Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

UFA/RFA Re-Signing, What Does Everyone Get?


  • Please log in to reply
65 replies to this topic

#41 Danielsm

Danielsm

    3rd Line Checker

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 481 posts

Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:46 AM

Alfredsson moved his whole family to Detroit. If he wasn't serious about staying, the family could have lived in Ottawa. I think he'll play another year or two, and he should. He's been great.



#42 wings87

wings87

    Wake Up!

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,016 posts
  • Location:Texas

Posted 09 March 2014 - 11:03 AM

Alfredsson moved his whole family to Detroit. If he wasn't serious about staying, the family could have lived in Ottawa. I think he'll play another year or two, and he should. He's been great.


I think he'll resign, and was real good early on; but since being relegated to the third line he's been pretty invisible.

"He usually shows up when the game is over and tries to be the hero. Puts his cape on and goes and flies out there." ~ Franzen 


#43 DickieDunn

DickieDunn

    http://redwingsandotherthings.wordpress.com/

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,563 posts
  • Location:Belding

Posted 09 March 2014 - 11:38 AM

Hard to score when you're playing with Glendening and Abdelkader


Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#44 larionov_8

larionov_8

    3rd Line Checker

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 433 posts

Posted 09 March 2014 - 04:09 PM

Not to get off topic, as this has an influence on who makes what, but I think this year's experience demonstrates that the wisest course of action would have Jurco and Glendening start the year in GR. There will be injuries, and when there are, I'd rather see these guys, who have shown they are capable, fill a role, over a player who may not be ready. Meanwhile they can play big minutes and continue to learn how to win with GR.

 

Given that we have enough youth already (Tatar, Nyquist, Sheahan and Andersson, plus potentially Ferraro and Callahan - Helm and Abby aren't "old" and there are 3 young guys on the D too), there is value in filling out the roster with veterans who can also fill some roles (e.g. Legwand and Alfie). That gives us the kind of depth needed to compete in this league when those injuries hit. I think this stretch of games right now is showing that it is a lot to ask of these young guys to drive the bus themselves. Hopefully they will be ready to take on bigger roles as they develop but they are still young and raw in some ways. 

On a less argumentative note, can anyone explain why Almquist is / is not waiver-exempt in 2014-15?



#45 Buppy

Buppy

    1st Line All-Star

  • Silver Booster
  • 1,980 posts

Posted 09 March 2014 - 04:44 PM

...

On a less argumentative note, can anyone explain why Almquist is / is not waiver-exempt in 2014-15?

Waiver status is determined by a few factors: The players age during the first season of their first NHL contract sets the number of years or games played the player has to reach before losing their exemption. Once a player plays that number of NHL games, or after that number of seasons (regardless of whether the player is in the NHL or not), the player then has to clear waivers.

 

In Almquist's case, he signed his first contract at age 20, for the 2011-12 season. This gave him 3 years or 160 games (the games were then reduced due to the lockout, but that's not a factor in his case). This is his third pro season, so he needs to clear waivers next year.

 

There are some tricky parts to the waiver rules, mostly pertaining to players who sign at 18/19 and play in the NHL. Easiest way to check waiver status is with http://capgeek.com/waiver-calculator/. Just note that the "To date" line does not include this season, so if it says the player has 1 year left, it means they would need to clear next year.



#46 Detroit # 1 Fan

Detroit # 1 Fan

    Truculence.

  • HoF Booster
  • 19,080 posts
  • Location:St John's

Posted 09 March 2014 - 05:08 PM

Legwand back 3yrs/3.5 or 4, Alfie back 1yr/4, re-sign all the RFAs, Gus back 2yrs/2.75. If we can't upgrade the D, Quincey at a reduced rate wouldn't be terrible.

 

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Alfredsson

Nyquist-Legwand-Franzen

Tatar-Weiss-Abdelkader

Miller-Helm-Sheahan

Callahan, Andersson/Glendening/Ferraro

 

That's a seriously deep, and potent forward group. Jurco gets back in the line-up when Alfie retires, because he's waiver exempt.


#NOMOREKINDL


#47 larionov_8

larionov_8

    3rd Line Checker

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 433 posts

Posted 09 March 2014 - 07:56 PM

...

