Retire Sergei Fedorov’s Jersey Immediately

[Helmethead 235]

That isn't true. Holland signed Derian Hatcher that summer. While he turned out to be a $10 mil buyout after the lockout, at the time he was one of the most sought after UFAs on the market. After Feds signed with Anaheim, Kenny signed Ray Whitney who did not fit on the Wings and he too was bought out. Kenny later traded for Robert Lang just before the trade deadline to replace Feds. The first round pick in that trade used by the Caps turned out to be...Mike Green! Full circle...

[DRW Dominance 255]

I loved Feds and have a jersey still. However I don't think 91 should be in the rafters.

[LeftWinger 4,953]

It should be there and will.

Fedorov was offered virtually identical contract in DECEMBER of 2002. He asked Holland if he could wait to decide because he was in the middle of a divorce and looking for a new agent. Wben all that settled and Fedorov WANTED to sign the contract that was offered to him in DECEMBER, he was told it was no longer on the table and was offered a contract with less term and worth less money. The organization slapped Feds in the face because he didn't want to make the decision in the middle of very personal issues going on in his life. Feds left and signed nearly exact contract (from December) with Anaheim. In NO way can you compare Fedorov with Yashin...apples and oranges when it comes to production and honoring contracts. When Fedorov was making league minimum ($285,000) at the time, he never ONCE asked to be paid more or held out to renegotiate anything. The Wings gave him a raise before his contract was up, along with an extension. Then when 1997-98 come around, the Wings told him to field offers from other teams if he felt like it, they were going to match whatever was offered anyhow. The ONLY reason Karmanos offered Feds so much up front is because (as it is known) he and Ilitch are bitter rivals and near enemies and Karmonos would have loved to have poached this prized possession from his rival. You cannot blame Feds or accepting such an offer because he knew that Wings would match and he would pretty much be guaranteed all that money up front...he wouldn't have gotten it from Carolina, they would have never made the conference finals. BUT for the rest of the contract, from 1998-2003, Feds only may slightly over $2M, which is what he was making basically from his raise he got from Detroit in the mid 90's. So for nearly 10 years (outside of his bonuses) Feds was making $2M or less per season for all he did for this franchise and all the accolades he was getting in the NHL. So be pissed at him because he actually wanted to sign the original 5 year $55M offer and he left when it was lessoned to 4 years $40M? Be pissed at Holland or whoever pulled the offer, because if the offer still stood at 5 years $55M, he would've never left the organization and this would not even be up or debate.

They pissed each other off, sure, no argument there, but the number deserves to be recognized and put up in the rafters with the rest of the Wings Elite. It's time, it's deserving and needs to be done.

Sergei Federov - Hart, Selke, All-Star, All Rookie, Hall of Fame, Stanley Cup Champion. Its a no brainer, if the number doesn't go up, its because this organization is nothing but a crybaby grudge holding hunk of garbage when it come to this subject. Honor your ELITE, Fedorov helped build this team to its greatness, he bled for it, he suffered for it, he left his family for it. You pulled the offer from him, its time to atone for that mistake. Put #91 up there next to #5 and #19, perhaps the THREE reasons that this team achieved such greatness throughout the 90's into the 2000's, alone they could not have done it, but together they made this franchise Elite.

[kliq 3,755]

It should be there and will.

Fedorov was offered virtually identical contract in DECEMBER of 2002. He asked Holland if he could wait to decide because he was in the middle of a divorce and looking for a new agent. Wben all that settled and Fedorov WANTED to sign the contract that was offered to him in DECEMBER, he was told it was no longer on the table and was offered a contract with less term and worth less money. The organization slapped Feds in the face because he didn't want to make the decision in the middle of very personal issues going on in his life. Feds left and signed nearly exact contract (from December) with Anaheim. In NO way can you compare Fedorov with Yashin...apples and oranges when it comes to production and honoring contracts. When Fedorov was making league minimum ($285,000) at the time, he never ONCE asked to be paid more or held out to renegotiate anything. The Wings gave him a raise before his contract was up, along with an extension. Then when 1997-98 come around, the Wings told him to field offers from other teams if he felt like it, they were going to match whatever was offered anyhow. The ONLY reason Karmanos offered Feds so much up front is because (as it is known) he and Ilitch are bitter rivals and near enemies and Karmonos would have loved to have poached this prized possession from his rival. You cannot blame Feds or accepting such an offer because he knew that Wings would match and he would pretty much be guaranteed all that money up front...he wouldn't have gotten it from Carolina, they would have never made the conference finals. BUT for the rest of the contract, from 1998-2003, Feds only may slightly over $2M, which is what he was making basically from his raise he got from Detroit in the mid 90's. So for nearly 10 years (outside of his bonuses) Feds was making $2M or less per season for all he did for this franchise and all the accolades he was getting in the NHL. So be pissed at him because he actually wanted to sign the original 5 year $55M offer and he left when it was lessoned to 4 years $40M? Be pissed at Holland or whoever pulled the offer, because if the offer still stood at 5 years $55M, he would've never left the organization and this would not even be up or debate.

