Samuelsson: IR to All-Star?

[Dabura 12,207]

The "Sammy sucks" thing goes way back. This isn't just about last season.

To be honest, I don't think he sucks. He can just be maddeningly...Samuelsson-y.

My big beef with him right now is he's 35. And he's given absolutely no indication that he's anything remotely close to an iron man. (The opposite, in fact.)

Holland likes veterans, familiarity, big guys who aren't especially physical, reclamation projects. That's why he's here. Not because he's especially impressive. Also: he's a right-handed shot.

[number9 3,297]

What I remember is that he was brutally honest - Vancouver simply offered the most money, and Sammy said so. It was always my favourite thing about him, his interviews were always honest and he didn't deal in empty platitudes just to please the fans like so many players do (and so many fans fall for). He's never hidden the fact that he is a proffesional hockey player i.e. playing hockey is his job, not his hobby.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWmJC1EhWnE

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

What I remember is that he was brutally honest - Vancouver simply offered the most money, and Sammy said so. It was always my favourite thing about him, his interviews were always honest and he didn't deal in empty platitudes just to please the fans like so many players do (and so many fans fall for). He's never hidden the fact that he is a proffesional hockey player i.e. playing hockey is his job, not his hobby.

That's how I remember it as well. He got more money and ended up with more icetime there too.

He took a lot of flack his first stint in Detroit but he was a great value for his contract and a key part of the offense. I don't fault Sammy at all for coming back on this contract. I fault Holland for having such a fixation on former Wings and throwing in a NTC to what was already a good contract. Sammy's production is unlikely to go up at this point in his career, even if he stays healthy.

The upside is he shoots the puck (all shinpad assassin jokes aside), he's a righthanded shot, and he's irritating to play against.

My guess is he won't produce/stay healthy enough to earn his contract, but for better or worse the Wings are stuck with him. Hopefully he contributes.

[barabbas16 499]

I had no problem with Sammy's first stint with the Wings. It was how he left and the way he acted when he did. If I recall, he was kind of nasty and bitter about the whole thing, not being offered a deal. He was equally unpleasant when he wasn't put on the Swedish Olympic team. Also, if the rumors that he was going to dispute an attempted buyout are accurate, that really hasn't endeared him to me either. With is injury situation, Babcock has seemed to be a bit frustrated with him, along the lines of maybe not believing he's injured or as seriously injured as he says. Just an impression, no direct quotes from Babs.

But this one's all on Holland. I see what his thinking was as far as having a guy on the second unit of the PP play the point with the loss of Lidstrom. But no way in hell was he worth a two year, 6m, NTC deal. I just don't think there was that much of a market for him.

You don't recall correctly. If I'm wrong, please post a link with Samuelsson's nasty quotes about Detroit from that time period. Seriously, has the Samuelsson hate gotten to the point now where we're going to make up bad stories about him that never happened? Or is the hatred just so blinding that we don't really remember and just assume everything associated with Samuelsson was negative and terrible?

[GoWings1905 2,694]

I would be content with just another IR stint.

My biggest gripe with Sammy is which forward doesn't play because of him? There's already a logjam up front. Even if the Wings remove a couple bodies, they are likely going to be guys that were on the fringe of being regulars anyways. Samuelsson and Bertuzzi shouldn't be playing at the expense of Nyquist and Tatar.

It was a silly contract from the start and I don't see any purpose for Samuelsson being on the team.

[Jesusberg 1,256]

My biggest issue with Sammy being on the team isn't his play, but what he's taking away from the young guys - ice time. With Abs all but certain to be on the 1st line beside Z and Dats, and the 2nd line poised to be Mule-Weiss-Alfie, that knocks guys like Gus and Tatar down even further. The 3rd line of Tatar-Andersson(Helm, healthy)-Nyquist may end up using Sammy instead.

Goose doesn't belong on the 4th line, but then again, neither does Samuelsson. It's just an unfortunate situation to have at the moment.

