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Red Wings Target Mike Green


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#161 Motown4013

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 05:33 PM

If it's truly a salary dump, then Ferraro and a pick should do it...no higher than a 4th though, not in this deep draft.  If they are going to be allowed to rape us (as per Gary Bettman) then I say screw it, no deal.  LIke I said, I really don't want to give up any prospect, but if Ferraro gets it done...that would suck for him though, I know he knows its a business, but it sucks to put your time in and then get traded...but then again, if he gets to the NHL with Washington, there is definitely no room for him here this year,plus being out of exemptions... Mike Green better turn out what we need and he better re-sign.  You think we could throw #kfq in for good measure? :lol:


I'm not sure how we started with Nyquist, Tats or Jurco was probably the asking price and now they may take Ferraro and a fourth should do it. Although Greens value has declined sharply over the last few years, I think he's worth more than a fourth rounder and LF who has very little NHL potential other than a fourth line guy. I would be thrilled if this happened but I think they would want more than that. As I said in my first post, I think the attraction it works for both clubs- salary cap for Caps and a legit acquisition for Detroit.....but I think getting getting Derek. Morris or Sami. Salo would cost us. Ferraro and a fourth! Just sayin'
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#162 chances14

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 06:17 PM

Chances14 - I think the idea is if Garrison went for a salary dump and only garnered a 2nd, 7th rights to a player, then Washington's salary dump could get similar.  I honestly think Ferraro and Almqvist's rights are worth more than the 7th and the rights Tampa acquired.  The only sticking point is the 2nd.  I would prefer a 4th, as long as its not our 1st.  BTW, Niskanen and Orpik are Washington's jewels now, Green is expendable and basically a salary they need to shed.  In most NORMAL salary dumps, you accept some depth players and picks, since you really don't want to trade salary for salary.  Notice I said most NORMAL, we are after all, dealing with Ken Holland here and he has been known to overpay....from time to time!

I don't think green is going to be a salary dump. The caps could fit him in and still have enough space to fill out their roster for the upcoming season. Plus, everyone knows that right handed defensman are highly coveted around the league right now. The only thing holland has going for him is that he's only got one year left on his deal, which might bring the price down a little, depending on how many teams are trying to get him

 

I don't know how highly you think of Ferraro but i consider him a dime a dozen player. getting the rights to almqvist, a player whom may never play in the nhl again is pretty much worthless in my eyes. the best piece in that hypothetical trade is the draft pick, which isn't saying much. I would consider that trade a slap in the face if i was washington's gm

 

if holland wants to make a run for the cup he needs to man up and stop trying to lowball other gm's to get good players. you got to give to get



#163 LeftWinger

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 07:20 PM

Holland isn't making a run at the Cup...that is the reason no quality UFA even considered Detroit.  Holland is looking to fill holes and bits and pieces to keep competitive and keep the playoff streak alive...


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#164 Jesusberg

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 07:23 PM

Not to say it kills the rumor, but Trotz says Green factors into his plans for the Caps. Doesn't end the speculation, but unless Detroit makes them a realgud offer...

http://www.csnwashin...t-plan-capitals



#165 amato

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 07:38 PM

Good piece by J.J. @ WIIM:
 
Mike Green is an Attractive, Expensive Risk



Good article, thanks for sharing. Really backs up the whole green still being in their plans thing. If I'm the caps, I don't trade him to the wings without getting at least Tatar back.. but I'm not the caps so maybe Holland can get a deal done without giving up one of "the untouchables."

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#166 wings87

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 08:03 PM

 
I love when people start differentiating between us real and us fake fans...  I'd never be able to tell us apart....

You have to look really close, the "non-real" fans have a birthmark of Crosby on their ass.

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#167 Euro_Twins

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 08:05 PM

You have to look really close, the "non-real" fans have a birthmark of Crosby on their ass.

 

that's what that is, I always wondered what that birthmark was



#168 TheXym

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 09:19 PM

 
And for the record, I'd take Red Green for comedic relief on the 4th line.


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#169 Seraph

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 09:34 PM

I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.


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#170 chances14

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:11 PM

I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.

yup. people want holland to make moves but don't want to give anything up. that's not how trades involving good players work. You can't trade your trash and expect to get something good back. this isn't a video game

 

holland has built up a logjam of good prospects. there's not going to be room for them all down the road. might as well move some of them now to try to make a cup run while the window is still open


Edited by chances14, 09 July 2014 - 10:12 PM.


#171 kipwinger

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:20 PM

I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.

 

I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable.  But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts.  Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks. 


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#172 Euro_Twins

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 05:17 AM

 
I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable.  But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts.  Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks. 


What should Tatar or jurco be traded for? Stamkos? Trading Tatar for a guy like green makes sense and is a fair trade, like it or not.

#173 DickieDunn

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 05:55 AM


I think it's kind of funny that we have one thread blasting Holland for his lack of moves and "we like our team" mentality, and here we have everyone making a commotion about how they couldn't bear to see us lose ANY of our up and coming young players in an actual move.


 
I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable.  But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts.  Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks. 


A top 4 D isn't peanuts. Fans have a highly inflated value of the Wings' prospects and young players. Tatar is a good young scoring winger, more like Kozlov than Datsyuk. Mantha hasn't played a game of pro hockey but people are acting like he's Brendan Shanahan part 2.

Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#174 krsmith17

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 06:34 AM

You don't GIVE away your top prospects, no matter how they may or may not turn out, for a top 4 defenseman that will more than likely be a one year rental. I wasn't a huge fan of the Legwand trade, but the reasons for that have been beaten to death for months, whether justifiable or not, there was a reason we gave up promising prospect, Calle Jarnkrok. I don't think we are nearly as desperate for Green as we were for Legwand at the time. Maybe if by November, Lashoff and Kindl are our top pair, we would be forced to trade a top end talent for a rental such as Green, but as we currently sit, I don't see that happening.



#175 e_prime

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:03 AM

 

I don't think anybody is saying that all the young guys are untouchable.  But rather that they shouldn't be traded for peanuts.  Which should be obvious, except that it isn't to some folks. 

What a lot of arguing about trades and such comes down to is that:

Everyone has different ideas about what young guys are untouchable and which ones are.

On top of that, each of them are valued in different ways by different fans. Sometimes they are very over-valued and sometimes very under-valued. 

Additionally, sample size of performance with younger guys makes the valuing of these guys even more difficult, especially by armchair GMs like ourselves.

 

As for peanuts, I prefer lightly salted, dry roasted.  Yum.


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#176 The Secret

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:31 AM

Tatar is two years older and spent more time in Grand Rapids developing, so obviously he is going to look more NHL ready than Jurco right now. Tatar is a pretty limited player -- he's very good at that particular skill (scoring goals), but that's about all he brings to the table. At best, Tatar is probably another version of Jiri Hudler.

 

I think Tatar is already more valuable the Hudler ever was... Tatar is what we wanted Hulder to be rather. And while we are doing comparisons I have a strong gut feeling (and I hope I am really wrong) that Jurco is going to be Filppula Junior.... shows "flashes of greatness" and never reaching his "potential", always on the verge of a "breakout season" but never really earning the money that has been spent to keep him, waiting for the day he "steps up" and "maximizes his chances"



#177 krsmith17

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:45 AM

I think Jurco has the one thing that Filppula lacks in his game. Drive. Filppula has always been a very talented player but he lacked the ability to go to the dirty areas, drive the net, and take or give a hit to make a play. Jurco has all the tools to be an elite player in NHL, big body, physical, great skater, deceptively hard shot, crazy stick skills, defensively sound, etc.. Whether or not he puts it all together is entirely up to himself, but I don't see him as another Filppula at all...



#178 The Secret

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:52 AM

I think Jurco has the one thing that Filppula lacks in his game. Drive. Filppula has always been a very talented player but he lacked the ability to go to the dirty areas, drive the net, and take or give a hit to make a play. Jurco has all the tools to be an elite player in NHL, big body, physical, great skater, deceptively hard shot, crazy stick skills, defensively sound, etc.. Whether or not he puts it all together is entirely up to himself, but I don't see him as another Filppula at all...

 

I hope you are right! Used to drive me nuts to see how often Filp got man handled, and usually when we needed him most. Though Tatar also has all the same skills you've outlined above for Jurco minus the big body... but he makes up for it with his feistiness and has proven ability to scored some wicked goals.

 

Also, I'm probably not onboard for trading either of them for Green. Green could end up being another Carlo Colaiacovo! I really liked Carlo's game but he spent more time on the shelf hanging out with glassman and his pal useless vagine


Edited by The Secret, 10 July 2014 - 07:54 AM.


#179 krsmith17

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 08:04 AM

I love Tatar but I definitely see Jurco as the better player in a few years from now.

 

I'd also love to add Green to our blue line but there is no way he is worth either of those two guys on his current contract. Over paid and on his last year (more than likely being a rental). Like I said before, if he was extended to a more reasonable cap hit, I would possibly consider trading Tatar, but not Jurco.



#180 derblaueClaus

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 09:01 AM

If Washington puts a 3rd or 4th round pick in the mix to make up for Greenes remaing short contract length I'd be ok with the trade Greene for Tatar. Only problem is I don't think Washington will do it. This team has the chance to get both of their PP-Units run by a (proven) QB. Thats an asset not many teams have and will/would make the Caps a dangerous opponent to play against. I don't think that Tatar would make up for that.

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