They pissed each other off, sure, no argument there, but the number deserves to be recognized and put up in the rafters with the rest of the Wings Elite. It's time, it's deserving and needs to be done.

Sergei Federov - Hart, Selke, All-Star, All Rookie, Hall of Fame, Stanley Cup Champion. Its a no brainer, if the number doesn't go up, its because this organization is nothing but a crybaby grudge holding hunk of garbage when it come to this subject. Honor your ELITE, Fedorov helped build this team to its greatness, he bled for it, he suffered for it, he left his family for it. You pulled the offer from him, its time to atone for that mistake. Put #91 up there next to #5 and #19, perhaps the THREE reasons that this team achieved such greatness throughout the 90's into the 2000's, alone they could not have done it, but together they made this franchise Elite.

Sergei????

Kidding aside, you seem to be very specific on what happened. What is the source?

[LeftWinger 4,953]

The source was that it was well known when It happened, but as time goes on, folks memory gets more and more clouded and just choose to remember that he left for the same amount of money.

[kliq 3,755]

The source was that it was well known when It happened, but as time goes on, folks memory gets more and more clouded and just choose to remember that he left for the same amount of money.

Who was the source when it happened? Was it Fedorov himself? Holland? Illitch? Detroit Free Press? ESPN? TSN?

I'm not saying you are wrong, but just because a story is out there doesn't make it 100% fact.

[Buppy 1,720]

... So for nearly 10 years (outside of his bonuses) Feds was making $2M or less per season for all he did for this franchise and all the accolades he was getting in the NHL. ...

Lol. Yeah, outside of his $26 MILLION in bonuses.

From 94-95 through 02-03 he was paid almost as much as Yzerman, and more than Lidstrom. You make it sound like he was doing charity work playing for us

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

Lol. Yeah, outside of his $26 MILLION in bonuses.

From 94-95 through 02-03 he was paid almost as much as Yzerman, and more than Lidstrom. You make it sound like he was doing charity work playing for us

Charity work? Na he did cups for us

[matthewdanna 143]

Definitely should be retired.

[LeftWinger 4,953]

I think the healing started when Ken Holland was very interested in re-acquiring him from Columbus at the trade deadline in (was it 07 or 08?) But rumor had it that our former coach, who couldn't figure him out in Anaheim, voted NO for the trade. In hindsight, we now know how he treats players that he doesn't really want on this team or once they get in his doghouse....Fedorov in Anaheim, Commodore, Modano, Weiss, Legwand, Smith, Jurco just to name a few. Also a huge step was taken when he was invited to play at the Winter Classic.

[kickazz 5,459]

I think the healing started when Ken Holland was very interested in re-acquiring him from Columbus at the trade deadline in (was it 07 or 08?) But rumor had it that our former coach, who couldn't figure him out in Anaheim, voted NO for the trade. In hindsight, we now know how he treats players that he doesn't really want on this team or once they get in his doghouse....Fedorov in Anaheim, Commodore, Modano, Weiss, Legwand, Smith, Jurco just to name a few. Also a huge step was taken when he was invited to play at the Winter Classic.

I don't see why it's a problem if Babcock didn't want him. It's the coaches will who he wants playing on his roster. You're acting like it's uncommon. Blashill will be the same way just like any coach in the NHL. You're either suited to play a coaches system or you're not.

Remember than Bowman turned Sergei into a defenseman for a good month. It's what they do. The chess board is theirs and they can move each piece (player) they way they see suited in order to win the game.

BTW it was Hollands decision to not bring Fedorov back. Columbus wanted Valterri Filpulla and a First round draft pick. Holland didn't want to give that up. So no, you can't blame Babcock because it was Hollands decision at the end.

Edited July 7, 2015 by kickazz

[number9 3,297]

I love how we never talk about retiring 96. Holmstrom is (for the most part) universally loved by RW fans, but at the same time I feel like he gets forgotten in the talk of stars of higher reputation. Spent his whole career here and is probably the best net front powerforward of all time. Much like how Lidstrom was great without playing like a Stevens, Holmstrom was great without playing like a Lucic. Fundamentally sound in every way. Probably why those guys were friends (Lids and Homer that is)

Seriously, what kind of hit to his points does Lidstrom take without Holmstrom in front of the net? Not many do what he did at that caliber.

