cnot19 191 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 By that rationale we should be ok with it if one of our guys cheap shots someone in the head. Ya know, because other people do it too. I'm a proponent of having higher standards than that. Honestly I am not gonna murder someone over a headshot, it happens when playing a physical game, something I wish the wings did Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Smart enough to be more subtle about it, maybe, but more or less yeah. I think there's a pretty big difference between saying all players will get away with as much as they can, and saying all players will trap a guy's stick between their legs, jump straight up in the air, and fall down as if shot. 2 haroldsnepsts and cnot19 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wheelchairsuperhero 1,453 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Diving, or at least embellishment, is already commonplace and accepted. Several times every game. A lot of it minor, like throwing up the arms or throwing the head back when being hooked/held or high-sticked, some blatant like this dive, some subtle, like clamping an elbow over someone's stick to embellish a hook... Like the old axiom, "if you ain't cheating, you ain't trying". Embellishment works, plain and simple. Everyone does it. Some worse than others of course, but even Pav and Hank do it. Nick, Yzerman... I really doubt there's even a single player who won't try to get one over on the refs if he thinks he can. Players should be ashamed of themselves, but on the other hand I can't really blame them. Winning is everything after all. Kudos though to the league for finally trying to do something about it. Not going far enough I think, but at least it's a start. Personally, I don't think it will end until it's no longer effective. Embellishment should negate the original penalty, or be a double-minor if there was no penalty. And if a team gets caught doing it too often they should lose points. That bit about clamping the elbow over a stick to draw a hooking penalty is something I've noticed Zetterberg do quite a bit and it's something that always bothered me. Or just casually grabbing the defenders stick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Diving, or at least embellishment, is already commonplace and accepted. Several times every game. A lot of it minor, like throwing up the arms or throwing the head back when being hooked/held or high-sticked, some blatant like this dive, some subtle, like clamping an elbow over someone's stick to embellish a hook... Like the old axiom, "if you ain't cheating, you ain't trying". Embellishment works, plain and simple. Everyone does it. Some worse than others of course, but even Pav and Hank do it. Nick, Yzerman... I really doubt there's even a single player who won't try to get one over on the refs if he thinks he can. Players should be ashamed of themselves, but on the other hand I can't really blame them. Winning is everything after all. Kudos though to the league for finally trying to do something about it. Not going far enough I think, but at least it's a start. Personally, I don't think it will end until it's no longer effective. Embellishment should negate the original penalty, or be a double-minor if there was no penalty. And if a team gets caught doing it too often they should lose points. Part of the problem is the lack of consistency from the refs. I know I sound like an old grouch (and it's not completely unfounded) but they don't manage the games and players as well as they used to. The game against the Canucks the refs were calling all sorts of really soft penalties, and the embellishing definitely picked up as a result. Which reminds me, shouldn't we hear about Kassian getting fined for diving? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 (edited) Bad Nyquist bad bad. That being said, how many times have Ryan "Tumbleweed" Kesler or Pavelski been fined? Is it 10? The answer better be 10. Also, I should add: if the NHL is serious about getting rid of the dives, then stop calling the initial friggin infraction too. Just send one guy to the box for unsportsmanlike. Then the other team can point at him and laugh, and then score on the PP. Edited January 8, 2015 by rick zombo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 I think there's a pretty big difference between saying all players will get away with as much as they can, and saying all players will trap a guy's stick between their legs, jump straight up in the air, and fall down as if shot. Well, that isn't what I said, so... $2000 for embellishment. Pay up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 I think there's a pretty big difference between saying all players will get away with as much as they can, and saying all players will trap a guy's stick between their legs, jump straight up in the air, and fall down as if shot. What worries me is that Nyquist essentially got fined for being bad at diving. If he was a real pro like Kesler, we wouldn't even be talking about this right now. 1 WingsAlways reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WingsAlways 486 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Clearly deserved and unprofessional. He needs to spend some time at Sidney Crosby's diving camp before he can successfully pull off a stunt like that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Euro_Twins 4,476 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Should be more. He makes 950,000 a year. Should be $10,000 minimum fine, if the league is actually serious about it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Well, that isn't what I said, so... $2000 for embellishment. Pay up. I know. Which is why there aren't any quotation marks in my post. I'm telling you, I think there's a difference in what you described (players get away with as much as they can), and what I saw in the Nyquist video (jumping up and falling down like a girl). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Also, how the hell did Kassian not get fined for his dive against Franzen on Saturday? I'd love to see a league breakdown of what constitutes a fine-worthy dive, much like the Shanaban head-shot videos. Those would be pretty fun to watch Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 What worries me is that Nyquist essentially got fined for being bad at diving. If he was a real pro like Kesler, we wouldn't even be talking about this right now. I don't know. Kesler could use some more finesse to his dives as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brett 1,029 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 2000 is a lot for me. chump change for him. it really looked like he was leaning against the devils player and the devils player moved and nyquist wasnt expecting it and he fell over Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 I don't know. Kesler could use some more finesse to his dives as well. Ha. Thd 2nd one is the source of that great collection of Kesler dive gifs. http://vansunsportsblogs.com/2012/04/18/the-six-best-ryan-kesler-tumbleweed-gifs/ That's why I referred to him as Tumbleweed in an earlier post. 1 BottleOfSmoke reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nevermind 363 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 You're forgetting Smith. He's had a couple doozies. Updated my list. Just a couple years ago it was only Franzen and maybe Abdelkader. Not liking this new direction we're headed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 What worries me is that Nyquist essentially got fined for being bad at diving. If he was a real pro like Kesler, we wouldn't even be talking about this right now. The first fine handed out for diving was to James Neal, a notorious diver. Like I said, the league has only given out two so far. They'll get around to the other culprits in due time as long as they keep emphasizing this rule like they are now. I mean, none of us even knew Nyquist had got a warning right? So god knows how many other people have been warned once already. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Updated my list. Just a couple years ago it was only Franzen and maybe Abdelkader. Not liking this new direction we're headed. Agreed. We're not talking about someone like Maltby who would try to get people to punch him in the face. This is some of the Wings top players who are diving. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,524 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Ha. Thd 2nd one is the source of that great collection of Kesler dive gifs. http://vansunsportsblogs.com/2012/04/18/the-six-best-ryan-kesler-tumbleweed-gifs/ That's why I referred to him as Tumbleweed in an earlier post. The baby duck gif slays me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Agreed. We're not talking about someone like Maltby who would try to get people to punch him in the face. This is some of the Wings top players who are diving. Harold, aren't you a Kings fan sort of? What's your opinion of their captain? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arag 308 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Embarrassing! And it had to happen against the Bruins. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Harold, aren't you a Kings fan sort of? What's your opinion of their captain? Love-hate. Good player. Wish he didn't dive, especially given the C on his sweater. I haven't noticed him doing it as much as in years past, but someone who draws as many penalties as he does definitely embellishes. And he's had some questionable hits. I don't think he's hunting knees per se but he's following through on some hits that he should've bailed on. But he's also a gutsy player who has a ton of heart. Hits hard, works hard, and can chip in some goals. Truth be told I think Kopitar should be the captain but that may just be that he's more in the mold of the Red Wings captains. 1 rick zombo reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaps80 1,591 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 (edited) LOL@ that dive. Come on Nyquist... I don't know. Kesler could use some more finesse to his dives as well. LOLLLLLLLLL Edited January 8, 2015 by chaps80 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Pathetic. If Babcock is serious about this (which he's not), he should at the very least be demoted. Personally I think he should sit for a game. Diving and embellishing is an embarrassment to the individual player, the coach, and the organization as a whole. I detest nothing more about the way hockey is "developing" than the way diving and embellishing is basically commonplace. Total garbage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BottleOfSmoke 5,965 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 Ha. Thd 2nd one is the source of that great collection of Kesler dive gifs. http://vansunsportsblogs.com/2012/04/18/the-six-best-ryan-kesler-tumbleweed-gifs/ That's why I referred to him as Tumbleweed in an earlier post. This is one of my favorite memes of all time. And I've been on the internet a loooong time. Not happy about the diving direction of this team either. I don't give a s*** if other teams do it. We're not other teams, and it's a punk ass move. Get an advantage because you're better, not because you're flopping around like a pansy. 2 rick zombo and kipwinger reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted January 8, 2015 (edited) Well. No dives tonight. Except for the Calgary dude on Quincey’s penalty. Edited January 8, 2015 by rick zombo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
