Team next season?

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Like I said earlier, anyone who expects or wants major changes is probably going to be disappointed.

Unless Franzen tells the Wings that he's done, there's no room for Cole, and they don't need to sign an older injury prone player to a contract anyway. That's if Cole even decides to come back. If I were him, I'd seriously think about calling it quits while I was still able to walk.

[rick zombo 3,739]

Like I said earlier, anyone who expects or wants major changes is probably going to be disappointed.

Unless Franzen tells the Wings that he's done, there's no room for Cole, and they don't need to sign an older injury prone player to a contract anyway. That's if Cole even decides to come back. If I were him, I'd seriously think about calling it quits while I was still able to walk.

I think the Phanuef deal happens before the draft. That's a major change.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

I think the Phanuef deal happens before the draft. That's a major change.

I don't see it happening unless the Leafs change their demands

[rick zombo 3,739]

I don't see it happening unless the Leafs change their demands

He's gone from Toronto. 100%. The only issue is that some other team may shed some salary and out-bid the Wings.

But my impression from the deadline was that there just wasn't enough time to work out a deal of this magnitude.

[ami 273]

After last night game vs MTL, I hope Babcock is out comes July.

Yes, Wings clinched. Frankly, I've had little doubt they will.

The question how they did it.... How they have played last couple seasons, last couple games.

It frustrates me more each game - dump-and-chase tactics, enter the zone and dump it, and chase, chase, chase...

Last game I calculated how many times they dump-and-chase and how many times they've got a possession after that. Less then 30%!!!

This team used to play smart hockey, now they are dumb and dumper.

Can Babcock do better?

If he can - then show us something smarter in the next 5 games, please...

If no, then, after these five remaining games - team should say: thank you, coach and good luck to you too!

Edited April 10, 2015 by ami

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

After last night game vs MTL, I hope Babcock is out comes July.

Yes, Wings clinched. Frankly, I've had little doubt they will.

The question how they did it.... How they have played last couple seasons, last couple games.

It frustrates me more each game - dump-and-chase tactics, enter the zone and dump it, and chase, chase, chase...

Last game I calculated how many times they dump-and-chase and how many times they've got a possession after that. Less then 30%!!!

This team used to play smart hockey, now they are dumb and dumper.

Can Babcock do better?

If he can - then show us something smarter in the next 5 games, please...

If no, then, after these five remaining games - team should say: thank you, coach and good luck to you too!

Of course you mean the remaining 17+ games.

I get what you're saying on Babcock, though. I'm on the fence about him. There have been a lot of things recently that have reflected poorly on the coach. Even beyond play - The number of too many men penalties, for instance. Then again, people were saying this was Babcock's Jack Adams year at the halfway mark. I think a better assessment is somewhere in the middle. There's no guaranteed better option so it would be a big decision.

Edited April 11, 2015 by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

Umm just watched off the record here in canada and they mentioned sj and how changes need to be done and thornton needs to be gone

Now I don't think it'll ever happen but if he could be had for a cheap price although his cap hits pretty high and he's 35 he only has 2 yrs left and everyone knows what a great passer thornton is and im picturing a line of Tatar thornton nyquist doing some serious damage ... And if we add Phaneuf , lineup looks something like ...

Abdelkader datsyuk zetterberg

Tatar thornton nyquist

Helm sheahan pulkkinen

Miller glendening jurco

Kronwall Phaneuf

Dekeyser Ericsson

Zidlicky marchenko

Thoughts?

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

Umm just watched off the record here in canada and they mentioned sj and how changes need to be done and thornton needs to be gone

Now I don't think it'll ever happen but if he could be had for a cheap price although his cap hits pretty high and he's 35 he only has 2 yrs left and everyone knows what a great passer thornton is and im picturing a line of Tatar thornton nyquist doing some serious damage ... And if we add Phaneuf , lineup looks something like ...

Abdelkader datsyuk zetterberg

Tatar thornton nyquist

Helm sheahan pulkkinen

Miller glendening jurco

Kronwall Phaneuf

Dekeyser Ericsson

Zidlicky marchenko

Thoughts?

Wed be old.

[Ekmanc 586]

I honestly don't think they'll get rid of Thornton.

[derblaueClaus 1,668]

Umm just watched off the record here in canada and they mentioned sj and how changes need to be done and thornton needs to be gone

Now I don't think it'll ever happen but if he could be had for a cheap price although his cap hits pretty high and he's 35 he only has 2 yrs left and everyone knows what a great passer thornton is and im picturing a line of Tatar thornton nyquist doing some serious damage ... And if we add Phaneuf , lineup looks something like ...

Abdelkader datsyuk zetterberg

Tatar thornton nyquist

Helm sheahan pulkkinen

Miller glendening jurco

Kronwall Phaneuf

Dekeyser Ericsson

Zidlicky marchenko

Thoughts?