I know I'm just being nostalgic now, but seriously what's Homers knock? Points? To me he makes up for that in intangibles. What's Osgoods knock? Great stats but great team? Fedorov? Great all around but bailed? I think a true hockey sav would look at Holmstrom and realize just how massively important he was to the Wings.

For pete sake he ended his career as the final touch to the euro twins lines practically

Edited July 8, 2015 by number9

[Buppy 1,720]

I don't see why it's a problem if Babcock didn't want him. It's the coaches will who he wants playing on his roster. You're acting like it's uncommon. Blashill will be the same way just like any coach in the NHL. You're either suited to play a coaches system or you're not.

Remember than Bowman turned Sergei into a defenseman for a good month. It's what they do. The chess board is theirs and they can move each piece (player) they way they see suited in order to win the game.

BTW it was Hollands decision to not bring Fedorov back. Columbus wanted Valterri Filpulla and a First round draft pick. Holland didn't want to give that up. So no, you can't blame Babcock because it was Hollands decision at the end.

It's easy to blame Babcock. Now that he's gone, if we can convince ourselves that everything was his fault it gives us reason to be optimistic.

LW also tends to ignore reality at times. Like with Fedorov. The one season he played for Babcock was the one non-Wing season he had that was similar to his production with the Wings. But Babcock couldn't figure him out, misused him, and didn't want him on the Wings. Because then that's why he never came back, and why his number isn't retired, and now that Babs is gone there's hope for the future.

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

I love how we never talk about retiring 96. Holmstrom is (for the most part) universally loved by RW fans, but at the same time I feel like he gets forgotten in the talk of stars of higher reputation. Spent his whole career here and is probably the best net front powerforward of all time. Much like how Lidstrom was great without playing like a Stevens, Holmstrom was great without playing like a Lucic. Fundamentally sound in every way. Probably why those guys were friends (Lids and Homer that is)

Seriously, what kind of hit to his points does Lidstrom take without Holmstrom in front of the net? Not many do what he did at that caliber.

I know I'm just being nostalgic now, but seriously what's Homers knock? Points? To me he makes up for that in intangibles. What's Osgoods knock? Great stats but great team? Fedorov? Great all around but bailed? I think a true hockey sav would look at Holmstrom and realize just how massively important he was to the Wings.

For pete sake he ended his career as the final touch to the euro twins lines practically

I think they evened out with how many were called back.

At least, that's what those two would probably tell you.

[number9 3,297]

I think they evened out with how many were called back.

At least, that's what those two would probably tell you.

New Holmstrom should wear 69 instead of 96 and the back of his sweater should say 'NEW HOLMSTROM'

[LeftWinger 4,953]

SO 65 points was non-Wings like for Feds? Look at his last 5 seasons in Detroit before his first in ANA. He got above 70 points ONCE. The other four years was 62-69 points. I'd say 31 goals amongst 65 points for him at that point in his career was very Wings-Like. Babcock couldn't figure out his tendencies and once he fell in the Dog house, he was done....traded the next season (Only 5 games played for ANA) and Babs was on the side of "NO" for the trade, sure the asking price was Fil and a 1st (pretty high) but isn't that typical of a divisional trade?

Reality is, sure Holland was VERY reluctant to trade that much for Feds, and when Babs gave his opinion, it cemented it. I blamed Babs way back then, not just now because he is gone. It's not like Holland has never overpaid for a proven vet even after that year, right? Just looking at some of the deals he has made since, I think a 2008 Fedorov for a 2008 Filppula and a 2008 1st (Thomas McCullom) would have been one of his better overpayments.

In the section called "small world" one of the players Feds was traded for from ANA to CBJ is now our Director of Amateur Scouting, Tyler Wright.

I see the player the Washington had to give up for Feds was well worth it! I seem to remember a ton of folks here saying Ruth was a better prospect than Fil...Hmmmm...more evidence of inner-divisional Holland rape!

Edited July 8, 2015 by LeftWinger

[Buppy 1,720]

SO 65 points was non-Wings like for Feds? Look at his last 5 seasons in Detroit before his first in ANA. He got above 70 points ONCE. The other four years was 62-69 points. I'd say 31 goals amongst 65 points for him at that point in his career was very Wings-Like. Babcock couldn't figure out his tendencies and once he fell in the Dog house, he was done...

I think you misunderstand. By "non-Wing" I meant a season in which he did not play for the Wings.

And as you say, that season (the one and only season he played for Babcock) he did well. What makes you say Babcock couldn't figure him out our that he was in the doghouse?

