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Will young talent ever speak out against Wings philosophy?


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#41 evilmrt

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 12:26 AM

Let's keep this on topic about hockey and not a discussion of what makes America great.
 

 

One of the best mod comments ever. HAHAHA


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#42 Nev

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 12:36 AM

There are 79 regular season games left to play this year, The young guys will get there playing time. 

 

Injuries, loosing streaks, players games going to hell, back to back games and a ton of other reason will get these guys in the line up. 

probably sooner rather then later. 

 

We've already got 3 forwards out injured and they can't get a game.  So currently, we'd need 5 forwards injured before Babcock would be forced to play both of them.  Do we really want 5 forwards injured? Because you bet they won't be Cleary, Sammy, Emmerton, Bertuzzi and Eaves.  Some of them are going to be forwards that we actually like and want on the team.


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#43 cusimano_brothers

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 06:52 AM

The Detroit Red Wings: Where forty is the new twenty thirty.


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#44 F.Michael

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 10:37 AM



 

Are you advocating hurting your own teammate in practice to get ahead?  How very "Black Swan" of you.  I'd hate to be your coworker, god knows what you'd do for a better parking spot. 

Hey now - did I say "hurt"?

 

My co-workers know better not to mess with F.Michael.....I just might do something totally irrational.....A good example; just this morning I bought the ingredients for my kick butt cheesy artichoke heart dip to share this upcoming weekend with said co-workers...Ok - if ya really wanna know...

 

Pre-heat over to 350 F

2 cups mayo (preferrably Hellmans - no fat free, nor reduced fat, and dear lord no miracle whip)

4 cups mozzarella cheese

2 cups parmesan cheese

2 cans 14 oz each can of artichoke hearts (not the marinated, nor the cocktail - just reg canned in water artichoke hearts - drain 1st - then it's best to cut/chop them down to bite size) 

1 very large bowl for mixing

 

Combine the above ingredients into large mixing bowl, mix thoroughly, and then spread evenly into a baking dish, and bake for 25 to 30 min, or until the edges are 'golden brown'.

 

I prefer Keebler 'Town House Toppers' crackers, but you may use any cracker/chip/veggie.

 

This stuff is addictive...That's how evil I am.


Edited by F.Michael, 09 October 2013 - 11:09 AM.


'Evolution' created by Offsides

#45 Crymson

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 11:51 AM

In answer to the OP: they get to be part of the most successful organization of the past 20 years, one that makes the playoffs every season; and they know that if they do well, they'll probably be treated very well by the organization for the rest of their careers.

 

And, as others have said, it's rather bad for one's career in the NHL to whine about such things. More, you make it seem as if this policy affects literally every prospect. That's not the case. Your diatribe was brought on by the fact that Nyquist is in the AHL and Tatar is scratched. That's all.



#46 Opie

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 12:00 PM

In answer to the OP: they get to be part of the most successful organization of the past 20 years, one that makes the playoffs every season; and they know that if they do well, they'll probably be treated very well by the organization for the rest of their careers.

 

And, as others have said, it's rather bad for one's career in the NHL to whine about such things. More, you make it seem as if this policy affects literally every prospect. That's not the case. Your diatribe was brought on by the fact that Nyquist is in the AHL and Tatar is scratched. That's all.

[Sarcasm] But those are the only two youngsters the wings have[/sarcasm]

 

People act like this D doesn't have guys with less than a full season of NHL experience or that Andy isn't a youngster who got a chance.

 

Maybe it is because young guys like Dekeyser and Andy play a great defensive game.

I mean I know Smith is not the best defenseman on this team, but he plays solid D at times as well.

 

Players who are not defensively responsible, especially when young, are going to get passed over for a vet who plays solid in both ends every time in this org.

 

Not saying Tatar and Nyquist won't or can't eventually be that, but right now the org thinks there are better options.


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#47 T.Low

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 01:11 PM

I am sort of torn here. We could be a team like the Oil and be on a 7 season playoff drought trying by trying to play all of our young kids or we can be like the wings and be on a 22 season playoff streak doing what we do. Don't get me wrong I would love to see some of our young players over the likes of Sammy and Cleary but with the success the wings have had with the way they have done things I don't see that changing any time soon. The young players still talk highly about the wings and how they are ran so I think its more us fans that have a problem with it then any of the players.


I agree I thought last year was the perfect mix of veterans and youngsters with the forward group.
Youngsters together on the third line playing against other teams third pairing D makes a lot of sense to me and it seemed to work out well.


