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Myers close to become a wing?


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#161 jimmyemeryhunter

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Posted 11 December 2014 - 05:22 PM

I wish this one would die... especially after reading this:
 
http://www.thehockey...on-tyler-myers/

"And this is where things get interesting. Im told the asking price from the Sabres for Myers is prospect Dylan Larkin, a roster player along the lines of a Riley Sheahan or Tomas Jurco, and a first-round pick. That seems like an awful lot for an underachieving player who still has five years on his deal with a cap hit of $5.5 million per season."
 
:huh: Seriously? Larkin, Sheahan/Jurco AND a 1st? No thanks.
 

Yeah EFF that.

#162 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 12:10 AM

Ya I wouldn't give up those guys but the wings do have a lot of forwards coming up and from what I read a while back buffalo was stacked on defense in there prospect system

id do something like pulkkinen athanasiou a 2016 1st for myers ... Think that's more than fair considering he's underachieving and has 5+ longterm ... Even throw in Andersson for the fun of it

And we still have mantha larkin bertuzzi natasiuk janmark frk and a few others with some potential

And of course Tatar nyquist sheahan jurco glendening for the future

And I don't know our cap space so we might have to include kindl somehow in that deal or with someone else

Edited by nyqvististhefuture, 12 December 2014 - 12:11 AM.


#163 jimmyemeryhunter

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 12:17 AM

Ya I wouldn't give up those guys but the wings do have a lot of forwards coming up and from what I read a while back buffalo was stacked on defense in there prospect system

id do something like pulkkinen athanasiou a 2016 1st for myers ... Think that's more than fair considering he's underachieving and has 5+ longterm ... Even throw in Andersson for the fun of it

And we still have mantha larkin bertuzzi natasiuk janmark frk and a few others with some potential

And of course Tatar nyquist sheahan jurco glendening for the future

And I don't know our cap space so we might have to include kindl somehow in that deal or with someone else

I wouldn't give up athanasiou.
Dudes a beast and could potentially be a top 6 center, which as you know, we are going to need.
I know you have to give to get, but I just don't think its worth it.
Myers is good

But he's not going to take us over the top.

Edited by jimmyemeryhunter, 12 December 2014 - 12:18 AM.


#164 krsmith17

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 06:46 AM

^ This ^

 

I wouldn't give up Athanasiou straight up for Myers, let alone the other pieces. Andreas should absolutely be in our future plans, he has a combination of size, speed, skill and hands that is very hard to come by. You don't give up that type of player for a project defenseman like Myers.



#165 Jesusberg

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 11:29 AM

My worry is that Holland sees this year's team as a contender, and is going to try to land a high-end defender by overpaying. Generally, it's a good idea if you've got a shot at the cup. If that means one of two of the defensive prospects, then sure... but I hope he steers clear of the forwards for the most part. I haven't watched as much of the Griffins as I would have liked this season, but I've heard/seen tons of people raving about AA. To be honest, I'm more worried about moving someone like Tatar, Jurco or Mantha. I really want those wingers to stick around.

The thing is, I do think ONE of our prospect centers should be made available for the right deal. I'm not saying they should just move one for a rental, and I definitely don't think Myers is the right deal. The thing is, Sheahan has exceeded my expectations in terms of the offensive potential he's shown this season. If we've got Sheahan, Larkin and AA as potential top 6 centers, combined with the remaining years of Z, Weiss and perhaps Helm... I would be fine with moving one for a significant upgrade on the blueline. When you look at the whole picture and factor in the years of overlap with the vets and younger players, I actually think we could be in good shape up the middle.


Edited by Jesusberg, 12 December 2014 - 11:30 AM.


#166 arag

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 11:51 AM

Myers and Yandle and the Lord Stanley Cup is ours.

#167 jimmyemeryhunter

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 01:48 PM

My worry is that Holland sees this year's team as a contender, and is going to try to land a high-end defender by overpaying. Generally, it's a good idea if you've got a shot at the cup. If that means one of two of the defensive prospects, then sure... but I hope he steers clear of the forwards for the most part. I haven't watched as much of the Griffins as I would have liked this season, but I've heard/seen tons of people raving about AA. To be honest, I'm more worried about moving someone like Tatar, Jurco or Mantha. I really want those wingers to stick around.

