3/22 GDT : Red Wings 3 at Wild 2

[SDavis35 140]

Doesn't matter. People posting on the internet has no effect on whether Howard is Below, Above, or Equal to being an average goalie.

It's his on ice play that determines that.

And if people are saying he sucks after one bad goal they too are ignoring half the information to make their remarks.

But you made a sarcastic remark about him being average. (Which, again, he is when you look at ALL the information and not just the info that supports what you want)

Top 10 among active goalies (career) in both SV% and GAA.

I thought he's played well this past week at least, I didn't notice how many solid saves he had until FSD showed the clip early in the 3rd.

[roboturner 562]

He was fantastic today. That isn't blind praise. Also, you do realize there are plenty of people here on the opposite end of the spectrum regarding Howard, right?

It is blind praise when there are constant excuses when things are bad for him, and when he's playing well he's the greatest goalie and somehow ALL the bad things he does are ignored.

I'm sure there are, but to get to that point you have to think "OK, if he wasn't playing for the Wings, would I think he's an above average goalie? Would I want him on my team?" Then you take a critical look at his game.

It seems most "Howard Supporters" are just that. Supporters. "I'm going to support Howard no matter what cuz he's on the Wings and I'm a fan of the Wings so I can't think bad thoughts about any aspect of his game or I won't be a true fan and anybody who doesn't support him 100% no matter shouldn't voice their concerns and opinions Y cant U jsut support him!!"

If you're referencing people saying "he sucks" right after goal without any other thoughts or analysis going into that, then yeah they are just as guilty as people saying "Average Save There, Hey Guys!!" after he makes one nice save and not putting any other thoughts or analysis into it.

It's the same thing. Selecting only the instances that confirm your theory and ignoring all the instances that don't isn't going to get you to an informed, rational position, whatever that position is.

If I selected only his greatest moments he would seem like a great, above average NHL goalie.

If I selected only his weakest moments he would seem like a s***ty, below average NHL goalie.

If I look at ALL his work, then and only then could you make a determination on how well he actually plays. That's all I'm advocating. I don't care where you fall once you've done that.

[roboturner 562]

Top 10 among active goalies (career) in both SV% and GAA.

I thought he's played well this past week at least, I didn't notice how many solid saves he had until FSD showed the clip early in the 3rd.

He did play well this past week and I don't think that first goal was as bad as some. (See, I'll give him credit when he deserves it!!)

Among active goalies who have played more than 10 games, Howard is:

40th in GAA &

37th in SV%

His numbers from previous seasons don't guarantee he'll continue to be a top 10. His numbers from this season don't guarantee he'll continue to be a mid 40 goalie.

But you can't take only one piece of info, then ignore the rest and try to assert something based on that. I'll just quote myself haha

If I selected only his greatest moments he would seem like a great, above average NHL goalie.

If I selected only his weakest moments he would seem like a s***ty, below average NHL goalie.

If I look at ALL his work, then and only then could you make a determination on how well he actually plays. That's all I'm advocating. I don't care where you fall once you've done that.

[pucktividi 472]

I'm gonna watch the game now.I like the final score though

[SDavis35 140]

He did play well this past week and I don't think that first goal was as bad as some. (See, I'll give him credit when he deserves it!!)

Among active goalies who have played more than 10 games, Howard is:

40th in GAA &

37th in SV%

His numbers from previous seasons don't guarantee he'll continue to be a top 10. His numbers from this season don't guarantee he'll continue to be a mid 40 goalie.

But you can't take only one piece of info, then ignore the rest and try to assert something based on that. I'll just quote myself haha

What about 20+ games? (ie. among Starters) Not that it would say he's better or anything, it would probably make him look worse.

You are not a Howard hater, you will at least entertain the idea that he played well. I don't think either goal could be considered "bad" as much as he just got beat. Bad timing for sure, but the Wings are battling and competing well so the goals allowed is behind us.

At least we can agree that this season, Howard has not been at the top of his game. He is therefore average (statistically) this season. I just don't enjoy reading the others who think we need to trade in Howard based on a single poor season.

[marcaractac 3,963]

I love how that even with this depleted lineup, the officiating can't even beat us.

[Andy Pred 48 337]

with all the kids getting better with each game it'll be interesting who sits when the injured guys start coming back.

Do we have a limit on the cap still or is that now lifted. I can only presume that Jurco, Sheahan, Pulkkinen,Ferraro

and Emmerton will go back to GR's and maybe Glendening stays as Babs likes him. To me Sheahan should stay

up because him with Gus and Tats can be a dominate 3rd line for us.

Hopefully they can keep going and get us in the post season when most of our injured guys should be back.

At the end of the day the kids have done great, but when you have the guys we have out it could be any other

teams top 2 forward lines.

[wings87 1,290]

This is mesmerizing, I can't stop looking at it.

[nawein 324]

What were the actual lines today?

Mule-Legwand-Alfie

Tats-Tinky-Gus

Miller-Glendening-Bert

Ferraro-Helm-Emdog

Kronner-Smith

DK-Q

Kindl-Lash

[Guest Playmaker]

Outside of Joakim Andersson, no one else is really close to coming back. I don't see Datsyuk coming back this season, or Zetterberg either.

[roboturner 562]

What about 20+ games? (ie. among Starters) Not that it would say he's better or anything, it would probably make him look worse.

You are not a Howard hater, you will at least entertain the idea that he played well. I don't think either goal could be considered "bad" as much as he just got beat. Bad timing for sure, but the Wings are battling and competing well so the goals allowed is behind us.

At least we can agree that this season, Howard has not been at the top of his game. He is therefore average (statistically) this season. I just don't enjoy reading the others who think we need to trade in Howard based on a single poor season.

35th in GAA

31st in SV% not great haha

I always try to use "replacement word/words" in these situations.

"If a Wing had scored that 1st goal on another goalie, would I think that goalie sucks cuz he didn't stop it? Or would I think that it was just a really nice shot by a talented Red Wing?"

"If the Wings scored a weak goal on a goalie, would I think that goal was due to a lucky shot, lucky bounce, or poor defense? Or would I think that their goalie misplayed it."

I wouldn't want to get rid of Howard because of one bad season.

I would, however, want to get rid of him after 1.5 bad seasons (maybe 2, but I doubt it haha) AND due to his other severely lacking aspects of hockey playing ability. (or at the very least start exploring your options)

I would give him more time if these other aspects weren't as much of an issue but I don't see him making any improvements in those areas.

Edited March 22, 2014 by roboturner

[puckbags 863]

If we somehow get this battered team to the playoffs I can't see how Babs doesn't at least get a nomination for coach of the year.

[Andy Pred 48 337]

the thing is if we make the playoffs we'll want Pav and Z back on the ice if possible.

I would like the front office to shut them both down and let them heel up for next

year, where i believe we will be in a much better position to have a good year.

I think that they have told Weiss that he should call it a year already and get healthy

for 2014-15.

[marcaractac 3,963]

with all the kids getting better with each game it'll be interesting who sits when the injured guys start coming back.

Do we have a limit on the cap still or is that now lifted. I can only presume that Jurco, Sheahan, Pulkkinen,Ferraro

and Emmerton will go back to GR's and maybe Glendening stays as Babs likes him. To me Sheahan should stay

up because him with Gus and Tats can be a dominate 3rd line for us.

Hopefully they can keep going and get us in the post season when most of our injured guys should be back.

At the end of the day the kids have done great, but when you have the guys we have out it could be any other

teams top 2 forward lines.

Glendening-Sheahan-Miller. Boom, 4th line. You'd have to think Andersson is the odd man out when we get healthy. Nothing against him, but he is such a slow skater. Sheahan can more than make up for the points Andy would put up.

[Ekmanc 586]

If we somehow get this battered team to the playoffs I can't see how Babs doesn't at least get a nomination for coach of the year.

The Jack Adams trophy most likely already has Roy's name engraved on it. Sadly I don't think anyone coaching Detroit will come near that trophy in a foreseeable future.

[puckbags 863]

The Jack Adams trophy most likely already has Roy's name engraved on it. Sadly I don't think anyone coaching Detroit will come near that trophy in a foreseeable future.

Which is exactly why I said a nomination. The 2nd part of your statement is some weird attempt at questioning the coaching staff I take it? I'm confused.

[wings_fanatic 677]

Which is exactly why I said a nomination. The 2nd part of your statement is some weird attempt at questioning the coaching staff I take it? I'm confused.

I think he is saying what I said the other day... Mike Babcock should have already won the jack Adams award at least once by now (probably should have won twice tbh) but he has been ignored every year just because its Detroit.

[DatsyukianDekes 2,428]

Which is exactly why I said a nomination. The 2nd part of your statement is some weird attempt at questioning the coaching staff I take it? I'm confused.

Don't think that's what he/she meant, it was taken in different context.

I read it as the Wings have been so successful in the last 20 years they won't win it based upon that. If the Wings bottomed out for 3 years and went on to make the playoffs then Babcock would probably win it.

[pucktividi 472]

Sadly I don't think anyone coaching Detroit will come near that trophy in a foreseeable future.

I'm optimist about our coaches.We have Babcock here and Blashill in Grand Rapids.Blashill had a year as Babs assistant,learned a thing our two,then turned back to Griffins and won the Calder Cup.So basically,he's familiar with both our young and veteran players and it's a win-win situation when/if he takes over the Wings one day.

[Ekmanc 586]

No I like our coaches but I don't think there's anything they could do with this team that would give us the Jack Adams, everyone expects Detroit to do well.

[Guest Playmaker]

I don't think it's anything against Detroit. I think it has more to do with having a team with a ton of talent that people expect to win. Usually, it tends to go to a coach who made the biggest turnaround of a team. Patrick Roy definitely fits the bill on that, but I do think Babcock will get votes. But, making the playoffs is essential.

[marcaractac 3,963]

I don't think it's anything against Detroit. I think it has more to do with having a team with a ton of talent that people expect to win. Usually, it tends to go to a coach who made the biggest turnaround of a team. Patrick Roy definitely fits the bill on that, but I do think Babcock will get votes. But, making the playoffs is essential.

Then they should have a most improved team award.

[gowings00 545]

We won because the PP scored. Plain and simple.

[marcaractac 3,963]

We won because the PP scored. Plain and simple.

Can't stop our ENFORCER!!!

[Euro_Twins 4,475]

Can't stop our ENFORCER!!!

It was a good deadline acquisition