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Mike Babcock Line swapping.. Too much?


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#1 kickazz

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 10:47 PM

Seriously, the past three years and especially this year the line swapping have been at a maximum. I feel like there's no opportunity for any chemistry being built. Don't get me wrong , I like Babcock, but how are you supposed to let team chemistry build if you just keep swapping guys back and forth ? He started the year with Z, Dats and Brunner, it wasn't doing good for a few games and he completely gave up on it? I mean, at some point you've got to realize that there simply isn't enough offense available right?

 

In any case, does it logically make sense as a coach to swap lines so much? It takes time to built chemistry in a line.. You're at the end of the season and you haven't built any good chemistry at all.. Maybe he shouldn't have swapped around cuz it sure didn't make a difference at this point in the season.

 

What are you thoughts?


Edited by kickazz, 19 April 2013 - 10:48 PM.


#2 GMRwings1983

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:20 PM

In a short season, you have to swap all these lines, because you don't have time to let them gel together.

 

He's done it frequently because the offense has been terrible and the lines haven't mixed well for the most part.

 

It's a catch-22 in many ways.  


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#3 DeGraa55

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:28 PM

In a short season, you have to swap all these lines, because you don't have time to let them gel together.
 
He's done it frequently because the offense has been terrible and the lines haven't mixed well for the most part.
 
It's a catch-22 in many ways.



Pretty much what I was going to say...

#4 irishock

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 12:06 AM

He had 82 games to work with last season so lines like Franzen-Dats-Bert, Miller-Helm-Danny and Flip-Z-Hudler were able to stay permanent.


Edited by irishock, 20 April 2013 - 12:06 AM.

bringit.jpg


#5 TheOwl

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 12:49 AM

Letting Hudler go was a huge mistake. At least the guy knew the system and could put up points. You develop a player for almost a decade, and right when he's reaching his potential, you let him go. I'm afraid the same thing might happen to Flipulla. Unless Holland buys out Quiency and another significant player, there is no way out roster is going to be any better on paper than this year.



#6 loutswings

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 06:02 AM

I get its a short season and all but I think putting a totally different defensive lineup every game does us no justice. I thought the defense looked good against Nashville and the next game we changed it again.

#7 kickazz

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 09:57 AM

In a short season, you have to swap all these lines, because you don't have time to let them gel together.

 

He's done it frequently because the offense has been terrible and the lines haven't mixed well for the most part.

 

It's a catch-22 in many ways.  

I get that but , in Babcocks case I feel as though he's overdone it compared to other teams. And at this point in the season there's absolutely no chemistry at all...



#8 GMRwings1983

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 10:24 AM

I get that but , in Babcocks case I feel as though he's overdone it compared to other teams. And at this point in the season there's absolutely no chemistry at all...

 

Line combos don't matter if the forwards are lazy and don't have much talent.  We have a few great players (who aren't scoring goals) and a bunch of scrubs surrounding them.  

 

It's the players that make the lines work, not the coaches.  I do think the players have tuned out Babcock  the last few years, but changing lines isn't going to fix that.


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#9 Crymson

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:19 AM

Letting Hudler go was a huge mistake. At least the guy knew the system and could put up points. You develop a player for almost a decade, and right when he's reaching his potential, you let him go. I'm afraid the same thing might happen to Flipulla. Unless Holland buys out Quiency and another significant player, there is no way out roster is going to be any better on paper than this year.

 

I can't even imagine the explosion that would have occurred had Holland given Hudler $4m for four seasons. It would have been thermonuclear.



#10 Nyquistfan14

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:58 AM

 
I can't even imagine the explosion that would have occurred had Holland given Hudler $4m for four seasons. It would have been thermonuclear.


I will take hudler for 4 mill over Sammy for 3 mill with a NTC. Hudler is in his prime and had great chemistry with hank and fil. As much flack as he took the guy can slow down the play and make things happen. Oh and even being a small guy he did a hell of a job in front of the net.

#11 Echolalia

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 01:16 PM

There was another coach who swapped lines even more than Babcock has.

He goes by the name Scotty Bowman.

