Rank our griffins d prospects

[GoWings1905 2,694]

I'm most excited about Sproul because he has the most unique skill set of the bunch and provides something the Red Wings are sorely lacking. Ouellet has been extremely impressive while up in Detroit -- you would never have any idea he's only 21 because he is so composed and sound defensively. Not as good of a skater as DeKeyser, but Ouellet's presence kinda reminds me of DeKeyser's game.

I think Ouellet and Sproul are untouchables for me going forward, but I would be fine with using the other three as trade bait. The odds of all or any of them panning out are pretty low, plus you already have Smith, DeKeyser and Ericsson around in Detroit. That being said, Ouellet and Sproul probably have the most appeal, so they are going to be the names at the top of other teams desires in a potential trade too.

I like the direction the defense is heading in the next couple of years. The transition hasn't necessarily been smooth getting there, but once these guys start hitting the NHL, the Wings should be in good shape.

[LeftWinger 4,953]

Jensen is going to surprise a lot of folks. I just hope he earns a spot before he runs out of exemptions and we run into an "or else" situation...

[Jesusberg 1,256]

So, it looks like there's something to the rumors about Backman being unhappy, after all.

http://www.mlive.com/griffins/index.ssf/2014/12/organization_tries_to_control.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

To be honest, I'm a little torn. I really think Holland needs to step up and move Kindl now. This would allow Ouellet to play in Detroit, and create space down in GR for Backman and others to play on a more consistent basis.

On the other hand, is Backman going to complain every time he doesn't get the playing time he thinks he deserves? Is he going to threaten to bolt back to Sweden in 2-3 years if he's not getting regular time in Detroit?

“I play almost four years in Swedish league and played on national teams, so it’s kind of weird you don’t play here," Backman said. "In my opinion, the Swedish league is much better than here. But it’s like different hockey, so it’s hard to compare. You have to get used to the smaller rinks.”

To me, this quote screams a sense of entitlement. At the end of the day, I do think the onus is on Kenny to free up some room for both Ouellet and Backman. I think it's fair to be concerned about Backman's tone, though.

Edited December 17, 2014 by Jesusberg

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

So, it looks like there's something to the rumors about Backman being unhappy, after all.http://www.mlive.com/griffins/index.ssf/2014/12/organization_tries_to_control.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter To be honest, I'm a little torn. I really think Holland needs to step up and move Kindl now. This would allow Ouellet to play in Detroit, and create space down in GR for Backman and others to play on a more consistent basis. On the other hand, is Backman going to complain every time he doesn't get the playing time he thinks he deserves? Is he going to threaten to bolt back to Sweden in 2-3 years if he's not getting regular time in Detroit?“I play almost four years in Swedish league and played on national teams, so it’s kind of weird you don’t play here," Backman said. "In my opinion, the Swedish league is much better than here. But it’s like different hockey, so it’s hard to compare. You have to get used to the smaller rinks.” To me, this quote screams a sense of entitlement. At the end of the day, I do think the onus is on Kenny to free up some room for both Ouellet and Backman. I think it's fair to be concerned about Backman's tone, though.

Given what he says later in the article though it doesn't sound quite as bad.

For his part, Backman said he doesn’t want to be a distraction to the organization. He just wants an opportunity to play. “I want to develop,” he said. “I came here to play hockey and to develop and to someday make the NHL. That’s my base goal. But if I’m not playing, I won’t be able to get to a higher level. But I also know there are a lot of good players here, too … We have a pretty good team and pretty good guys here.”

But I wholeheartedly agree about Holland needing to move Kindl. Until now I hadn't really consider that it might be stunting someone else's progress in addition to XO's.

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

So, it looks like there's something to the rumors about Backman being unhappy, after all.

http://www.mlive.com/griffins/index.ssf/2014/12/organization_tries_to_control.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

To be honest, I'm a little torn. I really think Holland needs to step up and move Kindl now. This would allow Ouellet to play in Detroit, and create space down in GR for Backman and others to play on a more consistent basis.

On the other hand, is Backman going to complain every time he doesn't get the playing time he thinks he deserves? Is he going to threaten to bolt back to Sweden in 2-3 years if he's not getting regular time in Detroit?

“I play almost four years in Swedish league and played on national teams, so it’s kind of weird you don’t play here," Backman said. "In my opinion, the Swedish league is much better than here. But it’s like different hockey, so it’s hard to compare. You have to get used to the smaller rinks.”

To me, this quote screams a sense of entitlement. At the end of the day, I do think the onus is on Kenny to free up some room for both Ouellet and Backman. I think it's fair to be concerned about Backman's tone, though.

For me, it all depends on how he's been playing. If he's been playing well (Some struggles from the different ice size can be forgiven) then he should be in the lineup and the Wings could be at fault for signing too many AHL extras.

