Do we need a trade to get our offence going ?

[joesuffP 1,746]

We have assets that other teams actually want. If you're not willing to trade your pick, Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Jurco, Mantha or Larkin you're not going to get anything. The list of "untouchables" on this team is getting longer and longer. If you can get Yandle without trading Nyquist, Tatar, Mantha or Larkin that's a good deal and we'll survive

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

We have assets that other teams actually want. If you're not willing to trade your pick, Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Jurco, Mantha or Larkin you're not going to get anything. The list of "untouchables" on this team is getting longer and longer. If you can get Yandle without trading Nyquist, Tatar, Mantha or Larkin that's a good deal and we'll survive

I just don't wanna give up Jurco or sheahan.

They're ours.

Or Anyone of our kids.

Edited December 16, 2014 by jimmyemeryhunter

[rick zombo 3,739]

As much as I agree nyquist would get the best return.

It's safe to say he is a lifer. He is the next great swede in the line after lids z now him for each generation of red wings.

I honestly don't see holland making any sort of major trade.

A. That's his history.

B. If he didn't make a trade when we REALY REALLY REALLY needed one. Why make one now when he is clearly confident in his in house guys and development? No sense in trade 2-4 prospects if he thinks they're going to pan out. It is better to just patient then.

I sort of agree with all of this.

But one thing I'll add is that Holland has never had the assets to make a major deal. Except maybe when Filpulla, Hudler, Kronwall and Howard were in GRs together. But even then, retaining those players suited the team's need.

Now Holland has more prospects than room, too many skilled forwards, and a glaring need for a legit D man.

This is why I DO see him making a major trade either at the deadline or in the summer. Unless he can get a guy like Green or Franson via UFA in July.

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

It seems like the CBj fans aren't too high on prout.

Hes right handed and physical.

Kindl for him straight up, then whatever trade we make well have two right handers.

[WingedWheel91 271]

I just had a good laugh at all of the experts on here who contributed to the "Fire Ken Holland" thread, but are now reluctant to part with any of our "overripe" prospects because all of the sudden "they like our team" too. And to everyone who understood that the current NHL landscape doesn't allow for any individual team to compete for the Stanley cup every year, please pat yourself on the back for defending him like I did.

As for a trade to "get our offense going" - We currently rank 6th in the NHL in GPG and 8th in PP% (all after scoring only 4 goals in 3 games in 4 nights). I think the question is "should we make a trade for a new goaltender who can make a save in a shootout?"... kidding.

[joesuffP 1,746]

I just don't wanna give up Jurco or sheahan.

They're ours.

Or Anyone of our kids.

Me too I love Sheahan more than anyone but I think Yandle is worth it and the defense has needed help for a long time Edited December 16, 2014 by joesuffP

[LeftWinger 4,959]

I find that Sheahan should be untouchable as well. If Nyquist is indeed a lifer, and I am fine with that, then the untouchable list should be this: (IMO)

Mantha, Larkin, Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Dekeyser, Ouellet, Sproul, Jensen, Mrazek, Athanasiou.

I would be ok (just ok, though) with giving up Jurco, Helm, Marchenko, Backman, Frk, Callahan, Ferraro, Janmark, Nedomlel, Franzen (of course, but I know better) and Smith. Only, ONLY because we need to give up to get and we have such a log jam at good prospects coming of age.

I am very cautious to put Marchenko and Nedomlel on this list because Marchenko being ranked our top D prospect (according to Hockey's Future) along with being right handed, and Nedomlel is a monster. I also like Jurco a TON and would be very upset to lose him, but again, if I am keeping Nyquist as a lifer, and he will get a SIGNIFICANT raise this summer, then there will have to be sacrifices. Just not Sheahan, PLEASE.

[LeftWinger 4,959]

Wingedwheel91 - I agree, and I am very critical of Holland, but as our kids develop and the GR and below kids get even better, the "need" for a trade gets less and less. But, if a deal comes up that is good for both teams and we are able to get a player for the playoffs, it would be interesting to see what transpires. I am usually not for rentals, but if Holland could get a pending UFA for a draft pick, then I wouldn't be against it. I am just tired of trading our future before we get to see them play. Let alone trading one of the players (Sheahan) who was a big reason we made the playoffs last season and a big reason we are where we are at now.

It's painful sometimes to watch the D struggle, what do you expect with guys like Kindl, Quincey and Lashoff out there (noted that Lashoff is a very good #7 and his cap hit is very friendly towards that as well) but if the likes of Ouellet (which we are seeing now,) Sproul and Jensen are NHL ready, we won't have to deal with the crappy D too much longer. Hence the reason a "rental" for the playoffs this season (at the price of a pick or a mid level prospect) wouldn't be half bad. I just hate that most GM's are so jealous of Holland & Co. that they are allowed to attempt rape when it comes to trade proposals. A big reason I would love to see an arbitrator system put back into place. Last season Holland was desperate and overpaid for Legwand. I hope and pray, that this season is different and Holland isn't forced to give up any top level prospect in order to just make the playoffs.

[Euro_Twins 4,476]

I just had a good laugh at all of the experts on here who contributed to the "Fire Ken Holland" thread, but are now reluctant to part with any of our "overripe" prospects because all of the sudden "they like our team" too. And to everyone who understood that the current NHL landscape doesn't allow for any individual team to compete for the Stanley cup every year, please pat yourself on the back for defending him like I did.

As for a trade to "get our offense going" - We currently rank 6th in the NHL in GPG and 8th in PP% (all after scoring only 4 goals in 3 games in 4 nights). I think the question is "should we make a trade for a new goaltender who can make a save in a shootout?"... kidding.

I jumped on the fire Ken Holland train. But I'm also one who is ok with trading assets for proven players like yandle. Holland didn't steer clear of over paying for trades or ufa's. He said he wouldn't over pay and then made every attempt to over pay but to no avail because no one wanted to come here. He didn't make a big trade, but he did trade a highly rated center prospect for a rental(which I was ok with). Holland says one thing and does another and if he doesn't get what he wants oh well cause he said he didn't want to do it in the first place right?

[number9 3,297]

I just had a good laugh at all of the experts on here who contributed to the "Fire Ken Holland" thread, but are now reluctant to part with any of our "overripe" prospects because all of the sudden "they like our team" too. And to everyone who understood that the current NHL landscape doesn't allow for any individual team to compete for the Stanley cup every year, please pat yourself on the back for defending him like I did.

As for a trade to "get our offense going" - We currently rank 6th in the NHL in GPG and 8th in PP% (all after scoring only 4 goals in 3 games in 4 nights). I think the question is "should we make a trade for a new goaltender who can make a save in a shootout?"... kidding.

August - THIS TEAM IS GOING NOWHERE! FIRE KEN HOLLAND! TRADE FOR *Insert name* OR TANK FOR MCDAVID!

December - No need to make any trades if we don't have to. Let's all just be patient and hold onto prospects and let them develop.

In a way I envy them. They truly live in the moment.

[LeftWinger 4,959]

why would they tank for McDavid? You know he wouldn't even sniff the NHL in Detroit for at least 3 years. Loyalty. The Goodness for Cleary and Quincey.

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

Oilers are actually considering dealing taylor hall ... Jimmy Howard's been amazing and I know I'll get slaughtered for this and I don't care I'll say it anyways

Howard In a package deal to Edmonton for taylor hall I'd do In a heartbeat and then give mrazek (who I think will be a future star) most of the workload with Gus as backup and if need be throw in fasth in case and send him to the minors (he's sucked this year in Edmonton but he did have a stretch where he was real good in Anaheim and provide insurance)

Having a player like taylor hall in detroit would be a huge move and give us more hope to finish off some games rather than always playing overtime

That being said I do think Edmonton is all talk and won't end up moving him anyways

[Dabura 12,207]

Oilers are actually considering dealing taylor hall ...

That's according to Darrren Dreger, who's basically a glorified troll.

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

That's according to Darrren Dreger, who's basically a glorified troll.

Heard it around the radio as well .. We'll see if they deal anyone but if they wanna improve the team they'll have to do a 3-4 for 1 type deal and hall and eberle have most value

[Guest DeGraa55]

Oilers are actually considering dealing taylor hall ... Jimmy Howard's been amazing and I know I'll get slaughtered for this and I don't care I'll say it anyways

Howard In a package deal to Edmonton for taylor hall I'd do In a heartbeat and then give mrazek (who I think will be a future star) most of the workload with Gus as backup and if need be throw in fasth in case and send him to the minors (he's sucked this year in Edmonton but he did have a stretch where he was real good in Anaheim and provide insurance)

Having a player like taylor hall in detroit would be a huge move and give us more hope to finish off some games rather than always playing overtime

That being said I do think Edmonton is all talk and won't end up moving him anyways

Trade them mrazek.

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

Trade them mrazek.

