Red Wings Target Mike Green

[Datsyukian-Deke 722]

What did Garrison go for? I'd start with a package that was just a little better than that and work my way up.

2nd rounder. But Tampa also got back the rights to a player and Vancouvers 7th rounder.

[LeftWinger 4,951]

The 4th into a 2nd doesn't sound too bad if he re-signs. Although I sure would like to maybe add a player instead of that conditional pick...going to be a deep draft and having a 1st and 2nd next year will be like gold.

Dats-Deke...that's not too bad for Garrison, wonder if they would take our 4th, Ferraro and the rights to Almqvist...

Edited July 9, 2014 by LeftWinger

[Datsyukian-Deke 722]

The 4th into a 2nd doesn't sound too bad if he re-signs. Although I sure would like to maybe add a player instead of that conditional pick...going to be a deep draft and having a 1st and 2nd next year will be like gold.

Dats-Deke...that's not too bad for Garrison, wonder if they would take our 4th, Ferraro and the rights to Almqvist...

With Garrison being a lefty I'm sure Holland didn't give him a second look.

[LeftWinger 4,951]

No, I meant if Washington would take Ferraro, 4th and Almqvists rights for Green...sorry for the confusion there.

[kipwinger 8,521]

I definitely don't think that Garrison is as good as Green, and Garrison is under contract, but the two scenarios would be similar in that they're both cap dumps of offensive defensemen in the 30-40 pts. range. So starting with something similar is not a bad idea. If Garrison was worth a second then Detroit should probably start with a 2nd plus a little more and go from there. All this talk about starting with Tatar or Jurco is nuts.

[chances14 227]

Dabura, how many times does it need to be said that Green could very well be a rental?... Why would you give up any promising assets for a guy that could bolt after this season? No way, any of our top prospects should be involved in a trade to get Green.

if i was holland, i would make it part of the trade where green agrees to resign

No, I meant if Washington would take Ferraro, 4th and Almqvists rights for Green...sorry for the confusion there.

that's not going to get it done. the fact that red wings are even suggesting that shows they haven't learned anything the last few years. You're not going to give other teams your trash for their treasure.

this is all goes back to the issue we all have with holland. He needs to either gamble and make a run for the cup while zetterberg and datsyuk are still elite players or do a complete rebuild. This retooling on the fly stuff is not going to work

[LeftWinger 4,951]

Chances14 - I think the idea is if Garrison went for a salary dump and only garnered a 2nd, 7th rights to a player, then Washington's salary dump could get similar. I honestly think Ferraro and Almqvist's rights are worth more than the 7th and the rights Tampa acquired. The only sticking point is the 2nd. I would prefer a 4th, as long as its not our 1st. BTW, Niskanen and Orpik are Washington's jewels now, Green is expendable and basically a salary they need to shed. In most NORMAL salary dumps, you accept some depth players and picks, since you really don't want to trade salary for salary. Notice I said most NORMAL, we are after all, dealing with Ken Holland here and he has been known to overpay....from time to time!

[dirtydangles 1,328]

I was thinking about it and there IS incentive for the caps to trade green now - they could potentially lose him for nothing next offseasoon and its not like he makes them a legit contender. Makes sense to cash in now when they get more value. This isn't the case for Buffalo and Myers.

[Dabura 12,207]

Good piece by J.J. @ WIIM:

Mike Green is an Attractive, Expensive Risk

[Guest Playmaker]

ownership won't

If not making the playoffs for a few years, guaranteed being a contender, I think fans and management would go for it. But ask Edmonton, Calgary, Buffalo, NYI, Florida, etc, how easy it is to turn it around. All the high draft picks in the world doesn't guarantee a contending team. It could take a decade or more to turn it around if you start dumping players and create a losing atmosphere. You also have to have the good fortune to win the draft lottery, have a potential franchise player being in the draft the year you are picking and have an elite scouting staff to recognize those players. Fans act like oh, we should just miss the playoffs for a year or two, and pick up a few superstars in the draft, and voila, we'll be Stanley Cup Champions in a season or two.

[Motown4013 350]

If it's truly a salary dump, then Ferraro and a pick should do it...no higher than a 4th though, not in this deep draft. If they are going to be allowed to rape us (as per Gary Bettman) then I say screw it, no deal. LIke I said, I really don't want to give up any prospect, but if Ferraro gets it done...that would suck for him though, I know he knows its a business, but it sucks to put your time in and then get traded...but then again, if he gets to the NHL with Washington, there is definitely no room for him here this year,plus being out of exemptions... Mike Green better turn out what we need and he better re-sign. You think we could throw #kfq in for good measure?

