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Opinion: Petr Mrazek should be starting Game 1

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Your reaching for excuses now.

You guys obviously didn't follow the GDT, where I said, what now 6 times, that Petr was really bad today...but just to remain a non fan of Jimmy, I had to blame him for the GWG goal. But thats fine, you two always cherry pick posts that just support your arguments. We are all used to it...

so since Jimmy really wasn't at fault for the loss, even though he did give up the GWG, then all of Franzen's GWG's that weren't actual game winning, just the last goal that was scored before the other team almost caught up, didn't count either? I seem to remember huge debates over what a GWG really meant. But his counted, yet jimmy's doesn't.

So once can argue that Petr was bad, BUT Jimmy couldn't make that big stop to keep the GWG out...if you want to go by what a GWG means when it comes to stats...plus Jimmy got the loss, even though it was more Petr's fault.

Edited by LeftWinger

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I will say it, I don't think Jimmy is good enough to win a Cup, so I guess that means I don't like him, that is fine...I will also say I think Petr is better than Jimmy, so I guess that means that since I like Petr, I don't like Jimmy. Thats fine...even if Jimmy can s*** out a Cup for us, still doesn't mean I have to like the guy or think he is all of a sudden great. Look at all the s*** Osgood gets, and he won us what, two and almost three! He should have been MVP if not for one shift by Zetterberg and if they would have won in 09, he would have most definitley been MVP. People still don't like him and he won. So it's not wrong for folks not to like Jimmy, even if he does manage to be around for a Cup.

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You guys obviously didn't follow the GDT, where I said, what now 6 times, that Petr was really bad today...but just to remain a non fan of Jimmy, I had to blame him for the GWG goal. But thats fine, you two always cherry pick posts that just support your arguments. We are all used to it...

so since Jimmy really wasn't at fault for the loss, even though he did give up the GWG, then all of Franzen's GWG's that weren't actual game winning, just the last goal that was scored before the other team almost caught up, didn't count either? I seem to remember huge debates over what a GWG really meant. But his counted, yet jimmy's doesn't.

So once can argue that Petr was bad, BUT Jimmy couldn't make that big stop to keep the GWG out...of you want to go by what GWG means for stats.

You never cease to amaze me lol

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Likewise....but I will be here all week, glad you enjoy the show! Feel free to click the link to donate!

Do the one about how people who didn't read all your other posts in other threads = cherry pickers. Or maybe the one about how allowing the GWG is somehow worse than allowing the preceding 4. No, no, do the one where you loosely manage to tie Franzen into it lol that one's my favorite.

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I admit that clearly Petr is not quite ready to handle a full time #1 job where he can go back to back a play at the same level both games. It just doesn't mean I think Jimmy is better. Petr is a rookie, whats Jimmy excuse? IMO Petr is better. But after watching today, he clearly isn't ready to take over the #1 legit spot yet, but he is hot on the heels of it!

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I admit that clearly Petr is not quite ready to handle a full time #1 job where he can go back to back a play at the same level both games. It just doesn't mean I think Jimmy is better. Petr is a rookie, whats Jimmy excuse? IMO Petr is better. But after watching today, he clearly isn't ready to take over the #1 legit spot yet, but he is hot on the heels of it!

Wait wait wait... Petr is definitely better than Jimmy, but Petr is not ready to be #1 while Jimmy is? Oh do explain how that works LeftWinger

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I admit that clearly Petr is not quite ready to handle a full time #1 job where he can go back to back a play at the same level both games. It just doesn't mean I think Jimmy is better. Petr is a rookie, whats Jimmy excuse? IMO Petr is better. But after watching today, he clearly isn't ready to take over the #1 legit spot yet, but he is hot on the heels of it!

I can agree with what your saying. I will say that I don't hate Jimmy Howard, my gripe with Howard is I don't think he's earned his contract, much like I feel with Matt Stafford of the Lions.You have to win big in sports to earn those type contracts. Gotta do something great, not necessarily win a championship, but be good consistantly. I think Howard can be a really good goalie but only if he has a defense in front of him. Same with Osgood, what if he didn't have the defenses on those cup winning teams, he would basically be what Howard is. Howard is not elite and never will be, thats not a knock on him its just the way it is. Thats why its up to the organization to put a defense around him. They just haven't been able to do that.

