Bannedforlife 403 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Wait... are you saying that you never bash those guys? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,948 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) No, I bash them a ton! But I did not bash any of them in that post. I actually included Franzen in my lineup, I said he should have waited to sign Q, instead of just bashing the signing. I pick and choose my bashing, but your response to my post had nothing to do with what I wrote. It was more so of an attack on me pretty much saying it doesn't matter what I write because all I do is bash bash bash. When in all actuality, even though I do talk crap about said players, I don't do it every chance I get. Another thing I do do, is I give them credit when they do things that are good for this team. Even though I do not like any of them, I can still appreciate when they do have that couple of good games...or shifts. I will never "like" Q, K, Cleary, Franzen, E or Howard, but it doesn't mean that I bash them in everything I write. edit: I do bash them when they have bad games or shifts...that is for sure! And it's not my fault that it seems that on any given game, one of those guys are having a bad game, so I love to point it out. But again, nothing in the post you responded to, did any of that. Edited October 21, 2014 by LeftWinger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Praying Mantha Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Heatley and Iginla on a line with Datsyuk is far better than having Abby and Z on his line with no legit 2nd line. We weren't scoring any big name UFA either way, besides, have Heatley and/or Iginla is no more todays news that having Alfie back. So instead of waiting to hear...be more aggressive. Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Abby Alfie - Weiss - Franzen OR Heatley - Dats - Iginla Franzen - Z - Nyquist which one is better... This I can agree with. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,948 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 ....but, we are stuck with what we have. No top 6 depth and now forcing perhaps the best 3rd line the in NHL (ok, that may be a bit of homerism) to be a 2nd line when they aren't quite ready for that. Thankfully dats is back tonight and maybe, just maybe Babcock can find a combo of linemates for him and keep Franzen and Nyquist on a line together with Franzen when he gets back. Of course, just inserting Dats with Z and Nyquist is going to be exciting to watch too! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bannedforlife 403 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 You said that holland's offseason was a failure even though you admit that prices were too high... you blame him for signing weiss even though he had no way of knowing that he would get injured... you criticize him for resigning quincey even though he has been playing great so far... you called franzen "franzine"... Id call that bashing 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,948 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Holland off season was a failure, and I said not that I wanted him to pay the prices other teams were asking in trade, but that doesn't mean, once he lost out on his top targets, that he had to jump so quickly on Q. Like I said, he could have waited until later to sign him when he would have cost less money. I didn't bash the signing in that post. I always called him Francine or Franzia or Franzine when I remember to. I don't like the guy, doesn't mean I cannot appreciate when he does play well from time to time. I despise Crosby, and call him Cindy Lee all the time, but I cannot deny how good he is. If I were ranting about fire Holland, fire Holland, kill Q...etc...then I would agree I was bashing. But criticizing some things and the way they were done isn't really bashing. If there is anything I learned over the years, is there is a way of making a point without coming off like....well, like I used to come off all the time. I have toned it down tremendously here, all along while maintaining the same mindset towards the same players and the GM. Franzen (spelled correct on purpose) can score 50 goals, I still won't like him. It's just me. He could score 20 in two weeks and I will give him his props, and the first time he floats around out there and makes a few mistakes, I will nail him on it. Same goes with Q, K, Howard and E. It especially goes that way with the tire kicker. I just didn't appreciate to response you put, it had nothing to do with my post and like I said pretty much was just an attack in order to start a confrontation. If maybe you would have commented on what I actually said and then added the "bashing" part, that would have made all the difference in the world. But you can rely on one thing, there will be time when I do bash when I am upset over something, and then a response like that will be 100% justified! Until then, Let's Go Wings! Don't get me wrong, banned, I enjoy your posting and conversation, so keep being you and keep this place fun and interesting! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vladdy16 2,154 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Okay, you know a thread has gone astray when you don't even know what the actual topic is without looking at the title again. Let's get back to that, shall we? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Praying Mantha Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Okay, you know a thread has gone astray when you don't even know what the actual topic is without looking at the title again. Let's get back to that, shall we? Franzen needs to toughen up. Too many injuries for a guy of his stature. "Franzen is in great shape" all preseason. For what? A croquet match? He gets a bruise and he's out of the lineup. Its disturbing. 1 LeftWinger reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,948 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 I have said this for a long time with Franzen...maybe I am still bitter over "The Choice," but ever since he singed that 11 year deal, it just seems like he is nowhere near the player he was those two years and the player Holland (and us) had hoped he would turn into. He has been injured a crap ton since then as well. Probably because he is getting older every year and his body is breaking down, but it just rattles my chain to see that happen when all eggs were put in his basket to maintain his "Playoff Franzen" stature... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Praying Mantha Report post Posted October 21, 2014 I have said this for a long time with Franzen...maybe I am still bitter over "The Choice," but ever since he singed that 11 year deal, it just seems like he is nowhere near the player he was those two years and the player Holland (and us) had hoped he would turn into. He has been injured a crap ton since then as well. Probably because he is getting older every year and his body is breaking down, but it just rattles my chain to see that happen when all eggs were put in his basket to maintain his "Playoff Franzen" stature... Yup. Franzen is too soft for 6-3, 225. He needs more consistent health and effort. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmyemeryhunter 2,747 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 I wish franzen was an iron man, but he's 34. Part of what will make us successful this season is going to be making sure our players stay healthy long term. And I'd they have some concerns about him right now, its a perfect time to give him some time, that way down the road when we need him he's not at 60% and hurting more than he's helping. Not to mention if we stay healthy were going to have to wave someone to be roster compliant, this is a good time to see with dats coming if Jurco going to find his scoring touch, or if he needs to be the first call up. I don't want to lose nestrasil for nothing. 2 T.Low and krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,948 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Was it Nestrasil that was out of options? Oh boy, ya if that is true, I do not want to waive him either. Jurco is going to be the one to go because he does have options...either that or waive Cleary or Andy... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmyemeryhunter 2,747 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Yeah leftwinger nestrasil is out of options. Sticky situation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 LeftWinger, I'm happy to hear that you have "toned it down tremendously" but the fact that you admit that if one of those players that you "hate" (Holland, Franzen, Cleary, Quincey, Ericsson, Kindl, Howard) play great for an extended period of time and then have a bad game or shift, you're ready to rip them to shreds, is a little troublesome to me... Franzen will be fine, he will continue to play 60-70 games and average a little under a point per game. Cleary will be gone after this season. Quincey has been one of our best defenders so far this season, so how about giving the guy some credit. Ericsson is off to a rough start but he will be fine. I'm not a fan of Kindl but he has been better than I expected. Howard has been great in his first few games but is still awful at handling the puck. 1 kliq reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Praying Mantha Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Send Miller down. Is anyone gonna claim him? No. Is anyone gonna be unhappy if someone does claim him? No. Will anyone say "damn, Miller would have had that? No. Simple solution. Jurco >>> Miller. Why protect Miller when you don't have to? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Echolalia 2,961 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Send Miller down. Is anyone gonna claim him? No. Is anyone gonna be unhappy if someone does claim him? No. Will anyone say "damn, Miller would have had that? No. Simple solution. Jurco >>> Miller. Why protect Miller when you don't have to?Given the way each of them have played so far this year, I'd rather keep Miller and send Jurco down. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Praying Mantha Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Given the way each of them have played so far this year, I'd rather keep Miller and send Jurco down. I like the kids and their potential. Miller is just vanilla to me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Euro_Twins 4,475 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 this is why Holland's off season was such a failure. Not that I wanted him to pay the prices other teams were asking for, but he could have been a bit more active in UFA. I get the Cleary promise, but he isn't playing anyway. He waited and waited for Alfie to make a decision...he is still waiting actually. He should have been looking for depth at the top 6. I know Dats and Z are lights out together, but I really think they would be doing much better for this team apart, with other legit scorers on their wing. The only reason they are kept together is they don't have enough top 6 talent to surround them on two line. Weiss has been a wash out (it happens) and now the Sheahan line is being forced to be a top 6 when they are best on the third, because a lot of other teams bottom 6er's can't match them. Now they are playing against other teams top 6 and it is showing a bit. I fully believe our 4 centers should be Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Sheahan and Helm with Andy in the press box for backup. It will be nearly impossible to get rid of Weiss, but that is fine if he is already destined for the press box anyhow. IMO, if Holland would have been a bit more aggressive July 1st and offered some more cash to the likes of Heatley and Iginla our top 6 would have been perfectly fine with Franzine going down. I mean they wouldn't be missing his output as much as they are going to do so now. I know the focus was on a RH defender, but when his first couple of targets went elsewhere, instead of panicing and re-signing Q for so much right away, he should have maybe turned focus on his offense and addressed Q in August when he would have cost less...or maybe he would have gone elsewhere, which wouldn't really had mattered. Again the Cleary promise is what it is...stupid, but it happened. I think, a full healthy lineup that looked like this would have been awesome. (also I know it doesn't mean the UFA's would have come here, or at the very least it would have cost a bit more cash.) Heatley - Datsyuk - Iginla Franzen - Zetterberg - Nyquist Jurco - Sheahan - Tatar Abdelkader - Helm - Glendening Ya, there wasn't enough roster room because of Weiss and Cleary, but that, again, is where Holland screwed up. Andersson and Miller in the press box rotating in and out. I know Nesty wouldn't be here, but he wouldn't have to be when all are healthy. I know its only a 23 man roster and this would have 24, but if push came to shove you can always find a home for Andy or Weiss. Heck, you may be able to waive Andy and he would probably clear. Then there is Cleary.... :facepalm: All hypothetical of course, since Holland...well...was Holland over the summer. So it's Holland's fault that he picked up a 50-60 point scorer to replace flip, and that he got injured? Had he picked up Heatley and iginla and they played very poorly would it then be his fault to? I get your point but the Weiss signing was not a bad signing at the time. And we still have 4 years to find out if it will be bad going forward. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nawein 324 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Send Miller down. Is anyone gonna claim him? No. Is anyone gonna be unhappy if someone does claim him? No. Will anyone say "damn, Miller would have had that? No. Simple solution. Jurco >>> Miller. Why protect Miller when you don't have to? Incorrect. Offensively, yes, Jurco is better than Miller. Good thing we're not paying Miller to score goals and play the power play. We're paying him to play defensive hockey, shut down whoever he's out against, not take penalties, kill penalties. In those aspects I'd take Miller over Jurco 100/100 times right now. I fully expect Jurco to go to GR when Franzen comes back, and based on everyones play so far this year and the reasoning I gave before the season even started, that's how it should be. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Praying Mantha Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Incorrect. Offensively, yes, Jurco is better than Miller. Good thing we're not paying Miller to score goals and play the power play. We're paying him to play defensive hockey, shut down whoever he's out against, not take penalties, kill penalties. In those aspects I'd take Miller over Jurco 100/100 times right now. I fully expect Jurco to go to GR when Franzen comes back, and based on everyones play so far this year and the reasoning I gave before the season even started, that's how it should be. I'm OK with that. I just don't think Miller is better than Jurco. I'd rather have Jurco on the 4th line than Miller. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nawein 324 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 I'm OK with that. I just don't think Miller is better than Jurco. I'd rather have Jurco on the 4th line than Miller. We would lose more games with Jurco on the 4th line over Miller. 1 T.Low reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmyemeryhunter 2,747 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 I'm OK with that. I just don't think Miller is better than Jurco. I'd rather have Jurco on the 4th line than Miller.Nahhh man.Jurcos going to be a good scorer, but he's not a defensive guy. You don't have skill play fourth line minutes. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
martinezsvsu 240 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 The 4th line has been good, seems like they are always getting scoring chances for us and thats not even why we play them 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,948 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 Bottom line is this is a business... Babcock and Holland see Miller very important to the bottom 6, hence if push came to shove the guy with options will be the one sent down, unless (as in Tootoo's case) the team is really not too worried whether the lose the guy to waivers or not. Nestrasil, they will NOT send down through waivers...I think Cleary would be waived before Nesty. Cleary would most definitely clear waivers before Nesty would... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings4thecup06 504 Report post Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Sorry but that's absolute bull. You can't compare Miller to Jurco because both have completely different roles on this team. miller is clearly a 4th line guy who is relied on on the PK, whereas Jurco is a scoring forward who is counted on to use his body and speed to create offensive chances If we actually send Miller down, what does that achieve? Who's going to play on the 4th line? Cleary? Sorry, but that 4th line thus far has been tremendous through 5 games, and if Glendening had the hands of Ovechkin he'd be leading the league in scoring with the number of chances he's had. You can't fix one problem by creating another. As for Franzen, I know a lot of you hate him, but screw it. He's been on fire thus far. He's 34. We know exactly what he is. And oh yea. Hockey's a contact sport. I'm sure they're far more injuries that ever get reported to the press. Doesn't make it more or less frustrating when they happen, but they just do. Luckily he's not out long term and it's only 7 day IR. So can please, just for once, when we get an injury this season, can all the haters hold off with the 'i told you so's', and actually enjoy this team for what it's worth, which right now is looking quite promising. Edited October 21, 2014 by wings4thecup06 2 krsmith17 and T.Low reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