 

There are some tricky parts to the waiver rules, mostly pertaining to players who sign at 18/19 and play in the NHL. Easiest way to check waiver status is with http://capgeek.com/waiver-calculator/. Just note that the "To date" line does not include this season, so if it says the player has 1 year left, it means they would need to clear next year.

 

Thanks Buppy. I knew of capgeek's waiver calculator but it tells me that he has 2 years of exemption (2 left this year, one next year). Since I had heard he wouldn't be exempt next year, I was trying to get a handle on how that's calculated and what the right answer is! 

Fortunately there are people who get paid to figure these things out so I don't need to worry about it too much....



#48 Buppy

Buppy

    1st Line All-Star

  • Silver Booster
  • 1,980 posts

Posted 09 March 2014 - 11:40 PM

 

Thanks Buppy. I knew of capgeek's waiver calculator but it tells me that he has 2 years of exemption (2 left this year, one next year). Since I had heard he wouldn't be exempt next year, I was trying to get a handle on how that's calculated and what the right answer is! 

Fortunately there are people who get paid to figure these things out so I don't need to worry about it too much....

No problem. One other note is "Professional games" means games in any pro league, not just the NHL. AHL, ECHL, and any European pro leagues all count. For a player signed at age 20 or older, the first season he plays one pro game counts as their first season of exemption, and every season thereafter counts even if they don't play any pro games. The rules are different for players signed at 18 or 19; the first year of their contract is their first year of exemption even if they only play in juniors.



#49 VM1138

VM1138

    Legend

  • Moderator
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,611 posts
  • Location:Michigan

Posted 10 March 2014 - 07:39 AM

Don't forget Alfie has a bonus next season that counts against the cap. $2.5 million, I think. So trchnically he agreed to play here for $5. Unless a second year was part of a gentleman's agreement he will command about $5 million more, giving him a cap hit of about $7 million, I think.

Unless they finagle a two year deal for less. Still, I want him back. But playing him on the third is one of the dumber things Babcock has done.
Check out my short e-book on the Red Wings' 1937 Stanley Cup championship entitled: "Nothing Could Keep 'Em Down." Please download it from my profile at Smashwords: https://www.smashwor...ile/view/victor

New e-book: The Spanish-American War: A Brief History. Relatively short, introductory read for casual history buffs and people who want to learn more about a forgotten war that changed America. Available at BN.com, Smashwords, Kobo, and Diesel E-Books right now. Same link as above.

#50 DickieDunn

DickieDunn

    http://redwingsandotherthings.wordpress.com/

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,563 posts
  • Location:Belding

Posted 10 March 2014 - 07:54 AM

Don't forget Alfie has a bonus next season that counts against the cap. $2.5 million, I think. So trchnically he agreed to play here for $5. Unless a second year was part of a gentleman's agreement he will command about $5 million more, giving him a cap hit of about $7 million, I think.
Unless they finagle a two year deal for less. Still, I want him back. But playing him on the third is one of the dumber things Babcock has done.


$2 mil of his deal is bonus money that can be deferred.

They have 7 guys who can score. Andersson hasn't been getting the job done so they might as well toss someone else in. It would be dumb to break up the kid line or the Franzen-Nyquist combo when they're hot. That leaves Alfredsson as the odd man out.

Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#51 PavelValerievichDatsyuk

PavelValerievichDatsyuk

    2nd Line Scorer

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 595 posts
  • Location:Montreal, Quebec

Posted 10 March 2014 - 08:04 AM

Don't forget Alfie has a bonus next season that counts against the cap. $2.5 million, I think. So trchnically he agreed to play here for $5. Unless a second year was part of a gentleman's agreement he will command about $5 million more, giving him a cap hit of about $7 million, I think.

Unless they finagle a two year deal for less. Still, I want him back. But playing him on the third is one of the dumber things Babcock has done.

But we could do another deal with playing bonuses and push some that cap hit to the following year again. 

 

Breaking up the kid line or the Gus-Mule-Leg would be worse i think than having Alfie on the the 3rd. If it's so dumb, what's the alternative? 