Edited by Jericho613

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I can agree with what your saying. I will say that I don't hate Jimmy Howard, my gripe with Howard is I don't think he's earned his contract, much like I feel with Matt Stafford of the Lions.You have to win big in sports to earn those type contracts. Gotta do something great, not necessarily win a championship, but be good consistantly. I think Howard can be a really good goalie but only if he has a defense in front of him. Same with Osgood, what if he didn't have the defenses on those cup winning teams, he would basically be what Howard is. Howard is not elite and never will be, thats not a knock on him its just the way it is. Thats why its up to the organization to put a defense around him. They just haven't been able to do that.

Not sure why everyone expects Howard to be elite. He's not paid like an elite goaltender. Yeah he's going through a rough patch right now (the entire team is including Mrazek) but this rough patch doesn't negate his past accomplishments. Everyone is so quick to forget his all-star and Olympic worthy performances as soon as things get rough. The team, and Howard, will bounce back in time. Lets hope it's before the POs start.

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Do the one about how people who didn't read all your other posts in other threads = cherry pickers. Or maybe the one about how allowing the GWG is somehow worse than allowing the preceding 4. No, no, do the one where you loosely manage to tie Franzen into it lol that one's my favorite.

Ok, I will...You cherry pick things that just support your argument, like ignoring the fact that I said Petr sucked today and tongue in cheek said, but technically Jimmy gave up the GWG. You focused only on the GWG part, that is you cherry picking...

Again, giving up 4 goals, and three pretty bad ones, is bad, but technically, for stats, Jimmy gave up the GWG and got the loss...

Lets talk about Franzen's GWG...remember the argument "Franzen floats but he leads the team in GWG's?" Remember that? Now lets tie these two together: GWG is the goal your team wins by, but most of Franzen's GWG's came when he scored the 5th or 6th goal in a 6-1 lead, then as the team derailed and battled back to lose by a 6-5 score, technically for stats the 6th goal was a GWG, but in real life it wasn't a goal that was scored that won the game, like it was 5-5 and he scored to win the game...BUT he still got credit for the GWG, right? My argument was always, the former, it really wasn't a GWG.

So tonight, Petr gave up 4 goals and Jimmy only one, sure Petr should have in reality gotten the loss because he played worse than Jimmy, but because Jimmy gave up the one goal that the team lost by, Jimmy was given the loss. It's not like it was tied 4-4 and Jimmy gave up the goal, so really it wasn't a GWG that he gave up at the time, but technically speaking he did give up the GWG.

You cannot have it both ways. You either talk about the importance of the goal, or you go by stats. In Franzen's case, even though I was right in that most of his GWG weren't of that importance at the time they were scored, by definition of a GWG though, I was wrong. Same goes for tonight, even though when Jimmy gave up the 5th goal, it was not a GWG at the time it was scored, but by definition of the stat, he did end up giving up the GWG. and getting the loss, even though the loss is more on Petr's shoulders than Jimmy's...

That was the only comaparison between the two.

$100 please...

Wait wait wait... Petr is definitely better than Jimmy, but Petr is not ready to be #1 while Jimmy is? Oh do explain how that works LeftWinger

Must we hold your hand in everything? Petr is better than Jimmy IMO, but I can admit he needs more experience to be the legit #1, Jimmy is Jimmy and by default will be the #1 until Petr takes it from him fully. Nowhere did I say Jimmy SHOULD be our #1, if you recall I was calling for him to be traded over the summer. Petr will take the job from Jimmy, its just lack of experience in the NHL that is keeping that from happening.

Right now though, if you really want to talk about who should be #1, neither seem to be wanting it. But Petr, being a rookie, at least as that as an excuse, Jimmy has noithing to excuse his s***ty play...

$200....

