DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 (edited) this is a potential lineup for next year if they don't sign anyone Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Jurco Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist Tatar-Helm-Sheahan Miller-Andersson-Abdelkader Kronwall-Dekeyser Smith-Ericsson Kindl-Marchenko (or Sproul or Ouellet) Callahan, Ferraro, and Lashoff as reserves Howard and Mrasek in goal This is assuming Alfredsson either retires or signs elsewhere, and Vanek, Girardi and the other handful of legitimately good pending free agents don't hit the market or sign outrageously stupid contracts somewhere else so the best players left are guys like Boyes, the Jokinens, Zidlicky, Gilbert, etc. Edited January 31, 2014 by DickieDunn Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brett 1,029 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 (edited) I would want glendening in other then it would be ok. I still would like a few additions though. But aslong as no more cleary and Bert I'm ok with it Edited January 31, 2014 by brett 2 Z Winged Dangler and wingfanatic4alltime reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 This was hard because it's significantly better than what we've got now, and because it would probably make the playoffs. But I don't think it would win the Cup and I want one more of those before Datsyuk and Zetterberg decline. As such, any lineup that doesn't compete for a Cup is wasting another year of their careers and the lineup above needs a power forward and a better puck mover than Smith to make that happen. 2 wingedominance13 and sjr2012 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GoWings1905 2,694 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 It's better than this season for sure, but I probably wouldn't be OK with it. With all the dead weight coming off the books, the Red Wings need to add something on defense. Whether through free agency or trading some of the prospects on the cusp of the NHL, this team desperately needs a puck moving d-man. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 It's better than this season for sure, but I probably wouldn't be OK with it. With all the dead weight coming off the books, the Red Wings need to add something on defense. Whether through free agency or trading some of the prospects on the cusp of the NHL, this team desperately needs a puck moving d-man. Agreed. With all the guys going away, I won't be happy with a blueline that still has Kindl as a significant part of it. He'll be 27 years old going on his 5th season in the NHL and he still has all the same issues as his rookie season. I'd rather they cut bait with him and bring a solid vet into the mix. It'd also be nice if there was a deal made up front for a player to eventually take over for Z and Dats, but I don't really see that happening. I like the young guys, but I don't think there's new Eurotwins in there. And why is the Wings most consistent D-man now moved down to the 2nd pairing? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 Here's the other question. If the good players are taken, and there aren't that many good players who are slated to be free agents, would you want them to sign a 2nd or 3rd tier guy to a 4 or 5 year deal for $5 mil if that's what those guys are signing for? Vanek is the only clear cut top line forward available, with another dozen or so guys who can play on a top line if they have enough help, and then a bunch of second and 3rd line guys. Defense is even weaker. You've got Girardi and maybe MacDonald as top pairing guys, a handful of solid 2nd pair guys who are near the end of their careers, then a bunch of guys who are probably better served and #4 d-men. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadgerBob 297 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 (edited) I'd say yes, though I'd like to see Glendening up as well, I can understand guys with no options coming up. If we can't fill our needs through FA, I wouldn't mind waiting until next off season to see what's out there, or possibly making a deal before the season starts. Cutting the fat off this team should make us a better team anyways. Don't spend money in free agency just because the cap room is available. Edited January 31, 2014 by BadgerBob 1 haroldsnepsts reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 Here's the other question. If the good players are taken, and there aren't that many good players who are slated to be free agents, would you want them to sign a 2nd or 3rd tier guy to a 4 or 5 year deal for $5 mil if that's what those guys are signing for? Vanek is the only clear cut top line forward available, with another dozen or so guys who can play on a top line if they have enough help, and then a bunch of second and 3rd line guys. Defense is even weaker. You've got Girardi and maybe MacDonald as top pairing guys, a handful of solid 2nd pair guys who are near the end of their careers, then a bunch of guys who are probably better served and #4 d-men. I voted no but I don't think that roster is awful, or very far away from what will likely happen. It's not worth bringing in a middle tier guy, especially not a long contract but like I said some move to bolster the defense would help, even if it's just bringing in a big physical vet to play the bottom pair. And Lashoff has played well enough to maintain a roster spot. Kindl's the dead weight. 