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Thinking on 2013/14 roster.


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#21 Nev

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 06:48 AM

Andersson will be our 4th line Center next year - Babs has a bromance with him, and he's the only one of our rookies to not yo-yo up and down or be benched.  I wonder if the current Franzen experiment is to try him out for next season if/when we lose Flip.  Emmerton will be traded/sent down/waived. 


"If I can be totally honest, it's not a lot of guys you get impressed by. Actually, it's no one else but him. From the bench, to see what move he makes -- you're like, 'I wish I could do that.' Sometimes you sit on the bench and just think, 'wow,' and you look over to the other bench and they sit there and shake their heads, too. He has great, great skills. I'm probably not going to play with another player who has the kind of skills he has." Mikael Samuelsson on Pavel Datsyuk

#22 ogreslayer

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 09:06 AM

Kenny wont use it. We all hope and wish he does.

Maybe you should ask Darren McCarty, Darian Hatcher, & Ray Whitney whether Kenny would ever use something like an amnesty buyout.



#23 Dominator2005

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 09:35 AM

Holland talks about "rebuild". That's definitely not a bad idea. After this season, everyone will recognize that.
 
 
Top Winger 23-28 years, Datsjuk, Jurco
Tatar, Zetterberg, Brunner
Cleary, Helm, Bertuzzi
Miller, Emmerton, Eaves
 
Lashoff, Kronwall
Kindl, Top Defender 23-28years
Smith, DeKeyser
 
Howard
Mrazek
 
 
plus: White, Ouellet, Sheahan, Ferraro, Tootoo
 
 
Need Andersson and Tatar or Nyquist to add a winger to go with Pav. Would prefer to keep Tatar. Would be the perfect addition for Z and Brunner. I really like Jurco. Very skillfull player and his size is not bad. Maybe he can fit in. Otherwise let's check the other younger guys or Bertuzzi with Pav. If the younger guys step up, there's no need for Cleary and Eaves, too. But Miller and Bertuzzi should stay.


Jurco on the 1st line : not ready yet
Lashoff top 2 : never gonna happen
T-Z-B line : too small

No toughness at all... Let's not forget that the next saison we are in east conf. which means we are going to play Boston, Philly, Rags, Pens, Leafs... physical teams.
"Some guys dream about scoring goals, or making big saves... I swear to God I dream about kicking ass in a hockey fight - no other way to say it than I love to do it, its who I am"... Brian McGrattan

#24 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 10:42 AM

Maybe you should ask Darren McCarty, Darian Hatcher, & Ray Whitney whether Kenny would ever use something like an amnesty buyout.

Though he re-signed Mac a few years later.

I'd be surprised if Holland bought out Sammy one year after giving him a 35+ contract with a NTC, but I guess there's always a chance.

#25 PROBIE4PREZ

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 11:41 AM

Has everyone drank the Kool-Aid? Kenny Holland doesn't have a split personality disorder people. REALISTICALLY SPEAKING this is what we'll be looking at. Where all these bodies are going is something well have to wait and see.

 

Pav -  Z  -  Bert

Fil -  Franz - Brunner

Gus - Helm - Sammy

Eaves - Abby - Tootoo

 

Anderson

Emmerton

 

Sheahan(GR)

 

55 - 52

Smith - Quincey

Kindl - Lashoff

Colo

 

Dekryser (GR)

 

Howie

insert veteran FA cheap goalie here

 

Only change we could be looking at is Fil not resigning.

 

Is there a section for people who haven't drank the Kool-Aid? I'd love to see it. People are delusional around here. Detroit can't just rebuild on the fly.


"I mean, the best thing for my knee, for anyone's knee, is to never play again and retire. But I'm not going to do that." o-captain my captain

#26 Crymson

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 12:02 PM

Is there a section for people who haven't drank the Kool-Aid? I'd love to see it. People are delusional around here. Detroit can't just rebuild on the fly.

 

Thanks for all you've added to this discussion. I disagree with you, so I guess I'm cool-aid drinking loon.