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Ok, I will...You cherry pick things that just support your argument, like ignoring the fact that I said Petr sucked today and tongue in cheek said, but technically Jimmy gave up the GWG. You focused only on the GWG part, that is you cherry picking...

Again, giving up 4 goals, and three pretty bad ones, is bad, but technically, for stats, Jimmy gave up the GWG and got the loss...

Lets talk about Franzen's GWG...remember the argument "Franzen floats but he leads the team in GWG's?" Remember that? Now lets tie these two together: GWG is the goal your team wins by, but most of Franzen's GWG's came when he scored the 5th or 6th goal in a 6-1 lead, then as the team derailed and battled back to lose by a 6-5 score, technically for stats the 6th goal was a GWG, but in real life it wasn't a goal that was scored that won the game, like it was 5-5 and he scored to win the game...BUT he still got credit for the GWG, right? My argument was always, the former, it really wasn't a GWG.

So tonight, Petr gave up 4 goals and Jimmy only one, sure Petr should have in reality gotten the loss because he played worse than Jimmy, but because Jimmy gave up the one goal that the team lost by, Jimmy was given the loss. It's not like it was tied 4-4 and Jimmy gave up the goal, so really it wasn't a GWG that he gave up at the time, but technically speaking he did give up the GWG.

You cannot have it both ways. You either talk about the importance of the goal, or you go by stats. In Franzen's case, even though I was right in that most of his GWG weren't of that importance at the time they were scored, by definition of a GWG though, I was wrong. Same goes for tonight, even though when Jimmy gave up the 5th goal, it was not a GWG at the time it was scored, but by definition of the stat, he did end up giving up the GWG. and getting the loss, even though the loss is more on Petr's shoulders than Jimmy's...

That was the only comaparison between the two.

$100 please...

You brought up the GWG argument. Not me. You're the one who continues to harp on about it. Not me.

But yeah... cherry picking, right? lol

What is all this Franzen garbage your spewing on about? I don't know what you're talking about and I don't care lol

What if Nyquist scored 4 goals in a game and then Tatar scored number 5. And we won the game 5-4. Sure Tatar scored the last goal, but Nyquist is 4x more responsible for the win, regardless of when the goals occured.

Same applies to Jimmy and Mrazek today.

$1000 dollhairs plz

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Not sure why everyone expects Howard to be elite. He's not paid like an elite goaltender. Yeah he's going through a rough patch right now (the entire team is including Mrazek) but this rough patch doesn't negate his past accomplishments. Everyone is so quick to forget his all-star and Olympic worthy performances as soon as things get rough. The team, and Howard, will bounce back in time. Lets hope it's before the POs start.

Yeah he shouldn't be expected to be elite, hes just not that type of goaltender. Until they put a defense in front of him people are always gonna blame Howard. Like I said I don't hate Jimmy, I like Mrazek for the future, but with Howard I just don't like they gave him that contract when he hasn't gotten us out of the second round. I know its not like a huge contract but I just don't think he's earned it yet. Sometimes your goaltender has to steal a game. Wings have played alot of games this year where the other goalie stole a game on us that was on a bad team, Niemi being the most recent.

Edited by Jericho613

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Yeah he shouldn't be expected to be elite, hes just not that type of goaltender. Until they put a defense in front of him people are always gonna blame Howard. Like I said I don't hate Jimmy, I like Mrazek for the future, but with Howard I just don't like they gave him that contract when he hasn't gotten us out of the second round. I know its not like a huge contract but I just don't think he's earned it yet. Sometimes your goaltender has to steal a game. Wings have played alot of games this year where the other goalie stole a game on us that was on a bad team, Niemi being the most recent.

It's Jimmy's job to take us beyond the 2nd round of playoffs? Na, that's his and 22 other guys jobs. Those performances appearances do not rest solely on him.

Jimmy was an allstar goalie before his injury, funny I didn't see you around here preaching that he hasn't earned his contract when times were good. Strange how that works.

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It's Jimmy's job to take us beyond the 2nd round of playoffs? Na, that's his and 22 other guys jobs. Those performances appearances do not rest solely on him.

