Dabura 12,205 Report post Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) If anyone gets traded I'm betting it's Ericsson. I'll be amazed if Ericsson gets moved, as his ridiculous contract makes him pretty much untradable. ($4.25M cap hit until 2020. MY EYES!!! IT BURNS!!!) He's the only one with any snarl, but that's about all he brings that other players don't. I'd say Quincey plays a meaner, heavier brand of shutdown defense. But I don't think "snarl" has ever been one of Ericsson's strengths. Essentially, he's a quality PKer, shot blocker, lane clogger. Pretty much any way you pair up the defensemen, he's the odd man out. Just doesn't really pair up with anyone but Kronwall all that well, and even then there are better options. In fairness to Ericsson, he's been wildly miscast in a top-pairing role that puts him way out of his depth and pretty much sets him up to fail. That he's always paired with Kronwall doesn't necessarily mean he isn't a good fit with any of our other defensemen, it just means he's always paired with Kronwall. In theory, I wouldn't mind Kronwall-Ericsson as a second pairing, or perhaps a third pairing of Ericsson-Ouellet. [Note: The way I structured this response kinda makes it look like I'm picking apart your post and looking to start a debate. Not so! I just felt this line-by-line approach was the easiest way to organize my points. Ultimately, I think we're on the same page in believing Ericsson needs to go. I don't see it happening, though.] Edited July 7, 2015 by Dabura Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings4thecup06 504 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 I actually cursed a little to myself when we signed Green. Purely because I knew it meant that both Ouellet and Marchenko will start the year (and probably stay for most of it) in Grand Rapids. Seriously. What have these guys got left to prove down there? I'm not asking for too much change, but seriously, I agree with what Dabura said earlier. These guys need a chance to play, because how can they grow into their full NHL potential if they're stuck in the minors. I get it. You never want to give up on a former first rounder. But the Wings have 2 (Kindl and Smith), one of whom needs to be moved IMO (Kindl) and has been needed to be jettisoned for quite some time. Smith I'm fine with, because I see the potential, and if he gets PP time this year, it might help him grow more. I might get scalped for this, but I see no issue with Quincey. He was solid last year, and he and DK were our best pairing all year long. I think the time has come for the Wings to seriously think about moving Ericsson and Kindl, maybe even Smith, and giving Ouellet and Marchenko a proper shot for a full season. All the Wings have to do is open up one spot (I'm not advocating we trade all of Ericsson, Kindl and Smith at once, that would be stupid and could backfire if Ouellet and Marchenko struggle), and just give them a chance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmyemeryhunter 2,747 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 I actually cursed a little to myself when we signed Green. Purely because I knew it meant that both Ouellet and Marchenko will start the year (and probably stay for most of it) in Grand Rapids. Seriously. What have these guys got left to prove down there? I'm not asking for too much change, but seriously, I agree with what Dabura said earlier. These guys need a chance to play, because how can they grow into their full NHL potential if they're stuck in the minors. I get it. You never want to give up on a former first rounder. But the Wings have 2 (Kindl and Smith), one of whom needs to be moved IMO (Kindl) and has been needed to be jettisoned for quite some time. Smith I'm fine with, because I see the potential, and if he gets PP time this year, it might help him grow more. I might get scalped for this, but I see no issue with Quincey. He was solid last year, and he and DK were our best pairing all year long. I think the time has come for the Wings to seriously think about moving Ericsson and Kindl, maybe even Smith, and giving Ouellet and Marchenko a proper shot for a full season. All the Wings have to do is open up one spot (I'm not advocating we trade all of Ericsson, Kindl and Smith at once, that would be stupid and could backfire if Ouellet and Marchenko struggle), and just give them a chance. They don't have much left to prove, but theyre not better options than we have now, thats the problem.Yes kindl should be gone, but he still has some potential too, and he actually showed he can be a top four d man, albeit for the lockout shortened season, but still. And Ericsson is not suited for our top pair, I agree with that, but he is still a top four d man, and you don't move that for a bottom pairing guy. There will be injuries, and they'll get their shot, and hopefully when they do, they'll grab ahold if it and run with it... Then next season one of them will be the seventh guy while waiting for his chance...its how the wings tend to do things, we've seen it at forward with Gus and tats, and I don't see it changing just because its defense and not forwards. And no arguments about Quincey, he was good last year, but hell be gone next season. He was one of our steadiest d men last year, which could be just because he was with Deke, which is fine. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings4thecup06 504 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 They don't have much left to prove, but theyre not better options than we have now, thats the problem. Yes kindl should be gone, but he still has some potential too, and he actually showed he can be a top four d man, albeit for the lockout shortened season, but still. And Ericsson is not suited for our top pair, I agree with that, but he is still a top four d man, and you don't move that for a bottom pairing guy. There will be injuries, and they'll get their shot, and hopefully when they do, they'll grab ahold if it and run with it... Then next season one of them will be the seventh guy while waiting for his chance...its how the wings tend to do things, we've seen it at forward with Gus and tats, and I don't see it changing just because its defense and not forwards. And no arguments about Quincey, he was good last year, but hell be gone next season. He was one of our steadiest d men last year, which could be just because he was with Deke, which is fine. Maybe not better options as it looks right now, but how are these guys supposed to realise their potential if they don't ever get to play at the highest level? I get your opinion, I just feel its time the Wings took a chance with 1 of these guys, especially with how they both played last year. Kindl plays arguably the most sheltered minutes in the league in terms of D, which is why he looks good every time he comes into the lineup, appears to play well for a couple of games, then makes the inevitable couple of mistakes and gets bounced. Its the same story over and over, I just feel its time the Wings cut their losses with him. That's my opinion though 2 jimmyemeryhunter and e_prime reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 Will Callahan see 4th line time this year? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amato 3,210 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 Will Callahan see 4th line time this year? I think he'll get a few games. Probably only if there are injuries that force him into the lineup though. we have a pretty solid fourth line as it is. If he does get up though, he has a chance to stay imo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,205 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 (edited) They don't have much left to prove, but theyre not better options than we have now, thats the problem. See, I don't buy that. Babcock wanted Ouellet on last year's opening night roster. Before we'd signed Green, Ryan Martin said one of the kids would be making the team out of camp. Even now, with Green in the fold and one less spot "available," Kenny has indicated he'd like to start the season with Ouellet or Marchenko on the roster and that he may (but, realistically, surely won't) move someone out for the purpose of freeing up a roster spot for one of the kids. For Kenny to speak to that possibility...it means he himself realizes that starting both Ouellet and Marchenko in Grand Rapids would be pretty much inexcusable, especially given all his talk about how the young players need to take a step forward this season and how we need to get younger and faster as a team. If both Ouellet and Marchenko start the season in Grand Rapids (and, by extension, spend the majority of another season playing against AHLers), it will be because 1) Smith ($2.75M cap hit x 2 years for a 26-year-old third-pairing defenseman who doesn't produce points and makes costly peewee mistakes on the defensive side of the puck) and Kindl ($2.4M cap hit x 2 years for a 28-year-old #7 defenseman who's a disaster in the d-zone) and Ericsson ($4.25M cap hit x 5 years for an error-prone 31-year-old "defensive defenseman") are all pretty much untradable, and 2) it's very important that the promising and NHL-ready young player who will be replacing Legendary All-Star Defenseman Kyle Quincey next season (and is fully capable of replacing him this season) sees as little NHL ice time as possible this season, because development! Edited July 10, 2015 by Dabura 3 Detroit \# 1 Fan, wings4thecup06 and jimmyemeryhunter reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,458 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 (edited) See, I don't buy that. Babcock wanted Ouellet on last year's opening night roster. Before we'd signed Green, Ryan Martin said one of the kids would be making the team out of camp. Even now, with Green in the fold and one less spot "available," Kenny has indicated he'd like to start the season with Ouellet or Marchenko on the roster and that he may (but, realistically, surely won't) move someone out for the purpose of freeing up a roster spot for one of the kids. For Kenny to speak to that possibility...it means he himself realizes that starting both Ouellet and Marchenko in Grand Rapids would be pretty much inexcusable, especially given all his talk about how the young players need to take a step forward this season and how we need to get younger and faster as a team. If both Ouellet and Marchenko start the season in Grand Rapids (and, by extension, spend the majority of another season playing against AHLers), it will be because 1) Smith ($2.75M cap hit x 2 years for a 26-year-old third-pairing defenseman who doesn't produce points and makes costly peewee mistakes on the defensive side of the puck) and Kindl ($2.4M cap hit x 2 years for a 28-year-old #7 defenseman who's a disaster in the d-zone) and Ericsson ($4.25M cap hit x 5 years for an error-prone 31-year-old "defensive defenseman") are all pretty much untradable, and 2) it's very important that the promising and NHL-ready young player who will be replacing Legendary All-Star Defenseman Kyle Quincey next season (and is fully capably of replacing him this season) sees as little NHL ice time this season as possible, because development! I think you mean, renegade hardass defenseman Kyle Quincey. Can baby-face Marchenko, or Le Francais, grow a beard like this? I don't think so. If Kyle Quincey didn't already rule too much to have a nickname, I'd call him "The Outlander". Just on the strength of that beard alone. Edited July 10, 2015 by kipwinger 3 jimmyemeryhunter, Dabura and amato reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,205 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 (edited) I think you mean, renegade hardass defenseman Kyle Quincey. Can baby-face Marchenko, or Le Francais, grow a beard like this? I don't think so. If Kyle Quincey didn't already rule too much to have a nickname, I'd call him "The Outlander". Just on the strength of that beard alone. I must admit, he does bear a striking resemblance to Jesus Christ. Edited July 10, 2015 by Dabura Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Helmethead 235 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 He does get called that a lot. Each time he screws up Babs used to yell "Jesus Christ!". Come to think of it Brendan Smith is likely Jesus Christ. 