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#101 dropkickshanahans

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 07:38 PM

Helene St. James ‏@HeleneStJames 2h
Bobby Ryan off to Ottawa. #RedWings had little interest in Ryan, none after lackluster performance in this year's playoffs against them.


That's wrote as fact not opinion.

 

I'd like to know why she doesn't quote Holland directly then if this were true. This kind of stuff is probably why many on here disregard HSJ.



#102 pucktividi

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 07:39 PM

Toews had lackluster performance against Wings too,therefore...



#103 DeGraa55

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 07:42 PM

Remember this is how old of a thread? Lackluster, lazy, compete level etc etc same idea.

Either way that being the reason why they had no interest is pretty dumb. Considering what he can do, as well considering they tolerate king floater of them all(franzina).
Ya drop kick I agree. But remembering something from long ago I can't remember the source of information just the information itself.

#104 DickieDunn

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 07:44 PM

Helene St. James ‏@HeleneStJames 2h
Bobby Ryan off to Ottawa. #RedWings had little interest in Ryan, none after lackluster performance in this year's playoffs against them.


That's wrote as fact not opinion.

 

 

If I say "you're an idiot," that's written as a fact, not an opinion.  Does it make it true?

 

Helene St. Lame is one of the worst "reporters" out there.


Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#105 number9

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 07:52 PM

Remember this is how old of a thread? Lackluster, lazy, compete level etc etc same idea.

Either way that being the reason why they had no interest is pretty dumb. Considering what he can do, as well considering they tolerate king floater of them all(franzina).
Ya drop kick I agree. But remembering something from long ago I can't remember the source of information just the information itself.


Dictionary time!

Lackluster = lacking in vitality force or conviction
Lazy = unwilling to work or use energy

 
 
If I say "you're an idiot," that's written as a fact, not an opinion.  Does it make it true?
 
Helene St. Lame is one of the worst "reporters" out there.


Don't be a fool dickie. HSJ was in the room when holland and his scouts discussed ryans lacklusterness. That's why she quoted him directly in her tweet.

#106 FlashyG

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 08:07 PM

Remember this is how old of a thread? Lackluster, lazy, compete level etc etc same idea.

Either way that being the reason why they had no interest is pretty dumb. Considering what he can do, as well considering they tolerate king floater of them all(franzina).
Ya drop kick I agree. But remembering something from long ago I can't remember the source of information just the information itself.

 

Saying someone didn't play well isn't the same as saying they are lazy.

 

Also it came from Helene St. James' not Ken Holland or anyone else within the Red Wings organization, which is who you said called him lazy, and why I immediately knew it was false. Holland would never speak like that about any player, he's way too professional for that.

 

Lastly even though I really like Ryan, He;s basically a younger Franzen. As soon as he hit his first slump you'd have a feminine nickname for him too and then you'd have 2 guys you hate on the team. 


Edited by FlashyG, 19 February 2014 - 08:08 PM.


#107 Echolalia

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Posted 19 February 2014 - 10:07 PM

Helene St. James ‏@HeleneStJames 2h
Bobby Ryan off to Ottawa. #RedWings had little interest in Ryan, none after lackluster performance in this year's playoffs against them.


That's wrote as fact not opinion.

 

Its definitely not written as fact, but if you want to interpret it as fact there's probably little any of us can do to convince you otherwise.  It was also written in July, not after the first round of the playoffs ended, and the thread link that you posted demonstrated that many of us at LGW also took the tweet by HSJ to be rumor and not a very valid one at that.  Helene St. James was attempting to fill in the blanks and its sloppy journalism (although its tough to call anything tweeted as journalism).  I don't believe she (or anyone) has published any references or quotes from Holland or any Detroit Red Wings upper management which suggests they passed on Bobby Ryan because of laziness, lackluster performance, or any of a handful of reasons we can speculate on.  When it comes to rumors like this or any type of sports journalism, sometimes its best to ignore what the author of the piece adds in, and just sift through for quotes directly from Red Wings staff or other official personnel.  I can't tell you how many times I've read an article with a certain slant on a story, only to find out that it was entirely embellished or interpreted or what-have-you by the writer of the piece, and the athletes', or coaches', or general managers' words were taken either intentionally or unintentionally out of context.  Unfortunately there's a lot of slant forming that occurs here and on other forums as well, sometimes from otherwise entirely unbiased and honest journalism, and that can snowball into serious rumors.  Anyway, that's my advice.  You're free to do with it what you want.



#108 wings4thecup06

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 10:01 AM

I've just re-read this entire thread purely from an entertainment perspective (and because I'm procrastinating instead of working, but still) and have found myself enlightened. 

