Do we need a trade to get our offence going ?

[kipwinger 8,524]

Helm and Franzen are Wings lifers FACE IT

True. Ugh.

[DatsyukianDekes 2,428]

A couple of points I'd make in response. Despite the fact that Rafalski wasn't exactly loved around here, anybody who still doesn't see how valuable he was to the team is nuts. Yandle would be too. Secondly, Boedker is noted for his two way play, I'm not sure where you're getting that from? AND he's capable of putting up points. Finally, I think we get (marginally) more physical in the sense that A) Yandle is more fiesty than any of our d-men and fights (rarely, but on occasion), B) Boedker is physical in the same way that Helm is, plus he's quite a bit bigger and heavier, C) trading Andersson would get Callahan in the lineup, and he's more physical than anybody on our team.

And really, what are we losing? Helm? Franzen? Neither of them are particularly strong this season, and I'd be happy to move them plus picks and prospects for two 50 pts. players in their twenties (not exactly mortgaging the future by trading a 22 year old Pulkkinen for a 24 year old Boedkker).

I like that trade, I think it def makes us better. Not sure Arizona takes Franzen though, I could see them wanting Tatar, or Jurco.

[kipwinger 8,524]

I like that trade, I think it def makes us better. Not sure Arizona takes Franzen though, I could see them wanting Tatar, or Jurco.

I'm sure they'd want one of those guys, but it's part of KH's job to make taking Franzen a more palpable idea. Maybe keep the second and upgrade it to a first. Or throw in another middling prospect.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it HAS to happen. I don't hate Franzen or Helm. But I don't like Franzen on the third line, and I don't like Helm as a winger in the top six. So if I can get rid of those situations, AND pick up quality players, I'm happy to sacrifice a pick and a prospect (or two).

[joesuffP 1,746]

Yandle is being underrated by Wings fans. Anybody that is choosing a team is going to take Yandle well before they take Kronwall but luckily, we don't have to choose because we'll have both! It's called defensive depth and when you only have one skilled puck mover you start to notice that puck movement and overall game is filled with inconsistency. I wouldn't be the least bit upset if we traded Jurco and Sheahan for Yandle and I also wouldn't be opposed to packaging Smith and Dekeseyer for another big time RH top 4 so we'll have elite defense. Because isn't that what this is all about, improving to become elite. Seems like this forum only cares about how good our prospects can get. Passing up on Yandle is dumb unless Holland wants to wait 2 or more years to see if Smith or Dekeseyer can grow into that role and by that time we'll have to give up on our forward depth anyways

[rick zombo 3,739]

This team cannot trade away BOTH of their big young forwards (Sheahan and Jurco) and keep the two midgets (Nyquist and Tatar). Pick one from each group unless you want to really get pushed around.

[kipwinger 8,524]

No need to trade either of them. Almost every team in the league asks for top young talent, and almost nobody trades it. There's a reason why guys like Stafford, Stewart, Fleishmann, Boyes, Perron, etc. are the names being rumored for trade. Because those are the kinds of guys teams trade. Not their 23 year old future top sixers. Teams can ask all day for Sheahan and Jurco, but they're not going anywhere. Doesn't mean we don't have valuable pieces for trade though.

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

Yandle is being underrated by Wings fans. Anybody that is choosing a team is going to take Yandle well before they take Kronwall but luckily, we don't have to choose because we'll have both! It's called defensive depth and when you only have one skilled puck mover you start to notice that puck movement and overall game is filled with inconsistency. I wouldn't be the least bit upset if we traded Jurco and Sheahan for Yandle and I also wouldn't be opposed to packaging Smith and Dekeseyer for another big time RH top 4 so we'll have elite defense. Because isn't that what this is all about, improving to become elite. Seems like this forum only cares about how good our prospects can get. Passing up on Yandle is dumb unless Holland wants to wait 2 or more years to see if Smith or Dekeseyer can grow into that role and by that time we'll have to give up on our forward depth anyways

I understand that you're sacrificing for a big name, but getting rid of those 2 would be WAY too much. They are two solid players heading into their prime that can be a solid #3 and #4 (or may develop higher) for the rest of their careers. Not to mention they're pretty cheap at the moment. I really don't know which RH Dman could be worth giving them both up.