[Nev 1,085]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWmJC1EhWnE

Hahaha

My personal fave was during the '08 finals. For some reason the NHL stops giving us the CBC/Versus/NBC/local feed during the finals and gives us a special "international" commentary that treats the viewers like idiots. Anyway, the intermission interviews are always a Euro from each team and they always finish the interview by saying "would you like to say something in you native tongue for the folks back home?" and the player will give a line in whatever language.

So one game it was Sammy for Detroit.

Dave Strader: Mikael, one last thing, would you like to say something in your native tongue for the folks back home?

Samuelsson: Not really *walks away*

Edited August 24, 2013 by Nev

[RyanBarnes! 293]

W a s h e d U p !

[blgillett 48]

[url=http://thehockeywriters.com/detroit-red-wings-mikael-samuelsson-ir-star/]http://thehockeywriters.com/detroit-red-wings-mikael-samuelsson-ir-star/[/url

Of course he's not going to be an actual "All-Star", but I'm also of the opinion that Sammy gets to much flack for a guy that never had a chance to show he's worth his cap hit. I think having him and Helm back will really give us some good options at forward. Plus Sammy did play in Florida with Weiss, though I'm not sure how much they played on the same line.

If sammy isn't on IR this year we are in deep crap

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Last year you have to kinda throw out the window with Samuelsson being injured so match.

At the time, definitely seemed like a decent signing. Nothing earth shattering, but the amount of flak he takes is pretty absurd at times. At the time, couldn't have really predicted if some of the younger guys would have really stepped up in the immediate short term to produce, Nyquist, Andersson, Tatar, etc.

With some of the younger guys showing their potential last season, Samuelsson, and Bertuzzi as well, are at a crossroads where they're going to have to be fighting for playoff time.

That being said too much forward depth/experience isn't a bad problem to have.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Last year you have to kinda throw out the window with Samuelsson being injured so match.

At the time, definitely seemed like a decent signing. Nothing earth shattering, but the amount of flak he takes is pretty absurd at times. At the time, couldn't have really predicted if some of the younger guys would have really stepped up in the immediate short term to produce, Nyquist, Andersson, Tatar, etc.

With some of the younger guys showing their potential last season, Samuelsson, and Bertuzzi as well, are at a crossroads where they're going to have to be fighting for playoff time.

That being said too much forward depth/experience isn't a bad problem to have.

Actually, even at the time it seemed like an awful signing, and many people here stated so.

As usual, we wanted Holland to target a bigger winger, and not a former washed up player. The no-trade clause ticked even more people off. Sammy was coming off an injury season. Also, many people were calling for the young guns to get more playing time.

The signing was pointless even when it happened. This isn't hindsight being 20/20. Just a bad move by Holland, much like the Tootoo / Colaicovo signings and the Quincey trade.

Let's hope Alfredsson and Weiss turn out much differently.

[dirtydangles 1,328]

What I remember is that he was brutally honest - Vancouver simply offered the most money, and Sammy said so. It was always my favourite thing about him, his interviews were always honest and he didn't deal in empty platitudes just to please the fans like so many players do (and so many fans fall for). He's never hidden the fact that he is a proffesional hockey player i.e. playing hockey is his job, not his hobby.

I completely disagree with the premise here. In order to be a professional at your job it does not imply that you take the most money. Many people choose to turn down job opportunities that offer greater financial compensation for many reasons such as comfort, work environment, loyalty, colleagues, etc. Squeezing pennies out of your employers isn't part of being a professional. I think that the truth is that Sammy values money higher than the other things I listed and that has no barring on his status as a professional hockey player.

[Dabura 12,207]

Doesn't "professional" just mean "Gets paid to do what he/she does"? I mean, in the "strict" sense of the word?

Edited August 25, 2013 by Dabura

[Euro_Twins 4,475]

Doesn't "professional" just mean "Gets paid to do what he/she does"? I mean, in the "strict" sense of the word?

Right gets "paid" wouldn't you try to get paid as much as possible?

