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Ilya Kovalchuk announces retirement


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#181 number9

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 04:25 PM

They could have tied him to his contract. Not sure that it would qualify as "being a dick" to make him fulfill a contract that he signed. They also voided the contract outright. That allowed him outright freedom. They could have just loaned him to the KHL (think of Radulov or Hudler). Not every GM would have been so willing to let him go and and relinquish his NHL rights.
 
And for number9: Here's Kovalchuck when left:
 
http://www.nhl.com/i...s.htm?id=677712
 
Kovalchuk said in a statement released by the team. "Though I decided to return this past season, [general manager] Lou [Lamoriello] was aware of my desire to go back home and have my family there with me. The most difficult thing for me is to leave the New Jersey Devils, a great organization that I have a lot of respect for, and our fans that have been great to me."
 
Yes, he's saying it partly for PR reasons, but I'm not sure why people disagreed with me that he might feel some good will toward Lamoriello. Is there some stated animosity that I'm unaware of? 

Kovys always been a money chaser. Suddenly he wants to return right when the Russian economy is getting hit? Coincidence? Or maybe he's just sick of his family (sarcasm)?

If he does come back, my bet is he's going to sign with the highest bidder plain and simple.

Parise had nothing but good things to say about NJ, doesn't mean he wanted to stay there.

Edited by number9, 25 March 2015 - 04:26 PM.


#182 PavelValerievichDatsyuk

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 04:38 PM

Kovys always been a money chaser. Suddenly he wants to return right when the Russian economy is getting hit? Coincidence? Or maybe he's just sick of his family (sarcasm)?

If he does come back, my bet is he's going to sign with the highest bidder plain and simple.

Parise had nothing but good things to say about NJ, doesn't mean he wanted to stay there.

Okay, I see that. 

 

It's a more compelling argument than "lol, naaaaa."

 

For what it's worth, kovy denied the rumour:

 

http://www.sportsnet...uk-nhl-rumours/



#183 Buppy

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 05:14 PM

They could have tied him to his contract. Not sure that it would qualify as "being a dick" to make him fulfill a contract that he signed. They also voided the contract outright. That allowed him outright freedom. They could have just loaned him to the KHL (think of Radulov or Hudler). Not every GM would have been so willing to let him go and and relinquish his NHL rights.

 

... 

Tied him to his contract in what sense? They couldn't force him to stay in NJ. All they could have done was maybe block him from playing in Russia. And IMO, doing something to hurt someone even though you don't gain anything from it is pretty much the definition of being a dick.



#184 PavelValerievichDatsyuk

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 05:46 PM

Tied him to his contract in what sense? They couldn't force him to stay in NJ. All they could have done was maybe block him from playing in Russia. And IMO, doing something to hurt someone even though you don't gain anything from it is pretty much the definition of being a dick.

When you sign a contract, you're expected to fulfill it. If you decide one day, nevermind, i don't wanna do that thing that I legally put my name to and promised to do, then you are the dick not the otherside who is fulfilling their end of the contract. When the other side waives their legal right to enforce said contract and allows you out of it that, is a personal favour. In this case, it was a favour that was detrimental to the interests of their organization.

 

They had a contract it's not "forcing him to stay in NJ." Any NHL contract blocks that person from playing in Russia or any other league.



#185 Buppy

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Posted 25 March 2015 - 07:03 PM

When you sign a contract, you're expected to fulfill it. If you decide one day, nevermind, i don't wanna do that thing that I legally put my name to and promised to do, then you are the dick not the otherside who is fulfilling their end of the contract. When the other side waives their legal right to enforce said contract and allows you out of it that, is a personal favour. In this case, it was a favour that was detrimental to the interests of their organization.

 

They had a contract it's not "forcing him to stay in NJ." Any NHL contract blocks that person from playing in Russia or any other league.

Not exactly. NHL players are allowed to retire. They have every right to, "decide one day, nevermind...". Regardless of whether doing so makes Kovy a dick or not, two wrongs don't make a right. You might speculate that had the Devils wanted to block him from playing in the KHL, he might have stayed with them, but I could just as easily speculate that the Devils wanted out of the deal themselves. Going on the assumption that he wasn't going to play in NJ regardless, then allowing or not allowing him to play in the KHL doesn't have any impact on the Devils. There's no reason to block it except out of spite.

 

And it isn't detrimental to the organization at all. It may become detrimental if Kovy wants to come back to the NHL and the Devils in fact no longer retain any rights to him and he can still play up to the level of his previous contract and the Devils would indeed want him and his contract back. That's a lot of ifs.