To me, our Tradable roster Dmen goes: 1.KIndl, 2.Lashoff (does his job, but easily sacrificed) 3.Quincey, 4.Ericsson

[joesuffP 1,746]

Top young talent from us is Nyquist and Tatar. Sheahan and Jurco are second tier. Yandle is the coyotes best player, on a great contract in his prime years. I'm sorry to say this but Yandle is better than anybody we have on defense. We're not going to get him for a bundled up pile of role players. Also, we don't have enough room for all these guys on forward and a gaping hole in defense ever since Lidstrom left. There's been something fundamentally wrong with this team for years and that's why we're soooo inconsistent

[joesuffP 1,746]

I understand that you're sacrificing for a big name, but getting rid of those 2 would be WAY too much. They are two solid players heading into their prime that can be a solid #3 and #4 (or may develop higher) for the rest of their careers. Not to mention they're pretty cheap at the moment. I really don't know which RH Dman could be worth giving them both up.

To me, our Tradable roster Dmen goes: 1.KIndl, 2.Lashoff (does his job, but easily sacrificed) 3.Quincey, 4.Ericsson

E is the only guy that has value and he's on a huge contract so no value to other teams. Our young guys on defense are not that good, I'm sorry. If you compare Smith with other teams "blue chip prospect" he is developing at a snail pace. I'm not trying to compare him to Ekbald or anything. Guys like Torey Krug and what not. Im sorry but Smith should be a little farther along I would have no confidence in assuming he can develop into a top 4 on a winning team Edited December 14, 2014 by joesuffP

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

E is the only guy that has value and he's on a huge contract so no value to other teams. Our young guys on defense are not that good, I'm sorry. If you compare Smith with other teams "blue chip prospect" he is developing at a snail pace. I'm not trying to compare him to Ekbald or anything. Guys like Torey Krug and what not. Im sorry but Smith should be a little farther along I would have no confidence in assuming he can develop into a top 4 on a winning team

Fine, you don't like Smith, but you proposed giving up Smith AND Dekeyser. I think that hurts us on defense. We might get a good top defender, but then we're top heavy. If you're going to give up 2 really good players at least make it a forward and a defensman. But anyway, I would be against pretty much anything involving Dekeyser.

[BottleOfSmoke 5,965]

Rumor has it that Yandle and Boedker can be had. The asking price for Yandle is rumored to be a top line guy, prospect, and second round pick. We've got a top line forward on our third line. No rumored asking price on Boedker. So...

Franzen, Helm, Kindl (or Andersson), Pulkkinen, 2nd

for

Yandle and Boedker

Which would give us

Nyquist-Z-Abby

Tatar-Pav-Boedker

Jurco-Sheahan-Weiss

Miller-Glendening-Andersson (or Callahan if Andersson went the other way)

Thoughts?

YOUR AVATAR

YES

carry on

[kipwinger 8,524]

YOUR AVATAR

YES

carry on

I knew you'd like it. I was waiting for your inevitable comment lol.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

The biggest problem I have with potentially getting Yandle is he shoots left. If they make a trade for defense or needs to be a RH one that can play the PP. Of trade Dekeyser or Smith as part of the package to bring that as long as it was a guy in his prime.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

The biggest problem I have with potentially getting Yandle is he shoots left. If they make a trade for defense or needs to be a RH one that can play the PP. Of trade Dekeyser or Smith as part of the package to bring that as long as it was a guy in his prime.

Said it before and I'll say it again bring in Boychuck in the of season or else something like Tatar or Jurco plus a 2nd for Myers

Edited December 15, 2014 by frankgrimes

[kipwinger 8,524]

Said it before and I'll say it again bring in Boychuck in the of season or else something like Tatar or Jurco plus a 2nd for Myers

We need an offensive, puck moving, d man who can quarterback the powerplay and you'd bring in a career stay at home defender or else a guy who's got about as many points as Jakub Kindl does this year (despite playing 25 minutes a night)?

Thank god you're not the GM of this team.

[Dabura 12,207]

Yandle is not better than Kronwall.

I didn't say he is.