Actually, even at the time it seemed like an awful signing, and many people here stated so.

As usual, we wanted Holland to target a bigger winger, and not a former washed up player. The no-trade clause ticked even more people off. Sammy was coming off an injury season. Also, many people were calling for the young guns to get more playing time.

The signing was pointless even when it happened. This isn't hindsight being 20/20. Just a bad move by Holland, much like the Tootoo / Colaicovo signings and the Quincey trade.

Let's hope Alfredsson and Weiss turn out much differently.

If memory serves correct, and it does. Holland did try to get big name ufas. And when that plan failed he had to get the table scraps that were left.

[derblaueClaus 1,668]

I completely disagree with the premise here. In order to be a professional at your job it does not imply that you take the most money. Many people choose to turn down job opportunities that offer greater financial compensation for many reasons such as comfort, work environment, loyalty, colleagues, etc. Squeezing pennies out of your employers isn't part of being a professional. I think that the truth is that Sammy values money higher than the other things I listed and that has no barring on his status as a professional hockey player.

The point that nev and some others make is more that you cannot blame a professional Athlet for deciding against a better team and taking more money instead. And, by the way, I can understand every person who does. It's the same everywhere : You don't need to love what you do, you only need to be good at it. You probably won't get the love and passion of the fans like people as Yzerman, Orr, Crosby and many others get. But that doesn't turn them instantly into bad and unprofessional players or bad persons per se.

And that you can decide against money and still be called professional is out of question and as far as I understood, never argued for by anyone.

Edited August 25, 2013 by derblaueClaus

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Right gets "paid" wouldn't you try to get paid as much as possible?

If memory serves correct, and it does. Holland did try to get big name ufas. And when that plan failed he had to get the table scraps that were left.

Just because you can't get big name ufas, doesn't mean you should sign a Samuelsson to a foolish contract. I guess Holland is just as prone to overreaction as any other GM.

Edited August 25, 2013 by GMRwings1983

[DickieDunn 2,571]

When he takes time away from kids then people can complain about it

Eaves and Emmerton are the guys getting cut not anyone better than a 4th liner.

2 years at $3 mil is not a big contract. I can easily list a dozen signed the last 2 years worse. The ntc was a moot point. If he played well they wouldn't want to trade him. If he played bad nobody would want him and players will generally waive them anyway.

When he's healthy he can score 45+ points throw a few hits and piss off the other team. If he's not orbhe craps the bed then he sits on IR again or the press box and a younger guy gets his ice time. Win-win.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

When he takes time away from kids then people can complain about it Eaves and Emmerton are the guys getting cut not anyone better than a 4th liner. 2 years at $3 mil is not a big contract. I can easily list a dozen signed the last 2 years worse. The ntc was a moot point. If he played well they wouldn't want to trade him. If he played bad nobody would want him and players will generally waive them anyway. When he's healthy he can score 45+ points throw a few hits and piss off the other team. If he's not orbhe craps the bed then he sits on IR again or the press box and a younger guy gets his ice time. Win-win.

Sammy playing on the 4th line is just as bad as him playing bigger minutes. He's not the type of player that should be a 4th liner. That role is better for players with size and grit. Holland and Babcock have no clue what a 4th line is supposed to be.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

The 4th line is whatever is left. For a time the team was stacked and the Grind Line was #4. Last year it was the Pk guys and/or Tootoo. This year it could be the kid line or Helm's check line, possibly centering Miller and Samuelsson, will be the 4 line.

Edited August 25, 2013 by DickieDunn

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

The 4th line is whatever is left. For a time the team was stacked and the Grind Line was #4. Last year it was the Pk guys and/or Tootoo. This year it could be the kid line or Helm's check line, possibly centering Miller and Samuelsson, will be the 4 line.

Our 4th line has been awful for several seasons. Look at the series against Anaheim, where their 4th line was a huge advantage for them. Ours did nothing in that series. Teams that win the Cup typically have a 4th line that contributes greatly throughout the run.

