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nhl.com calls Kenny the best GM


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#41 Euro_Twins

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 02:52 PM

Second round exit in 2010

Second round exit in 2011

First round exit in 2012

 

I doubt we'll get out of the first round this year, providing we even make the playoffs.  This team has gotten worse over the years.  The people he has brought in have been either injured or are a waste of time.  

 

Brunner, Dekeyser and Tootoo have not been a waste of time, just because he makes a few mistakes does not mean you need focus all your attention on them. Would you rather he sell the farm to get a couple rentals?

 

all these "big name" teams right now will not win the cup, maybe one will, but think about how many of them will be losing pieces next year, Vancouver, Chicago, NYR, Minnesota, Montreal, Pittsburgh, San Jose,and especially Philly desperately need to lose 2-6 million in cap space next season, all these big trades and signings only help them this year and maybe next, but these teams trade away a bunch of picks, and prospects to get all these players the LGW gm's say we should have gotten and they won't be nearly as good next year, whereas we will have some cap space, and won't have the issue of desperately trying to get under the cap, if you ask me, Kenny was smart to not be taken like a fool for a rental or two. And no we didn't need Bouwmeester, and Dekeyser is looking great



#42 SDavis35

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 03:05 PM

A good GM makes the moves that are hard to get done. Not the cupcakes.

 

I don't generally like what you post, but this one is spot on.

 

I think being a GM is far more difficult than what we see, some posters are saying that few moves = bad GM, but I have to disagree. Holland's bad move was signing Franzen as long as he did, that and Zetterberg's extended contract put us in a position where we can't sign others (Parise, Suter types) for long-term which is something a lot of the big-name players have been interested in lately. But in dealing with what he's been left with, I think he's done well. 



#43 The Axe

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 03:33 PM

 
I don't generally like what you post, but this one is spot on.
 
I think being a GM is far more difficult than what we see, some posters are saying that few moves = bad GM, but I have to disagree. Holland's bad move was signing Franzen as long as he did, that and Zetterberg's extended contract put us in a position where we can't sign others (Parise, Suter types) for long-term which is something a lot of the big-name players have been interested in lately. But in dealing with what he's been left with, I think he's done well. 


I think Holland's focus is the issue. He doesn't seem to recognize what type of forwards are dominant in the NHL.

#44 JoeBuddy

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 04:24 PM

A bit of perspective.  Our big rivals from the free-spending years.  Colorado - what happened to them after Roy, Foote, Sakic, Forsberg et al retired?  They've sucked ever since.  What about Dallas after Modano, Belfour, Zubov etc went?  They've sucked.  What happened to us after we lost Yzerman, Fedorov, Shanahan, Larionov, Hull, Robitaille etc?  Ken Holland went out and built another Stanley Cup roster.  And now most of that roster has retired or left and he's rebuilding the team again.  How many GMs out there have sucessfully rebuilt Cup winning rosters? Lou Lamoriello, and uh, I think thats about it.

 

This is all it took for me to read to know that Ken Holland is the best GM in the NHL. You are 100% correct. I'm sure it wasn't easy to fire Dave Lewis after he had been with us throughout the dynasty years. He hired a great coach (despite what some of LGW things) in Babs and has put this team in a position to win. He has no control over how well our goaltending is in the playoffs, or if we score goals or not. He puts the players that are capable of helping us win on the roster. It is up to them to play well. Kenny is the best GM in the league and I wouldn't prefer anyone over him.


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#45 Shaman

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 04:36 PM

NHL.com also said that Kronwall was a Norris favorite. So take whatever they say with a pound of salt. 


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#46 VM1138

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 05:17 PM

It would seem a lot of people forget that the Wings lost Hudler to free agency.. He scored 25 goals last season! That's 25 goals the Wings are dearly missing: Sammy's barely played and Brunner is basically a rookie, so it can't be expected of him to light it up consistently...
 
Also, Bert and Helm's injuries have completely destroyed the balance that would have helped the Wings's 2 first lines play together on a regular basis..
 
Finally, it needs to be said that Suter and Parise didn't pick Minnesota over Detroit.. They just went where they were offered more money. I would have hated to see the Wings jeopardize their economic future by giving 13M to those 2....


I'm tired of people bringing up Suter to bash Holland. Suter was going with Parise, and Parise wanted to go home. Reports said Surer actually wanted to come here, but Parise picking Minnesota tied his hands, because they wanted to play together.

