• Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

Sign in to follow this  
Wings_Dynasty

TSN Radio - McKenzie: Enforcers in the NHL

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

Power forwards IMHO are a very rare commodity...Used to be a plethora of them throughout the 80's/90's.

Yes - I can live without the talentless goon, and would prefer to see guys who can take a reg shift, and drop the gloves when needed.

As far as concussions go - seems to me many are due to hits (be it clean, or dirty) more so than due to fights.

Not me. I want to see a stat that reads 82GP, 1G, 3A, 346 PIM.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Enforcers are a waste. The game right now is based so much on speed that it doesn't make sense to have an enforcer who only plays 4 minutes a game. Team now have 4 lines that they just put out there one after the other.

The league needs to step up to keep the players safe, like the NFL does. I was watching an OHL game last year, and I was very impressed with the "Hit to the Head" penalties. Banning hits to the head didn't take anything away from the game. The NHL needs to do something like this too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Clinical depression caused by concussions has nothing to do with one's perception. Its not as if someone with clinical depression can simply say "I'm not going to be depressed anymore, I'm going to change my outlook." I wish it were that simple. Its an extremely tough battle for the individual and unfortunately can end extremely bad.

I cant speak for others, but again, my opinions about guys that just fight day in and day out has nothing to do with a lack of respect, or trying to put them down, its not wanting to see guys suffer the rest of their lives for no reason. I'm not anti fighting, I'm against constant senseless fighting.

Sadly I know that, had friends to go through depression and had a "mild" one myself but I think, if there's even a chance to make the life and well-being of enforcers better you simply have to do it.

I don't want to see them suffering also, hence why I don't watch UFC you almost know this guy will have a lot of problem as he ages..but keep in mind the most devasting injuries are coming from full-speed full-geared checks. The game has become too fast, the league should slow it down and look at ways to make the shoulder pads less weaponlike while keeping them at the same safety rate.

also the argument "goon = talentless" doesn't hold up these are still guys who have made to the elite junior levels and then for whatever reason couldn't reach the top of the crop, also fighting takes a lot of talent and especially endurance/timing too..so calling them talentless is just false.

best example Rinaldo yesterday:

Guy ran around like a rabbit on speed, Seidenberg and Robins checked him hard, Robins fought Luke Schenn and won...well after that Rinaldo didn't ran around like a rabbit of speed anymore...that's not just coincidence .)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sadly I know that, had friends to go through depression and had a "mild" one myself but I think, if there's even a chance to make the life and well-being of enforcers better you simply have to do it.

I don't want to see them suffering also, hence why I don't watch UFC you almost know this guy will have a lot of problem as he ages..but keep in mind the most devasting injuries are coming from full-speed full-geared checks. The game has become too fast, the league should slow it down and look at ways to make the shoulder pads less weaponlike while keeping them at the same safety rate.

also the argument "goon = talentless" doesn't hold up these are still guys who have made to the elite junior levels and then for whatever reason couldn't reach the top of the crop, also fighting takes a lot of talent and especially endurance/timing too..so calling them talentless is just false.

best example Rinaldo yesterday:

Guy ran around like a rabbit on speed, Seidenberg and Robins checked him hard, Robins fought Luke Schenn and won...well after that Rinaldo didn't ran around like a rabbit of speed anymore...that's not just coincidence .)

I don't disagree with you that a lot of concussions are also caused by full-geared checks, and I think there will change to the rules regarding those as well as time goes on.

I don't think I ever used the word "talentless" but never the less. Alot of fighters in the NHL do not have the skill set required to play in the NHL, however due to their ability to drop the gloves they are in the NHL. Sure, they are not Brock Lesnar on skates, they obviously came up through junior and know how to play, but they shouldn't be in the NHL, and if they wanted to ever quit fighting they would lose their job. My argument, is that if you are going to have a guy who can fight, why not have a guy who is not one dimensional? (ie. Probert, Hartnell etc.) One of my favourite fighters back in the early 2000's was Georges Laraque, he definitely wasn't Pavol Datsyuk, but I would take his 53 career goals (13 one season) at times clutch play over McGratton's 10 goals any day. Guys like Georges you can argue have a place, guys like McGratton and Orr do not and GM' not named Brian Burke are seeing this as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Power forwards IMHO are a very rare commodity...Used to be a plethora of them throughout the 80's/90's.

Yes - I can live without the talentless goon, and would prefer to see guys who can take a reg shift, and drop the gloves when needed.

As far as concussions go - seems to me many are due to hits (be it clean, or dirty) more so than due to fights.