I'm not sure how we started with Nyquist, Tats or Jurco was probably the asking price and now they may take Ferraro and a fourth should do it. Although Greens value has declined sharply over the last few years, I think he's worth more than a fourth rounder and LF who has very little NHL potential other than a fourth line guy. I would be thrilled if this happened but I think they would want more than that. As I said in my first post, I think the attraction it works for both clubs- salary cap for Caps and a legit acquisition for Detroit.....but I think getting getting Derek. Morris or Sami. Salo would cost us. Ferraro and a fourth! Just sayin'

[chances14 227]

Chances14 - I think the idea is if Garrison went for a salary dump and only garnered a 2nd, 7th rights to a player, then Washington's salary dump could get similar. I honestly think Ferraro and Almqvist's rights are worth more than the 7th and the rights Tampa acquired. The only sticking point is the 2nd. I would prefer a 4th, as long as its not our 1st. BTW, Niskanen and Orpik are Washington's jewels now, Green is expendable and basically a salary they need to shed. In most NORMAL salary dumps, you accept some depth players and picks, since you really don't want to trade salary for salary. Notice I said most NORMAL, we are after all, dealing with Ken Holland here and he has been known to overpay....from time to time!

I don't think green is going to be a salary dump. The caps could fit him in and still have enough space to fill out their roster for the upcoming season. Plus, everyone knows that right handed defensman are highly coveted around the league right now. The only thing holland has going for him is that he's only got one year left on his deal, which might bring the price down a little, depending on how many teams are trying to get him

I don't know how highly you think of Ferraro but i consider him a dime a dozen player. getting the rights to almqvist, a player whom may never play in the nhl again is pretty much worthless in my eyes. the best piece in that hypothetical trade is the draft pick, which isn't saying much. I would consider that trade a slap in the face if i was washington's gm

if holland wants to make a run for the cup he needs to man up and stop trying to lowball other gm's to get good players. you got to give to get

[LeftWinger 4,951]

Holland isn't making a run at the Cup...that is the reason no quality UFA even considered Detroit. Holland is looking to fill holes and bits and pieces to keep competitive and keep the playoff streak alive...

[Jesusberg 1,256]

Not to say it kills the rumor, but Trotz says Green factors into his plans for the Caps. Doesn't end the speculation, but unless Detroit makes them a realgud offer...

http://www.csnwashington.com/hockey-washington-capitals/talk/barry-trotz-mike-green-part-plan-capitals

[amato 3,210]

Good piece by J.J. @ WIIM:

Mike Green is an Attractive, Expensive Risk

Good article, thanks for sharing. Really backs up the whole green still being in their plans thing. If I'm the caps, I don't trade him to the wings without getting at least Tatar back.. but I'm not the caps so maybe Holland can get a deal done without giving up one of "the untouchables."

[wings87 1,290]

I love when people start differentiating between us real and us fake fans... I'd never be able to tell us apart....

You have to look really close, the "non-real" fans have a birthmark of Crosby on their ass.

[Euro_Twins 4,475]

You have to look really close, the "non-real" fans have a birthmark of Crosby on their ass.

that's what that is, I always wondered what that birthmark was

[TheXym 2,606]

And for the record, I'd take Red Green for comedic relief on the 4th line.

At least you know he'd keep his stick on the ice.

[Seraph 240]

I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.

[chances14 227]

I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.

yup. people want holland to make moves but don't want to give anything up. that's not how trades involving good players work. You can't trade your trash and expect to get something good back. this isn't a video game

holland has built up a logjam of good prospects. there's not going to be room for them all down the road. might as well move some of them now to try to make a cup run while the window is still open

Edited July 10, 2014 by chances14

[kipwinger 8,521]

I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.

I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable. But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts. Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks.

[Euro_Twins 4,475]

I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable. But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts. Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks.

What should Tatar or jurco be traded for? Stamkos? Trading Tatar for a guy like green makes sense and is a fair trade, like it or not.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.

I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable. But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts. Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks.

A top 4 D isn't peanuts. Fans have a highly inflated value of the Wings' prospects and young players. Tatar is a good young scoring winger, more like Kozlov than Datsyuk. Mantha hasn't played a game of pro hockey but people are acting like he's Brendan Shanahan part 2.

[krsmith17 7,191]

You don't GIVE away your top prospects, no matter how they may or may not turn out, for a top 4 defenseman that will more than likely be a one year rental. I wasn't a huge fan of the Legwand trade, but the reasons for that have been beaten to death for months, whether justifiable or not, there was a reason we gave up promising prospect, Calle Jarnkrok. I don't think we are nearly as desperate for Green as we were for Legwand at the time. Maybe if by November, Lashoff and Kindl are our top pair, we would be forced to trade a top end talent for a rental such as Green, but as we currently sit, I don't see that happening.

[e_prime 1,936]

I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable. But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts. Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks.

What a lot of arguing about trades and such comes down to is that:

Everyone has different ideas about what young guys are untouchable and which ones are.

On top of that, each of them are valued in different ways by different fans. Sometimes they are very over-valued and sometimes very under-valued.

Additionally, sample size of performance with younger guys makes the valuing of these guys even more difficult, especially by armchair GMs like ourselves.

As for peanuts, I prefer lightly salted, dry roasted. Yum.