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Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses



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#441 Euro_Twins

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 12:04 AM

Do we know the details of that offer? Obviously he preferred to sign a a 1 year deal with us. The rest of my points remain the same.


Well at that point all the cap space was eaten up and they gave him less than the original offer. I think it was something like 3 years $7 million or something like that.

#442 number9

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 12:09 AM

Well at that point all the cap space was eaten up and they gave him less than the original offer. I think it was something like 3 years $7 million or something like that.


Thank god we didn't give him that, if that's any conciliation

#443 roboturner

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 12:21 AM

First off, I don't like this signing anymore than you.

Second, you're making up facts, unless I'm completely unaware.

He turned down a three year deal? He had a tryout with Philly, and said afterwards I'd rather be in Detroit (who wouldn't :))

He's trying to pawn it the signing off on others? Please link to this bc I'm completely unaware of this Cleary audacity.

Lastly, questioning his role in the lockeroom is dumb. Mostly bc none of us know what it is, but also bc his continued re-signing probably also suggests we do not understand the full dynamics of that lockeroom and his roll in it.

Again, I don't like the signing either. But exaggerating the cleary hatred has become beyond annoying at this point. The guy is bad, but he's not satan himself.

As was said I'm not making s*** up.

 

Those were Holland's quotes about signing him:

 

http://msn.foxsports...d-wings-071114
 

Holland looked at me and said, "Who do I listen to on Cleary, the fans or the guys in the room, my players and my coach?

"Everybody wanted me to bring Cleary back." 

That was after signing him last year. And Holland still didn't learn his lesson.

 

http://www.usatoday....troit/12494391/

General manager Ken Holland said the decision, "has more to do with last year. My program has been one of loyalty, and there's good things and bad things that go with that. Way more good, in my opinion. I reached out to a lot of people before signing Dan, and he's very popular in our organization and with our on-ice leaders."

 

Do you honestly think the players in the locker room want the team to get worse?  Do you honestly think the young guys who are eager to contribute appreciate getting passed over for someone who makes the team worse? Do you honestly think Pav & Z want to spend their final years in the NHL on a mediocre team instead of chasing championships? Do you honestly think that Dan Cleary brings some amazing locker room intangible which apparently nobody else can that it justifies making the team worse? I don't need to be in the locker room to make an educated guess on that.

 

And teaching these young guys that it's OK to be selfish and demand the team bend over backwards for you and only you isn't exactly what I would call a great example of 'leadership' or being a 'good locker room guy'.

 

And your last line is exactly why I was saying he should have just retired. He's being vilified and it didn't have to go down this way, but again, he's brought this on himself by demanding that Holland honor his handshake deal after that horrid season he had last year.

 

Edit: oh and who wouldn't want to be in Detroit, you want to know? Ask all the free agents that passed us up cuz our team is seriously mismanaged and going nowhere fast.


Edited by roboturner, 12 July 2014 - 12:29 AM.

This might be getting a little heated. Just know I don't hate any of you guys.

 

That doesn't mean that I respect ideas & opinions. Some ideas & opinions are ridiculous.

 

In fact, if you confront my ideas & opinions, that will lead to a discussion. (We're on a discussion board after all. Don't forget that!)

 

  :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1:


#444 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 12:56 AM

Last time was almost totally on Cleary. He was offered a 3-year deal by Ken, turned it down....and then came crawling back cuz his heart was still in Detroit? If that was the case he would have signed the first deal. It was only when he found out that every other team thinks he is worthless that he came back cuz his 'heart' was here.

 

And this time around he won't give it up because of some 'handshake' deal that was made last time. He actually thinks he deserves special treatment after that god-awful season he had because of that 'handshake'.

 

As much as I blame Holland for signing him (and I do quite a bit, for he has total power to just walk away and not sign him), even he knows what a bad deal this is. Already he's trying to pawn it off on players/coach & good/bad loyalty quotes.

 

I can't be certain who initiated these talks but I'm sure his agent wasn't going to stop letting Holland know about that 'handshake'. And Holland to his greatest fault went for it.