7 games is a lot of games to be scratched for a high prospect in the AHL. It's not like he's complaining about not being in Detroit.

Then again, all complaints like this should be taken to someone within the organization rather than the media.

P.S. Agree: move Kindl, promote Ouellet, then Backman gets time in GR. If we do upgrade the D by adding another Dman, Backman is in the same position.

Edited December 17, 2014 by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

[DickieDunn 2,571]

I'm pretty sure the Wings have Kindl on the block. If nobody wants him they can't trade him, though, and I don't think they want to put him through waivers.

[SpiritFan 37]

Winnipeg could be a great destination for someone like Kindl - with their defensive injuries & whatnot they could really use him. They are REALLY thin on the blueline right now. And they have the picks they could send back this way.

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

Why don't they just get rid of paetsch and/or evans and make room for the kids? It be nice to have some vets with the griffins but there not in the wings future plans

And while there at it get rid of hogan or someone else and make room for frk , how does it help frk to play 2 yrs in the echl , he should be with the other kids

Edited December 18, 2014 by nyqvististhefuture

[Buppy 1,720]

While I certainly wouldn't object to getting rid of Kindl, I don't think we need to be so concerned about trying to manufacture an opportunity for Backman. It's not like he's buried behind 6 blue-chip studs. 4 not-too-dissimilar prospects and 2 career AHLers. If he can't win a regular spot in that situation, why should we care whether he's happy or not.

[matt198913 932]

I think Sproul gives you the most offense.I do like me some Marchenko though.

[krsmith17 7,191]

I'm not worried about Backman, he will be fine. But I do agree that Ouellet needs to get up with the big club full time. Why Kindl is still on this team is beyond me. We're not going to get much of a return for him but I believe he can still be a serviceable defenseman on several other clubs. There are 3 teams that I think could use help on the back end right now, due to lack of depth or injury. The Oilers need help at every position, but mostly on the back end. Kindl could be a good fit there. The Islanders and Jets could also use a little help on their back end right now, because of injuries. Any of these teams could have him for a mid to late round draft pick or even future considerations. We can bare to lose the "asset", the roster spot should be more important to us right now.

[RyanBarnes! 293]

Why don't they just get rid of paetsch and/or evans and make room for the kids? It be nice to have some vets with the griffins but there not in the wings future plans

And while there at it get rid of hogan or someone else and make room for frk , how does it help frk to play 2 yrs in the echl , he should be with the other kids

You cannot get rid of all veterans. Someone has to teach the kids how it works.

[Jesusberg 1,256]

I'm not worried about Backman, he will be fine. But I do agree that Ouellet needs to get up with the big club full time. Why Kindl is still on this team is beyond me. We're not going to get much of a return for him but I believe he can still be a serviceable defenseman on several other clubs. There are 3 teams that I think could use help on the back end right now, due to lack of depth or injury. The Oilers need help at every position, but mostly on the back end. Kindl could be a good fit there. The Islanders and Jets could also use a little help on their back end right now, because of injuries. Any of these teams could have him for a mid to late round draft pick or even future considerations. We can bare to lose the "asset", the roster spot should be more important to us right now.

I think they'd all be good suitors, as well. The biggest issue with moving Kindl, I believe, is the term on his deal. One less year on his deal and he's gone by now, IMO. The Jets seem like a perfect place for him to go, considering a lot of their injuries have some term on them, and they have plenty of cap space.

Rumors have them offering a bottom six player (Thorburn, Halischuk, Peluso, Galiardi) in return for a defender. I'd prefer a pick, but at this point I want that roster spot cleared up above all else.

[Red Crazy 201]

I think they'd all be good suitors, as well. The biggest issue with moving Kindl, I believe, is the term on his deal. One less year on his deal and he's gone by now, IMO. The Jets seem like a perfect place for him to go, considering a lot of their injuries have some term on them, and they have plenty of cap space.

Rumors have them offering a bottom six player (Thorburn, Halischuk, Peluso, Galiardi) in return for a defender. I'd prefer a pick, but at this point I want that roster spot cleared up above all else.

I wouldn`t mind Thorburn if we couldnt get a pick.`Nice to have a toughness option

[amato 3,210]

I think they'd all be good suitors, as well. The biggest issue with moving Kindl, I believe, is the term on his deal. One less year on his deal and he's gone by now, IMO. The Jets seem like a perfect place for him to go, considering a lot of their injuries have some term on them, and they have plenty of cap space.

Rumors have them offering a bottom six player (Thorburn, Halischuk, Peluso, Galiardi) in return for a defender. I'd prefer a pick, but at this point I want that roster spot cleared up above all else.

There's definitely a need there for d-men, that's for sure.