Neverrrrrrr

You'll regret it in 3 yrs when bettman changes playoff format to shootouts

[sjr2012 439]

we need to do something I mean clearly we have ppl we can move since we are playing 2 centers t wing most of the time think maybe we should consider packaging a center a D and maybe a prospect or draft pick for proven offense since right now Defense has been great

[Guest DeGraa55]

we need to do something I mean clearly we have ppl we can move since we are playing 2 centers t wing most of the time think maybe we should consider packaging a center a D and maybe a prospect or draft pick for proven offense since right now Defense has been great

But the problem is it's very hard to find that proven offense or elite sniper in trade.

We've seen like Ryan and vanek who yes would've helped but guys like that aren't moved all the time. A yes I would've like vanek for example but like Franzen when he isn't scoring he doesn't provide anything else at all. Which if were going to have that if prefer to have someone like ovi or Stamkos who can score 50+ goals a year.

But good luck ever finding that in a trade.

That's why I'm starting to believe were better off waiting. At least for now...who knows who will pop up on the trade market but we do need a top six winger. Maybe edm can be that partner....

[LeftWinger 4,959]

srj2012 - Yes, that would be a splendid idea. I would offer a package of Helm, Smith and Pulk to EDM for Hall. I touched on in the other thread. I doubt it would happen in this Rape Holland NHL, but really, those three are great building blocks, lots of NHL experience, a Stanley Cup under Helm's belt to boot! If Holland was able to swing that, and Hall proves to be "coachable" here in Detroit, our offense gets instantly better.

You then make the deadline deal for Green (if indeed all will take is a draft pick) and the Wings are sitting pretty.

Z - Dats - Hall

Franzen - Weiss - Nyquist

Jurco - Sheahan - Tatar

Miller - Glendening - Abby

Andy/Cleary

Kronwall - Ericsson

Green - Dekeyser

Quincey - Ouellet

Lashoff/Kindl

I do think that would be a very good (healthy) playoff roster.

(of course there's this thing called a Cap, I neglected to mention...LOL!)

They could for sure be able to absorb Hall's salary by dumping Smith's and Helm's, but they'd be a bit shy on being able to absorb Green's $6M at the deadline...they could dump Kindl as a throw-in for Green or extra in the Edmonton deal, but I think it would still be too much salary...Do the Hall deal.

GREAT NEWS!!! I was wrong! With Detroit's Deadline Cap Space of $9.1M they would have plenty of room for Hall and Green if they traded Helm, Smith and Kindl. They would actually have $2.8M left in cap space... I say do it! Make the Hall deal now, then acquire Green at the deadline.

Edited December 17, 2014 by LeftWinger

[DatsyukianDekes 2,428]

srj2012 - Yes, that would be a splendid idea. I would offer a package of Helm, Smith and Pulk to EDM for Hall. I touched on in the other thread. I doubt it would happen in this Rape Holland NHL, but really, those three are great building blocks, lots of NHL experience, a Stanley Cup under Helm's belt to boot! If Holland was able to swing that, and Hall proves to be "coachable" here in Detroit, our offense gets instantly better.

You then make the deadline deal for Green (if indeed all will take is a draft pick) and the Wings are sitting pretty.

Z - Dats - Hall

Franzen - Weiss - Nyquist

Jurco - Sheahan - Tatar

Miller - Glendening - Abby

Andy/Cleary

Kronwall - Ericsson

Green - Dekeyser

Quincey - Ouellet

Lashoff/Kindl

I do think that would be a very good (healthy) playoff roster.

Not even close to getting Hall with that package. Edm give up a top 5 winger in the NHL for...

Helm - 3rd liner at best

Smith - Top 6 D man (at best top 4).

Pulks - AHL winger who is currently unproven.

Realistic package will start with Tatar, Nyquist or Mantha, then ++

Edited December 17, 2014 by darkmanx

[trule23 119]

were not getting hall just stop lol

[DatsyukianDekes 2,428]

were not getting hall just stop lol

I agree, but let's be realistic if we are making proposals. This isn't NHL15 where you can just force trades.

[rick zombo 3,739]

were not getting hall just stop lol

Nor do we want him.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

were not getting hall just stop lol

I agree, but let's be realistic if we are making proposals. This isn't NHL15 where you can just force trades.

Well I guess if Hall is really on the block it would take something like Dekeyser, Goose and a first dinner to get the conversation started. Hall is one of the top Wingers in the game that guy won't come cheap

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Nor do we want him.

we don't?

Admittedly I can't see a scenario where the Wings could get Hall anytime soon, but I also can't imagine why the Wings wouldn't want him given the right deal.

Yes he plays a little recklessly and isn't great defensively, but I can't hold too much against him for any of that given the disaster that is the Edmonton Oilers. He still has maturing to do, and it's not gonna happen in Edmonton under the conditions there for the last few years.