#52 VM1138

VM1138

    Legend

  • Moderator
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,611 posts
  • Location:Michigan

Posted 10 March 2014 - 08:50 AM

Well, when Datsyuk and Zetterberg get back, he can play with them.  There's space for Alfie in the top 6.  Yet he hasn't really played in the top six since early in the season, if I recall correctly.


Check out my short e-book on the Red Wings' 1937 Stanley Cup championship entitled: "Nothing Could Keep 'Em Down." Please download it from my profile at Smashwords: https://www.smashwor...ile/view/victor

New e-book: The Spanish-American War: A Brief History. Relatively short, introductory read for casual history buffs and people who want to learn more about a forgotten war that changed America. Available at BN.com, Smashwords, Kobo, and Diesel E-Books right now. Same link as above.

#53 DickieDunn

DickieDunn

    http://redwingsandotherthings.wordpress.com/

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,563 posts
  • Location:Belding

Posted 10 March 2014 - 10:46 AM

Andersson isn't the 3rd center anymore because he went 12 games without a point, simple as that.  Emmerton isn't the answer either.  Their only real option would be to put Nyquist on Alfredsson's line and Abdelkader with Franzen and Legwand.  Given the crap game the entire team had yesterday, I wouldn't be shocked to see a shakeup like that.


Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#54 The Datsyukian Deke

The Datsyukian Deke

    Top Prospect

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 99 posts

Posted 10 March 2014 - 07:25 PM

I would prefer:

 

Z - Dats - Alfie

Nyquist - Legwand - Franzen

Tatar - Helm - Abby

Sheahan - Weiss - Mantha

 

Assuming everyone is healthy, which especially for Helm is not going to happen...

 

Why those lines? Offense would be an absolute terror. If i recall correctly, Pavs had 48 points in 45 games last season DESPITE his wingers being (offensive) scrubs like Cleary and Abby. He could set them up for empty netters 4-5 times a game and they still would blow every chance. Now pair him with Z and Alfie..oh boy. :D

2nd line already showed us what it possibly can produce, and improved chemistry won't worsen that..

3rd line has the potential to completely frustrate opposition everywhere on the ice from a defensive standpoint AND would be dangerous, too.

4th line, get Mantha playing time in the NHL. In that setup we could easily afford some mistakes in the learning process but profit long-term because of the experience he gains.


Lidstrom: "Retiring today allows me to walk away from the game with pride, rather than have the game walk away from me."


#55 Richdg

Richdg

    1st Line All-Star

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,994 posts

Posted 12 March 2014 - 02:34 PM

I don't understand why so many are so willing to bring back 40 year olds instead of playing the youth. makes no sense. we don't need Alfie back, nor cleary, nor bert etc..... we have a top line of Z-Dat-franzen for next year. we have several good young F's: nyquist, tatar, jurco, Sheahan and pulk that need to play. add in grinders like helm, abby, legwand if he comes back, Weiss if healthy, miller and glendening and we already have 14 forwards. We also have a lot of cap space. If spending the money and trying to add talent is the plan-I hope it is, then go after vanek-40 goal guy, moulson-30 goal guy, and Callahan-25 goal guy.



#56 Son of a Wing

Son of a Wing

    London Lions Captain

  • Gold Booster
  • 1,914 posts
  • Location:London, Ontario

Posted 12 March 2014 - 02:36 PM

I don't understand why so many are so willing to bring back 40 year olds instead of playing the youth. makes no sense. we don't need Alfie back, nor cleary, nor bert etc..... we have a top line of Z-Dat-franzen for next year. we have several good young F's: nyquist, tatar, jurco, Sheahan and pulk that need to play. add in grinders like helm, abby, legwand if he comes back, Weiss if healthy, miller and glendening and we already have 14 forwards. We also have a lot of cap space. If spending the money and trying to add talent is the plan-I hope it is, then go after vanek-40 goal guy, moulson-30 goal guy, and Callahan-25 goal guy.

 

Considering you lumped in Alfie with Cleary and Bert it's really not surprising that you don't understand...