 

I know monetary wise it'd be stupid to turn it down, but all this talk of his 'leadership' is bulls*** because the guy isn't a leader. He's a hound chasing a squirrel. One of your 'team leaders' shouldn't be dragging the team down, especially if that is literally the only supposed thing he brings to the table. If he was truly a team leader he would be doing what is best for the team, and whats best for the team is him off of it.

 

For simplicity's sake, I bolded the parts you're making up. 



#445 Vladiator

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 01:22 AM

I really hope that this is the last comment on this thread...

 

Holland promised to sign Cleary for the 2014-2015 season. Done.

 

Cleary needs to demonstrate in camp that he can make the team. Not Done.

 

Yes, we all make the conspiring suggestions that Babs and Holland will turn a blind eye no matter what Cleary does in camp and put him on the roster.

 

The other alternative.. Cleary realizes that he can't make the team and walks away from the contract . 

 

This guy has to understand that a majority of Wings fans completely despise him and want him to go away as well as Holland. Neither will probably happen though.


Edited by Vladiator, 12 July 2014 - 01:23 AM.


#446 roboturner

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 01:53 AM

 

For simplicity's sake, I bolded the parts you're making up. 

"Of course I can explain what's wrong with this, I just don't want to! I'll just say it's made up cuz i'm a mod" Well done harold, well done.

 

Sure it's speculation. But it isn't baseless. It's called extrapolation and its amazing the amount of info you can get by it. You should try it sometime!

Answer me this:

Do you really think he turned down a 3 year deal from Detroit because his heart was in Detroit? Does that make sense to you?

        - doesn't make sense to me

 

Did he turn down multi-year offers from multiple teams (or even 1 team) to come back? Or was it a tryout with one team with no guarantees?

        -Indications are it was the latter (I'll admit I'm not positive as its been claimed both ways, still alot of confusion about this)

 

Do you think this handshake deal has nothing to do with this signing?

        -Quotes from Holland strongly indicate it does

 

Do you really think his agent was just going to forget about said deal?

        -Wouldn't be much of an agent if he did. Of course he's going to reach out to the GM about it.

 

And please tell me what kind of positive leadership the guy is bringing to the table and (if there is any) how that outweighs his on ice performances.

        -If they need his locker room presence so bad then they could pay him to sit in the locker room. Pay him a million buck for a few years to be 'President of Team Morale'. No need to sign him to a playing contract.


Edited by roboturner, 12 July 2014 - 03:17 AM.

This might be getting a little heated. Just know I don't hate any of you guys.

 

That doesn't mean that I respect ideas & opinions. Some ideas & opinions are ridiculous.

 

In fact, if you confront my ideas & opinions, that will lead to a discussion. (We're on a discussion board after all. Don't forget that!)

 

  :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1:


#447 Nev

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 02:37 AM

 

Another thing that pissed me off is he finished his response with, "That said, we will no longer expect voice messages from you either".  This after one message. Haha. 

 

That I'm not paraphrasing. 

 

Wow.  I wonder if yours isn't the only voicemail they've received the last couple of days? :lol:


"If I can be totally honest, it's not a lot of guys you get impressed by. Actually, it's no one else but him. From the bench, to see what move he makes -- you're like, 'I wish I could do that.' Sometimes you sit on the bench and just think, 'wow,' and you look over to the other bench and they sit there and shake their heads, too. He has great, great skills. I'm probably not going to play with another player who has the kind of skills he has." Mikael Samuelsson on Pavel Datsyuk

#448 Spongewingredpants

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 02:55 AM

Can we please bury this thread. Its too depressing


My wish: A healthy roster

 

 


#449 derblaueClaus

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 03:42 AM

Why?

I'll make it short: The good (drafting, prospects) far outweighs the bad (arguably the missed FAs, signing of washed up Vets).
And, maybe most important for me, the Organisation is a classy one and Holland is a huge reason for that. I don't want to win a cup if we deal with things like Vancouver or Montreal or with having players who behave like assholes on the ice like Lucic.

