Next Seasons Needs/Team Future

[Internet.Unknown 422]

Or I can join a forum and talk about it.

Which does nothing to try to convince those in power that the streak is "meaningless."

You can shout it here again and again, but until Holland et. al hears and agrees, the Wings' philosophy isn't going to change.

[Shaman 713]

Which does nothing to try to convince those in power that the streak is "meaningless."

You can shout it here again and again, but until Holland et. al hears and agrees, the Wings' philosophy isn't going to change.

The problem is this literally applies to everything that is said on here.

Also you remind me a lot of Helen St James. This is not a good thing.

[FlashyG 1,799]

And people who make mudpies thing they have value. It doesn't matter what they think, they are selling a product.

I go to multiple games a year, buy their merchandise, watch their broadcasts. I am their customer and their product is fast becoming s***.

If you're unhappy with the product then stop buying it.

No team is going to change its direction because a small group of fans wants them too.

Edited April 29, 2014 by FlashyG

[Buppy 1,720]

The futility of the argument aside, it's a false dilema. Trying to win now and trying to build a contender are not mutually exclusive.

[drumnj 459]

Lots of talk throughout this thread of the needed right handed shooter who can rip it from the circle.

If only the Wings had someone who can blast it like this:

[wings_fanatic 677]

I think it is clear that the brass is going to make a couple moves to improve this team in the off season. Lets be realistic, we have a good group put together and, with a couple key additions, we become an instant contender again.

For those of you saying the streak is overrated, I would just like to say that I was born in 1991 and am therefore 23 years old... the same age as the Red Wings playoff streak. It is truly remarkable that I have never not seen the Red Wings in the playoffs. I think it says something about the organization. Yes we might not win the Cup every year, but the mere fact that we get in shows that this team is about winning. Zetty said it best... we have not gone deep enough in the playoffs for too many times in a row lately. The fact that he and Babs both basically said that we need a couple key additions tells me that Kenny will act.

I am honored to call myself a true Red Wings fan because of the passion that the Red Wings and its players have always had for winning. My friend has a little brother that is 14 and he is a Leafs fan. We talked about how the Maple Leafs have missed the playoffs 8 out of the 14 years he has been alive (more then half of his life he has not watched his team in the playoffs). Meanwhile I am 23 and have always had my team to cheer for in the playoffs. Some Red Wings fans take that for granted, but we are such lucky fans and I have faith our team gets much better from here once again.

[Dabura 12,207]

I think the streak is amazing. I think the streak is important. But I think you have to be careful not to place too much importance on the streak itself. Zetterberg himself said he'd trade a season or two of the streak for a deeper run one year. Point being, the streak isn't really about making the playoffs every year. It's about sustained excellence, being in the mix for the Cup every season, not just being glad because "Phew! We kept a streak alive. Thank goodness. Now we can rest a little easier." The Cup is all that matters. 23 straight seasons is important not because it's a ridiculous streak, but because it shows a commitment to winning. But the Wings have to make good on that. The commitment itself can't be fetishized. There has to be some actual winning. Just making the dance isn't good enough, even in a transitional year like this one. It's really interesting to see Zetterberg basically say as much.

Then again, I suppose it's possible that the whole sustained excellence and commitment to winning thing might not be doable without yearly playoff revenue. It's entirely possible that Mr. I has been able to spend like he has largely because of the streak itself.

[Guest DeGraa55]

This off season can be the most exciting off season we have had in awhile as wings fan or one of the most disappointing.

Here is why. We have lots of cap space like 20m. IIRC. Not sure I that was before or after RFA are signed. So we have the ability to target a big name free agent or two. Even if they're signed for three or four year deals they'll be up when guys like nyquist are ready for a big payday.

We also have lots of pieces we COULD trade. Now I'm not saying trade any or all of these players BUT when your list of players on the roster include Howard, mrazek, Ericsson, Franzen, Weiss, helm Tatar nyquist etc etc or guys in the minors like sproul oullete marchenko pulkinnen etc etc we have pieces that could potentially be traded.