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi
 
When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”

#57 Richdg

Richdg

    1st Line All-Star

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,994 posts

Posted 12 March 2014 - 02:48 PM

ya, those 6 extra goals he has is worth the 2.5 extra million we pay him...... he isn't even going to score 20 goals this year.


remember the beginning of the year, when everyone and I do mean everyone was bitching about tatar and nyquist needing to play, be consistent. No need to waste money and roster spots of washed up players. No matter how great they USED to be.



#58 Motown4013

Motown4013

    1st Line All-Star

  • Silver Booster
  • 1,071 posts
  • Location:Ontario

Posted 12 March 2014 - 04:19 PM

Isolating the forward group here a minute, and this is getting nuts.
 
IMO, the wings will look to re-sign Legwand, initially on the fact that he's a local guy who's delighted to be playing here, but now also for the way he's playing (if of course, that continues). Maybe a 3 year deal or so worth $4 mil per

Alfredsson has said at numerous times this year he's really enjoying things, and I think that will continue. He's shown he's got all the tools to be an effective player night in night out. I think there's a good chance he'll come back on a 1 year deal, maybe $3.5
 
Assuming that Bertuzzi and Cleary are gone, that leaves us in a huge pickle. Look at this:
 
40-13-93
90-17-14
26-15-21
 
Who the hell is going to fill out that fourth line?
 
Helm
Abdelkader
Andersson 
Miller
Glendening
Alfredsson
 We will need all of thes epeople because 8 pf the above players will spend next year injured!
And that's not even counting Callahan and Ferraro
 
A couple of guys will have to be moved - maybe at the draft to get a good D guy. Even if Legwand and Alfie don't come back, we're still going to have to move a body or two. The kids need to play, and I hope management recognises that. We have a stock of good players that we can use to acquire a good D man, and I wouldn't mind betting that Kindl would be included in the package - seen as a former 1st round pick/reclamation project type. I'm excited about the remainder of this year, but the off-season could be really interesting too

We have a ton of guys that play then same role.....IF we can remain healthy....
Raising another Red Wings Fan!

The future looks bright in Hockeytown!
GUSTAV SNIPEQUIST!

#59 roboturner

roboturner

    3rd Line Checker

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 479 posts

Posted 12 March 2014 - 04:44 PM

ya, those 6 extra goals he has is worth the 2.5 extra million we pay him...... he isn't even going to score 20 goals this year.


remember the beginning of the year, when everyone and I do mean everyone was bitching about tatar and nyquist needing to play, be consistent. No need to waste money and roster spots of washed up players. No matter how great they USED to be.

 

Yeah you don't really get it.

 

                   Games Played         Points

Alfie                    53                       37

Nyquist               40                       32

Tatar                  56                       26

Bert                    50                       15        (-16 by the way)

Cleary                52                       8          (-11 by the way)

 

We wanted the young guys on the team not because they are young, but because they contribute more than Cleary and Bert. Thats the main point here.

 

Alfie isn't in that category of old and useless.  Alfie is 3rd on the team in points! He contributes to the success of the team. You want to get rid of the 3rd leading scorer because he's old?

 

So yes, we are being consistent. We consistently want players who contribute, and want to get rid of the ones who don't. It doesn't matter how old they are.


Edited by roboturner, 12 March 2014 - 04:56 PM.

This might be getting a little heated. Just know I don't hate any of you guys.

 

That doesn't mean that I respect ideas & opinions. Some ideas & opinions are ridiculous.

 

In fact, if you confront my ideas & opinions, that will lead to a discussion. (We're on a discussion board after all. Don't forget that!)

 

  :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1:


#60 wings4thecup06

wings4thecup06

    1st Line Sniper

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 934 posts
  • Location:London, United Kingdom

Posted 12 March 2014 - 04:48 PM

Alfie, while he has been slumping a bit recently, is a guy who I would take back in a heartbeat. Solid veteran presence, battles hard along the boards for the puck, not afraid to get involved physically, still skates really well and has a terrific shot. At the right price there is no reason NOT to bring him back IMO. 

 

I'm all for bringing the kids up, but at least let them take roster spots that actually benefit the team - clearly, bert etc. 


temp 1

 






Similar Topics Collapse

  Topic Forum Started By Stats Last Post Info

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users