Yandle wouldn't be our #1. I wouldn't want him facing the opposition's best. I wouldn't play him regularly on the PK. I'd give him relatively easy assignments and expect him to take full advantage. Sort of an exploitation role, not unlike how the kid line was used last season. I'd even consider going all the way with that and putting him on the third pairing.

Edited December 15, 2014 by Dabura

[joesuffP 1,746]

I feel like you guys are taking crazy pills. What makes you think Yandle refuses to play defense? And why is Kronwall suddenly some brilliant defensive player. He's been getting walked around routinely all season. Yandle steps on this team and he's our best defensemen, simple as that. I'm sure Babs and Holland already know that but I find it strange that LGW thinks every defensemen that doesn't play for the Red Wings suck and can't play defense. I swear you guys have gotten so used to our trash defense you forgot what having a good one is like. Puck possession starts at the defense and our whole game plan is centered around puck possession. Teams forecheck hard on our D and we lose, seen it over and over again.

[joesuffP 1,746]

Yandle-Ericsson

Kronwall-Dekeseyer

Now we finally have depth... the last pairing would have to consist of Smith/Quincey/Ouellette/Kindl with Lashoff as a 7th which makes a roster d man expendable which gets you Green. Bam RH power play specialist now we're lethal from the back end. Where does our defense scoring sit right now? Don't be fooled Yandle can handle playing defense against top lines when need be, but good thing Babs is a master of match ups and we will always have the puck

Edited December 15, 2014 by joesuffP

[Dabura 12,207]

The biggest problem I have with potentially getting Yandle is he shoots left. If they make a trade for defense or needs to be a RH one that can play the PP. Of trade Dekeyser or Smith as part of the package to bring that as long as it was a guy in his prime.

I'd be including one or two of our bottom three regulars - Quincey, Smith, Kindl - in the package. We'd still have a need for a righty, but we wouldn't necessarily need that righty to be a real stud.

Again, though, Green is probably preferable.

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

I'd be including one or two of our bottom three regulars - Quincey, Smith, Kindl - in the package. We'd still have a need for a righty, but we wouldn't necessarily need that righty to be a real stud.

Again, though, Green is probably preferable.

Saw this blog that suggests we could possibly get Green for a 2nd round pick. Do you think that's realistic? Cause I think we should do that deal if it is. He's a rental at this point, but I could see him resigning. No lost roster players. We could then flip Kindl for a lower pick.

http://www.mynhltraderumors.com/2014/12/12/nhl-rumors-ii-bruins-sabres-wings-leafs-oilers-and-blues/

Edited December 15, 2014 by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

Saw this blog that suggests we could possibly get Green for a 2nd round pick. Do you think that's realistic? Cause I think we should do that deal if it is. He's a rental at this point, but I could see him resigning. No lost roster players. We could then flip Kindl for a lower pick.

http://www.mynhltraderumors.com/2014/12/12/nhl-rumors-ii-bruins-sabres-wings-leafs-oilers-and-blues/

Something tells me that if that's all it would take it would be done.

We gave the preds a 2nd round pick and an undersized center, and a good fourth liner for David legwand.

Unless they're really going to try to get myers or yandle.

This one seems like a no brainer though.

If it is in fact all it would take to get Him.

[BottleOfSmoke 5,965]

Any trade that invloved moving Franzen would make me smile.

What if it was Franzen, Nyquist, Larionov, Probert and a first for Mike Ricci, Jiri Tlusty, and Olli Jokinen?

[Andy Pred 48 337]

This roster is one top D and power forward short of being a real contender in the playoffs. Not sure if we have enough assets to make the deals we need.

[Dominator2005 558]

**** that!!!! Please tell me thats false!?

Well Kenny offered: Nyquist, Smith and a 1st (Mantha) for Edler...

You never know

[Guest DeGraa55]

This roster is one top D and power forward short of being a real contender in the playoffs. Not sure if we have enough assets to make the deals we need.

No that's not even a debate. We HAVE the assets.

It's just a matter of do we want to trade any of Tatar nyquist smith dekeyser mrazek mantha Larkin etx etc

We have the assets. We just sit wanna give then up. Which is fine it just makes the rebuild a bit longer. Holland clearly feels more comfortable with building from within cause the strengths are scouting and player development not trading.