 

To summarise: A rather crazy suggestion was made that we should buy out either our franchise icon at present, our best player and captain, leader, heart and soul guy, or a guy who has firmly established himself as a 30 goal scorer in this league, a guy who is one of the most dominant offensive threats in the league when he's rolling and on his game. 

 

Subsequently, the statement was made that we don't have goalscorers, and that to overcome this problem we should trade either of the two aforementioned, who have combined to provide the Wings with 1/6th of our goals this year.

 

As us fans often do, we look back retrospectively at what could have been, and thus the last 3 pages of this thread have been spent lamenting the fact that we didn't get Bobby Ryan and thus our entire front office is 'lazy', just like Franzen and even Bobby Ryan himself! 

 

Thus I feel compelled to add my 2 cents:

 

  • No we shouldn't buy out our captain or Franzen, what kind of a message does that send to the rest of the players in the league for a start, to both players? 
  • Can we scrap this 'floater' term to describe a player who is lazy? Is annoying and wholly inaccurate in terms of describing a player's tendency when they're on the ice. 
  • Franzen IMO, is worth that much more than Vanek. 1. He has great chemistry within our team. 2. He's proven to score when we needed it most (see 08 playoffs). 3. His contract is an absolute bargain, in a league with a cap that will forever go up, once again driving up salaries and leading to another lockout when Gary can't face the fact that the Panthers are losing more than just the $100,000 a day that was rumoured this past week (and just to avoid another 'fact' argument here's the link with proof! http://prohockeytalk...ing-100k-daily/) and doesn't want to have them fold or re-loacte them to Quebec City
  • Franzen may be infuriatingly inconsistent at times, but he's not lazy or a 'floater'. Surely most of us here have gone out there and played hockey on a regular basis (or any sport for that matter) and just had an 'off' game, when it doesn't all fit quite right and you know you haven't got it that day. You can argue they're paid to play, but everyone is human after all. And when he's hot, like he was for a lot of this year, it's incredibly exciting. 
  • I still believe in this team, with or without Z for the remainder of this year. You could classify me as being optimistic perhaps, but if Franzen and Weiss come back and are healthy and productive, with Howard getting his game together, and the kids staying up, why can't we squeeze into the playoffs? I see no reason why not. 

Edited by wings4thecup06, 20 February 2014 - 12:12 PM.

temp 1

 


#109 number9

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 11:57 AM

 

I've just re-read this entire thread purely from an entertainment perspective (and because I'm procrastinating instead of working, but still) and have found myself enlightened. 

 

To summarise: A rather crazy suggestion was made that we should buy out either our franchise icon at present, our best player and captain, leader, heart and soul guy, or a guy who has firmly established himself as a 30 goal scorer in this league, a guy who is one of the most dominant offensive threats in the league when he's rolling and on his game. 

 

Subsequently, the statement was made that we don't have goalscorers, and that to overcome this problem we should trade either of the two aforementioned, who have combined to provide the Wings with 1/6th of our goals this year.

 

As us fans often do, we look back retrospectively at what could have been, and thus the last 3 pages of this thread have been spent lamenting the fact that we didn't get Bobby Ryan and thus our entire front office is 'lazy', just like Franzen and even Bobby Ryan himself! 

 

Thus I feel compelled to add my 2 cents:

 

  • No we shouldn't buy out our captain or Franzen, what kind of a message does that send to the rest of the players in the league for a start, to both players? 
  • Can we scrap this 'floater' term to describe a player who is lazy? Is annoying and wholly inaccurate in terms of describing a player's tendency when they're on the ice. 
  • Franzen IMO, is worth that much more than Vanek. 1. He has great chemistry within our team. 2. He's proven to score when we needed it most (see 08 playoffs). 3. His contract is an absolute bargain, in a league with a cap that will forever go up, once again driving up salaries and leading to another lockout when Gary can't face the fact that the Panthers are losing more than just the $100,000 a day that was rumoured this past week (and just to avoid another 'fact' argument here's the link with proof! http://prohockeytalk...ing-100k-daily/) and doesn't want to have them fold or re-loacte them to Quebec City
  • Franzen may be infuriatingly inconsistent at times, but he's not lazy or a 'floater'. Surely most of us here have gone out there and played hockey on a regular basis (or any sport for that matter) and just had an 'off' game, when it doesn't all fit quite right and you know you haven't got it that day. You can argue their paid to play, but everyone is human after all. And when he's hot, like he was for a lot of this year, it's incredibly exciting. 
  • I still believe in this team, with or without Z for the remainder of this year. You could classify me as being optimistic perhaps, but if Franzen and Weiss come back and are healthy and productive, with Howard getting his game together, and the kids staying up, why can't we squeeze into the playoffs? I see no reason why not. 