So Holland did everything he could. It wasn't because he didn't offer enough, its because Suter had locked himself into playing with Parise.
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#47 wingsfan4795

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 05:18 PM

 
Second round exit in 2010
Second round exit in 2011
First round exit in 2012
 
I doubt we'll get out of the first round this year, providing we even make the playoffs.  This team has gotten worse over the years.  The people he has brought in have been either injured or are a waste of time.  

The fact that they are going through a major rebuild and still making the playoffs every year says something about Kenny and the management staff.

The Oilers are going through a major rebuild as well:
Last place in 2010
Last place in 2011
29th place in 2012

Would you rather go through that?
Also, last summer our D looked like it would be the worst in the league, but then Kenny managed to sign some guys who have really helped us out, and he showed off his draft skills again. (Colaiacovo has been really solid in the games he's played and dekeyser looks good as well. Kindl and lashoff have both proved to be surprisingly good draft picks)

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#48 The Axe

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 05:35 PM

The fact that they are going through a major rebuild and still making the playoffs every year says something about Kenny and the management staff.

The Oilers are going through a major rebuild as well:
Last place in 2010
Last place in 2011
29th place in 2012

Would you rather go through that?
Also, last summer our D looked like it would be the worst in the league, but then Kenny managed to sign some guys who have really helped us out, and he showed off his draft skills again. (Colaiacovo has been really solid in the games he's played and dekeyser looks good as well. Kindl and lashoff have both proved to be surprisingly good draft picks)


The Oil is looking good, tho.

#49 pondrocket

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 05:42 PM

Kenny is enjoying the last year of the good old boy network, earned through two decades of more good choices than bad and a few exceptionally great choices.

 

Soon it will end & they will begin to autopsy the decline of a great team.  They will point out bad breaks & bad deals.  Wventually the team will be above average again & that GM will begin to reap the rewards associated with success; until success leaves.  It's the same in every city & every & most every industry.



#50 rick zombo

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 06:04 PM

I think Holland's focus is the issue. He doesn't seem to recognize what type of forwards are dominant in the NHL.


I think he recognized this pretty good in 2008.
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#51 esteef

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 06:09 PM

Would you rather he sell the farm to get a couple rentals?

 

This cliche is about as overused here as "I like our team".

 

It's also interesting that you left LA out of that list you made of teams that made big moves (Carter, Richards, etc), and yet they won the Cup because of them and are still looking good this year.  Chicago has recovered quite nicely from their after-Cup fire sale to be a top contender again and Pittsburgh barely gave up anything for their "rentals" this year.  I would say those GMs have done a nice job.

 

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#52 GMRwings1983

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 07:20 PM

The fact that they are going through a major rebuild and still making the playoffs every year says something about Kenny and the management staff.

The Oilers are going through a major rebuild as well:
Last place in 2010
Last place in 2011
29th place in 2012

Would you rather go through that?
Also, last summer our D looked like it would be the worst in the league, but then Kenny managed to sign some guys who have really helped us out, and he showed off his draft skills again. (Colaiacovo has been really solid in the games he's played and dekeyser looks good as well. Kindl and lashoff have both proved to be surprisingly good draft picks)

 

The Oilers aren't rebuilding, because they have nothing to rebuild from.

 

We've had a good core the last few years, but Holland has let the pieces around it dwindle without adding anything of value.  

 

We do have some decent young players, but Datsyuk and Zetterberg are current stars, whose careers I'm afraid will wind down on an average team.  Do you think when they retire, guys like Nyquist and Tatar will be stars on their level?  I don't.  

 

The real rebuilding will start when Pavel and Z (or either of them) finish their careers.  Then we can start to suck.  Now, we can be better than this.    


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#53 The Axe

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 07:40 PM

 
The Oilers aren't rebuilding, because they have nothing to rebuild from.
 
We've had a good core the last few years, but Holland has let the pieces around it dwindle without adding anything of value.  
 
We do have some decent young players, but Datsyuk and Zetterberg are current stars, whose careers I'm afraid will wind down on an average team.  Do you think when they retire, guys like Nyquist and Tatar will be stars on their level?  I don't.  
 
The real rebuilding will start when Pavel and Z (or either of them) finish their careers.  Then we can start to suck.  Now, we can be better than this.    


Z and D have 3 or 4 more in them. I wouldn't abandon ship just yet.

#54 GMRwings1983

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 08:18 PM

Z and D have 3 or 4 more in them. I wouldn't abandon ship just yet.

 

Datsyuk probably has like 1 or 2 in him.