#12 The Axe

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 01:55 PM

There was another coach who swapped lines even more than Babcock has.

He goes by the name Scotty Bowman.


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#13 kickazz

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 02:07 PM

There was another coach who swapped lines even more than Babcock has.

He goes by the name Scotty Bowman.

Yes but those line swappings actually produced chemistry man.. Wings had some legitimate players in the mid to late 90s and early 2000s. I remember when he put Federov on defense, it actually worked. But nothing Babcock has done this season has worked.



#14 The Axe

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 03:19 PM

Yes but those line swappings actually produced chemistry man.. Wings had some legitimate players in the mid to late 90s and early 2000s. I remember when he put Federov on defense, it actually worked. But nothing Babcock has done this season has worked.


We have a few gaping holes at forward. Can you imagine if we removed our 2 goal scoring wingers from the cup teams?

McCarty - Yzerman - Cleary
Kozlov - Larionov - Abdelkader

Come on. Cleary and Abdelkader with Datsyuk says it all. That's simply bad management. And note to Babcock: spreading talent only works if you have some. Put Flip, Days, and Hank together and hope.

#15 F.Michael

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 03:28 PM

For Babs it must be tuff...You have elite forward talent such as Dats/Hank, and yet many well below average talent that must play alongside our top guys.



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#16 kickazz

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 05:20 PM

We have a few gaping holes at forward. Can you imagine if we removed our 2 goal scoring wingers from the cup teams?

McCarty - Yzerman - Cleary
Kozlov - Larionov - Abdelkader

Come on. Cleary and Abdelkader with Datsyuk says it all. That's simply bad management. And note to Babcock: spreading talent only works if you have some. Put Flip, Days, and Hank together and hope.

 

 

Yessir, I agree with you, and the point im tryin to make is. Mr. Babcock,: you shoulda just stuck to Z, Dats, and Brunner and by now it wuda been a good chemistry after 43 games are done. But... they never happened, and abdelkader is still on line 1, with no chemistry >.>



#17 The Axe

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 05:23 PM

 
 
Yessir, I agree with you, and the point im tryin to make is. Mr. Babcock,: you shoulda just stuck to Z, Dats, and Brunner and by now it wuda been a good chemistry after 43 games are done. But... they never happened, and abdelkader is still on line 1, with no chemistry >.>


I would not complain.

#18 Wings_Toledo

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 05:52 PM

The problem with having a top line of Z - Dats - Brunner is that if the opposing team shuts down that line, they pretty much shut down the entire team.

 

If Z and Dats are separated, then there's a least a chance that something could happen.  There just isn't enough offensive talent on this team to keep them together for the entire short season.



#19 kickazz

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 05:54 PM

The problem with having a top line of Z - Dats - Brunner is that if the opposing team shuts down that line, they pretty much shut down the entire team.

 

If Z and Dats are separated, then there's a least a chance that something could happen.  There just isn't enough offensive talent on this team to keep them together for the entire short season.

Yea but when they get separated they get double teamed lol. It's a catch 22.



#20 poel

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 12:38 AM

Z and Datsjuk need to be separated, otherwise this team will not be able to create offense over several lines. But Datjuk has to play with Franzen and Z has to play with Brunner. Otherwise the offense will not work, too. Z isn't a goal scorer and will never be one, so he needs snipers on his line who can score goals. I'd prefer Tatar and Brunner. Datsjuk needs someone who can create space, who wins the board battles and who can drive to the net. Abby is a guy for just 10min a game, so Datsjuk has to go with Franzen. That's the reason why other lines didn't work and it's also the reason why we're still fighting for a playoff spot. Remember the time when Quincey was injured and Lash played with Kronwall, Tatar was in the roster instead of Nyquist and Brunner played with Z. Wings won a lot of games and played very successfully. I really don't understand why Babs changed everything.

Also remember who the team stepped up after a terrible 1st period against the Flames when Babs reunite Datsjuk with Franzen and Z with Brunner. That's exactly what I say all the time. Even I blind can see it but Babcock's obviously too stubborn to admit that...







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