 

I'm beyond thrilled that most of LGW is starting to reject the "Franzen = Floater Therom" (not saying you ever drank that kool-aid). I've always been a Franzen defender and the amount of flack he takes from Wings fans makes me feel ashamed to be a part of that group. There is nothing harder in hockey than scoring goals. Guys like Ovechkin and Stamkos do it on a nightly basis, and that's what makes them incredible. Is Franzen a Stammer or Ovi? No. He goes through the same droughts and hot streaks that most other goal scorers go through.

Would Babs dress a "Lazy" player? There's a reason Franzen plays a lot of minutes for him.



#110 DeGraa55

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 02:16 PM

Asking if babs would play a lazy player is kind of a terrible question ain't it?

Look at what we have seen: Sammy, cleary, and Franzen.

But to be fair id say cleary actually gives A LOT more effort than Franzen ever has. He just doesn't have the god given natural talent that's pissed away on a guy like Franzen.

But Sammy? Can't we all agree he is lazy?

Or sorry according to mr dictionary.com earlier "lackluster" better? These guyS are CONSISTENTLY lackluster.
And to continue you from what I've said these guys have been played instead of guys like nyquist, glendening, Sheahan etc etc who I would argue actually give the most effort.

#111 wings4thecup06

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 02:17 PM

Asking if babs would play a lazy player is kind of a terrible question ain't it?

Look at what we have seen: Sammy, cleary, and Franzen.

But to be fair id say cleary actually gives A LOT more effort than Franzen ever has. He just doesn't have the god given natural talent that's pissed away on a guy like Franzen.

But Sammy? Can't we all agree he is lazy?

Or sorry according to mr dictionary.com earlier "lackluster" better? These guyS are CONSISTENTLY lackluster.
And to continue you from what I've said these guys have been played instead of guys like nyquist, glendening, Sheahan etc etc who I would argue actually give the most effort.

 

Hang on a minute, are you insinuating that Cleary is a lazy player? Or am I reading this incorrectly? 


temp 1

 


#112 VM1138

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 02:21 PM

I can't even process most of these threads anymore. So much ridiculousness.

I'm inclined to believe HSJ about Ryan. He has a reputation as not being a big game player. Fair or not. Thus, when he disappeared against us, I would hope Holland would have lost interest. Toews having a bad series against us isn't the same thing. Toews can carry his team when It matters.
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#113 DeGraa55

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 02:24 PM

I still believe in this team, with or without Z for the remainder of this year. You could classify me as being optimistic perhaps, but if Franzen and Weiss come back and are healthy and productive, with Howard getting his game together, and the kids staying up, why can't we squeeze into the playoffs? I see no reason why not.


I think we're better with the kids playing. We need z and dat but I like Franzen and Weiss out we're doing better. Id rather see guys that want to be out there like a nyquist or Sheahan or jurco over Franzen.

If Franzen, Weiss, Sammy, Bert, cleary, and Quincey never played a game for us again we would be much better in the long term and prolly in the short term as well.

#114 number9

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 04:32 PM

But you're forgetting the fact that vanek hasn't had the caliber teammates Franzen has had. In the specific year you looked at Franzen had z and dats and others vanek had? ...pomiville or however it's spelt and? Ya not near the same level. Vanek has done more with less FACT. Younger. Healthier?
You take your 20 goal a year average goal scorer who can't stay on the ice and doesn't play defense and I'll take guys that show up to play.


Hell most of you are still delusional and think we will win a cup this year.

 

 

There's a difference between hope and crazy.

I hope we win the cup to. But facts and common sense say it's 99.9% we don't.


We are only a couple of players away from having a legit shot but holland won't make the moves necessary. We may disagree on the players but I think we all can agree on that.

 

 

I still believe in this team, with or without Z for the remainder of this year. You could classify me as being optimistic perhaps, but if Franzen and Weiss come back and are healthy and productive, with Howard getting his game together, and the kids staying up, why can't we squeeze into the playoffs? I see no reason why not.


I think we're better with the kids playing. We need z and dat but I like Franzen and Weiss out we're doing better. Id rather see guys that want to be out there like a nyquist or Sheahan or jurco over Franzen.

If Franzen, Weiss, Sammy, Bert, cleary, and Quincey never played a game for us again we would be much better in the long term and prolly in the short term as well.

 

 

Classify you as optimistic lol??? Maybe inconsistent with a roller coaster of opinions, but definitely not optimistic.

 

Asking if babs would play a lazy player is kind of a terrible question ain't it?

Look at what we have seen: Sammy, cleary, and Franzen.

But to be fair id say cleary actually gives A LOT more effort than Franzen ever has. He just doesn't have the god given natural talent that's pissed away on a guy like Franzen.

