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Was Legwand worth it?


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#101 Dominator2005

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 05:55 PM

 
I don't believe he was the "face of the next generation" at all.  In order to be the face of the next generation, he has to be seen.  I recognize he was a prospect, but thats all he was is a prospect.  Maybe, just maybe an above average prospect.  We have other prospects that are more "the face of the next generation".  Players like Jurco, Tatar, Nyquist, Mrazek, and Mantha are players I would say are those next level prospects.


Half of players mentioned above were offered by Kenny for a trade. Jarnkrok was oir best C prospect... do some research on him. Trading for Legwand was a panic move. Kid never got a chance...

Those guys don't play center. We had too many centers already, he wouldn't have gotten a shot here. Look at legwand, career 2nd line center ended up on the fourth line as a wing.


Nyquist's natural position is C.
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#102 PredsFanTheBayouState

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 05:57 PM

Oh god I'm so sick of the Jarnkrok talk already

I'm so sick of hearing about shea weber trade talks,but i have to deal with it,because they aren't gonna go away



#103 lomekian

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 06:07 PM

If Legwand re-signs and gets used in a more appropriate manner by the coach its a good trade. If not we just about lost. 

We needed a centre...and there weren't any others moving. 

Much of the criticism or desire not to re-sign Legwand is on the assumption that Weiss will be back to 50+ points form next year, which is unlikely even if it does happen the year after. With Z's back playing up more often, a Centre who can contribute now is important, and the captain will be mostly playing wing from here on in I think. 

 

Of course this comes down to how important you think the playoff streak is & how high you rate Jarnkrok.

 

For me the streak is massively important

1) The money - even our first round exit essentially pays for Legwand's annual salary

2) Marketing prestige.  The longest current playoff streak is a big thing.

3) Player prestige. Added to the lure of Dats & Z, and the new pipeline of kids, the willingness of a GM to trade away prospects/picks to ensure that you make the playoffs sends a message to FAs and current players. We are totally committed to giving ourselves a shot at the playoffs EVERY year. Most teams will rely on geography, quality of life or current roster levels to attract players. The Wings are one of a very small selection who will take risks to make the playoffs. 

 

And of course, who knows what happens in the playoffs. Rask gets Howard Flu and Chara tweaks something and suddenly its a much more even series. Gotta buy a ticket etc.

 

Also, much as I like Jarnkrok, his value to us wasn't as great as we once thought. Another small playmaker in a team quite well stocked in 2 way playmakers, in a team desperate to get bigger, a desperation increased by the emergence of Tatar and Nyquist as two more small NHL quality forwards. I also think the leaps forward of AA & Janmark (gorgeous assist yesterday) made this trade more palatable. And if we draft a quality centerman this year or next, and Legwand re-signs Jarnkrok will have to get near his ceiling to make us really regret it.

 

Its like Adam Oates. He went on to have a great career. His departure freed up space for Feds, Primeau (who got us shanny) and Larianov. Indeed His demands for a raise at STL led to the merry go round that made Shanny possible.   We won 3 cups and he didn't....ultimately even the worst trade in wings history paved the way for the dynasty that followed. 


Edited by lomekian, 27 April 2014 - 06:17 PM.


#104 Dabura

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 06:36 PM

I don't believe he was the "face of the next generation" at all.  In order to be the face of the next generation, he has to be seen.  I recognize he was a prospect, but thats all he was is a prospect.  Maybe, just maybe an above average prospect.  We have other prospects that are more "the face of the next generation".  Players like Jurco, Tatar, Nyquist, Mrazek, and Mantha are players I would say are those next level prospects.

 

I'm not going to argue about this much more because I'm not saying anything especially controversial. Jarnkrok was (one of) our best prosect(s). It was universally understood, until he was traded. I met a scout once, he literally wouldn't shut up about the kid. Pierre McGuire made a point of gushing about him on, like, four separate occasions, all during national broadcasts. Every time someone would talk about our prospects, Jarnkrok's name would come up, and for very good reason. The kid's good. Damn good. Is it up for debate exactly where he truly ranked on The List? Sure. But then we're just nitpicking.

 

It's easy for us to say, "Well, whatever. I didn't think he was so special - and look at that, Kenny agreed with me." It's easy for us to say, "Well, I think all the prospects that didn't get traded to Nashville for David Legwand - those are the players I would say are the next level prospects." It's easy to say, "A prospect is a prospect, nothing more, nothing less. (Plus, he wasn't very good anyway.)" But, bottom line, we traded Calle Jarnkrok and a second-round pick for a rental because we had to Keep the Streak Alive, because playoff games = bonus revenue.

 

If you'd told me a year ago that we'd basically be flipping Jarnkrok for nothing, I would've laughed. If you'd told me Holland would cite a logjam at center as a major motivating factor, I would've laughed even harder, knowing full well that even with a thin group of centermen, Babcock probably would've put him on the wing anyway.

 

Like I said, if it had been, say, Dave Nonis trading Jarnkrok for Legwand, we would've had a field day with it.