Yes but hitting is a much more integral part of the game, even though some hits will involve contact with the head that can cause concussion. With the league looking to reduce concussions, eliminating guys punching each other in the head is a pretty clearcut way to reduce potential concussions without affecting actual game play that much.

I'm not advocating for or against, but I think fighting in hockey will be going away in the next decade.

Honestly I'm torn on the issue. I've been watching hockey a long time and think fighting has a place in the game (though I hate staged fights and fights after obviously clean hits), but given the toll it takes on these enforcers after their careers are over, it's harder for me to accept as a good part of the game. A guy living the rest of his life with screwed up hands or a bad knee is one thing. But post concussion syndrome is a brain injury with much more serious symptoms.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't disagree with you that a lot of concussions are also caused by full-geared checks, and I think there will change to the rules regarding those as well as time goes on.

I don't think I ever used the word "talentless" but never the less. Alot of fighters in the NHL do not have the skill set required to play in the NHL, however due to their ability to drop the gloves they are in the NHL. Sure, they are not Brock Lesnar on skates, they obviously came up through junior and know how to play, but they shouldn't be in the NHL, and if they wanted to ever quit fighting they would lose their job. My argument, is that if you are going to have a guy who can fight, why not have a guy who is not one dimensional? (ie. Probert, Hartnell etc.) One of my favourite fighters back in the early 2000's was Georges Laraque, he definitely wasn't Pavol Datsyuk, but I would take his 53 career goals (13 one season) at times clutch play over McGratton's 10 goals any day. Guys like Georges you can argue have a place, guys like McGratton and Orr do not and GM' not named Brian Burke are seeing this as well.

See and that's the problem, players are getting bigger, stronger and faster as does the equipment so the only solution is to slow the game down.

The problem with the "perfect fighter" is this, those guys are really hard to find (think about Lucic, Thornton and Gazdic), for sure Lucic is a top 6 player and a mean fighter but guys like him are so rare nowadays, it's really a shame. Laraque was a good example of a perfect fourth line enforcer I fully agree with that.

I also think the aspect the bigger brother syndrome is playing a bit of a role here, a lot of players are saying they play a heavier game with guys like The Boogeyman (RIP big man :( ), Orr or McGrattan on the bench. Even if it's just a small affect this would indirectly increase a players performance. When it comes to Brian Burke, the guy has a team with a lot of smaller, undersized and young players he simple can't afford to let rats run over Monahan, Bärtschi or Johnny Hockey (who is under 170 lbs). Just looked up who Brock Lesnar is, good comparison *g*

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

See and that's the problem, players are getting bigger, stronger and faster as does the equipment so the only solution is to slow the game down.

The problem with the "perfect fighter" is this, those guys are really hard to find (think about Lucic, Thornton and Gazdic), for sure Lucic is a top 6 player and a mean fighter but guys like him are so rare nowadays, it's really a shame. Laraque was a good example of a perfect fourth line enforcer I fully agree with that.

I also think the aspect the bigger brother syndrome is playing a bit of a role here, a lot of players are saying they play a heavier game with guys like The Boogeyman (RIP big man :( ), Orr or McGrattan on the bench. Even if it's just a small affect this would indirectly increase a players performance. When it comes to Brian Burke, the guy has a team with a lot of smaller, undersized and young players he simple can't afford to let rats run over Monahan, Bärtschi or Johnny Hockey (who is under 170 lbs). Just looked up who Brock Lesnar is, good comparison *g*

But isnt gaudreau is in the lineup?

And Brock lesnars just a huge steroid driven man.

i was watxhing Joe rogans stand up, and he was talking about how big he was, and he said something to the effects of "Brock lesnars such a massive human being that if he wanted to f*** me, who would stop him.

Not that he would Cuz if he was *** he could get a lot better than me, but if he went all hulk and decided it was to be, no one in this theatre is stopping him."

It kinda made me laugh.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This sort of fighting is going to become more common if the "goon" continues to be phased out.

Yeah, and I'm not a big fan of watching these types of players fight. It's admirable, but boring and not good in the long run for star players getting hurt in fights.

And yes, I know Hamhuis isn't a star player, but I'd rather watch a heavyweight fight than him.

Edited by GMRwings1983

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, and I'm not a big fan of watching these types of players fight. It's admirable, but boring and not good in the long run for star players getting hurt in fights.

And yes, I know Hamhuis isn't a star player, but I'd rather watch a heavyweight fight than him.

Thanks :-) I mean watching Mcgrattan and Macintyre square off a few years ago was just a blast, they've put on a show for over one minute both throwing absolute haymakers.

Or Orr versus Engelland, these guys are just on a different level when it comes down to fighting and that's why it's way more entertaining watching them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this