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Cleary in, Tatar out against Caps


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#61 Son of a Wing

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:32 PM

Whether you liked him or not, I think Babs has decided that Tots is a Huder 2.0.

 

He's critical and a bit impatiet with the Tatar.....I am glad we have Tom Renney because you constantly Renney patting the young guys on the back, giving them praise.

PS- Hey Babs....Hudler playing top line minutes with the right line mates and has a 19 points on the season.....are you paying attention Babs???

 

Hudler is a top line guy on the Flames.  Easily the weakest forward grouping in the NHL. He's a 2nd/3rd line scoring forward on most other teams.  Great support player, but definitely not a go to guy.

 

Great on him though.  Happy to see him doing well.  He won't see that kind of time on a contender though.  There's a reason for that.


I agree Renney has a key role on our bench as well.


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When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”

#62 GMRwings1983

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:32 PM

I wonder if Holland's approval rating is higher than Obama's at this point?  

 

 

I don't trust either Holland or Babcock at this point in the year 2013.  Don't care what they've accomplished in the past.  I don't trust them here and now to make good roster decisions, trades or free agent signings.  They've made awful moves and personnel decisions the last few seasons that were avoidable.    


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#63 Son of a Wing

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:35 PM

I wonder if Holland's approval rating is higher than Obama's at this point?  

 

 

I don't trust either Holland or Babcock at this point in the year 2013.  Don't care what they've accomplished in the past.  I don't trust them here and now to make good roster decisions, trades or free agent signings.  They've made awful moves and personnel decisions the last few seasons that were avoidable.    

 

It'd be nice to see them bring in another "hockey mind" into the front office.  Especially after losing Nill.  I'm not saying fire anybody but get a fresh perspective.  


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi
 
When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”

#64 GMRwings1983

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:38 PM

 

It'd be nice to see them bring in another "hockey mind" into the front office.  Especially after losing Nill.  I'm not saying fire anybody but get a fresh perspective.  

 

Holland and Babcock are great hockey minds, but they seem to be losing their minds.  Certainly losing their touch.    

 

Maybe it's one of those situations where being too long in the same place creates a stale environment.    


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#65 Lonewuhf

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:48 PM

 

Hudler is a top line guy on the Flames.  Easily the weakest forward grouping in the NHL. He's a 2nd/3rd line scoring forward on most other teams.  Great support player, but definitely not a go to guy.

 

Great on him though.  Happy to see him doing well.  He won't see that kind of time on a contender though.  There's a reason for that.


I agree Renney has a key role on our bench as well.

 

Yet he's got 6 times more points than Cleary... Since he's on a non-contender team shouldn't he still have crap for points?



#66 Son of a Wing

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:49 PM

 

Holland and Babcock are great hockey minds, but they seem to be losing their minds.  Certainly losing their touch.    

 

Maybe it's one of those situations where being too long in the same place creates a stale environment.    

 

Judging from an outsider's perspective I can totally understand why Babcock's approach and overall coaching style can eventually lead to eye rolls and having players tuned out. 

 

Which again (as Motown4013 stated), makes the role of Renney and the assistants just that much more important.  It'll be interesting to see what happens with Blashill. (who I'm a big fan of)


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi
 
When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”

#67 rrasco

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:50 PM

I think it is more personal than business at this point.  If you want to run a successful business, you gotta cut the ties.  Be a boss, not a buddy.


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#68 Son of a Wing

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 09:51 PM

 

Yet he's got 6 times more points than Cleary... Since he's on a non-contender team shouldn't he still have crap for points?

 

No one responded to your trolling in the Weiss thread so you decided to try it here?


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi
 
When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”

#69 Lonewuhf

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 10:17 PM

 

No one responded to your trolling in the Weiss thread so you decided to try it here?

 

Actually I posted this one first.  How is this trolling? You said something bashing Hudler and I simply stated facts. Your post was more trollish than mine.

 

Edit: Hudler is 17th in the league in points. I don't care what kind of team he's on. He's still playing against top lines in the league and doing really well, and this is coming from someone who hated Hudler when he was here.


Edited by Lonewuhf, 14 November 2013 - 10:20 PM.


#70 CMatt89

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 10:35 PM

Holland and Babcock should be apologizing to the fans, also to Zetterberg and Datsyuk. Hopefully we wont trade away our middle of the pack draft pick this year for an extra second round pick like we do every year. I've also noticed that Babcock wants to play a certain way. A way that a lot of the league is playing, and playing successful. The only difference is that he's continuously provided the wrong types of players to the point where it almost seems like he's handcuffed and obliged to play these incompetent players. His overly optimistic attitude and unwarranted praise for low end players seems a little bit fishy to me. I'm glad he's not Tortorella, but I also feel like there's a loaded gun being pointed at him every time he wants to say whats really on his mind. I'd love to play for Babcock, maybe not so much Ken Holland and the Illitch maf..........ya get where I'm going with this. 

 

If we make the playoffs, we'll see Nyquist. I just hope the general fan super savior pressure that is expected doesn't turn him into public enemy number 1 when he doesn't perform. (which I hope he does)


Edited by CMatt89, 14 November 2013 - 10:50 PM.