Jimmy was an allstar goalie before his injury, funny I didn't see you around here preaching that he hasn't earned his contract when times were good. Strange how that works.

No your right, I don't come on here much. I'm not trying to be a Jimmy hater, I'm just saying if I had a gripe it would be that I feel he hasn't earned his contract. And it is a team game, but what i'm saying is that there are alot of other goaltenders on bad teams that steal games, why can't Howard. Sometimes a goaltender has to step up and carry his team. I Think the Wings are still gonna make the playoffs. But unless they get better on Defense Howard has to step up, sorry but its just how it has to be.

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Ok, I will...You cherry pick things that just support your argument, like ignoring the fact that I said Petr sucked today and tongue in cheek said, but technically Jimmy gave up the GWG. You focused only on the GWG part, that is you cherry picking...

Again, giving up 4 goals, and three pretty bad ones, is bad, but technically, for stats, Jimmy gave up the GWG and got the loss...

Lets talk about Franzen's GWG...remember the argument "Franzen floats but he leads the team in GWG's?" Remember that? Now lets tie these two together: GWG is the goal your team wins by, but most of Franzen's GWG's came when he scored the 5th or 6th goal in a 6-1 lead, then as the team derailed and battled back to lose by a 6-5 score, technically for stats the 6th goal was a GWG, but in real life it wasn't a goal that was scored that won the game, like it was 5-5 and he scored to win the game...BUT he still got credit for the GWG, right? My argument was always, the former, it really wasn't a GWG.

So tonight, Petr gave up 4 goals and Jimmy only one, sure Petr should have in reality gotten the loss because he played worse than Jimmy, but because Jimmy gave up the one goal that the team lost by, Jimmy was given the loss. It's not like it was tied 4-4 and Jimmy gave up the goal, so really it wasn't a GWG that he gave up at the time, but technically speaking he did give up the GWG.

You cannot have it both ways. You either talk about the importance of the goal, or you go by stats. In Franzen's case, even though I was right in that most of his GWG weren't of that importance at the time they were scored, by definition of a GWG though, I was wrong. Same goes for tonight, even though when Jimmy gave up the 5th goal, it was not a GWG at the time it was scored, but by definition of the stat, he did end up giving up the GWG. and getting the loss, even though the loss is more on Petr's shoulders than Jimmy's...

That was the only comaparison between the two.

$100 please...

Must we hold your hand in everything? Petr is better than Jimmy IMO, but I can admit he needs more experience to be the legit #1, Jimmy is Jimmy and by default will be the #1 until Petr takes it from him fully. Nowhere did I say Jimmy SHOULD be our #1, if you recall I was calling for him to be traded over the summer. Petr will take the job from Jimmy, its just lack of experience in the NHL that is keeping that from happening.

Right now though, if you really want to talk about who should be #1, neither seem to be wanting it. But Petr, being a rookie, at least as that as an excuse, Jimmy has noithing to excuse his s***ty play...

$200....

Don't bother man, he doesn't understand the concept of using similes and analogies to make a point about what was being discussed. Then, to avoid having to admit being wrong, he'll just claim you're not addressing the topic because of said use of similes and analogies.

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You brought up the GWG argument. Not me. You're the one who continues to harp on about it. Not me.

But yeah... cherry picking, right? lol

What is all this Franzen garbage your spewing on about? I don't know what you're talking about and I don't care lol

What if Nyquist scored 4 goals in a game and then Tatar scored number 5. And we won the game 5-4. Sure Tatar scored the last goal, but Nyquist is 4x more responsible for the win, regardless of when the goals occured.

Same applies to Jimmy and Mrazek today.

$1000 dollhairs plz

Ok, and I do agree with you and said Petr was more to blame for the loss....but since I am infamous for hating on Jimmy, I said, tongue in cheek, that technically Jimmy gave up the GWG and got the loss. Only because of me not liking Jimmy, I had to find something blame on him. But you must not get that humor part...