#186 Son of a Wing

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 08:20 AM

Not exactly. NHL players are allowed to retire. They have every right to, "decide one day, nevermind...". Regardless of whether doing so makes Kovy a dick or not, two wrongs don't make a right. You might speculate that had the Devils wanted to block him from playing in the KHL, he might have stayed with them, but I could just as easily speculate that the Devils wanted out of the deal themselves. Going on the assumption that he wasn't going to play in NJ regardless, then allowing or not allowing him to play in the KHL doesn't have any impact on the Devils. There's no reason to block it except out of spite.

 

And it isn't detrimental to the organization at all. It may become detrimental if Kovy wants to come back to the NHL and the Devils in fact no longer retain any rights to him and he can still play up to the level of his previous contract and the Devils would indeed want him and his contract back. That's a lot of ifs.

 

Of course players are allowed to retire.  But Kovy didn't retire. He "retired".  He used it as a legal maneuver to get out of his contract.  It's not the same.


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi
 
When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”

#187 Buppy

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 10:54 AM

 

Of course players are allowed to retire.  But Kovy didn't retire. He "retired".  He used it as a legal maneuver to get out of his contract.  It's not the same.

Not playing for the Devils is not playing for the Devils. Whether sitting on his ass or working in some unrelated business or playing for a non-competing hockey team on the other side of the world makes no difference. None of it has any impact on the Devils. 



#188 rrasco

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 11:06 AM

Not playing for the Devils is not playing for the Devils. Whether sitting on his ass or working in some unrelated business or playing for a non-competing hockey team on the other side of the world makes no difference. None of it has any impact on the Devils. 

 

I think he just means that he didn't simply retire and be done with the sport, he retired so he could go play somewhere else.  The Devils wanted out of that contract too so it was mutually beneficial at the time.


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#189 Son of a Wing

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 11:08 AM

Not playing for the Devils is not playing for the Devils. Whether sitting on his ass or working in some unrelated business or playing for a non-competing hockey team on the other side of the world makes no difference. None of it has any impact on the Devils. 

 

I didn't say anything to the contrary. lol

 

I'm just not going to pretend his retiring was anything but a legal maneuver.


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi
 
When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”

#190 PavelValerievichDatsyuk

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 11:51 AM

Not exactly. NHL players are allowed to retire. They have every right to, "decide one day, nevermind...". Regardless of whether doing so makes Kovy a dick or not, two wrongs don't make a right. You might speculate that had the Devils wanted to block him from playing in the KHL, he might have stayed with them, but I could just as easily speculate that the Devils wanted out of the deal themselves. Going on the assumption that he wasn't going to play in NJ regardless, then allowing or not allowing him to play in the KHL doesn't have any impact on the Devils. There's no reason to block it except out of spite.

 

And it isn't detrimental to the organization at all. It may become detrimental if Kovy wants to come back to the NHL and the Devils in fact no longer retain any rights to him and he can still play up to the level of his previous contract and the Devils would indeed want him and his contract back. That's a lot of ifs.

As Son of a Wing said, Kovy didn't retire even though they called it that. He switched leagues. Contracts inherently block against that. And the KHL and the NHL have an agreement to stop pursuing players under contract in the other league. All I'm saying is that to get this done, I think it took some good will on the part of the Devils. They did have a choice to let him go. I'll even allow that it might have be slightly dickish to point to the contract when a player really wants out, but that doesn't negate that it was classy for them to let him out of this gigantic contract where he had promised 9 more years to them. Also, they wouldn't have blocked him "out of spite." It would've been because they wanted him to play for their team and they had a contract.

 

My original point was just that Kovy might feel some debt or gratitude or respect for them letting him out of the contract. That's me speculating on Kovy's mindset. There's no way of knowing how he interpreted the events or knowing his true opinion of the Devils organization. I feel it would be a possibility.

 

Anyway, he denied the rumour and I don't see a return happening for him.


Edited by PavelValerievichDatsyuk, 26 March 2015 - 11:59 AM.


#191 wings4thecup06

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 12:18 PM

Seeing as he retired, wouldn't he have to be re-instated by the league, not just get the approval of the 29 other teams?


temp 1

 


#192 Son of a Wing

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Posted 26 March 2015 - 12:31 PM

Seeing as he retired, wouldn't he have to be re-instated by the league, not just get the approval of the 29 other teams?

 

I'd check out this video to understand the details.


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi
 
When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”





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