On Thursday, the club announced that veteran rearguard Mark Stuart would be out of the lineup ’til February with a lower-body injury, making him the fourth defenseman the club has lost for a significant length of time.

Jacob Trouba is out ’til February as well with an upper-body injury, while Tobias Enstrom (lower body) and Zach Bogosian (lower-body) aren’t expected back until early- to mid-January.

(edit: source) http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2014/12/18/jets-lose-yet-another-d-man-rule-stuart-out-til-february/

They might settle for a pick rather than moving a bottom 6 player.

I'm sure Kenny is looking into it.

Edited December 18, 2014 by amato

[Jesusberg 1,256]

They just traded a 6th rounder to Carolina for Jay Harrison. Carolina is retaining 25% of his salary (1.5 million). Seriously?

[Dabura 12,207]

While I certainly wouldn't object to getting rid of Kindl, I don't think we need to be so concerned about trying to manufacture an opportunity for Backman. It's not like he's buried behind 6 blue-chip studs. 4 not-too-dissimilar prospects and 2 career AHLers. If he can't win a regular spot in that situation, why should we care whether he's happy or not.

Backman's pretty much behind Kindl, Lashoff, Ouellet, Marchenko, Jensen, Sproul (and probably Hicketts, if he were in the AHL right now); he's the lowest man on the totem pole. If Ouellet - who's already better than Kindl - isn't going to be a true regular on the parent club until next season (and even then, tell me you can't see him starting next season on the farm), I can undersand why Backman might be feeling a little disillusioned with The Process. Why should we care? Because he's an asset with good potential. We used a draft pick on him. We picked him, not the other way around. Do we want this to start becoming a thing? D prospects saying, "Y'know, I'd rather take my chances elsewhere"? Maybe the Blackhawks can afford to lose a number of very good prospects for nothing, but the Wings can't. I'm not saying Holland needs to panic because O NOES BACKMAN IS UNHAPPY, but he can't take the "OK, well, have fun in Europe. We don't need you anyway" approach. Lord knows UFAs aren't dying to play for the Wings, so prospects becoming disillusioned with our over-long Process is kind of the last thing we want right now.

[Buppy 1,720]

Backman's pretty much behind Kindl, Lashoff, Ouellet, Marchenko, Jensen, Sproul (and probably Hicketts, if he were in the AHL right now); he's the lowest man on the totem pole. If Ouellet - who's already better than Kindl - isn't going to be a true regular on the parent club until next season (and even then, tell me you can't see him starting next season on the farm), I can undersand why Backman might be feeling a little disillusioned with The Process. Why should we care? Because he's an asset with good potential. We used a draft pick on him. We picked him, not the other way around. Do we want this to start becoming a thing? D prospects saying, "Y'know, I'd rather take my chances elsewhere"? Maybe the Blackhawks can afford to lose a number of very good prospects for nothing, but the Wings can't. I'm not saying Holland needs to panic because O NOES BACKMAN IS UNHAPPY, but he can't take the "OK, well, have fun in Europe. We don't need you anyway" approach. Lord knows UFAs aren't dying to play for the Wings, so prospects becoming disillusioned with our over-long Process is kind of the last thing we want right now.

He's also behind Kronwall, Ericsson, Dekeyser, Smith, Quincey, and apparently, Paetch and Evans.

If he's our 5th best prospect currently in the AHL, the chances of him ever sniffing the Wings are practically nil, whether he's playing every night or not. You can say he's a very good prospect, but don't gloss over that he's also apparently unable to win a regular spot in an AHL lineup at the moment.

Prospects wash out all the time. All over the league. 5th round picks do so much more often than not. I bet Gleason Fournier wasn't too happy that he sucked too much for the AHL, but he wasn't European so no one wrote a story about it. Did anyone here care? We feeling that loss? The pool of future NHL players is not going to say to themselves, "Hey, this one time, there was this one 5th round pick who couldn't win a regular AHL spot, and the Wings didn't go out of their way to make it easier for him. Those dicks, I'll never play there."

It's not about anyone being over-ripe, or our development process taking too long, or any unfair treatment. There are spots in GR besides Ouellet's. If Backman can't win one of those other 5, he should be unhappy with himself, not with the organization.

While my "why should we care" comment may have been flippant, and I'd certainly expect the organization to show more tact, I would much rather see them say, "Suck it up. Play better or have fun in Europe." than "Oh, sorry it's too hard for you, let me get one of these better players out of your way so you can play every day.".

[Ekmanc 586]

I don't know how much chance you've been given to "win a spot" when you've been benched for 7 out of your first 20-ish games.

[nawein 324]

I don't know how much chance you've been given to "win a spot" when you've been benched for 7 out of your first 20-ish games.