#27 PROBIE4PREZ

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 12:29 PM

Thanks for all you've added to this discussion. I disagree with you, so I guess I'm cool-aid drinking loon.

 

You didn't mention what you disagreed with.


"I mean, the best thing for my knee, for anyone's knee, is to never play again and retire. But I'm not going to do that." o-captain my captain

#28 Crymson

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 12:33 PM

You didn't mention what you disagreed with.

Why bother?



#29 Jesusberg

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 12:49 PM

The better Nyquist plays, and the longer Sammy is injured, the higher chance I think Holland uses an amnesty buyout. Could use one on Cola, but I think Lashoff can still play in GR next season? (Someone correct me if I'm wrong here) So we'd be using a buyout just so Lashoff could sit on the bench instead of Cola.

If Sammy's bought out, I'd like to see...

Nyquist-Zetterberg-Brunner
Filppula-Datsyuk-Franzen
Tatar-Helm-Bertuzzi
Abdelkader-Andersson-Tootoo
Emmerton, Eaves

Kronwall-Ericsson
Quincey-Smith
Kindl-DeKeyser
Cola or Lashoff

Howard
Gustavsson

It's not overly likely that Goose is on the top line, but I think he'd work well there. I'd actually prefer that over having both him and Tatar on either side of Helm, and Bert in the top six.



#30 DeGraa55

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 01:11 PM

I'm not sure what bit will look like. I do believe Holland will try to make a trade but will mostly likely fail just like this year. But a few free agents is my question. Just like he wants suter and parise I believe he will target someone. Now if they sign or not who knows?

I do believe he will also try his hardest to resign fil and Howard as top priority. So the question is where does the money come from? I believe he will shock us all and actually use his two buyouts and WONT resign cleary.

#31 ogreslayer

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 02:40 PM

The better Nyquist plays, and the longer Sammy is injured, the higher chance I think Holland uses an amnesty buyout. Could use one on Cola, but I think Lashoff can still play in GR next season? (Someone correct me if I'm wrong here) So we'd be using a buyout just so Lashoff could sit on the bench instead of Cola.

If Sammy's bought out, I'd like to see...

Nyquist-Zetterberg-Brunner
Filppula-Datsyuk-Franzen
Tatar-Helm-Bertuzzi
Abdelkader-Andersson-Tootoo
Emmerton, Eaves

Kronwall-Ericsson
Quincey-Smith
Kindl-DeKeyser
Cola or Lashoff

Howard
Gustavsson

It's not overly likely that Goose is on the top line, but I think he'd work well there. I'd actually prefer that over having both him and Tatar on either side of Helm, and Bert in the top six.

 

Agreed, I've been saying for weeks now that Sammy & Cola will be bought out.  And unless Kenny pulls off a trade for a #1 or 2 d-man that sends one back in the deal (most likely Smith I would think), White will be a goner too as a UFA.  



#32 Serratoni

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 02:54 PM

Holland talks about "rebuild". That's definitely not a bad idea. After this season, everyone will recognize that.

 

 

Top Winger 23-28 years, Datsjuk, Jurco

Tatar, Zetterberg, Brunner

Cleary, Helm, Bertuzzi

Miller, Emmerton, Eaves

 

Lashoff, Kronwall

Kindl, Top Defender 23-28years

Smith, DeKeyser

 

Howard

Mrazek

 

 

plus: White, Ouellet, Sheahan, Ferraro, Tootoo

 

 

Need Andersson and Tatar or Nyquist to add a winger to go with Pav. Would prefer to keep Tatar. Would be the perfect addition for Z and Brunner. I really like Jurco. Very skillfull player and his size is not bad. Maybe he can fit in. Otherwise let's check the other younger guys or Bertuzzi with Pav. If the younger guys step up, there's no need for Cleary and Eaves, too. But Miller and Bertuzzi should stay.

 

Lashoff in the top pairing? No Ericsson or Quincey? Are you just going to release these two?



#33 rick zombo

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 03:14 PM

Use those amnesty buyouts on Sammy and Cola. You HAVE too. It's not like UFAs are lining up to play in the D because Kenny's so nice to his players. The cap's going down, the league is viciously tight. Can't afford to be sentimental or as "classy" as you once were. Sammy and Cola were the two most recent UFA signings, so they should go.