#71 RedWang

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 11:54 PM

Whether you liked him or not, I think Babs has decided that Tots is a Huder 2.0.

PS- Hey Babs....Hudler playing top line minutes with the right line mates and has a 19 points on the season.....are you paying attention Babs???


Everything about this is 100% correct. Tatar is OBVIOUSLY a very skilled and gifted player. IMHO Under proper circumstances he could really excel in this league.

#72 Crymson

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 12:06 AM

I don't know why Babcock continues trying to get Cleary going when it's obvious to all that Cleary's time as a productive player ended two seasons ago. The guy is still all heart, but heart cannot compensate for a total lack of physical acumen.



#73 frankgrimes

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 01:34 AM

Marsh: Do you know something about big business (NHL) decisions?

Babcock: Oh yes, roster decisions are a big deal -->

Phase 1: Play my bff's despite effort

Phase 2: ???

Phase 3: Points?

 

In all seriousness I think Tatar and Nyquist are showing a lot of class, I am sure some other players would have told their manager to make it clear, that they are open for a trade.


Edited by frankgrimes, 15 November 2013 - 01:36 AM.

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blank cheque for The Captain or Jim Star Nil please..


#74 ben_usmc

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 02:30 AM

Marsh: Do you know something about big business (NHL) decisions?

Babcock: Oh yes, roster decisions are a big deal -->

Phase 1: Play my bff's despite effort

Phase 2: ???

Phase 3: Points?

 

In all seriousness I think Tatar and Nyquist are showing a lot of class, I am sure some other players would have told their manager to make it clear, that they are open for a trade.

For sure, it's like they have to mind f*** the kids and if they can withstand.Then they are safe for the next 15-30 years. 


Edited by ben_usmc, 15 November 2013 - 02:31 AM.

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#75 Dabura

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 06:29 AM

I don't know why Babcock continues trying to get Cleary going when it's obvious to all that Cleary's time as a productive player ended two seasons ago. The guy is still all heart, but heart cannot compensate for a total lack of physical acumen.

 

You know it's a bad call when even Crymson's on the hate train.

 

Someone mentioned Blashill. I friggin' love that guy, and would probably take him over Babs at this point. He's the second coming of Mike Babcock (the good Mike Babcock who did good things, not the evil/stupid Mike Babcock who does bad things).


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#76 Dabura

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 06:35 AM

In all seriousness I think Tatar and Nyquist are showing a lot of class, I am sure some other players would have told their manager to make it clear, that they are open for a trade.

 

Does that really count for anything tangible, though? Or is it just one of those hollow moral victory things? This is, of course, an organization that basically expects its players to take it up the butt in return for (a chance at) Stanley Cup contention. Which looks like kind of a silly business model these days when you realize we haven't been past the second round in about 85 years (time being a relative thing in this case).


Don't Toews me, bro!


#77 Playmaker

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 06:54 AM

 

Those teams have had the luxury of having high draft picks..seems to be the only way to get a solid core group of players is to tank for 5 years.

Those teams also have the luxury of not having a coach and GM that still think it's 2002.  You can't build a winning team by signing old vet after old vet.  It doesn't make sense financially or on the ice.  Does anyone recall what the Blackhawks did when they were up against the Cap after their first Cup win?  Made a huge trade and shed salary and added young players and as a result when winning the Cup again last year, had Kane and Toews as their "old guys"

 

They may not have superstars in the minors, but there's clearly NHL quality talent there, with more on the way.  Some very, very poor decisions of late by Holland and Babcock.



#78 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 11:15 AM

The good news is with Ericsson back, Babcock split up the terrible pairing of Quincey and Kindl. 

 

Dekeyser will be with Quincey, and Kindl will be playing more protected minutes on the bottom pair with Lashoff.  So hopefully the D will be more stable.  Or at least less terrifying to watch.



#79 BadgerBob

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 11:50 AM

The good news is with Ericsson back, Babcock split up the terrible pairing of Quincey and Kindl. 

 

Dekeyser will be with Quincey, and Kindl will be playing more protected minutes on the bottom pair with Lashoff.  So hopefully the D will be more stable.  Or at least less terrifying to watch.

 

Any pairing involving Quincey seems to be no good.



#80 Nev

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 12:02 PM

 Hopefully we wont trade away our middle of the pack draft pick this year for an extra second round pick like we do every year.

 

Why?  Its been one of his most successful tactics.  It got us Ferraro, Tatar and Nestrasil in 2009.  Jurco, Oullet and Sproul in 2011 in what may turn out to be our best draft since 1989.  And this summer, we still got Mantha after trading down, plus Nastasiuk and Nephtuzzi.

 

Just because Kenny re-signed Cleary and can't bring Nyquist up because he screwed the roster up so bad, doesn't mean that everything he does is wrong.


"If I can be totally honest, it's not a lot of guys you get impressed by. Actually, it's no one else but him. From the bench, to see what move he makes -- you're like, 'I wish I could do that.' Sometimes you sit on the bench and just think, 'wow,' and you look over to the other bench and they sit there and shake their heads, too. He has great, great skills. I'm probably not going to play with another player who has the kind of skills he has." Mikael Samuelsson on Pavel Datsyuk





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