 

I don't expect Holland to do anything significant during the offseason or next year's deadline.  The prices are unlikely to go down and he's still too bullheaded to get with the program.


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#55 Euro_Twins

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 03:16 AM

This cliche is about as overused here as "I like our team".

 

It's also interesting that you left LA out of that list you made of teams that made big moves (Carter, Richards, etc), and yet they won the Cup because of them and are still looking good this year.  Chicago has recovered quite nicely from their after-Cup fire sale to be a top contender again and Pittsburgh barely gave up anything for their "rentals" this year.  I would say those GMs have done a nice job.

 

esteef

 

I left out LA because they won't be in a cap crunch, LA did a good job of getting good talent at a low cost, Pittsburgh gave up draft picks in a deep draft, but moreso put themselves in a position that they have to unload cap in the summer. That is what I am reffering to, the teams that made big trades for a cup run, but won't be able to hold on to them because of the cap going down, which is the position we would have been in had we traded for someone



#56 frankgrimes

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 04:23 AM

My rankings are

 

Holland > Shero > Chiarelli > Poile > Stevie

 

Do I think Holland is perfect? No way, but which GM is? Hollands hands are tied, because the league is an absolute joke and embarrassment under the current office stuff and owners are blind enough, to keep these non-hockey-guys employed.

 

I think not trading White and filps at the deadline was a mistake and if Filps walks for nothing in the summer, missed chance in a deep upcoming draft. Holland is damn smart and still the best GM but honestly, I think he should move up in the organization and by that time Stevie should be ready to replace him.

 

btw. nhl.com is still blocked not going to give their site traffic thanks to the lockout.


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#57 esteef

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 10:51 AM

 
I left out LA because they won't be in a cap crunch, LA did a good job of getting good talent at a low cost, Pittsburgh gave up draft picks in a deep draft, but moreso put themselves in a position that they have to unload cap in the summer. That is what I am reffering to, the teams that made big trades for a cup run, but won't be able to hold on to them because of the cap going down, which is the position we would have been in had we traded for someone


I'd rather have a lot of good pieces and worry about which ones to shed than have to go overpay and be outbid for players who may or may not even be what we need or want. Which is what Kenny has done lately.

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#58 PavelValerievichDatsyuk

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 11:18 AM

The Oil is looking good, tho.

Look again



#59 Dominator2005

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 11:56 AM

I still think he's the best gm... By far.
A lot of posters here think he is on the decline because he hasn't landed a lot of big name free agents/trades but think about this:
29 teams didn't land parise or suter
29 teams didn't land semin
29 teams didn't get bouwmeester
29 teams didn't land Justin Schultz.......
Holand did manage to land Brunner and dekeyser who both look very promising.

Most teams' rebuilds look like Edmonton's or Calgary's or buffalo's. Holland managed to construct a major rebuild without even missing the playoffs (hopefully), and he kept our prospect pool intact. (He strengthened it if you consider dekeyser a prospect.
Good job Kenny!


I think that Brunner signed here because Babs was very high on him.
DeKe is a huge Red Wings fan so I guess it was an easy decision/call which he had to make.

My rankings are
 
Holland > Shero > Chiarelli > Poile > Stevie
 
Do I think Holland is perfect? No way, but which GM is? Hollands hands are tied, because the league is an absolute joke and embarrassment under the current office stuff and owners are blind enough, to keep these non-hockey-guys employed.
 
I think not trading White and filps at the deadline was a mistake and if Filps walks for nothing in the summer, missed chance in a deep upcoming draft. Holland is damn smart and still the best GM but honestly, I think he should move up in the organization and by that time Stevie should be ready to replace him.
 
btw. nhl.com is still blocked not going to give their site traffic thanks to the lockout.



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#60 Euro_Twins

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 12:37 PM

I'd rather have a lot of good pieces and worry about which ones to shed than have to go overpay and be outbid for players who may or may not even be what we need or want. Which is what Kenny has done lately.

esteef


Agree to disagree I suppose, while I do agree Kenny has made some questionable signings, I like that we are rebuilding and still within reach of a playoff position, and with a deep draft upcoming I am happy he didn't trade our picks away anyways. We all would love to see the wings win another cup, but I would rather it not come at the expense of our teams future. Nyquist is looking great, Tatar had a great run, Sheahan will be a great physical grinder. We have Frk, Pulkinin, Jurco, Sproul, Ouellet, Mrazek, Patterson and others in the pipeline that could potentially be stars one day, so I like the way our future team could look.


Edited by Euro_Twins, 14 April 2013 - 12:41 PM.






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