1 Nev reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 I voted no but I don't think that roster is awful, or very far away from what will likely happen. It's not worth bringing in a middle tier guy, especially not a long contract but like I said some move to bolster the defense would help, even if it's just bringing in a big physical vet to play the bottom pair. And Lashoff has played well enough to maintain a roster spot. Kindl's the dead weight. Do you really feel comfortable with Smith on the second pair? We've had our back and forth on the Kindl or Smith question, and I'll concede that I was wrong on that one. Smith is the better option over Kindl, BUT I still don't like him on my second pair right now. In a year or two, with significant progress, sure. But right now, I think a second pair with Smith gets exposed in the playoffs against a quality team. I agree about adding defense, but I'd prefer to sign a second pair guy and drop Smith down with Lashoff until he's more reliable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 Ok, yeah. Happy, not really. Kip: Not sure how you can think it's better than the current roster, unless you're meaning the current injured roster. Jurco, Sheahan, Callahan, & Ferraro are at best a wash with Alfie, Cleary, Bert and whichever of Eaves/Tootoo/Glendening/Sammy/Emmerton you want to consider our 14th. More likely a bit of a downgrade. Same goes with replacing Quincey and Gustavsson. Plus Pav, Hank, and Franzen all a year older... I like the confidence you seem to have in the farm, but to say they'd be significantly better is probably an unrealistic expectation. But I do agree that that lineup really wants for a good forward and defenseman. I'd also rather see Mrazek starting in GR than backing up here, but not so much that I'd complain about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingedominance13 112 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 I voted No for two reasons. 1) Jurco IMO is a bubble player next year. He's a guy that needs solid top six minutes and I really think the typical Red Wings trajectory will benefit him. 2) With how Alfie played this year I would resign him. Even if he plays in our bottom six. To me he is the type of player that you want on your team until his body breaks down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sabaton617 28 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 I voted no mainly because of the injuries this year to several of the forwards on those projected top lines. If this year was just a mirage with the injuries and those forwards are good to go next year, I kinda like the forward lines. Like others have said, need to improve the D. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 Ok, yeah. Happy, not really. Kip: Not sure how you can think it's better than the current roster, unless you're meaning the current injured roster. Jurco, Sheahan, Callahan, & Ferraro are at best a wash with Alfie, Cleary, Bert and whichever of Eaves/Tootoo/Glendening/Sammy/Emmerton you want to consider our 14th. More likely a bit of a downgrade. Same goes with replacing Quincey and Gustavsson. Plus Pav, Hank, and Franzen all a year older... I like the confidence you seem to have in the farm, but to say they'd be significantly better is probably an unrealistic expectation. But I do agree that that lineup really wants for a good forward and defenseman. I'd also rather see Mrazek starting in GR than backing up here, but not so much that I'd complain about it. Bingo. Compared to what we've iced for almost the entire season I think it's significantly better. But every point you made is valid and I'd add that I don't agree with many of his lines/defensive pairings. However I think that roster (rearranged) would probably make the playoffs, but not challenge for the cup, which is what I think we're capable with a couple changes (Kindl gone, Smith to the third, puck mover to the second, and power forward to the top six). 2 BadgerBob and wingedominance13 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dat's sick 1,002 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 Unless we can make a quality pickup, such as Girardi who will most likely be re-signed, then yes something like that would be fine. I'd gladly take one more year of Alfie though. And Glending and Oullet/Almqvist over Kindl. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 Do you really feel comfortable with Smith on the second pair? We've had our back and forth on the Kindl or Smith question, and I'll concede that I was wrong on that one. Smith is the better option over Kindl, BUT I still don't like him on my second pair right now. In a year or two, with significant progress, sure. But right now, I think a second pair with Smith gets exposed in the playoffs against a quality team. I agree about adding defense, but I'd prefer to sign a second pair guy and drop Smith down with Lashoff until he's more reliable. I wouldn't be against moving him to the bottom pairing when he falters. There's the chance Smith could become another Kindl and never develop, but I still have hope for the kid. It's really only his second season and his issue seems between the ears. I wonder if he's just not adjusting to the grind of an NHL season and doing the little things right night after night after night. I don't think he'll ever be some offensive juggernaut but I think he can definitely be a valuable asset on this team's blueline. I keep trying to remind myself how Kronwall's development went. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 I wouldn't be against moving him to the bottom pairing when he falters. There's the chance Smith could become another Kindl and never develop, but I still have hope for the kid. It's really only his second season and his issue seems between the ears. I wonder if he's just not adjusting to the grind of an NHL season and doing the little things right night after night after night. I don't think he'll ever be some offensive juggernaut but I think he can definitely be a valuable asset on this team's blueline. I keep trying to remind myself how Kronwall's development went. I agree with that, and I think he'll certainly be a 2nd pairing guy eventually. I guess I was asking if you really felt comfortable with him on the 2nd pair next season as you'd suggested bringing in a stay at home type vet to play with Lashoff and thus making Smith the second pair puck mover. I guess I just don't like him (yet) on the second pair if we're going to try and compete for a Cup. 1 haroldsnepsts reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frankgrimes 1,836 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 The title and poll are misleading a bit here. Would you be okay with this roster != would you be okay if the young guns are taking over for the dead weight So I'll answer the roster question because obviously I'm always okay, with giving young guns a chance. No, I would not be ok with this roster at all reasons: - fourth line is still a joke, you can't have that in the East - it's easily fixable so no excuse for not fixing it - defense would be still only have 3 good players Danny, Kronwall and Ericsson - unacceptable - offense: Jurco is a rookie so putting him on the top line might be a little too much pressure and I don't know, if he is ready for that kind of duty - goaltending: I would keep monster but I know it wont happen, guy will get a starting job somewhere and deseringly so If all cards are falling off and nothing is available, at least fix the fourth line and personally I'm against brining Alfie back, the team has enough leadership and I want to see him retire as a Senator. The roster looks a bit better than this years edition but not by far and with the amount of capspace at least some stopgaps should happen. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 Original post edited to include this. This is assuming Alfredsson either retires or signs elsewhere, and Vanek, Girardi and the other handful of legitimately good pending free agents don't hit the market or sign outrageously stupid contracts somewhere else so the best players left are guys like Boyes, the Jokinens, Zidlicky, Gilbert, etc. I just find it interesting that people want the Wings to bring up younger guys, but then they want the Wings to go out and sign mid level vets too. With one D spot and probably only 2 forward spots open next year, it's going to be one or the other. I think that if they can sign one forward and make a move to trade Kindl or Smith plus a prospect for an upgrade on defense, filling the other open spots with kids is going to be ideal. I'd even be pretty happy with slotting Jurco and Sheahan into the starting lineup and making the one move on D, sicne I think that #4 spot is probably the weak link in the roster. With goalies, the best 6 or 8 are going to want to go somewhere they have a chance at starting. Ideally I think Mrazek is going to be in GR, but if their best option to back up Howard is a guy like Dubnyk, Mrazek is the better option. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 this is a potential lineup for next year if they don't sign anyone Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Jurco Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist Tatar-Helm-Sheahan Miller-Andersson-Abdelkader Kronwall-Dekeyser Smith-Ericsson Kindl-Marchenko (or Sproul or Ouellet) Callahan, Ferraro, and Lashoff as reserves Howard and Mrasek in goal This is assuming Alfredsson either retires or signs elsewhere, and Vanek, Girardi and the other handful of legitimately good pending free agents don't hit the market or sign outrageously stupid contracts somewhere else so the best players left are guys like Boyes, the Jokinens, Zidlicky, Gilbert, etc. You stole my ideas. I will sue you for all you're worth. (I voted Yes.) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wheelchairsuperhero 1,453 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 I think the lineup looks good and would be happy with it but the real problem is when we get destroyed by injuries. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 One big concern I have, Dickie, is that big, gaping, Alfredsson-shaped hole. We don't even try to make up for that lost production? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stillwater 186 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 (edited) I voted no, the simple reason being, although I've enjoyed watching the kids play and understand there's more on the way ... I'm not convinced that the group is capable of winning Stanley Cups, and frankly, that's the goal. I'd like to see them unload some of the younger guys in the organization for proven producers or guys that are on the cusp of that. It's a dream, I know ... but some of these teams that are headed nowhere have some decent players who may be better off with a change of scenery. I won't list the players I'd target here, that would only stand to hijack the thread. Edited January 31, 2014 by stillwater Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VM1138 1,921 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 I look at it this way. The kids COULD be enough and could be great. Or they could continue to develop normally and not really hit their prime for a few more years. Now, if we go out and sign some top players, we're set. And then if the kids do develop, we'd be unstoppable. I choose the second option. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 One big concern I have, Dickie, is that big, gaping, Alfredsson-shaped hole. We don't even try to make up for that lost production? Alfredsson retires, Vanek and Gaborik sign before hitting the market, and people go nuts with the next tier of guys and hand out 7 year high salary deals to Grabovski, Stastny, etc. Wings are left with guys like Boyes to choose from. 1 dirtydangles reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted January 31, 2014 I actually think Zidlicky would be a good fit here. I'm sure an old, undersized, offensive-minded Euro wouldn't be popular, but he's still an effective player who fills one of our needs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites