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brett

buffalo and toronto fight

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Whatever. He didn't deserve the slashes period even if he is a goon. And I really think this whole thread would be going differently if it were Crosby. I don't care what you say on that.

In a perfect world Scott would get a 10 game suspension and Kessel would get a fine.

What!?!? Really?? What did Scott do to get 10 games again? 10 games for what!? Breaking some player code that half of these fake skilled tough guys apparently don't even live up to themselves? Kessel apparently was fine to fight someone in there. He dropped his gloves. He was no saint on the ice there.

Lighten up Francis, it was hyperbole.

Though it was Scott's goon tactics that set off the whole melee. I'm glad Kessel two handed him. Scott picked a fight with a much smaller non-fighting star player and jumped him on the faceoff to boot. What he got was a taste of old time hockey, and he absolutely deserved it.

As I said, I'm not even a Kessel fan, but it's an unbelievable idiotic move for a useless goon like Scott to jump Kessel on a faceoff. I think fighting has a place in hockey but it's crap like Scott just pulled that will get it completely removed from the game.

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While scott was out of line in challenging/threatening kessel or whatever, there is no defending a two handed slash (let alone multiple slashes).... kessel acted out of pure frustration with full intent to hurt another player. I don't care who the other player is, that makes kessel just as much of a goon as anyone.

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Here's a good take on the fight that I generally agree with. It's from one of my favorite hockey blogs, written by a former minor leaguer.

http://blogs.thescore.com/nhl/2013/09/23/on-the-regroup-leafs-sabres-brawl-goalies-included-zack-kassian-breaks-gagners-jaw/#more-86077

The Sabres send John Scott over the boards, who promptly tells Phil Kessel he’s coming after him off the faceoff, then does. This is mind-blowing. My question for Scott is, what’s the plan here? Let’s say somehow the ogre catches the jackrabbit, was he just going to punch his face a bunch of times? I’m seeing it widely assumed that was the plan, and it probably was, but I just can’t believe it made sense in John Scott’s head, like, “this is going to go over swell with the league and Leafs.”

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Lighten up Francis, it was hyperbole.

Though it was Scott's goon tactics that set off the whole melee. I'm glad Kessel two handed him. Scott picked a fight with a much smaller non-fighting star player and jumped him on the faceoff to boot. What he got was a taste of old time hockey, and he absolutely deserved it.

As I said, I'm not even a Kessel fan, but it's an unbelievable idiotic move for a useless goon like Scott to jump Kessel on a faceoff. I think fighting has a place in hockey but it's crap like Scott just pulled that will get it completely removed from the game.

So just because we use a quote from a movie it's OK to call someone a name? I will remember that next time I need to call someone an idiot or that they are psycho so I don't get banned. ;)

I'm not saying Scott isn't some goon because we all know he is but I just don't like the fact that people are making Kessel out to be some saint and that he was justified for trying to take someones ankles out is just beyond me. I know I keep going back to the Crosby example but it's true. If this were Crosby I'm sure even you would be saying "oh well" on this one. Preseason game so hopefully neither get anything but if some how Scott gets suspended for any amount that will be the biggest load of crap that I have seen in a hockey game in a long time.

Edited by hillbillywingsfan

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So just because we use a quote from a movie it's OK to call someone a name? I will remember that next time I need to call someone an idiot or that they are psycho so I don't get banned.

I'm not saying Scott isn't some goon because we all know he is but I just don't like the fact that people are making Kessel out to be some saint and that he was justified for trying to take someones ankles out is just beyond me. I know I keep going back to the Crosby example but it's true. If this were Crosby I'm sure even you would be saying "oh well" on this one. Preseason game so hopefully neither get anything but if some how Scott gets suspended for any amount that will be the biggest load of crap that I have seen in a hockey game in a long time.

Good lord, if you recognize that it's a quote from a movie (one of my favorites) then you also know the context. I was trying to make a joke about you seeming so worked up about this, not calling you a name. If I weren't so lazy I'm sure there's a pic or gif of it somewhere. I apologize if you took it personally. I just don't see why your posts seem so angry.

And I'm not sure who's making Kessel out to be a saint. He did give several two handed slashes to a guy. I didn't think I needed to state that he wasn't a saint. But if a goon like Scott came after Zetterberg or Datsyuk I'd be fine if they responded in exactly the same way.

I don't disagree that people would be going nuts in this thread if it were Crosby. But people also have an irrational hate for Crosby here and look for any opportunity to express it. That's why I prefer to consider how I would feel if a Wings player did what Kessel did. And I'd be fine with it. Regardless of how you've decided what my opinion would be, I'd be fine had Crosby done it as well. If you look back at my posts it's pretty clear Crosby irritates me but I don't deny what a talented player he is. It would've been even worse had Scott gone after someone with the concussion history of Crosby.

Frankly I do think Scott should be suspended and Rolston should be fined. He sent out his goon to start something. Carlyle responded by putting out the least confrontational lineup he could've picked and Scott went after Kessel anyway.