3 Dabura, TheXym and Detroit \# 1 Fan reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,205 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 He does get called that a lot. Each time he screws up Babs used to yell "Jesus Christ!". Come to think of it Brendan Smith is likely Jesus Christ. LOL! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Caanis Cooper 5 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 (edited) I think Quincey played amazing this last season. I would be totally against moving him at all. I know we need to make some cap space room now, but we just can't lose his toughness and good defensive play. Edited July 10, 2015 by Caanis Cooper 5 martinezsvsu, krsmith17, marcaractac and 2 others reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ekmanc 586 Report post Posted July 10, 2015 I would like to see someone score 30+ goals, it's been way too long now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,914 Report post Posted July 11, 2015 I would like to see someone score 30+ goals, it's been way too long now. ya, ever since.....don't get me started on The Choice! Ugh! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmyemeryhunter 2,747 Report post Posted July 11, 2015 I would like to see someone score 30+ goals, it's been way too long now.I wanna see multiple 30 goal scorers, and I want at least one of our defenseman. I want Green to do it to shut up all the people who say he isn't even all that good offensively anymore.The people like that are the same ones who continuously tall trash aabout every thing the wings make. jealous bastards Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Euro_Twins 4,469 Report post Posted July 11, 2015 I wanna see multiple 30 goal scorers, and I want at least one of our defenseman. I want Green to do it to shut up all the people who say he isn't even all that good offensively anymore. The people like that are the same ones who continuously tall trash aabout every thing the wings make. jealous bastards Ya it's funny cause green is only 29 and right in his prime, he could have a career year 1 jimmyemeryhunter reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmyemeryhunter 2,747 Report post Posted July 11, 2015 Ya it's funny cause green is only 29 and right in his prime, he could have a career yearThat would be amazing, but he has had quite a few injuries and concussions, so he may have already went through his peak because Of the wear and tear on his body over the years...He was the number one d man for Washington for a while back in the day, maybe him being back in the top four will reignite something in him. With danny dekeyser there to cover up for Him on the defensive side of things, he's in there right position to do so. I'm kind of worried we end up not using him right, or not playing him enough to get into the flow of the games. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
e_prime 1,936 Report post Posted July 11, 2015 I'm kind of worried we end up not using him right, or not playing him enough to get into the flow of the games.Remember! Babcock no longer coaches here! 1 amato reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmyemeryhunter 2,747 Report post Posted July 11, 2015 Remember! Babcock no longer coaches here! Ha. If babs was still here, and Green did still sign with us he'd end up a $6,000,000 healthy scratch. 1 e_prime reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
e_prime 1,936 Report post Posted July 11, 2015 Ha. If babs was still here, and Green did still sign with us he'd end up a $6,000,000 healthy scratch. Yup. Wouldn't be "heavy" enough on the puck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,205 Report post Posted July 12, 2015 Ya it's funny cause green is only 29 and right in his prime, he could have a career year He absolutely could. I plan on doing a post on why we should expect great things from Mike Green and why media-driven narratives (e.g. "The Red Wings are paying $6M for a third-pairing defenseman who can't play defense") are just the worst. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Helmethead 235 Report post Posted July 12, 2015 I expect 50+ points from Green this season. His game is perfect for the Red Wings. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Pred 48 337 Report post Posted July 12, 2015 D pairings; Dekeyser Green Kronwall Smith Quincey Ericsson now could Smith and Kronner move upto the top pair? and give Green lesser forwards to deal with thus hopefully improve his out put. and for all our moaning and groanings, there wont be a better 3rd pairing than Q and E anywhere. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kickazz 5,459 Report post Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) Kronwall - Green Dekeyser - Quincey Marchenko/Smith - Ericsson We keep our best pairing (D and Q). Ericsson plays on third pair where he's less likely to make errors. Smith would be his offensive compliment. Kronwall and Green just raise havoc on top line. EVERYBODY WINS Edited July 12, 2015 by kickazz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Helmethead 235 Report post Posted July 12, 2015 I'm still expecting... Kronwall-Ericsson Dekeyser-Green Quincey-Smith 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites