilding on the fly while never publicly admitting to it.

 

The Wings are quietly (and not-so-quietly last week) building a nice young defense. The team also has a variety of forward prospects in GR and elsewhere, along with veteran leadership (Zetterberg) that won't be going anywhere for a number of years.

 

Have faith, fans, and be patient. Enjoy the magic of Datsyuk and the emergence of young stars over the next few seasons.


Edited by Serratoni, 02 April 2013 - 04:12 PM.


#20 F.Michael

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:05 PM

I love it - one thread bemoaning Hollands passivity.  Another thread praising it.

 

Man, this board is getting as bi-polar as our team.  I haven't seen it split like this since the Great Enforcer Wars of 4-5 years ago.

Ohhh - don't get me started!



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