I like your Nyquist and Tatar example and it supports mine as well, even though Nyquist was 4x more responsible for the win, Tatar is the one who got the GWG. Even (in Franzen's case) if he scored that 5th goal to make it 5-1 and then they held on to win 5-4. Still a GWG. Not taking away from Nyquist's 4 goals or Petr's giving up 4 goals, statistically speaking, Tatar got the GWG and Jimmy gave up the GWG.

So since, I say Petr is better, I had to take a shot at Jimmy, even while saying how bad Petr played. But cherry-pickers just focus on the Jimmy part because they like to call folks out for bashing Jimmy (or any other player) and don'e even comment on the part about saying that Petr played horrible...they chose to just cherry pick the part that causes arguments.

That being said, I still think Petr is better than Franzen.....wait, what?

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Don't bother man, he doesn't understand the concept of using similes and analogies to make a point about what was being discussed. Then, to avoid having to admit being wrong, he'll just claim you're not addressing the topic because of said use of similes and analogies.

While you're busy pulling things out of your butt, how's Mrazek doing lately?

Ok, and I do agree with you and said Petr was more to blame for the loss....but since I am infamous for hating on Jimmy, I said, tongue in cheek, that technically Jimmy gave up the GWG and got the loss. Only because of me not liking Jimmy, I had to find something blame on him. But you must not get that humor part...

I like your Nyquist and Tatar example and it supports mine as well, even though Nyquist was 4x more responsible for the win, Tatar is the one who got the GWG. Even (in Franzen's case) if he scored that 5th goal to make it 5-1 and then they held on to win 5-4. Still a GWG. Not taking away from Nyquist's 4 goals or Petr's giving up 4 goals, statistically speaking, Tatar got the GWG and Jimmy gave up the GWG.

So since, I say Petr is better, I had to take a shot at Jimmy, even while saying how bad Petr played. But cherry-pickers just focus on the Jimmy part because they like to call folks out for bashing Jimmy (or any other player) and don'e even comment on the part about saying that Petr played horrible...they chose to just cherry pick the part that causes arguments.

That being said, I still think Petr is better than Franzen.....wait, what?

Lol. Yeah, seems fair man.

Edited by number9

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While you're busy pulling things out of your butt, how's Mrazek doing lately?

I'm not making anything up. That's exactly what happened when I tried to explain to you, using a simile, how having a bias doesn't automatically distort the truth of something.

And he's doing about the same as Howie, a consistent hit or miss.

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I'm not making anything up. That's exactly what happened when I tried to explain to you, using a simile, how having a bias doesn't automatically distort the truth of something.

And he's doing about the same as Howie, a consistent hit or miss.

It was in regards to scientific method and eliminating bias, which I informed you to PM me about if you wanted to discuss it, which you have not done. Don't be scared, PM me.

Aw f*** it, Jimmy sucks, Petr is great! The reason Petr gave up 4 goals today is becuase Jimmy was shining a mirror in his eyes! If Jimmy would have made that big save when we needed it, we would've gotten the loser point at least!

Ah, your surrender is what makes it all worthwhile for me

I'm not making anything up. That's exactly what happened when I tried to explain to you, using a simile, how having a bias doesn't automatically distort the truth of something.

And he's doing about the same as Howie, a consistent hit or miss.

And oh hey, how's Mraz doin? Huh?

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It was in regards to scientific method and eliminating bias, which I informed you to PM me about if you wanted to discuss it, which you have not done. Don't be scared, PM me.

It doesn't matter if a bias is in regards to a science experiment or not. A bias is a bias and it doesn't necessitate that a statement claimed with a bias isn't true. I even gave you another example about using Wayne Gretzky instead of the acceleration due to gravity. Like I said, you don't understand the concept of analogies.

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It doesn't matter if a bias is in regards to a science experiment or not. A bias is a bias and it doesn't necessitate that a statement claimed with a bias isn't true. I even gave you another example about using Wayne Gretzky instead of the acceleration due to gravity. Like I said, you don't understand the concept of analogies.

Hahaha nope nope and nope lol DUDE PM ME. Otherwise discuss hockey. It's not that hard.

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