Let Filpulla walk and add some size on the wing:

Brunner - Datsyuk - Horton/Clarkson
Goose - Z - Franzen
Tatar - Helm - Bert
Abby - Andersson - Tootoo

Eaves/Emmerton

Kronwall - Ericsson
Kindl - Quincey
DeKeyser - Smith
Lashoff

Howard
Gustavsson
"In Detroit, every day is a good day to win"

#34 TheOwl

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 03:55 PM

Buy-out Quiency. It makes no sense buying out someone who only makes 2 million a season. Buy out the guy getting paid almost 4 million a season.



#35 Richdg

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 05:32 PM

For the guy that said Filppula is good for 25 goals a year, no he isn't he has never scored 25 goals in a season, last year was his career high-23, the first and only time he has scored over 20 goals. Good 2 way player, yes. Good passer yes. but Filppula is not a goal scorer. Which after all is our problem.

 

When we get right down to it, the issues with this team are our top 6 forwards. we have plenty of bottom 6 guys: Abdelkader, Andersson, Sheahan, Tootoo, Emmerton, Eaves, and helm. All signed for next year. That is 7 guys that have good speed, good defensively, and some grit. it is the top 6 that is full of questions. datsyuk, Z and brunner are fine. But they need some size and toughness to go with them, and that is where our down fall is. Bert, sammy, and Franzen are just not cutting it. replacing them with tatar and nyquist is a disaster waiting to happen. I can't want to see the legion of threads next year when players start taking liberties with dat and Z because there is no one on their lines to protect them. I can hear the whining, crying, and b1tching now......



#36 Dominator2005

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 06:18 PM

For the guy that said Filppula is good for 25 goals a year, no he isn't he has never scored 25 goals in a season, last year was his career high-23, the first and only time he has scored over 20 goals. Good 2 way player, yes. Good passer yes. but Filppula is not a goal scorer. Which after all is our problem.
 
When we get right down to it, the issues with this team are our top 6 forwards. we have plenty of bottom 6 guys: Abdelkader, Andersson, Sheahan, Tootoo, Emmerton, Eaves, and helm. All signed for next year. That is 7 guys that have good speed, good defensively, and some grit. it is the top 6 that is full of questions. datsyuk, Z and brunner are fine. But they need some size and toughness to go with them, and that is where our down fall is. Bert, sammy, and Franzen are just not cutting it. replacing them with tatar and nyquist is a disaster waiting to happen. I can't want to see the legion of threads next year when players start taking liberties with dat and Z because there is no one on their lines to protect them. I can hear the whining, crying, and b1tching now......


I think that he was refering to Franzen
"Some guys dream about scoring goals, or making big saves... I swear to God I dream about kicking ass in a hockey fight - no other way to say it than I love to do it, its who I am"... Brian McGrattan

#37 Dimaline312000

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 07:14 PM

Ther Wings roster will have to be Bolstered this off-season or I'd really have to call for Holland's Job and his Head. If he thinks this team can get away with minimal changes and be a Stanley Cup Championship Team. I'm not going to say who should stay and who should go but this team is going to need help for next season and I hope Kenny has the B@LL$ to make a bold move or two this July or even at the Draft. If this team is going to get back to it's winning ways it's going ot need to have all the right peices in place and as of right now it doesn't so something will have to be done.



#38 Richdg

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 09:41 PM

The hard part of course is finding the right pieces to trade. yes we all would love to take 2 or 3 minor leaguers and pick up an AS power forward. but that isn't the way things work. So where are we strong-long term and what or how many pieces can go.

Right now we have great depth on D and at G. Look at the D: Kronwall, Ericsson, Smith, Kindl, Dekeyser, lashoff, Quincey, Colaviaco, Nicastro, Sproul, Oullett, deHaas, merchecnko. That is 13. We can only carry 7 and yes we need 2-3 in the minors for depth.