The thing is, I do think ONE of our prospect centers should be made available for the right deal. I'm not saying they should just move one for a rental, and I definitely don't think Myers is the right deal. The thing is, Sheahan has exceeded my expectations in terms of the offensive potential he's shown this season. If we've got Sheahan, Larkin and AA as potential top 6 centers, combined with the remaining years of Z, Weiss and perhaps Helm... I would be fine with moving one for a significant upgrade on the blueline. When you look at the whole picture and factor in the years of overlap with the vets and younger players, I actually think we could be in good shape up the middle.

Yea, we definitely could be...
But if larkin stays at um for lets say three years, Pavels contract will then be up.
Helms health is a concern, as is Weiss', yeah we have some prospects looking good for the future but I don't expect them to pan out as much as our current crop of kids did.
Not because I don'thave faith in the org. Just that id rather have more chances at one of them surpassing expectations.

Aa has the skill and speed to be great, I've been super high on him for awhile now, actually found lgw looking for people talking about him.


Yeah we have great depth now at c, but Pavel and z are getting up there, and id love to remain deep there in the future.

#168 Jesusberg

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 02:41 PM

Yea, we definitely could be...
But if larkin stays at um for lets say three years, Pavels contract will then be up.
Helms health is a concern, as is Weiss', yeah we have some prospects looking good for the future but I don't expect them to pan out as much as our current crop of kids did.
Not because I don'thave faith in the org.Just that id rather have more chances at one of them surpassing expectations.

Aa has the skill and speed to be great, I've been super high on him for awhile now, actually found lgw looking for people talking about him.


Yeah we have great depth now at c, but Pavel and z are getting up there, and id love to remain deep there in the future.

Believe me, I have this in mind as well. I'm very tentative when it comes to moving assets. I think running Sheahan-Larkin-Athanasiou-Glendening down the middle, in the future, would be excellent. However, I'm kind of viewing it in a similar way that I look at the defense. I really think that Detroit is going to hang on to Kronwall, Ericsson, DeKeyser and Smith (assuming nothing goes wrong in terms of health, etc.), leaving two/three spots for Ouellet, Sproul, Backman, Marchenko and Jensen. It's great to have that wealth, but something has to give there.

Center isn't as deep, obviously, but I still think that at least one of Zetterberg, Weiss and/or Helm will be around. There are more health issues with these guys than the aforementioned defensemen. Again, I'm not advocating moving a guy for the sake of getting a slight upgrade on the back end - it would have to be someone who was a big boost to the offense from the blueline. Basically, it comes down to me thinking that Riley has taken a big step forward, and having more comfort with the possibility of moving a center in a package deal. I'd be more at ease losing AA in a deal than I would Tatar, Jurco or Mantha.


Edited by Jesusberg, 12 December 2014 - 02:43 PM.


#169 jimmyemeryhunter

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 03:12 PM

Believe me, I have this in mind as well. I'm very tentative when it comes to moving assets. I think running Sheahan-Larkin-Athanasiou-Glendening down the middle, in the future, would be excellent. However, I'm kind of viewing it in a similar way that I look at the defense. I really think that Detroit is going to hang on to Kronwall, Ericsson, DeKeyser and Smith (assuming nothing goes wrong in terms of health, etc.), leaving two/three spots for Ouellet, Sproul, Backman, Marchenko and Jensen. It's great to have that wealth, but something has to give there.

Center isn't as deep, obviously, but I still think that at least one of Zetterberg, Weiss and/or Helm will be around. There are more health issues with these guys than the aforementioned defensemen. Again, I'm not advocating moving a guy for the sake of getting a slight upgrade on the back end - it would have to be someone who was a big boost to the offense from the blueline. Basically, it comes down to me thinking that Riley has taken a big step forward, and having more comfort with the possibility of moving a center in a package deal. I'd be more at ease losing AA in a deal than I would Tatar, Jurco or Mantha.

I know you're not trying to say trade them away for nothing.
But z is a better option at wing, and Weiss and helm have shown they can play wing well.
Not to mention that as they get older in age playing them on the wing is less wear and tear on them.
I know were not going to have space for everyone, but if the kids keep progressing in the top six, imagine a few years down the line having z on the third line wing.

Its all moot anyway.
Aas value isn't high enough yet to get what he'all be worth.

Edited by jimmyemeryhunter, 12 December 2014 - 03:12 PM.


#170 DickieDunn

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 07:21 PM

I would trade anyone doe the right deal. A risk isn't the right deal though, and Myers is a risk. He could turn into a stud after a trade like Chara and Pronged, or he could continue to play like a deer caught in the headlights and miss 20% of each season, or he could just settle into being a decent second pair D.

Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#171 DSM

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 08:11 PM

The only way I'm sending that kings ransom to Buffalo for a RH Dman, is if it's part of a three way deal sending Shea Weber to Detroit.... and they're retaining half his salary.

It would be one thing if Myers had a consistent and healthy history on his NHL resume. However, his full potential is still a huge question mark. Plus, if he doesn't become atleast a #1-3 Dman, he'll have an Albatross of Andrew McDonald proportions for a contract.

Speaking of Andy McDonald, I'll bet Tim Murray's asking price to Holland is so high because Philly already has their first rounder, Matt Read AND Sean Couturier on the table waiting for the green light....

Edited by DSM, 12 December 2014 - 08:13 PM.


#172 Jesusberg

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 11:00 PM

Athanasiou: "Hey guys, come check out this post on LGW. What's a Jesusberg? Either way, this guy said I should be made available for trade. I'm gonna go score a couple goals and maybe add an assist... make him look stupid."



#173 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 12 December 2014 - 11:27 PM

I would trade anyone doe the right deal. A risk isn't the right deal though, and Myers is a risk. He could turn into a stud after a trade like Chara and Pronged, or he could continue to play like a deer caught in the headlights and miss 20% of each season, or he could just settle into being a decent second pair D.

Think we need to take notice that he's playing on a disaster team like buffalo for years and there's no doubt about it if he came to detroit he would be a ton better and would log a ton of ice time

And I think myers coming here might give Babcock another reason to stay

About the forward prospects , with Tatar nyquist sheahan jurco already here and mantha and larkin being as much as untouchable as you can get along with role players you need and I'd keep such as bertuzzi and natasiuk , as well as veteran players , something's gotta give

Pulkkinen I think will be used in a trade to get a key piece and if it takes adding athanasiou I'd do it

We also have janmark who's a center and turgeon and other guys with potential(holmstrom etc..) were stacked

Edited by nyqvististhefuture, 12 December 2014 - 11:29 PM.


#174 krsmith17

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Posted 13 December 2014 - 06:52 AM

Yes, we are "stacked" at the forward position but I think you're willing to trade the wrong guys. I get that they have more value to other teams right now but they're still nowhere near the true value that they hold. Athanasiou is a stud and there is no way I just "throw him in" a deal at this stage of his career for a project player. And I certainly don't want to trade away some of these guys just because we can... My biggest issue with trading any of these young "unproven" guys is that you're never going to get full value in a trade, that's why I love how hesitant Holland is in trading prospects, and how set he is on building through the draft. Guy knows what he's doing, plain and simple. To be honest, I'd much prefer trade a roster player that is a known commodity and has more value to most teams right now, than to trade a guy with as much untapped potential as Athanasiou or Pulkkinen.

 

Like I said before I'm not one of the people that are saying "stay away from Myers" nor am I one of the people saying "trade for him NOW, we need HIM". I think he may be a decent fit with the Wings and grow into somewhat of the player he showed prior to being drafted and in his rookie year. But the most I would be willing to give up for such a project would be a couple middling prospects and a pick, none of our top end guys.



#175 DickieDunn

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Posted 13 December 2014 - 12:10 PM

Think we need to take notice that he's playing on a disaster team like buffalo for years and there's no doubt about it if he came to detroit he would be a ton better and would log a ton of ice time

And I think myers coming here might give Babcock another reason to stay

About the forward prospects , with Tatar nyquist sheahan jurco already here and mantha and larkin being as much as untouchable as you can get along with role players you need and I'd keep such as bertuzzi and natasiuk , as well as veteran players , something's gotta give

Pulkkinen I think will be used in a trade to get a key piece and if it takes adding athanasiou I'd do it

We also have janmark who's a center and turgeon and other guys with potential(holmstrom etc..) were stacked

 

There's plenty of doubt.  Sometimes a player has a good start of a career then falls off the map.  Sometimes a good young player gets his confidence crushed and never recovers.  Sometimes when a payer missed 20% of his games for 3 straight years it signifies that he will continue to be hurt frequently and that the constant injuries wear him down so he never reaches his potential.   All of those possibilities apply to Myers.


Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#176 Bannedforlife

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Posted 13 December 2014 - 05:41 PM

There was an article on THN today that claims Murray has acknowledged that his asking prices have been too high.







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