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2014 draft thoughts.


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#61 PumpkinEscobar

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 09:30 PM

29pts in 53 games, small, and already 22. He is looking like he will be a third line center and not much more. So 4 years from now when Dats and Zetty (possibly) will be gone who is centering the top two lines?

2 top notch free agents...and how do you know how these guys are gonna be in 3-4 years?
Wings could use every pick on centers for the next 2 drafts and could have none of them pan out

#62 PumpkinEscobar

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 09:36 PM

As far as size Jarnkrok is taller than Datsyuk and Zetterberg and weighs 10 less pounds...I think he can get that in the next couples years if not by next season. I could see them putting Jurco at Center in the future too

#63 dirtydangles

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Posted 24 February 2014 - 11:50 PM

Jarnkrok has been increasing production lately 13 points in last 13 games. I think he will be fine. When you see him on the ice he looks dangerous often (especially on PP) and always looks to play it safe to prevent odd man rushes (which is why his point production is lower). After watching the griffins over the olympic break I am less worried about him panning out. Also he would benefit from Mantha on his wing. 


Edited by dirtydangles, 25 February 2014 - 12:08 AM.

Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#64 Buppy

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 12:40 AM

Ok not really the thread for this but:

1. Little Tuzzi just cleared out his locker in Juniors. he is hurt-again and will not play anymore this year. hard to call a guy that can't play more than 30 games a prospect.

2. Ferraro will walk this off season.

3. Pulk was included in my 4 left in the minors.

4. Jarmark (spelling) isn't here yet and not sure when he will be.

5. Tvardon (spelling) is playing his way out of the system fast.

 

So once again, after this season we have 4 legit F prospects in the minors: mantha, AA, Pulk, and nastisauk. That is it. Teams typically carry 14 forwards and 7 Dman. We need twice as many F prospects as D prospects. We have 4. We all know without any doubt that every prospect doesn't make it. If half of our prospects make it we are doing GREAT! The hard part is of course figuring out which ones are which....

You don't necessarily need twice as many forward prospects. More, just not twice as many. Forwards are generally easier and cheaper to obtain as UFAs or in trade.

 

Also, prospects don't cease to exist because you decide you don't like them, nor is GR the only place we can have a prospect.

 

But even just in GR we should have the 4 you list, plus Jarnkrok (already has more points than Jurco had last year, in 20 fewer games). Jurco and Glendening could both be there. Frk probably deserves as much consideration as Jensen, and probably more than DeHaas (still has 2 or 3 years of college before we really begin to evaluate him, certainly seems unlikely he'll be in GR anytime soon).

 

Janmark deserves as much as Backman, both are doing fairly well overseas, and neither is certain to be in GR next year.

 

And we do have several young forwards on the roster already. While we have some young defensemen as well, I think the forward group has proven more capable thus far.

 

I'd agree that a top-6 center prospect is our biggest need, just not by such a degree that we absolutely have to take one in the first round, or focus on that area (or forwards in general) alone. We have good depth at both forward and defense. Like last year, it all depends on who's available. If a good defenseman drops to us but the top centers are gone, it could be worth it.

 

It may be a moot point though. Seems this draft is pretty weak at defense, there may not be any good ones available for us anyway.



#65 MasterPavel

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 05:57 AM

2 top notch free agents...and how do you know how these guys are gonna be in 3-4 years?
Wings could use every pick on centers for the next 2 drafts and could have none of them pan out

Right because elite free agents aren't being resigned by their teams left and right. Along with what it would cost to sign two elite centers, and how that would limit our options with the cap. Next year get a stud defender in the first, but even if Jarnkrok isn't a bust we still need another Top 6 C...

Edited by MasterPavel, 25 February 2014 - 07:06 AM.


#66 Buppy

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 11:52 AM

Replacements for Pav and Hank will most likely come by drafting high enough to get a truly elite prospect. If we're picking outside the top 10, or maybe even top 5, we're probably not going to get anyone all that much more promising than Jarnkrok or Sheahan.