REMEMBER IM NOT SAYING TRADE ANY OR ALL. Just listing all guys that could be palaces and there's more besides them. So IF a star player or good player become available we have pieces that can be moved.

So those two things combined in my opinion mean we could have an AWESOME off season and one of the best in awhile. Or we could do the usual sign Alfie and monster and sit in our ass and do nothing just to disappoint me as well as he a first round knockout.

So there's reason to be excited for this offseason!!!! Don't let me down Kenny pleeeeeease don't!

[wings1110 184]

Wouldn't mind Steve Downie.

[Dabura 12,207]

Thinking out loud...

Matt Niskanen and Tom Wilson. That, to me, would be a pretty fantastic offseason. I wouldn't expect Wilson to be an impact player right away, but I really, really like his upside. At the very least, he's big and he'll fight. I think we could get him without having to part with any of Nyquist/Tatar/Sheahan/Jurco, which would be huge. But, again, it really does look like we're gonna have to move at least two or three (!) of Ouellet, Sproul, Marchenko, Backman, Almqvist. So...Niskanen, Wilson, and - dare I dream? - a top-six winger?

What if - I dare dream! - we go balls to the walls for Simmonds? No, really, being serious this time. Could one of Nyquist/Tatar/Sheahan/Jurco (probably Nyquist in this case), one or two of Ouellet/Sproul/Marchenko/Backman/Almqvist (at least one of Ouellet and Sproul, probably) one or two of Abdelkader/Andersson/Smith/Kindl/Lashoff/Pulkkinen/Callahan/Ferraro and maybe a pick get us Wayne "Was a Wings fan as a kid" Simmonds? As someone who lives in Flyers territory, I can tell you there's pretty much no way in hell he gets moved this summer, or ever. But if we could somehow swing it, he would be manna from heaven. Imagine him on a line with Z and D. Imagine him as the net-front guy on our first power play unit.

Edited April 29, 2014 by Dabura

[BadgerBob 297]

Thinking out loud...

Matt Niskanen and Tom Wilson. That, to me, would be a pretty fantastic offseason. I wouldn't expect Wilson to be an impact player right away, but I really, really like his upside. At the very least, he's big and he'll fight. I think we could get him without having to part with any of Nyquist/Tatar/Sheahan/Jurco, which would be huge. But, again, it really does look like we're gonna have to move at least two or three (!) of Ouellet, Sproul, Marchenko, Backman, Almqvist. So...Niskanen, Wilson, and - dare I dream? - a top-six winger?

What if - I dare dream! - we go balls to the walls for Simmonds? No, really, being serious this time. Could one of Nyquist/Tatar/Sheahan/Jurco (probably Nyquist in this case), one or two of Ouellet/Sproul/Marchenko/Backman/Almqvist (at least one of Ouellet and Sproul, probably) one or two of Abdelkader/Andersson/Smith/Kindl/Lashoff/Pulkkinen/Callahan/Ferraro and maybe a pick get us Wayne "Was a Wings fan as a kid" Simmonds? As someone who lives in Flyers territory, I can tell you there's pretty much no way in hell he gets moved this summer, or ever. But if we could somehow swing it, he would be manna from heaven. Imagine him on a line with Z and D. Imagine him as the net-front guy on our first power play unit.

If we're going to give up that much, I'd rather it be fore someone better than Wayne Simmonds. Just my opinion.

[kipwinger 8,518]

Dabura, your posts are too long for me to respond to all your points. So, a couple of things...

Niskanen having a career year in a contract year worries me too, but in addition to coinciding with a contract season his explosion also coincides with the average trajectory for defenseman development, as well as the Pens losing their top guy and giving Niskanen the opportunity to shine. But again, dually noted on the correlation.

If they Pens can sign him after all the money they've spent the last couple of years I'll be blown away.