[Helmethead 235]

The words "inner divisional Holland rape" may give me nightmares tonight.

[kickazz 5,459]

SO 65 points was non-Wings like for Feds? Look at his last 5 seasons in Detroit before his first in ANA. He got above 70 points ONCE. The other four years was 62-69 points. I'd say 31 goals amongst 65 points for him at that point in his career was very Wings-Like. Babcock couldn't figure out his tendencies and once he fell in the Dog house, he was done....traded the next season (Only 5 games played for ANA) and Babs was on the side of "NO" for the trade, sure the asking price was Fil and a 1st (pretty high) but isn't that typical of a divisional trade?

Reality is, sure Holland was VERY reluctant to trade that much for Feds, and when Babs gave his opinion, it cemented it. I blamed Babs way back then, not just now because he is gone. It's not like Holland has never overpaid for a proven vet even after that year, right? Just looking at some of the deals he has made since, I think a 2008 Fedorov for a 2008 Filppula and a 2008 1st (Thomas McCullom) would have been one of his better overpayments.

In the section called "small world" one of the players Feds was traded for from ANA to CBJ is now our Director of Amateur Scouting, Tyler Wright.

I see the player the Washington had to give up for Feds was well worth it! I seem to remember a ton of folks here saying Ruth was a better prospect than Fil...Hmmmm...more evidence of inner-divisional Holland rape!

You're wrong mate.

Proof and source - http://blog.mlive.com/snapshots/2008/03/blame_bebcock_for_nixing_fedor.html

"On the eve of the "deadline" we had many conversations about Fedorov," Holland has stated. "I have collected 13 or 14 club officials--all our coaches, managers, and pro scouts. The emotions caused by possible return of Sergei, were [very] different. Yes, I have received Mike's opinion (Babcock--note, Igor Larin), but other positions were expressed. "We decided upon a certain offer, however Sergei eventually has been traded to "Washington " (the Capitol has given the young defender Teddy Ruth for the Russian veteran--note, Igor Larin). Such situation in general we arranged. They intended to receive a really good prospect player for Sergei, and we didn't want to give those up."

Holland really tried to get Fedorov, despite of the veto of the coach. However "Columbus" has requested from "Detroit" young forward Valteri Filppula and a first-round draft pick. As a result after these negotiations, and from this perspective "Columbus" has refused, having decided to not strengthen a club of the [same] division and having given the Russian legionary to a team not only in another division, but also the other conference.

There was apparently some sort of consensus in the room that several people had major concerns about bringing Fedorov back to Detroit, and in all likelihood, the concerns were related to both Fedorov's on-ice performance and the substantial off-ice distractions that Fedorov faced during his later years as a Wing.

---------------------

So 14 opinions and a lot of them didn't want Fedorov. Holland ultimately decided no because he didn't want to give up prospects and Filpulla.

Enough with trying to push the "Babcock is to blame" narrative. You're just wrong.

Edited July 8, 2015 by kickazz

[Euro_Twins 4,475]

You're wrong mate.

Proof and source - http://blog.mlive.com/snapshots/2008/03/blame_bebcock_for_nixing_fedor.html

"On the eve of the "deadline" we had many conversations about Fedorov," Holland has stated. "I have collected 13 or 14 club officials--all our coaches, managers, and pro scouts. The emotions caused by possible return of Sergei, were [very] different. Yes, I have received Mike's opinion (Babcock--note, Igor Larin), but other positions were expressed. "We decided upon a certain offer, however Sergei eventually has been traded to "Washington " (the Capitol has given the young defender Teddy Ruth for the Russian veteran--note, Igor Larin). Such situation in general we arranged. They intended to receive a really good prospect player for Sergei, and we didn't want to give those up."

Holland really tried to get Fedorov, despite of the veto of the coach. However "Columbus" has requested from "Detroit" young forward Valteri Filppula and a first-round draft pick. As a result after these negotiations, and from this perspective "Columbus" has refused, having decided to not strengthen a club of the [same] division and having given the Russian legionary to a team not only in another division, but also the other conference.

There was apparently some sort of consensus in the room that several people had major concerns about bringing Fedorov back to Detroit, and in all likelihood, the concerns were related to both Fedorov's on-ice performance and the substantial off-ice distractions that Fedorov faced during his later years as a Wing.

---------------------

So 14 opinions and a lot of them didn't want Fedorov. Holland ultimately decided no because he didn't want to give up prospects and Filpulla.

Enough with trying to push the "Babcock is to blame" narrative. You're just wrong.