 

Again, not saying we shouldn't look for a center. Just saying we shouldn't be expecting to answer the Pav and Hank question in this draft.



#67 dirtydangles

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 12:19 PM

Giroux was a 22 overall pick, O'reilly was a 33 overall, the list goes on - it is absolutely possible to get a great centre in the late first round. 


Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#68 frankgrimes

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 12:21 PM

This years draft pick could be the best one positionwise since forever so the only I'd trade that pick would be for a top defenseman coming back which won't happen.


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#69 Buppy

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 04:09 PM

Giroux was a 22 overall pick, O'reilly was a 33 overall, the list goes on - it is absolutely possible to get a great centre in the late first round. 

Possible, sure. But unlikely. And I wouldn't consider O'Reilly "great".



#70 Son of a Wing

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 04:15 PM

Possible, sure. But unlikely. And I wouldn't consider O'Reilly "great".

 

I would. O'Reilly is a very solid 2-way player who can put up a good amount of points.

 

He leads his team in ice-time among forwards and already has 40 points on the season while being the go-to guy on the penalty-kill.


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#71 dirtydangles

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 05:19 PM

Possible, sure. But unlikely. And I wouldn't consider O'Reilly "great".

Giroux is a 1C and O'Reilly is a 2C that is why I used those examples but there are plenty more out there (Perry 28th, Getzlaf 19th, Mike Richards 24th, etc). The point is - you can have high picks that bust and later picks that pan out - it is still possible in the current NHL to get great players outside the top 10.


Is there a kickstarter campaign for Jakub Kindl to never play another NHL game?


#72 Buppy

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 07:04 PM

Like I said, possible but unlikely. That you can cherry-pick a few (or even a few dozen) very good to great players from the hundreds drafted outside the top-10 in the last decade doesn't disprove that.

 

Center should be a priority, but only because we don't have that many. Six I think, and two of those seem unlikely to make the NHL. Has nothing to do with replacing Datsyuk and Zetterberg.

 

I'm just saying we shouldn't ignore a better player in favor of a center based on an unreasonable expectation.



#73 Richdg

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 08:52 PM

But for every O'reilly-who is very good and getting better, you have a Kindl.

My point before the flaming began was we are thin at F prospects. That is true. I have in my mind moved tatar, Nyquist, Jurco, Glendening, Callahan up to the RW's for next season. mantha, pulk, nastisauk and AA are the next group, 3 of those 4 will be in their first year in the pros. Yes we all hope, but let's be honest. That chances that all 4 work out is very very slim. Again-Kindl. We have major needs for top flight F. Our 2 best could be done at anytime. Age and injuries are a real thing. On D we are set a little better off. Kronwall is the only one over 30. E is 30. Means both should have 3-5 more quality years left. DD is just beginning his career and so is Smith-if he stays. That mean 4 of the 7 spots are already filled long term. lashoff is a good cheap option for the 6/7 spot. That means we have 2 D spots open over the next 3-5 years, baring injury of course. To fill those 2 spots we have a ton of talented young Dmen coming.



#74 Buppy

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 04:41 AM

Actually, for every O'Reilly there are a hell of a lot of Kindls, and Marek Zagrapans, and some Hanzals, Coglianos, and Downies. That's kind of my point. It's unlikely we'll find a star drafting outside the top 10.

 

Good players aren't that uncommon, but "good" isn't going to replace Pav and Hank. Replacing them isn't a good reason, by itself, to target a certain position.

 

We're not "thin" just because you don't like, or want to ignore, half our forward prospects. Maybe a bit stronger at defense, but we're not weak. Most organizational rankings agree that we're pretty deep all-around. We're good everywhere, but not great anywhere.

 

We do lack star power, and at every position. But we probably won't find that, at any position, where we end up picking. All other things being equal, I'd give preference to a center, then a winger (especially if they have some center potential), with defenseman last. But if there's a guy available, regardless of position (except maybe goalie), that looks significantly better we should take them.