Maybe too many youngsters on the defensive corps

It's kind of strange. I think we would benefit from more youngsters on offense, like the third line of Nyquist Andy and Tatar, but last year I think we would have benefited in the playoffs with the veteran experience of Ian White over the inexperience of young Smith.
Yes Babcock chooses opposite. Hmm.

Edited by T.Low, 09 October 2013 - 01:16 PM.


#48 Playmaker

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 02:17 PM

I think DeKeyser would have been sent to GR but his agents made it quite clear he wouldn't sign here to play in the minors.

#49 kipwinger

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:36 PM

Hey now - did I say "hurt"?

 

My co-workers know better not to mess with F.Michael.....I just might do something totally irrational.....A good example; just this morning I bought the ingredients for my kick butt cheesy artichoke heart dip to share this upcoming weekend with said co-workers...Ok - if ya really wanna know...

 

Pre-heat over to 350 F

2 cups mayo (preferrably Hellmans - no fat free, nor reduced fat, and dear lord no miracle whip)

4 cups mozzarella cheese

2 cups parmesan cheese

2 cans 14 oz each can of artichoke hearts (not the marinated, nor the cocktail - just reg canned in water artichoke hearts - drain 1st - then it's best to cut/chop them down to bite size) 

1 very large bowl for mixing

 

Combine the above ingredients into large mixing bowl, mix thoroughly, and then spread evenly into a baking dish, and bake for 25 to 30 min, or until the edges are 'golden brown'.

 

I prefer Keebler 'Town House Toppers' crackers, but you may use any cracker/chip/veggie.

 

This stuff is addictive...That's how evil I am.

 

Ok, so what did you mean when you said young guys should "take a run" at veterans and "knock them out of the lineup for a bit"?  Just curious, since I've obviously got it wrong and god knows you couldn't possibly have meant to say something so dumb. 


GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#50 F.Michael

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:45 PM

 

Ok, so what did you mean when you said young guys should "take a run" at veterans and "knock them out of the lineup for a bit"?  Just curious, since I've obviously got it wrong and god knows you couldn't possibly have meant to say something so dumb. 

As another poster had already mentioned - is there anything wrong with a young player who's rather tired of either riding the pine at the NHL level, or a regular in GR, and is confident enough that he may possess greater skill/ability than lets say the 3 players I have mentioned earlier - so he gets in their face - roughs them up - shows the coaching staff that he's more than ready for regular duty at the NHL level?

 

I'm thinking if there's a true competitive spirit - some of these guys should show it, and if need be - "take it" since nuthin is gonna get handed out for free (well except silly contracts by Holland for the aging vets).

 

Some here such as yourself may forget that this is a competitive game; wallowing in self pity will get ya nowhere, and certainly complaining to the media will do no good with this organization...Sometimes ya gotta man the f-up to get things done...Sorry if that's a shock to you.

 

EDIT - you really outta try my recipe - it's awesome!


Edited by F.Michael, 09 October 2013 - 04:46 PM.


'Evolution' created by Offsides

#51 kipwinger

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:47 PM

As another poster had already mentioned - is there anything wrong with a young player who's rather tired of either riding the pine at the NHL level, or a regular in GR, and is confident enough that he may possess greater skill/ability than lets say the 3 players I have mentioned earlier - so he gets in their face - roughs them up - shows the coaching staff that he's more than ready for regular duty at the NHL level?

 

I'm thinking if there's a true competitive spirit - some of these guys should show it, and if need be - "take it" since nuthin is gonna get handed out for free (well except silly contracts by Holland for the aging vets).

 

Some here such as yourself may forget that this is a competitive game; wallowing in self pity will get ya nowhere, and certainly complaining to the media will do no good with this organization...Sometimes ya gotta man the f-up to get things done...Sorry if that's a shock to you.

 

So you meant that the young guys should out compete the veterans, but you said "take a run at them" and "knock them out of the lineup for a bit"?  Not buying it.  Seems duplicitous to me.  I'm not stupid and neither are you, if you had meant that they should outperform veterans, you would have said so.


GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#52 F.Michael

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:55 PM

 

So you meant that the young guys should out compete the veterans, but you said "take a run at them" and "knock them out of the lineup for a bit"?  Not buying it.  Seems duplicitous to me.  I'm not stupid and neither are you, if you had meant that they should outperform veterans, you would have said so.

Out perform them - smack'em around - intimidate them...Yes - all of the above.

 

It's not like the 3 aging vets are crucial for this teams success; if any kid wants a shot at regular ice time - he should go out, and show the coaching staff what he's made of.

 

The league is rich in history of players changing up their game in order to play at the NHL level be it thru physical play, or becomming a shot blocker, or concentrating on the defensive side of the game, etc, etc.