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#105 DickieDunn

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 06:45 PM

 
I don't believe he was the "face of the next generation" at all.  In order to be the face of the next generation, he has to be seen.  I recognize he was a prospect, but thats all he was is a prospect.  Maybe, just maybe an above average prospect.  We have other prospects that are more "the face of the next generation".  Players like Jurco, Tatar, Nyquist, Mrazek, and Mantha are players I would say are those next level prospects.

Half of players mentioned above were offered by Kenny for a trade. Jarnkrok was oir best C prospect... do some research on him. Trading for Legwand was a panic move. Kid never got a chance...
Those guys don't play center. We had too many centers already, he wouldn't have gotten a shot here. Look at legwand, career 2nd line center ended up on the fourth line as a wing.

Nyquist's natural position is C.


As far as I know he's always been a winger.

Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#106 Dominator2005

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 07:28 PM

http://forecaster.th...player.php?6842

FYI Dickie
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#107 Internet.Unknown

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 09:24 PM

Some people just like to *****. Some love repeating "I told you so." A lot do both.

 

Yep, Jarnkrok could turn out to be a stud. He could also fizzle out like a lot of other prospects. Most likely he'll end up somewhere in the middle. But to proclaim this deal the equivalent to the Tigers' John Smoltz for Doyle Alexander trade is rashly premature (even though the Tigers got exactly what they wanted in that deal).

 

The fact is, Holland WAS desperate, but justifiably so. He, the rest of management, the ownership, and the players wanted to keep the playoff streak alive. So when Helm went down with yet another injury, the Wings' top center was Joakim Andersson. Talk about something to ***** about! A move for a veteran center HAD to be made at the deadline. Holland didn't have a choice. Season ticket holders, the media, the fans, and all the sweating, keyboard-pounding know-it-alls would have torched the Joe had the Wings iced Andersson as the 1C for the rest of the season. "Why didn't Holland make a deal at the deadline? He could have traded Kindl for a number one center! Instead he kicked my dog!" Moreover, every other GM in the league knew it. So when Holland called, they played hardball, and the Wings had to make their best offer, even though it stings.

 

The Wings still have Nyquist, Tatar, Jurco, Mantha, Oullette, Marchenko, Mrazek, and others whose names I can't remember/spell in the system. If half of these players turn out half as good as many suggest, the Wings will be winning the Cup soon and often. The future can't be that bleak after losing one of their prospects in a trade.


Edited by Internet.Unknown, 27 April 2014 - 09:26 PM.


#108 lomekian

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Posted 28 April 2014 - 05:50 AM

Some people just like to *****. Some love repeating "I told you so." A lot do both.

 

Yep, Jarnkrok could turn out to be a stud. He could also fizzle out like a lot of other prospects. Most likely he'll end up somewhere in the middle. But to proclaim this deal the equivalent to the Tigers' John Smoltz for Doyle Alexander trade is rashly premature (even though the Tigers got exactly what they wanted in that deal).

 

The fact is, Holland WAS desperate, but justifiably so. He, the rest of management, the ownership, and the players wanted to keep the playoff streak alive. So when Helm went down with yet another injury, the Wings' top center was Joakim Andersson. Talk about something to ***** about! A move for a veteran center HAD to be made at the deadline. Holland didn't have a choice. Season ticket holders, the media, the fans, and all the sweating, keyboard-pounding know-it-alls would have torched the Joe had the Wings iced Andersson as the 1C for the rest of the season. "Why didn't Holland make a deal at the deadline? He could have traded Kindl for a number one center! Instead he kicked my dog!" Moreover, every other GM in the league knew it. So when Holland called, they played hardball, and the Wings had to make their best offer, even though it stings.

 

The Wings still have Nyquist, Tatar, Jurco, Mantha, Oullette, Marchenko, Mrazek, and others whose names I can't remember/spell in the system. If half of these players turn out half as good as many suggest, the Wings will be winning the Cup soon and often. The future can't be that bleak after losing one of their prospects in a trade.

 

No to mention the Wings have Dats, Zetterburg, Weiss, Helm and at this rate possibly Legwand signed up for at least 2 years and in most cases more, With sheahan, athanaseau & Janmark in the pipeline. The team's need for a centre at the deadline is greater than their need over the next two years, which was Jarnkrok's window to make the team.  The very fact that people are ambivalent about re-signing a proven veteran 40-55 point centre from the local area, suggest that CJ would have had a struggle to get much time going forwards without a sudden explosion in output.



#109 LeftWinger

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Posted 28 April 2014 - 05:58 AM

I remember when Brendan Smith was our #1 prospect...and Johnathan Ericsson. Sure glad we didn't trade neither if those guys for something we desperately needed...they'd be tearing up the league somewhere else instead of tearing up the league here....oh....nevermind.


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#110 hillbillywingsfan

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Posted 28 April 2014 - 08:16 AM

 

u

o

 

Nashville is not that far away from icing a dangerous team, their goaltending and D is set they'll get a very good offensive forward in this draft and some young players are on their way.