#75 MasterPavel

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 07:29 AM

Buppy, let's say we pick 10 overall. More than one of Kapanen, Virtanen, Barbashev, Goldobin, Ehlers, or Vrana will be available. Not a single one is a can't miss prospect, but neither is Reinhardt, Ekblad, or Draistal. My point being is they all are extremely talented and could develop into stars. Not only top 5 picks make it into the HOF...

#76 Buppy

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 12:20 PM

How is it that when I type "unlikely" you all keep reading it as "impossible"?



#77 Richdg

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 12:37 PM

Pumpkin. You brought up jarnkrok. Some thoughts. 1. he is always the smallest guy on the ice, regardless of what they list him at. 2. he is already 22-turns 23 this year. 3. He is being outproduced by that offensive dynmo Emmerton, and Cory has played 20 fewer games than jarnkrok has.

Yes he has some more time-2 more years. But to date I don't see anything that screams star or even above average NHL player.

Sa,e with frk and Tvardon. yes both have talent and produced to Junior. But that is not pro hockey were neither has made much impact yet. Again, first year for Frk and he has 2 more years to make or break it.

Point is, at some point potential has to turn into production.

One last thing. Little Tuzzi is done for the year. Same injury as last year-concussion/neck injury. Cleaned out his locker and is in Detroit for medical evals. This could be a long term/career ending thing. It is serious.



#78 Richdg

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 12:43 PM

Buppy we are thin. very thin. I have already moved up most of the guys ready. tatar, nyquist, Callahan, Pulk, Jurco, Andersson-forgot him earlier, and Sheahan. That is just about everyone off of the Griffins. mantha, AA, Nastisauk need at least a year more of seasoning. Then they will be up. The rest of the guys we own the rights to are either: 1. not producing, or 2. several years away. Many are still playing college hockey, junior hockey, or yet to be drafted. Couple over in Europe. 3. This doesn't allow for any guys to fail. Which of course several will. Not everyone makes it. Some get hurt. That is why more depth is needed. Be it via draft, trades or UFA. We need more F's. Stars would be great, but just depth would be a major help right now.



#79 Son of a Wing

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 12:47 PM

Pumpkin. You brought up jarnkrok. Some thoughts. 1. he is always the smallest guy on the ice, regardless of what they list him at. 2. he is already 22-turns 23 this year. 3. He is being outproduced by that offensive dynmo Emmerton, and Cory has played 20 fewer games than jarnkrok has.

Yes he has some more time-2 more years. But to date I don't see anything that screams star or even above average NHL player.

Sa,e with frk and Tvardon. yes both have talent and produced to Junior. But that is not pro hockey were neither has made much impact yet. Again, first year for Frk and he has 2 more years to make or break it.

Point is, at some point potential has to turn into production.

One last thing. Little Tuzzi is done for the year. Same injury as last year-concussion/neck injury. Cleaned out his locker and is in Detroit for medical evals. This could be a long term/career ending thing. It is serious.

 

Jarnkrok has 13 points in his last 13 games and is finally starting to adjust to the NA rink. Since it's his first year here let's cut him some slack.

 

There's a reason he's been touted as our top prospect for the last couple years.


Also Tvrdon amd Frk are in their first pro years.  For someone who is so consumed by fantasy and future you sure don't seem to have much patience.


Any source on Bertuzzi "career ending injury". Thats quite the statement.


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#80 number9

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 01:14 PM

 
Jarnkrok has 13 points in his last 13 games and is finally starting to adjust to the NA rink. Since it's his first year here let's cut him some slack.
 
There's a reason he's been touted as our top prospect for the last couple years.

Also Tvrdon amd Frk are in their first pro years.  For someone who is so consumed by fantasy and future you sure don't seem to have much patience.

Any source on Bertuzzi "career ending injury". Thats quite the statement.


Every injury is "potentially career ending" in his book. Just gloss over.

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