The same thing at G. Howard, Gus, Marzek, the new kid from NMU, and peterson. That makes 5.

Now some have good/great trade value. Some do not. So what pieces do we keep and which ones do we put into a package?

Yes we all would like to move Quincey and free up his cap hit-3.75 million per year. But does Q alone get us a top notch forward? No. takes more than him. Do younger guys with Quincey become enough? maybe.



#39 Richdg

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 08:22 AM

Ok, let me focus on the who we need to replace side a bit. As I mentioned before we have 3 must improve spots and a 4th would like to improve spot. We have to replace/improve on Sammy, Bert, and Franzen-in that order. While Franzen has his worts, at least he still makes it to the ice most of the time. bert and Sammy haven't and are much older. The 4th spot that I would like to improve, is 1 good RH Dman. Finding one would also open up 1 of our other Dmen for trade.

 

So who is Samuelsson? He is a 37 year old 6-2/215 RH shooting RW that averages 18 goals for every 82 games over his career. He also has averaged a little over 1 hit per game for his career. he makes 3 million per year.

That is what we need to replace/improve on. Ideally we would be looking at guys that are under 30 years of age than can produce those results or better for roughly the same money.

Now what guys in the league can do that? What would it cost to get them? Here are some options:

 

UFA's:

 

Nathan Horton RW Boston. 6-2/230, 28 in May, he averages 28 goals for every 82 games played for his career. He averages just under 1 hit per game for his career. I would think that to sign him we are talking 5 years or more and 30+ million.

 

David Clarkson RW NJD. 6-1/200, just turned 29. He averages 19 goals per 82 games in his career, but has really improved the last 2 seasons. He is also a 2 hits per game guy over his career. I would expect him to get a contract of the same type of length and money as Horton. 5 years + 30 million +.

 

Others:

 

Chris Stewart RW STL. 6-2/230 and 25 years old. He averages 26 goals per 82 games for his career. He is also a hit per game + type of player.

 

Dustin Brown RW LAK. 6-0/212 and is 28. He averages 23 goals per 82 games. He is a 3 hits per game player.

 

Wayne Simmonds RW Philly and is 25 this summer. He averages 18 goals per 82 games for his career. he is a 1+ hits per game guy.

 

Bobby Ryan RW Ana and is 26. He averages 32 goals per 82 games for his career. he is a 1.5 hit per game player.

 

 

That about covers the list for RH shooting RWers, that score more than Sammy, hit more than Sammy, and are 28 or younger.



#40 Richdg

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 09:21 AM

Now let's do the same thing with Bertuzzi. Who is Bert? He is a 38 year old 6-3/230 LH shooting LW. Over his career he has averaged 23 goals per 82 games. This number has of course been dropping over the last 5 or 6 years, the time he has played for us. In his prime Bert averaged 31 goals per 82 games. he has also been an active checker. About 1.5 hits per game for his career.

So, once again, who are the under 30 LW's with the same abilities?

 

UFA's:

 

Viktor Stalberg CHI. 6-3/210 27 years old. He has averaged 18 goals per 82 games for his career, but is trending upward. Has a 1 hit per game average.

 

Others:

 

Evander Kane Win. 21 years old, 6-2/200. Averages 25 goals per 82 games. Good for 3 hits per game.

 

Milan Lucic Bos. 24 years old. 6-4/220. Averages 20 goals per 82 games. Good for 3 hits per game.

 

Nikolai Kulemin 26 6-1/225 Tor. Averages 18 goals per 82 games. Good for 2 hits per game.

 

Alex Ovechkin Wash. 27 6-3/230. Averages 50 goals per 82 games and is good for 2 hits per game.

 

Andrew Ladd Win. 27 6-3/205. Averages 21 goals per 82 games and is a 2 hit per game player.

 

James Neal Pit. 25 years old. 6-2/210. Averages 31 goals per 82 games and is good for 1.5 hits per game.

 

James van Riemsdyk Tor. 6-3/200. Averages 22 goals per 82 games. Is good for 1+ hit per game.

 

That pretty much finishes the list. Most of the others are over 30, don't score, or don't hit.







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