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#450 arag

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 05:40 AM

Iam not upset with Cleary signing anymore. He makes a good photoshop material. Thanks to masterful work by FlashyG we will enjoy having Cleary on our beloved team. Looking forward to start of the season.

#451 RedHasek2014

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 05:52 AM

Red Wings should sign Todd Bertuzzi to a two-way deal, sign Daniel Alfredsson. And be done. I don't really care what they do. Just as long as the team they put on the ice this season can finally score Goals.



#452 frankgrimes

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 06:10 AM

I'll make it short: The good (drafting, prospects) far outweighs the bad (arguably the missed FAs, signing of washed up Vets).
And, maybe most important for me, the Organisation is a classy one and Holland is a huge reason for that. I don't want to win a cup if we deal with things like Vancouver or Montreal or with having players who behave like assholes on the ice like Lucic.

 

Montreal I give you that but Lucic ? Yeah he can be a total douchebag but he is one of the best powerforwards in the game (behind Backes) and tough as nails. This is a guy who is at his best when he is pissed off and playing with a chip on his shoulder.

 

Our prospects:

Nobody knows if Tatar and Nyquist can repeat their unreal season, it is really possible that they might have some sort of a sophomore slumb. Mantha, Marchenko, Sproul haven't played yet or played at a too small sample size so I would be wise to temper the expectations and let all of them develop.

 

I also disagree with the ntoion that the good outweights the bad:

Drafting is mainly done by scouts, they are the ones looking at the players and providing the neccessary input for GMs, coaches. To me a lot of credit has to go to Hakan Anderson he just seems to have a great eye for swedish prospects. Btw. Pittsburgh fired Shero because he didn't receive the success they expected and he tied himself  faith to Bylsma and suffered the same fate... BUT the guy has had much more success than Holland during the last years.

 

Btw.

2 players (one is a former allstar and winger, the other one a  very good second line center) - 3 million caphit

Dan C. - 2,5 million caphit

 

Also if I was a betting man I would bet we are going to bring back Alfie...so then we will have the exact same roster as last year just one year older and this crap will continue till we miss the playoffs and I'm at the point where I'm cheering for that, if it means Holland moves up and we are going to see either a real rebuild or at least no more over the hill players.


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#453 Hockeymom1960

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 06:34 AM

Well at least we have two whipping boys



#454 derblaueClaus

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 06:42 AM

Lucic is one of the best powerforwards in the game but spears people from behind out of nowhere and reacts like a sissy when he lost a series because he couldn't stand the trashtalk . Not what I call "tough as nails" and certainly nobody I want to have on a team I cheer for.

Of course the Drafting relies on the scout reports but trading picks up and down and the last decisions who is draftet lays in the hands of Holland and his staff. The Scoutingstaff itself also is in Hollands responsebility. Of course he doesn't do it all alone but you have to give him credit where it is due.

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#455 number9

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 11:27 AM

"Of course I can explain what's wrong with this, I just don't want to! I'll just say it's made up cuz i'm a mod" Well done harold, well done.

 

Sure it's speculation. But it isn't baseless. It's called extrapolation and its amazing the amount of info you can get by it. You should try it sometime!

Answer me this:

Do you really think he turned down a 3 year deal from Detroit because his heart was in Detroit? Does that make sense to you?

        - doesn't make sense to me

 

Did he turn down multi-year offers from multiple teams (or even 1 team) to come back? Or was it a tryout with one team with no guarantees?

        -Indications are it was the latter (I'll admit I'm not positive as its been claimed both ways, still alot of confusion about this)

 

Do you think this handshake deal has nothing to do with this signing?

        -Quotes from Holland strongly indicate it does

 

Do you really think his agent was just going to forget about said deal?

        -Wouldn't be much of an agent if he did. Of course he's going to reach out to the GM about it.

 

And please tell me what kind of positive leadership the guy is bringing to the table and (if there is any) how that outweighs his on ice performances.

        -If they need his locker room presence so bad then they could pay him to sit in the locker room. Pay him a million buck for a few years to be 'President of Team Morale'. No need to sign him to a playing contract.

 

 

Bingo



#456 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 11:31 AM

"Of course I can explain what's wrong with this, I just don't want to! I'll just say it's made up cuz i'm a mod" Well done harold, well done.