The whole post about fetishizing the streak was right on.

Dream big with the Simmonds thing. Ain't happening.

[wings7 62]

Why I want Holland gone...He thinks this series was close.

“It was a learning experience,” Holland said. “When you look at it, Game 5 was 3-2 (before a Boston empty-net goal), Game 4 went into overtime. Those were close games.”

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20140428/SPORTS0103/304280095#ixzz30HeHvCoW

[kipwinger 8,518]

Why I want Holland gone...He thinks this series was close.

“It was a learning experience,” Holland said. “When you look at it, Game 5 was 3-2 (before a Boston empty-net goal), Game 4 went into overtime. Those were close games.”

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20140428/SPORTS0103/304280095#ixzz30HeHvCoW

I'm not going to try and talk you into liking Holland, you seem pretty dead set against it. But those were close games (on the scoreboard). Only problem is that despite their closeness, we had no realistic shot at winning any of them.

[wings7 62]

I'm not going to try and talk you into liking Holland, you seem pretty dead set against it. But those were close games (on the scoreboard). Only problem is that despite their closeness, we had no realistic shot at winning any of them.

He doesn't seem to have the same perspective and competitive nature that Nill, Scotty, Yzerman etc had.

Those games were close only via score, you're 100% right.

No one thought we were winning those games after the ice shifted in game 4 and really in game 5 it seemed like Boston was toying with us, playing just hard enough to win and move on.

[kipwinger 8,518]

He doesn't seem to have the same perspective and competitive nature that Nill, Scotty, Yzerman etc had.

Those games were close only via score, you're 100% right.

No one thought we were winning those games after the ice shifted in game 4 and really in game 5 it seemed like Boston was toying with us, playing just hard enough to win and move on.

Well I certainly agree with the second half of your post. But I'm actually a Holland fan. That doesn't mean I don't think he makes mistakes from time to time, he does, but usually his mistakes don't end up crippling the team in any serious way. Think of all his big "mistakes" e.g. Sammy, Tootoo, Quincey, bringing Cleary back, and then think about other people's big mistakes and you immediately feel better. He could have signed David Clarkson to a 5.2 million dollar contract for 7 years, given Ryane Clowe 4.8 million for 5 years despite his history of concussions, or traded away Mike Richards and Jeff Carter and Sergei Bobrovsky and James Van Riemsdyk for Wayne Simmonds/Jakub Voracek/ the Schenn brothers and some picks.

In the end, Holland's really done a pretty good job.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Or I can join a forum and talk about it.

Which does nothing to try to convince those in power that the streak is "meaningless."

You can shout it here again and again, but until Holland et. al hears and agrees, the Wings' philosophy isn't going to change.

Ownership can think of several million reasons the streak means something. People act like Holland doesn't have a boss and makes every decision based on what he wants. It doesn't work that way.

[rick zombo 3,739]

He doesn't seem to have the same perspective and competitive nature that Nill, Scotty, Yzerman etc had.

Those games were close only via score, you're 100% right.

No one thought we were winning those games after the ice shifted in game 4 and really in game 5 it seemed like Boston was toying with us, playing just hard enough to win and move on.

How do you know this? All of a sudden, Holland not only sucks, but he's not "competitive"? Unreal.

Also, Bowman was a terrible GM who wanted to trade Yzerman for Yashin. Either you knew this and chose to ignore, or you're really not informed enough on the issue to have a credible option.

[marcaractac 3,962]

I like that Niskanen is tearing it up in the playoffs thus far. Pricing himself right out of Pittsburgh.

[kipwinger 8,518]

How do you know this? All of a sudden, Holland not only sucks, but he's not "competitive"? Unreal.

Also, Bowman was a terrible GM who wanted to trade Yzerman for Yashin. Either you knew this and chose to ignore, or you're really not informed enough on the issue to have a credible option.

Dang. Why so acrimonious man? Everything alright at home?

I like that Niskanen is tearing it up in the playoffs thus far. Pricing himself right out of Pittsburgh.