If that's the way to give Thornton a pantstrick (= 4 goals) I'm in favor of doing it.

[LeftWinger 4,958]

That would be a TON of salary with the RFA's that need to be re-signed this season AND next. Anyhow, if Holland were picking apples from the Sharks, I can almost gurantee he's be pick Marleau over Thornton...just my opinion because Holland has for a long time now, be in the rumors concerning Marleau...Not that I would chose him, but frankly, I think getting Joe and Dion would most certainly cost us to lose a couple of our prized RFA's due to cap issues.

[Jesusberg 1,256]

At this point, I think it's more likely that San Jose will let Doug Wilson go before Joe Thornton.

IMO, the changes they need to make are in the bottom-six, and perhaps moving Burns back up to forward. The point totals are there, but quite a few Sharks bloggers/journalists have criticized his defensive play and how he was used this season. At one point, he was on SJ's third pairing. He just seems to be a better forward than defenseman.

Edited April 11, 2015 by Jesusberg

[Andy Pred 48 337]

I really think that the D is going to have a major overhaul, at least 3 changes

[joesuffP 1,746]

I think Smith gets packaged along with a small forward like Pulks.

Plus we really need to do whatever it takes to move Weiss

There will be options out there with teams like San Jose, LA and possibly Pitts looking to retool

I like the Phaneuf deal because Toronto wants out of that deal so bad it brings his value way down. Takin his whole salary is trade in itself

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Weiss's value in Detroit is going to be heavily dependent on what Babcock does. If there's a new coach who will play him at center with some skilled players instead off where ever there's a guy out of the lineup, Weiss is going to provide value. If Babcock is back and he's going to keep using him the way he is now, Weiss has very little value and needs to be moved for whatever they can get.

[Jesusberg 1,256]

Weiss's value in Detroit is going to be heavily dependent on what Babcock does. If there's a new coach who will play him at center with some skilled players instead off where ever there's a guy out of the lineup, Weiss is going to provide value. If Babcock is back and he's going to keep using him the way he is now, Weiss has very little value and needs to be moved for whatever they can get.

Exactly, which is why I'm at a total loss in regards to how Babcock has used him this year. If you're that low on Weiss, at least let him boost his trade value.

[mvanpop 98]

A suggestion that keeps being made is package Weiss in a deal for Phaneuf. If Toronto really wants Babcock why would they acquire a player he doesn't like. They would take Glendening over him. That might be why the trade didn't happen at the deadline. They don't want to deter Babcock

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

At this point, I think it's more likely that San Jose will let Doug Wilson go before Joe Thornton.

IMO, the changes they need to make are in the bottom-six, and perhaps moving Burns back up to forward. The point totals are there, but quite a few Sharks bloggers/journalists have criticized his defensive play and how he was used this season. At one point, he was on SJ's third pairing. He just seems to be a better forward than defenseman.

f*** Brent burns is awesome if we somehow got him it be amaze balls

Exactly, which is why I'm at a total loss in regards to how Babcock has used him this year. If you're that low on Weiss, at least let him boost his trade value.

Can't boost his trade if he does nothing ... I'm sorry guys but weiss had those 2 decent seasons in Florida cause he got all the ice time and ppl time there , he's just not that good ... Didn't like the signing from day 1 and certainly not now

Babcock isn't a dumbass ... If weiss was producing and could he'd be our number 2 center right now

[joesuffP 1,746]

Babs just hates Weiss for no reason. It has nothing to do with him consistently being one of our worst forwards every night

[kickazz 5,459]

Babcock isn't a dumbass ... If weiss was producing and could he'd be our number 2 center right now

Weiss has a better PPG than our current #2 center. Sheahan. There's more to it than just production. Seems like Babs just doesnt like the guy. We really don't know what happens behind the scenes. Maybe he dislikes Weiss's work ethic during practices or in the locker room. Who fricking knows.

[VM1138 1,921]

I think it really is just that Weiss is a turnover liability. Weiss works hard, he just isn't defensively sound and we all know that that is Babcock's first priority, even over scoring.

[Echolalia 2,961]

Weiss has a better PPG than our current #2 center. Sheahan. There's more to it than just production. Seems like Babs just doesnt like the guy. We really don't know what happens behind the scenes. Maybe he dislikes Weiss's work ethic during practices or in the locker room. Who fricking knows.

You're right, there is more to it than production. It also has to do with lack of responsibility with the puck, consistent turnovers and losses of possession when he's out there, particulalry in the offensive zone, being a non factor along the boards and in the corners, having no defensive game, no ability to retrieve loose pucks or force turnovers. You can point to just about any facet of the game and Weiss has been below average.

This is necessarily directed at you, but I'm shocked that there are so many Weiss apologists on the boards given everything the guy has shown us. Especially considering how quickly people turn on players like Howard, Smith, Ericsson, etc and go out of their way to look for ways to blame them, you'd think there would be more people who can just say "Weiss has not been good." I was as excited as anyone when the Wings signed him, but it hasn't been working out for him, and at this point I would be very nervous to see Weiss playing in the top six, against top six opposition.