I can't believe Columbus was asking that much for a 38 year old, who couldn't out up very many points anymore

[LeftWinger 4,953]

Never said Babcock was solely to blame, but I did say he didn't want him here...as proven by your article saying it was VETOED by the coach. I knew Holland really wanted him, was VERY reluctant to give up Fil and a 1st, and when Babcock vetoed it (and apparently along with a few more) he decided not to risk it. Besides the info saying that a few people didn't want him here, I was not wrong whatsoever. I was right in saying Babcock vetoed it, Holland really wanted him back but was reluctant to play the price. But if everyone was on board, he would've done it. We still would've have won the Cup that year, we only would've lost out on a mediocre Filppula and Tom McCullom in the 1sr round that season. Hell, Feds could have been that one goal we needed to win in 09 as well.

My point to this whole thing was the healing began when Holland wanted him back in 08. I think time has healed all butt rashes and his #91 will be retired.

Buppy, it was said on HNIC that season that Babcock was getting frustrated getting Sergei to play 100% all the time and called to ask Scotty how to approach him differently. Obvious all efforts failed as early the next season, he was traded. I just assume he ended up in the famed Babcock doghouse we are all familiar with...

[kickazz 5,459]

Never said Babcock was solely to blame, but I did say he didn't want him here...as proven by your article saying it was VETOED by the coach. I knew Holland really wanted him, was VERY reluctant to give up Fil and a 1st, and when Babcock vetoed it (and apparently along with a few more) he decided not to risk it. Besides the info saying that a few people didn't want him here, I was not wrong whatsoever. I was right in saying Babcock vetoed it, Holland really wanted him back but was reluctant to play the price. But if everyone was on board, he would've done it. We still would've have won the Cup that year, we only would've lost out on a mediocre Filppula and Tom McCullom in the 1sr round that season. Hell, Feds could have been that one goal we needed to win in 09 as well.

My point to this whole thing was the healing began when Holland wanted him back in 08. I think time has healed all butt rashes and his #91 will be retired.

Buppy, it was said on HNIC that season that Babcock was getting frustrated getting Sergei to play 100% all the time and called to ask Scotty how to approach him differently. Obvious all efforts failed as early the next season, he was traded. I just assume he ended up in the famed Babcock doghouse we are all familiar with...

I'm not arguing that Babcock didn't want him. I'm just pointing out somethings you mentioned that was wrong - This was your other quote:

"Reality is, sure Holland was VERY reluctant to trade that much for Feds, and when Babs gave his opinion, it cemented it."

Babcock said no first and so did others, but Holland still tried pursuing because Holland can override their decisions. Columbus asked for prospect and Filpulla and Holland didnt want to do that. Columbus then decided they didn't want to give Sergei to a division rival. So tell me exactly how does Babcocks veto "cement" anything?

Buppy, it was said on HNIC that season that Babcock was getting frustrated getting Sergei to play 100% all the time and called to ask Scotty how to approach him differently. Obvious all efforts failed as early the next season, he was traded. I just assume he ended up in the famed Babcock doghouse we are all familiar with...

So Fedorov wasn't playing 100% all the time? How is that Babcocks problem? I say blame Federov for not playing 100% and it was right for Babcock to speculate he wouldn't have played 100% if he came back in 09.

Btw LW don't get me wrong. I love Feds. But I'm trying to weed out the facts that's all.

To be honest if Fedorov or Ozzy's jersey (other thread) is retired, I would welcome it. It would increase the liklelyhood that my current fav players to have a chance of getting it retired (Pav and Z)

Edited July 8, 2015 by kickazz

[Buppy 1,720]

...

Buppy, it was said on HNIC that season that Babcock was getting frustrated getting Sergei to play 100% all the time and called to ask Scotty how to approach him differently. Obvious all efforts failed as early the next season, he was traded. I just assume he ended up in the famed Babcock doghouse we are all familiar with...

Babcock was no longer with Anaheim when Fedorov was traded, he had nothing to do with that. Nor, I'm sure, did Babcock's previous experience with Fedorov have anything to do with not wanting to trade for him.

And that doghouse is largely an overblown fan creation.

[Euro_Twins 4,475]

Babcock was no longer with Anaheim when Fedorov was traded, he had nothing to do with that. Nor, I'm sure, did Babcock's previous experience with Fedorov have anything to do with not wanting to trade for him.

And that doghouse is largely an overblown fan creation.

Ya he was. He was the coach in Anaheim in 02/03 & 03/04. Fedorov played in Anaheim in 03/04, and was traded early the next season

[Buppy 1,720]

Ya he was. He was the coach in Anaheim in 02/03 & 03/04. Fedorov played in Anaheim in 03/04, and was traded early the next season

Re-read that. Babcock was no longer with Anaheim when Fedorov was traded.