And probably right out of Kenny's price range as well. Not that we couldn't afford it mind you...

[rick zombo 3,739]

Well I certainly agree with the second half of your post. But I'm actually a Holland fan. That doesn't mean I don't think he makes mistakes from time to time, he does, but usually his mistakes don't end up crippling the team in any serious way. Think of all his big "mistakes" e.g. Sammy, Tootoo, Quincey, bringing Cleary back, and then think about other people's big mistakes and you immediately feel better. He could have signed David Clarkson to a 5.2 million dollar contract for 7 years, given Ryane Clowe 4.8 million for 5 years despite his history of concussions, or traded away Mike Richards and Jeff Carter and Sergei Bobrovsky and James Van Riemsdyk for Wayne Simmonds/Jakub Voracek/ the Schenn brothers and some picks.

In the end, Holland's really done a pretty good job.

No way bro. He sucks. He doesn't make exciting, ballsy, trades like Holmgren, and doesn't stack his team with truculent fighters like Burke, and has never had the lottery team to grab players like McKinnon, Crosby, Toews, Stamkos, etc.

Come on Holland!! How dare you not be incompetent enough to get us a first overall wellfare pick.

[amato 3,210]

I like that Niskanen is tearing it up in the playoffs thus far. Pricing himself right out of Pittsburgh.

my d-man off season wishlist right there.

he's had a breakout year, is good size, right handed, reletively young.... geterrdone kenny!

[rick zombo 3,739]

Dang. Why so acrimonious man? Everything alright at home?

And probably right out of Kenny's price range as well. Not that we couldn't afford it mind you...

Because I'm getting tired of logging on the LGWings and seeing people's negative opinions over and over and over. To the point where we're now making assumptions on Holland's mental and emotional disposition?

And I like coming here. So I don't plan on stopping. And I ignore lots of posts, but sometimes I just can't.

[marcaractac 3,962]

Dang. Why so acrimonious man? Everything alright at home?

And probably right out of Kenny's price range as well. Not that we couldn't afford it mind you...

I'm not so sure Kenny doesn't throw the bank at him. He threw the bank at Suter as well, he just chose to go to Minny. Holland will pony up the cash for the right player. Niskanen is the right player. He is EXACTLY what this team needs. Responsible in his own end, can move the puck, put up points, is young, and is a much, much needed righty. Holland will go after him hard. If he doesn't end up here, I do not think it will be because Holland was afraid to offer money.

my d-man off season wishlist right there.

he's had a breakout year, is good size, right handed, reletively young.... geterrdone kenny!

Agreed. Adding him, Then ridding Kindl and Lashoff makes the Wings D sooooo much better. Niskanen along with a reliable vet to play on the 3rd pairing fixes a lot of problems.

Most of the problems up front can be fixed just by cutting dead weight and getting more experience. I won't fret if all that is done up front is bringing Alfie back. It would give management time (if healthy) to see what the team is made of, and if they are good enough, missing pieces can be added at the deadline. Of course if the chance to land a guy like Moulson is there, Holland obviously shouldn't pass it up. I just don't think it would be the end of the world.

On top of that, give M-raz his chance to be the backup and I think we see a much improved team next season.

[kipwinger 8,518]

my d-man off season wishlist right there.

he's had a breakout year, is good size, right handed, reletively young.... geterrdone kenny!

I would be legitimately happy if Holland did nothing else but sign Niskanen and let all the obvious free agents walk. You can always fill needs at the deadline, but I'd be perfectly happy going into next season with...

Z-Dats-Abby

Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist

Tatar-Sheahan-Jurco

Miller-Helm-Glendening

Kronwall-Ericsson

Niskenen-Dekeyser

Smith-Quellet

Sproul/Marchenko

Edit: Obviously the means trading Andersson, Kindl, and Lashoff for whatever you can get (not roster players).

Edited April 29, 2014 by kipwinger