 

IMHO this team could use more sand paper on the 3rd/4th lines; why not play with a physical edge at practice, and show what ya can do?.....If you ruffle a few feathers in the process - well so be it...At least you'll get noticed.



'Evolution' created by Offsides

#53 kipwinger

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 04:58 PM

Out perform them - smack'em around - intimidate them...Yes - all of the above.

 

It's not like the 3 aging vets are crucial for this teams success; if any kid wants a shot at regular ice time - he should go out, and show the coaching staff what he's made of.

 

The league is rich in history of players changing up their game in order to play at the NHL level be it thru physical play, or becomming a shot blocker, or concentrating on the defensive side of the game, etc, etc.

 

IMHO this team could use more sand paper on the 3rd/4th lines; why not play with a physical edge at practice, and show what ya can do?.....If you ruffle a few feathers in the process - well so be it...At least you'll get noticed.

 

Dude, you said "take a run at them" and "knock them out of the lineup".  You didn't say, "compete harder".  You were clearly implying that they should injure the vets.  No matter what you're saying now, that's what you said before.  We all realize it, and now you're dodging it...poorly.  You aren't nearly as clever as you think.  Just own up to the absurd s*** you said and move on. 


GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#54 The Greek

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 05:01 PM

I think DeKeyser would have been sent to GR but his agents made it quite clear he wouldn't sign here to play in the minors.


It doesn't matter what was said before the contract is signed. DD got to stay because he has proven that he belongs on the wings.

#55 F.Michael

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 05:04 PM

 

Dude, you said "take a run at them" and "knock them out of the lineup".  You didn't say, "compete harder".  You were clearly implying that they should injure the vets.  No matter what you're saying now, that's what you said before.  We all realize it, and now you're dodging it...poorly.  You aren't nearly as clever as you think.  Just own up to the absurd s*** you said and move on. 

Ok - if it gets yur panties outta the wad they're in...

 

Knock an aging vet outta the lineup at the very next practice - place them on LTIR.

 

You happy now?

 

EDIT - now go make that dip dammit!


Edited by F.Michael, 09 October 2013 - 05:05 PM.


'Evolution' created by Offsides

#56 Euro_Twins

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 05:06 PM

It doesn't matter what was said before the contract is signed. DD got to stay because he has proven that he belongs on the wings.


You mean cause there are no vets signed to take his spot anymore. You can argue Tatar hasn't proved himself, but you can't argue that nyquist has earned a spot and doesn't deserve to be in the ahl
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#57 DeGraa55

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 05:25 PM

You mean cause there are no vets signed to take his spot anymore. You can argue Tatar hasn't proved himself, but you can't argue that nyquist has earned a spot and doesn't deserve to be in the ahl


Dekeyser is on the team because lids and hatcher said no to the four year 16m dollar deals with a no trade clause. If philly released pronger he would be our next target. O wait he is too big never mind he only meets the age and injury requirements.

Edited by DeGraa55, 09 October 2013 - 05:25 PM.


#58 Crymson

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 08:13 PM

I think DeKeyser would have been sent to GR but his agents made it quite clear he wouldn't sign here to play in the minors.

 

I think that's absolute conjecture.

 

You mean cause there are no vets signed to take his spot anymore. You can argue Tatar hasn't proved himself, but you can't argue that nyquist has earned a spot and doesn't deserve to be in the ahl

 

You're forgetting a certain veteran defenseman whose name began with a C and had a lot of vowels in it. He was on the team last season and was scratched in favor of DeKeyser.

 

As for Nyquist, he has 13 points in 40 NHL regular season games, and five in 13 playoff games. It's not as if he tore up the charts while he was up.


Edited by Crymson, 09 October 2013 - 08:13 PM.


#59 The Greek

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 08:19 PM

You mean cause there are no vets signed to take his spot anymore. You can argue Tatar hasn't proved himself, but you can't argue that nyquist has earned a spot and doesn't deserve to be in the ahl


Can you please elaborate? I don't understand what you're getting at. For the context of my post, see the post that I quoted. I was merely saying that the demands of dekeyser's agent have no bearing on the team's decisions, unless those demands were in the contract. I wasn't referring to Tatar or Nyquist at all. I think it is inexcusable for either of them to not be regulars on the team.

#60 Lidstromrules16

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 08:33 PM

I don't know if we will ever see a player speak out, but as a fan, I REALLY wish some of the younger guys would be given a legitimate shot.  Tatar and Nyquist, in my opinion, have more than earned a spot on the Red Wings roster.  Although I like Bert and Sammy, I would much rather see Tatar and Nyquist playing right now.  I was actually excited about this season because I foolishly thought we'd get to see more of Tatar and Nyquist.







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