It shouldn't just be a place to stack leftover players. It should have identity and purpose, namely an energy line that sparks the teams and has guys with grit, size and preferably fighting ability. A 4th line of Miller-Helm-Samuelsson isn't much of a 4th line.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Sure it is. 2 guys who get in and hit and Samuelsson is good at pissing people off. 2 grinders and a guy who shoots. Also if he shows anything he could bump Abdelkader out of the top 6. Samuelsson as the shooter for Datsyuk and Zetterberg could work well.

As for our 4th line, put the injured guys in and it's better.

Edited August 25, 2013 by DickieDunn

[Euro_Twins 4,475]

Sammy playing on the 4th line is just as bad as him playing bigger minutes. He's not the type of player that should be a 4th liner. That role is better for players with size and grit. Holland and Babcock have no clue what a 4th line is supposed to be.

Right, one of the best gms and coaches in the league have absolutely no clue what a 4th line should consist of. And in further news kwame is innocent

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Right, one of the best gms and coaches in the league have absolutely no clue what a 4th line should consist of. And in further news kwame is innocent

Not the last few years they don't.

You're thinking old times. Don't. It's 2013. For the last few seasons, our 4th line has been useless and a waste of time.

Sure it is. 2 guys who get in and hit and Samuelsson is good at pissing people off. 2 grinders and a guy who shoots. Also if he shows anything he could bump Abdelkader out of the top 6. Samuelsson as the shooter for Datsyuk and Zetterberg could work well. As for our 4th line, put the injured guys in and it's better.

Miller hits?

Also, Helm is more of a 3rd liner . He's too important to this team to be on the 4th line.

Edited August 25, 2013 by GMRwings1983

[GoWings1905 2,694]

When he takes time away from kids then people can complain about it Eaves and Emmerton are the guys getting cut not anyone better than a 4th liner.2 years at $3 mil is not a big contract. I can easily list a dozen signed the last 2 years worse. The ntc was a moot point. If he played well they wouldn't want to trade him. If he played bad nobody would want him and players will generally waive them anyway.When he's healthy he can score 45+ points throw a few hits and piss off the other team. If he's not orbhe craps the bed then he sits on IR again or the press box and a younger guy gets his ice time. Win-win.

That's where my concern lies. I don't see Samuelsson taking Eaves' or Emmerton's spot. Those two likely aren't playing regardless if everyone is healthy to start the season.

Z - Pav - Abby

Mule - Weiss - Alfie

Nyquist - Helm - Tatar

Miller - Andersson - Bertuzzi

I think you could mess around with the combinations on the bottom two lines, but those are the guys I think should/will dress if everything goes well with Helm. That doesn't even include Tootoo. So, even if the Wings end up cutting ties with Emmerton and/or Eaves, I still don't see where Samuelsson fits. I guess you could make a case over Bertuzzi, but I think Bert is more valuable with his ability to create space and as an asset in the shootout.

My overriding fear here is Nyquist goes to Grand Rapids all because of Samuelsson. When clearly, Gus has earned his place in the NHL.

Edited August 25, 2013 by GoWings1905

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

That's where my concern lies. I don't see Samuelsson taking Eaves' or Emmerton's spot. Those two likely aren't playing regardless if everyone is healthy to start the season.

Z - Pav - Abby

Mule - Weiss - Alfie

Nyquist - Helm - Tatar

Miller - Andersson - Bertuzzi

I think you could mess around with the combinations on the bottom two lines, but those are the guys I think should/will dress if everything goes well with Helm. That doesn't even include Tootoo. So, even if the Wings end up cutting ties with Emmerton and/or Eaves, I still don't see where Samuelsson fits. I guess you could make a case over Bertuzzi, but I think Bert is more valuable with his ability to create space and as an asset in the shootout.

My overriding fear here is Nyquist goes to Grand Rapids all because of Samuelsson. When clearly, Gus has earned his place in the NHL.

Abdelkader on the top line? I hope to God not.