It came off as maybe more blunt than intended because I didn't elaborate, but my point stands that you are making all this conjecture about things we have no real idea about.
 

Sure it's speculation. But it isn't baseless. It's called extrapolation and its amazing the amount of info you can get by it. You should try it sometime!
Answer me this:
Do you really think he turned down a 3 year deal from Detroit because his heart was in Detroit? Does that make sense to you?
        - doesn't make sense to me

 

I have no idea and neither do you.  He may not have realized how much he liked playing on the Wings until he was confronted with the reality of playing on another team.  Who knows.
 

Did he turn down multi-year offers from multiple teams (or even 1 team) to come back? Or was it a tryout with one team with no guarantees?
        -Indications are it was the latter (I'll admit I'm not positive as its been claimed both ways, still alot of confusion about this)

 

Holland has said (who you're using as a source so let's say he's reliable) that Cleary had multiple offers from other teams.
 

“He had three-year offers from some teams last year,” Holland said. “We said at the time we would talk at the end of the season.”



 http://www.theoaklan...or-another-year
 
 

Do you think this handshake deal has nothing to do with this signing?
        -Quotes from Holland strongly indicate it does

 

I never said it doesn't. As you point out, Holland said it does.
 
 

Do you really think his agent was just going to forget about said deal?
        -Wouldn't be much of an agent if he did. Of course he's going to reach out to the GM about it.

 

Probably. who knows. But you're stating it as fact and it's speculation on your part.
 
 

And please tell me what kind of positive leadership the guy is bringing to the table and (if there is any) how that outweighs his on ice performances.
        -If they need his locker room presence so bad then they could pay him to sit in the locker room. Pay him a million buck for a few years to be 'President of Team Morale'. No need to sign him to a playing contract.

I don't need to tell you any of that. If you read any of my posts in this thread, I'm not in favor of bringing Cleary back.

 

 

I just pointed out that you're hating him for invented reasons. That he only came back because no one else wanted him.  That he thinks he deserves special treatment.  That his agent keeps bringing up this handshake deal.
 
Nothing you've quoted confirms any of that.  It's all just your speculation, which you admit.  Which means it is not factual, it is made up based on your opinion.  



#457 LeftWinger

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 11:42 AM

Gee, I would have rather had Morrow for the $1.55M Yzerman signed him at, than cleary...of course I'd rather have an open position over cleary.  Morrow, while in his elder years of NHL, is still twice the hockey player cleary is... Add him to the list of players that should be here over cleary.  #firekenholland

 

 

I tell you what, there better be a grand scheme here with all this nonsense signing...#fkq and cleary were/are two of the worst UFA's that were available, and I am not even letting my anger speak for me.


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#458 roboturner

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 12:57 PM

Bingo

Of course you missed the point about extrapolation and it not being baseless. Besides, speculation is part of being a fan. It's what happens after the GM puts out cryptic messages.

 

And Harold you really aren't sure whether Cleary's agent would bring that up?

After Holland indicates that he kinda sorta didn't really want to sign him, but loyalty yadda yadda...That's you're honest opinion?

 

There probably isn't a sports agent who wouldn't at the very least try and use that if their client wanted another deal (I know more 'speculation')


This might be getting a little heated. Just know I don't hate any of you guys.

 

That doesn't mean that I respect ideas & opinions. Some ideas & opinions are ridiculous.

 

In fact, if you confront my ideas & opinions, that will lead to a discussion. (We're on a discussion board after all. Don't forget that!)

 

  :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1: :bye1:


#459 Dabura

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 01:13 PM

Dany Heatley (Danny Cleary's younger, hipper brother) signed for a million dollars.

 

I used to care, but now I take a pill for that.


Don't Toews me, bro!


#460 evilmrt

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 01:15 PM

Paraphrasing, but that's the gist. 

 

To be fair though, they offered to follow up with me about it but I refused. I just wasn't interesting in hearing the same recycled banter to try to convince me this is the best team ever. 

 

So you don't have any emails from them? 







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