[kickazz 5,459]

You're right, there is more to it than production. It also has to do with lack of responsibility with the puck, consistent turnovers and losses of possession when he's out there, particulalry in the offensive zone, being a non factor along the boards and in the corners, having no defensive game, no ability to retrieve loose pucks or force turnovers. You can point to just about any facet of the game and Weiss has been below average.

This is necessarily directed at you, but I'm shocked that there are so many Weiss apologists on the boards given everything the guy has shown us. Especially considering how quickly people turn on players like Howard, Smith, Ericsson, etc and go out of their way to look for ways to blame them, you'd think there would be more people who can just say "Weiss has not been good." I was as excited as anyone when the Wings signed him, but it hasn't been working out for him, and at this point I would be very nervous to see Weiss playing in the top six, against top six opposition.

I'm not a huge fan of Weiss's play but I'm also an objective individual. While it's true that Weiss is a turn over machine etc etc, it's also true that Ericsson is terrible at his position as well. Yet Babcock insists on keeping him as a top 2 defenseman and Weiss as a 4th liner? The point I'm trying to make is that Babs definitely plays favorites and it's costing us more than its helping us as of late. I don't necessarily mean Weiss. I mean in terms of other players on the roster such as Smith, Ericsson, Anderson.

If Weiss isn't as defensively sound then move him to winger would make sense. But then to the 4th line grind line? How does that add up? Isn't the 4th line supposed to do just that? Be defensive and grind with full energy. Nah Babs doesn't make sense to me with the Weiss situation. It's obvious he doesn't like the guy regardless of his on-ice screw ups. If it were truly the play style then Ericsson would be benched 70% of the games with Marchenko in the lineup.

Mind you I am a huge fan of Babcock.

Edited April 11, 2015 by kickazz

[kickazz 5,459]

I think it really is just that Weiss is a turnover liability. Weiss works hard, he just isn't defensively sound and we all know that that is Babcock's first priority, even over scoring.

Weiss was never known for his defensive prowess and they knew that before signing him. They needed a center to produce points after 2013 because they wanted Hank and Pav to play together on a line.

[Echolalia 2,961]

I'm not a huge fan of Weiss's play but I'm also an objective individual. While it's true that Weiss is a turn over machine etc etc, it's also true that Ericsson is terrible at his position as well. Yet Babcock insists on keeping him as a top 2 defenseman and Weiss as a 4th liner? The point I'm trying to make is that Babs definitely plays favorites and it's costing us more than its helping us as of late. I don't necessarily mean Weiss. I mean in terms of other players on the roster such as Smith, Ericsson, Anderson.

If Weiss isn't as defensively sound then move him to winger would make sense. But then to the 4th line grind line? How does that add up? Isn't the 4th line supposed to do just that? Be defensive and grind with full energy. Nah Babs doesn't make sense to me with the Weiss situation. It's obvious he doesn't like the guy regardless of his on-ice screw ups. If it were truly the play style then Ericsson would be benched 70% of the games with Marchenko in the lineup.

Mind you I am a huge fan of Babcock.

Ericsson isn't as bad as LGW make him out to be. Nor is Smith. People go out of their way to look for their mistakes, and have become really good at ignoring the solid things they do. Its the trend right now. It also happens to be magnified in the case of Ericsson and Smith because neither are offensive, so they're not going to put up solid, quantifiable numbers that are easy to analyze in their support. They make s***ty decisions sometimes, but they're also solid at their position, and for the most part nullify offensive chances and are pretty good at getting the puck back in our possession after defending an attack.

I can't speak for Babcock for his decisions to make the lines the way he does because I don't know what his thought process is, but Weiss is much better playing on the bottom two lines for the team than on the top two. He's a play-killer wherever he is, and if he's gonna be on the ice, its best to have him killing the plays of players like Glendening or Miller, instead of Datsyuk or Zetterberg. The latter two's offensive chances are pretty valuable to the team, and we could use those as often as possible. Additionally, the tactics of the fourth line are to be defensively sound at all times. They will play on the defensive side of the puck in almost every situation, so it forces Weiss at least positionally to be in a safe place. The top six have more variability and have the green light to be more aggressive and take chances. I don't want Weiss taking chances or losing possession in a top six role because we might not have the bodies back to cover for him compared to if he was playing with MIller, Glendening, Jurco, etc, who's main goal is to be in defensive position at all times. In short, Weiss is playing protected minutes on the bottom six. And he still has the opportunity to play more offensively on the powerplay. In the meantime, playing in a defensive line might get him to be a better two-way forward, or at the very least know when he can take chances and when he should play it safe, should he ever get the chance to play on the top six. And again, I don't know why Babs has him where he does, but those would be my reasons.