By my calculations that's 13-ish chances.

[Ekmanc 586]

By my calculations that's 13-ish chances.

Which isn't much for a guy who has played his entire career on big ice. Bäckman has quite a good resumé and if we can't even make room for him to get some security and learn in the AHL we are going to end up regretting it.

[nawein 324]

Which isn't much for a guy who has played his entire career on big ice. Bäckman has quite a good resumé and if we can't even make room for him to get some security and learn in the AHL we are going to end up regretting it.

No I agree with you entirely. I was just being a smart***. He needs more time and he'll play in the NHL. I fully believe that.

[amato 3,210]

They just traded a 6th rounder to Carolina for Jay Harrison. Carolina is retaining 25% of his salary (1.5 million). Seriously?

looks like 30%

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Craig CustanceVerified account‏@CraigCustance

Told that Carolina is retaining 30 percent of Jay Harrison's salary in trade with Winnipeg.

Also, seeing that Paul Maurice used to coach him in Carolina.... so he's a known commodity. That could've had something to do with it.

[Jesusberg 1,256]

He's also behind Kronwall, Ericsson, Dekeyser, Smith, Quincey, and apparently, Paetch and Evans.

If he's our 5th best prospect currently in the AHL, the chances of him ever sniffing the Wings are practically nil, whether he's playing every night or not. You can say he's a very good prospect, but don't gloss over that he's also apparently unable to win a regular spot in an AHL lineup at the moment.

Prospects wash out all the time. All over the league. 5th round picks do so much more often than not. I bet Gleason Fournier wasn't too happy that he sucked too much for the AHL, but he wasn't European so no one wrote a story about it. Did anyone here care? We feeling that loss? The pool of future NHL players is not going to say to themselves, "Hey, this one time, there was this one 5th round pick who couldn't win a regular AHL spot, and the Wings didn't go out of their way to make it easier for him. Those dicks, I'll never play there."

It's not about anyone being over-ripe, or our development process taking too long, or any unfair treatment. There are spots in GR besides Ouellet's. If Backman can't win one of those other 5, he should be unhappy with himself, not with the organization.

While my "why should we care" comment may have been flippant, and I'd certainly expect the organization to show more tact, I would much rather see them say, "Suck it up. Play better or have fun in Europe." than "Oh, sorry it's too hard for you, let me get one of these better players out of your way so you can play every day.".

I agree with some of your points, but I see things another way on others. Let me preface this by saying that I don't like Backman's tone, and I don't think any player should try to "strong-arm" his way into the line-up by suggesting he'll go elsewhere. That being said...

Backman being the "5th best" prospect in the NHL has less to do with him, and more to do with the talent in front of him. Coming into the year, I don't even think Jensen was on anyone's radar - certainly not mine. Him being unable to get a spot on the blueline right now could have something to do with how Blashill feels about his vets - or wanting to create pairings that are to his liking. Don't quote me on this, but I think he and Sproul were being used as a pairing at one time, and it just didn't take. My point is, there may be an element of circumstance and coaching blended in here, not just Backman's individual talents.

I really don't think Fournier and Backman are the same guy. Fournier looked great in the QMJHL, but never took in the AHL, or the ECHL for that matter. As much as I dislike that he brought it up, the SEL really is a much better league. Backman played well in a men's league, not one in the CHL. It's unfortunate that Fournier didn't pan out, though... I actually liked his game.

Fact is, I do think they have one too many AHL vets on the back-end there. They could have gone without Evans and kept Nedomlel up as the extra in GR. I'm not advocating giving Backman a spot because he's whining and deserves one, but I do think he actually needs regular ice time to adjust to play in North America. Not getting in playing time here really could hurt his long-term game. As I said, I think he's going about it the wrong way, though. This should have been an internal matter.

looks like 30%

Also, seeing that Paul Maurice used to coach him in Carolina.... so he's a known commodity. That could've had something to do with it.

I saw the 30% yesterday, but didn't think to fix it on here. The Maurice connection didn't even occur to me. Makes more sense now.

[Buppy 1,720]

...

Fact is, I do think they have one too many AHL vets on the back-end there. They could have gone without Evans and kept Nedomlel up as the extra in GR. I'm not advocating giving Backman a spot because he's whining and deserves one, but I do think he actually needs regular ice time to adjust to play in North America. Not getting in playing time here really could hurt his long-term game. As I said, I think he's going about it the wrong way, though. This should have been an internal matter.

I get it, and yeah it seems odd that a developmental team would give a spot to a non-prospect over one with decent potential.

But we also have 5 decent prospects who all run out of waiver exemption after next season, plus two kids on the roster, plus two vets under contract and worth keeping. All of our prospects aren't going to play in Detroit even if they all prove to be good enough. Two or three maybe.