Yeah but stop and think how many times Nashville has been not so far away from icing a dangerous team only to have the owners get cheap and never want to pay the players that have came through Nashville any money and they get traded. It's funny to watching aroundn the league and see how many players have went through nashville. hahaha My dad likes to always point out the players that have played on Nashville. 


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#111 Nightfall

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Posted 28 April 2014 - 10:34 AM

 

If you'd told me a year ago that we'd basically be flipping Jarnkrok for nothing, I would've laughed. If you'd told me Holland would cite a logjam at center as a major motivating factor, I would've laughed even harder, knowing full well that even with a thin group of centermen, Babcock probably would've put him on the wing anyway.

 

Like I said, if it had been, say, Dave Nonis trading Jarnkrok for Legwand, we would've had a field day with it.

 

Right now, Jarnkrok is just a prospect and he did look good in 12 games with Nashville.  To call this trade a success or failure will be judged in a few years.  Either you have faith that he will be a guaranteed stud, or you think he will be somewhere in the middle, or you don't believe he will be good at all.  Right now, I believe that some Wings fans are going over the top by saying he is a future star in the league.  I don't know what his future is going to be so I won't speculate.

 

I will agree with you on this point.  If they don't retain Legwand, then it really was flipping him for nothing in which case I will be disappointed.  If Legwand signs, then it was a worthwhile trade.

 

BTW, who listens to what Pierre Mcguire has to say anyway?  When Mcguire gushes about anyone, it usually gets a lot of scorn from Wings fans.  ;)


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#112 rick zombo

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Posted 28 April 2014 - 10:41 AM

In 7 years, when the streak has reached 30, and Jarnkrok is back in Sweeden, we'll all look back fondly on this trade :w00t:


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#113 kipwinger

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Posted 28 April 2014 - 11:27 AM

I've heard that that David Legwand has an extensive knowledge of wines and is quite the conversationalist.  TOTALLY worth it!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wait, we're talking about dating him right?  If not, then no, no he wasn't.


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Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

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#114 Wheelchairsuperhero

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Posted 29 April 2014 - 03:31 PM

I came to terms with the deal and accepted it shortly after it happened, but if he doesn't resign I'm going to say no, and we should've just called up Jarnkrok. I say this because in another thread it makes it sound like he won't be resigned.

#115 martinezsvsu

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Posted 29 April 2014 - 04:27 PM

hopefully we sign malykhin to replace calle



#116 joshy207

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Posted 29 April 2014 - 05:18 PM

I think Legwand was worth it at the time--you can't go into a stretch of games with Joakim Andersson as your #1 C, and he did play well for the first few games--but he ended up being a disappointment.



#117 Datsyukian-Deke

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 07:15 PM

Was Legwand worth it? Is this one of those rhetorical questions that no one can answer like if a branch breaks in the woods with no one around does it make a sound, or where does Franzen's game go for 20 game stretches at a time?

#118 Shaman

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 01:06 AM

Was Legwand worth it? Is this one of those rhetorical questions that no one can answer like if a branch breaks in the woods with no one around does it make a sound, or where does Franzen's game go for 20 game stretches at a time?

 

We know where he goes... He has a pillow fort in the dressing room.... 

 

I imagine it to be a lot like this:

 

archer-im-sorry-your-authority-is-not-re


Edited by Shaman, 01 May 2014 - 01:06 AM.

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#119 BBD10

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 09:44 AM

Legwand didnt help us get into the playoffs.  He made no difference and if anything, costed us the production of someone else who may have contributed a goal or 2 once in a while. 

 

If you asked me at the deadline if we would give up just the 2nd round pick or just Jankrok I would have laughed.  Holland made this trade so he wouldnt be the GM who ended the playoff streak.  We got as fleeced as the Caps did when they traded Forsberg to the Preds for Erat.  Erat had like 1 goal all season lol and they dished him.



#120 wings4thecup06

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 10:46 AM

Legwand didnt help us get into the playoffs.  He made no difference and if anything, costed us the production of someone else who may have contributed a goal or 2 once in a while. 

 

If you asked me at the deadline if we would give up just the 2nd round pick or just Jankrok I would have laughed.  Holland made this trade so he wouldnt be the GM who ended the playoff streak.  We got as fleeced as the Caps did when they traded Forsberg to the Preds for Erat.  Erat had like 1 goal all season lol and they dished him.

 

That's not exactly true. Erat was not and never has been considered a two way forward IMO (correct me if I'm wrong) and he's to be relied on as an offensive minded guy. The reason the Caps got fleeced was not only because Forsberg is a top prospect (and by that I mean if you added him to any team he would be right up there if not at the top of most teams prospects) and the fact that Erat has scored a grand total of 8 goals in the last 2 seasons. 

 

Legwand is a trademark 2 way forward who can chip in offensively at times but is strong and responsible on the back end. While I don't think it was a great trade by any means, it was necessary, and I feel he helped get this team in. At the very least, it sent a message to the guys in the locker room - almost if to say - 'here's some help, now get it done'


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