But Sammy? Can't we all agree he is lazy?

Or sorry according to mr dictionary.com earlier "lackluster" better? These guyS are CONSISTENTLY lackluster.
And to continue you from what I've said these guys have been played instead of guys like nyquist, glendening, Sheahan etc etc who I would argue actually give the most effort.

 

 

Nope, I don't agree. I've never considered Sammy lazy, nor have I considered Franzen or Cleary lazy. Have Sammy and Cleary been CONSISTENTLY lackluster? Yeah, your spot on there. But being lackluster in no way means one is lazy. Cleary and Sammy both tried their best, but theyre old and washed up... hence why one is on the 4th line and the other is in GR.

- Mr. Dictionary


Edited by number9, 20 February 2014 - 04:33 PM.


#115 Son of a Wing

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Posted 20 February 2014 - 04:41 PM

Classify you as optimistic lol??? Maybe inconsistent with a roller coaster of opinions, but definitely not optimistic.

 

Ya what happened to 99.9% of going nowhere...said 2 days ago...lol


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#116 DeGraa55

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 12:53 PM

That was quoting someone you clown. If you could comprehend the English language I CLEARLY said the mobile version sucks cause I can't properly quote someone. So I had to copy an paste it.


Glad to know you haven't actually read the thread though. LOL

Wings for the cup said it and you even quoted him haha. And my opinion has been consistent so don't ever say otherwise.

#117 DeGraa55

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 12:58 PM



Nope, I don't agree. I've never considered Sammy lazy, nor have I considered Franzen or Cleary lazy. Have Sammy and Cleary been CONSISTENTLY lackluster? Yeah, your spot on there. But being lackluster in no way means one is lazy. Cleary and Sammy both tried their best, but theyre old and washed up... hence why one is on the 4th line and the other is in GR.


That's a quote from number9. Just the people people who don't pay attention understand.

Now here is my response:


Thanks for saying the exact same thing I said in a previous post. Guess you agree with me on something. Laziness also can cause lackluster performances. But you can work hard and have a lackluster performance to franzina is typically cause from laziness and floating but not always.

#118 number9

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 04:40 PM

That was quoting someone you clown. If you could comprehend the English language I CLEARLY said the mobile version sucks cause I can't properly quote someone. So I had to copy an paste it.


Glad to know you haven't actually read the thread though. LOL

Wings for the cup said it and you even quoted him haha. And my opinion has been consistent so don't ever say otherwise.

 

You're copy/pasting has nothing to do with my comprehension of the English language. You're quoting others and not even including their names or quotations. If I reread the entire thread every time I wanted to respond to you to see if you're quoting someone or not, then yes, I would be a clown. I suggest downloading TapToTalk like most other mobile phone users. It's been out for a while.


Nope, I don't agree. I've never considered Sammy lazy, nor have I considered Franzen or Cleary lazy. Have Sammy and Cleary been CONSISTENTLY lackluster? Yeah, your spot on there. But being lackluster in no way means one is lazy. Cleary and Sammy both tried their best, but theyre old and washed up... hence why one is on the 4th line and the other is in GR.


That's a quote from number9. Just the people people who don't pay attention understand.

Now here is my response:


Thanks for saying the exact same thing I said in a previous post. Guess you agree with me on something. Laziness also can cause lackluster performances. But you can work hard and have a lackluster performance to franzina is typically cause from laziness and floating but not always.

Finally, the evidence that Franzen truly is lazy! Thanks!

What about Sammy though? He's lazy too right?


Edited by number9, 21 February 2014 - 04:47 PM.


#119 pucktividi

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Posted 21 February 2014 - 07:07 PM

I still believe in this team, with or without Z for the remainder of this year. You could classify me as being optimistic perhaps, but if Franzen and Weiss come back and are healthy and productive, with Howard getting his game together, and the kids staying up, why can't we squeeze into the playoffs? I see no reason why not.


I think we're better with the kids playing. We need z and dat but I like Franzen and Weiss out we're doing better. Id rather see guys that want to be out there like a nyquist or Sheahan or jurco over Franzen.

If Franzen, Weiss, Sammy, Bert, cleary, and Quincey never played a game for us again we would be much better in the long term and prolly in the short term as well.

I really like the kids line,but despite carrying dead weight in Cleary,Bert,Sammy or having lackluster performances by Weiss,Howard,Quincey,the Wings were 3rd in the East at one point.

 

Bottom line.We are  better team having combo of kids and newly returned Franzen and Weiss.



#120 marcaractac

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 01:52 PM

Johan Franzen said he believes he'll be ready to play Wednesday at Montreal. Will see doctor on Monday in hopes of being cleared.

 

Great news!







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