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Good lord, if you recognize that it's a quote from a movie (one of my favorites) then you also know the context. I was trying to make a joke about you seeming so worked up about this, not calling you a name. If I weren't so lazy I'm sure there's a pic or gif of it somewhere. I apologize if you took it personally. I just don't see why your posts seem so angry.

And I'm not sure who's making Kessel out to be a saint. He did give several two handed slashes to a guy. I didn't think I needed to state that he wasn't a saint. But if a goon like Scott came after Zetterberg or Datsyuk I'd be fine if they responded in exactly the same way.

I don't disagree that people would be going nuts in this thread if it were Crosby. But people also have an irrational hate for Crosby here and look for any opportunity to express it. That's why I prefer to consider how I would feel if a Wings player did what Kessel did. And I'd be fine with it.

Frankly I do think Scott should be suspended and Rolston should be fined. He sent out his goon to start something. Carlyle responded by putting out the least confrontational lineup he could've picked and Scott went after Kessel anyway.

But you are forgetting why Scott even came out after Kessel. You keep running your mouth calling out a Goon he will at some point come out. And that's what happened. That's the difference with players Like Dat's When is the last time you seen him chirping are a goon? The code I'm sure for the skilled guys as well is don't poke the bear unless you want to "get got" Scott never even was able to get him but Kessel sure did land several slashes. And then when Kessel's team mates jumped on Scott that sure didn't stop Kessel from still hacking away.

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But you are forgetting why Scott even came out after Kessel. You keep running your mouth calling out a Goon he will at some point come out. And that's what happened. That's the difference with players Like Dat's When is the last time you seen him chirping are a goon? The code I'm sure for the skilled guys as well is don't poke the bear unless you want to "get got" Scott never even was able to get him but Kessel sure did land several slashes. And then when Kessel's team mates jumped on Scott that sure didn't stop Kessel from still hacking away.

How do you have any idea what Kessel was saying to Scott? Scott being sent out had to do with the previous fight.

The Sabres were upset about Tropp getting his bell rung in a fight against a bigger opponent in Devane. But both those guys looked like willing combatants and Tropp hit his head on the ice when he pulled Devane down. That's not Devane's fault. So Rolston sends out ubergoon Scott. Carlyle counters with the least aggressive line he could've.

About the only thing that could excuse Scott's actions was if on the faceoff Kessel turned to him and said "You wanna go?" Instead it sounds like it was Scott telling Kessel he was going to jump him.

"I never believed in my wildest dreams that the attack would come at that type of player from the opposition, but I was wrong," Carlyle said Monday.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/id/26715/leafs-start-season-with-dose-of-adversity

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Ok to that point of the fight before was it fair that power forward like Jamie Devane 6'5 210lbs who has several fights fighting a 5'11 185lb more skilled winger Corey Tropp? I'm sure in Scotts eyes that was way unfair so he was going out to "settle" up. I really don't see Scott just jumping over for no reason and wanting to fight Kessel unless there was a reason. That's why this seems so strange for him.

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Kessel apparently thinks he is a fighter he dropped his gloves and fought.

Not really comparable. He did go, yeah, but with someone in his weight class after everyone else had paired off. He's got no business under any circumstances dropping the gloves with Scott and he knew it.

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Ok to that point of the fight before was it fair that power forward like Jamie Devane 6'5 210lbs who has several fights fighting a 5'11 185lb more skilled winger Corey Tropp? I'm sure in Scotts eyes that was way unfair so he was going out to "settle" up. I really don't see Scott just jumping over for no reason and wanting to fight Kessel unless there was a reason. That's why this seems so strange for him.

I agree it was a mismatch but Tropp chose to drop the gloves. He could've just as easily skated away or given a little slash and moved on with the play. If Scott had a problem with it he should've settled with Devane.

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I agree it was a mismatch but Tropp chose to drop the gloves. He could've just as easily skated away or given a little slash and moved on with the play. If Scott had a problem with it he should've settled with Devane.

Well I'm sure with Scott it was "you go after my small skilled guys i'm going after yours."

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i think clarkson gets an auto 10 game suspension for coming off the bench

i just dont like how scott drooped his gloves and chased him. i understand if he had a dirty hit or something but just going after him cause hes good. dumb.

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According to Scott, speaking with the media on Monday (via Buffalo News), he was following The Code, that time-honored and completely nebulous set of standards that dictates who gets punched and when.

Scott believes that Corey Tropp, his Sabres teammate, wasn’t in a fair fight with Jamie Devane of the Maple Leafs in the third period of their Sunday exhibition game. Scott was on the ice when the scrap went down. He apparently didn’t notice Tropp ask for the fight (he did). All he saw was Devane, with a height advantage by at least five inches, pummel Tropp, including a punch that landed as Tropp was falling to the ice, hitting his head.

“The last punch and driving his head into the ice, I don’t think that was needed,” said Scott.

So he stayed on the ice after Tropp went off and Devane went to the penalty box, looking for some measure of retribution. "I would have went after who ever they put lined up next to me,” said Scott.

Maple Leafs Coach Randy Carlyle didn’t have an appetite for further violence. Rather than sending someone out to be pummeled by Scott, he sent Kessel, the team’s best offensive player, out instead to “defuse” the situation.

It’s the hockey version of “you wouldn’t hit a guy with glasses, would ya?” The theory is that goons won’t go after star players. That’s how Carlyle read the Code. Scott had a different reading.

“I can understand his idea behind it. I obviously thought our guy got taken advantage of the shift before. I was trying to stick up for him, and send a message to Toronto,” said Scott.

So Scott decided that even if the sacrificial Leaf was Phil Kessel, he was still the sacrificial Leaf.

“I just lined up with him, and I knew I had to have a response for what happened the shift before, and I said, ‘Phil, we’re going to have to go here. Just to let you know,’” Scott claimed.

What did Kessel say to him?

"‘Alright, let's do it,’” Scott claims.

So Kessel and Scott yapped, Kessel put a glove on him, Scott dropped his, started chasing him, Leafs teammates intercepted the Sabres goon and engaged him, all the while Kessel was slashing and spearing the Buffalo forward in self-defense like a frantic Jedi.

“I’ve never seen a stick-swing like that. He’s gotta do what he’s gotta do. It was an even fight if he has his stick. I didn’t have anything,” said Scott. “Phil’s OK. He came out the better end of it. I have bruises all over my leg.”

Scott's perception of the Tropp/Devane fight is a little off there... which isn't all that surprising given that Scott's role as a hockey player is little more than PUNCH, PUNCH, PUNCH.

...but even big dummies can tell the difference between someone falling and someone's head being "driven" into the ice, no?

On the other side of the coin, if Kessel's gonna chirp... have at it John Boy.

Edited by e_prime

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lol

I should have been more specific last night instead of being caught up in the excitement of what happened.

What I meant was when Kessel dropped the gloves or whatever you want to call it with Flynn. That part not the rest lol

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Scott's perception of the Tropp/Devane fight is a little off there... which isn't all that surprising given that Scott's role as a hockey player is little more than PUNCH, PUNCH, PUNCH.

...but even big dummies can tell the difference between someone falling and someone's head being "driven" into the ice, no?

On the other side of the coin, if Kessel's gonna chirp... have at it John Boy.

even if he did drive his head into the ice, wouldnt you wait for that guy to come out of the box and take revenge on him and not someone else who had nothing to do with it? going after any random guy and forcing them to fight is not needed

i highly doubt kessel said ok lets do it to a guy almost a foot taller than him and 70lbs heavier. if he did then yea hes a ***** for running away

Edited by brett

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Scott's perception of the Tropp/Devane fight is a little off there... which isn't all that surprising given that Scott's role as a hockey player is little more than PUNCH, PUNCH, PUNCH.

...but even big dummies can tell the difference between someone falling and someone's head being "driven" into the ice, no?

On the other side of the coin, if Kessel's gonna chirp... have at it John Boy.

For me this just reaffirms, Scott is a goon, always has been a goon, and always will be a SENSELESS goon. If bertuzzi fought Tropp and Scott attacked Pasha for it, I would be furious!! Mind you I doubt babs would be dumb enough to send out any of our top 6 or top 4 defensemen if he saw Scott was still out there.

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Old time hockey, like it or not.

Sabres/Leafs games are gonna be real chippy this year. Scott is gonna have hands full once these teams meet in the regular season. Orr and McLaren will be after him. I fear for the Sabres, because outside of Scott, who do they have? It's not a guarantee that Cody McCormick makes the team. Ott is a bad fighter, and Kaleta has his gloves glued on. They're gonna get pounded.

Edited by Bring Back The Bruise Bros
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The game was in Toronto, Carlyle saw that Scott was still on the ice, and he sends out Kessel... that was a very bad idea. One of the coach's jobs is to manage the game, and that could have been a devastating mistake on his part. I'm not defending Scott -- he's a big idiot, see? -- but I think Carlyle deserves some heat for not protecting his star player. And if Kessel really was baiting him at all... well, hasn't he seen those Messin' With Sasquatch beef jerky commercials? Yeah, bad idea.

esteef, sputman, _SP_ and 2 others like this

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And if Kessel really was baiting him at all... well, hasn't he seen those Messin' With Sasquatch beef jerky commercials? Yeah, bad idea.

:lol:

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I think stick swinging is somdthing that shouldnt be tolerated. Kessel deserves 10-15 games.

esteef likes this

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I think stick swinging is somdthing that shouldnt be tolerated. Kessel deserves 10-15 games.

Listen...The first one I can sort of understand SORT OF...but when Scott was engaged with the other players that one is the one I didn't like then the spear at the end. Kessel is going to poke the bear like that then he needs to deal with the consequences of his actions.

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Kessel suspended three preseason games (the rest of the preseason).

NEW YORK -- Toronto Maple Leafs forward Phil Kessel has been suspended for the team’s final three preseason games for slashing Buffalo Sabres forward John Scott during NHL preseason game No. 61 in Toronto on Sunday, Sept. 22, the National Hockey League’s Department of Player Safety announced today.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=683953&navid=nhl:topheads

Seems fair to me. He got a match penalty and now has repeat offender status so next time maybe he'll cool it with the stickwork.

Though the Sabres coach should've been at least fined for sending out his goons as a retaliation for a fight.

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