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LeftWinger

Nyquist Files For Arbitration

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Eh.

I do and I don't.

I mostly wanted to use the phrase intangibulls**t because I thought it was funny.

I agree Toews isn't a top 10 player in the league skill wise, but he's good to great in every quantifiable category on top of what he brings as a captain, which you can't really put a dollar figure on.

If you say intangibALLS it carries more truculence

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http://www.freep.com/story/sports/nhl/red-wings/2015/07/07/detroit-red-wings-prospects-camp/29826233/

There's a small part about Nyquist in there, saying the club is working on a shorter term(2-3year) deal in the 4m range.

Nyquist update: Negotiations are underway on a shorter-term contract (2-3 years) with restricted free agent Gustav Nyquist. With two near-30 goal regular seasons to his credit, the 25-year-old forward will command in the $4-million range. Nyquist filed for arbitration, which runs July 20-Aug. 4. If it gets to that (unlikely), the club has the choice of electing a one- or two-year contract.

Oh boy looks like Nyquist is commanding for 4 mill range. Puts the whole "upwards of 5 mill" and "he's worth 6 mill" theory in the garbage dont it.

Eh.

I do and I don't.

I mostly wanted to use the phrase intangibulls**t because I thought it was funny.

I agree Toews isn't a top 10 player in the league skill wise, but he's good to great in every quantifiable category on top of what he brings as a captain, which you can't really put a dollar figure on.

I would be a bit pissed if we had drafted him, and had to pay him that much, but that anger would be mitigated by the fact that he had just brought us 3 cups recently so I can't say how I would feel for sure about it, because it didnt happen.

So I could care less about how much Toews got.

If Larkin become the player Toews is today. I'll be ecstatic, and I understand that well probably be shelling out the kinda money to him as Toews got, because of the contracts that are being handed out now.

I agree. Not a top 10 play but his leadership is unquestionable. And he's a complete player thats actually good at being a complete player (lol). I've never hated the idea of throwing money at someone who brings your organization success. That's why I felt like the Fed deal in 90s was worth it as well.

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Nyquist update: Negotiations are underway on a shorter-term contract (2-3 years) with restricted free agent Gustav Nyquist. With two near-30 goal regular seasons to his credit, the 25-year-old forward will command in the $4-million range. Nyquist filed for arbitration, which runs July 20-Aug. 4. If it gets to that (unlikely), the club has the choice of electing a one- or two-year contract.

Oh boy looks like Nyquist is commanding for 4 mill range. Puts the whole "upwards of 5 mill" and "he's worth 6 mill" theory in the garbage dont it.

And all the "so much for bridge deals," talk.

Although, if we were to get him locked up long term for 5-6, it could save us money in the future... especially if he finally hits the 30 goal mark.

I know that's only 2 more goals than hes hit before, but being an actual 30 goal scorer is a really good bargaining chip.

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There is a reason why guys like Lidstrom & Datsyuk are so well respected around here, they never put themselves first and even though they COULD get more money, they are/were willing to take a slight decrease in salary for the good of the team. They are still paid well, but not to the point where it hurts the team.

There was really no reason for Pav to extend his contract on a declining franchise when the KHL could have payed him twice as much. He stayed due to loyalty and because he loves it here. I have faith that Nyquist WANTS to be here and will be a team player. I believe that most of us here agree on that. The arbitration itself is a supporting argument to this.

Edited by kickazz

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Do you know what a "pay-cut" is? A pay-cut is when you take less money then what you used to get. Jonathan Toews NEVER took a pay-cut. http://www.spotrac.com/nhl/chicago-blackhawks/jonathan-toews/

You say Winnipeg & Buffalo were prepared to pay Towes 13.3 million a year? Please post a link to someone from either organization verifying or even hinting to this. Or are you just making up things as if they are facts because it helps your argument?

I don't think Towes is a top 3 player, I think he has been lucky enough to play with great players for the last 6 years, but that is irrelevant to this argument. I'm starting to see your philosophy Frank, you are pissed at the NHL/owners and anytime a player can get as much as they can out of them, you consider it a small "win". Nyquist is the perfect example, you seem to want him to get paid as much as possible even though if he does get a ridicoulas O'Rielly type contract, it hurts the Wings.

No one is disputing with you that these players CAN ask for the moon, what people including myself are saying is that in a team game where the team can only spend so much money with the cap, for a player to take a huge percentage of that money especially when the player is not worth it (ie. O'Rielly) it can and will hurt the team. Players that only look out for themselves are then perceived as selfish and entitled.

There is a reason why guys like Lidstrom & Datsyuk are so well respected around here, they never put themselves first and even though they COULD get more money, they are/were willing to take a slight decrease in salary for the good of the team. They are still paid well, but not to the point where it hurts the team.

Buffalo has had so much cap space to burn they would have offered Kane the moon if he would have become an ufa..think about merchandise from Jersey sales and all that stuff. At one point they were exactly 13 million under the cap floor so bringing in Kane would have made a lot of sense. Same goes for Winnipeg and Toews, a hometown kid who has won 2 cups, 2 gold medals and is just so clutch when needed ? Yup that's when the richest owner in the nhl would have opened his massive pocket.

We can argue about semantics all day long but basically a pay cut is defined as a reduced salary so compared to the potential he could have made on the open market yes he took a pay cut..if you are looking at it for the perspective of going from the 2 to the 3 contract then no he didn't.

And yes, you are right I am mad at the NHL but I don't view it as a win or victory if a player gets a nice contract. In fact I am not that emotionally attached to these things all I am saying is that I can understand every player who wants to get paid close or maybe even above what they are worth.

So maybe people are right and Goose signs a deal for 4 x 4 but I think it would suck if people turn at him because he commands and gets something significantly higher.

And guess what if Larkin delivers even 2 cups in 6 years I couldn't care less for what he asks just pay it and enjoy the ride..which sadly is exactly what Toews is doing for the Hawks

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Buffalo has had so much cap space to burn they would have offered Kane the moon if he would have become an ufa..think about merchandise from Jersey sales and all that stuff. At one point they were exactly 13 million under the cap floor so bringing in Kane would have made a lot of sense. Same goes for Winnipeg and Toews, a hometown kid who has won 2 cups, 2 gold medals and is just so clutch when needed ? Yup that's when the richest owner in the nhl would have opened his massive pocket.

We can argue about semantics all day long but basically a pay cut is defined as a reduced salary so compared to the potential he could have made on the open market yes he took a pay cut..if you are looking at it for the perspective of going from the 2 to the 3 contract then no he didn't.

And yes, you are right I am mad at the NHL but I don't view it as a win or victory if a player gets a nice contract. In fact I am not that emotionally attached to these things all I am saying is that I can understand every player who wants to get paid close or maybe even above what they are worth.

So maybe people are right and Goose signs a deal for 4 x 4 but I think it would suck if people turn at him because he commands and gets something significantly higher.

And guess what if Larkin delivers even 2 cups in 6 years I couldn't care less for what he asks just pay it and enjoy the ride..which sadly is exactly what Toews is doing for the Hawks

Frank, at the end of the day you are just guessing, who knows what Buffalo would have offered Kane. Even if they were under the cap floor, that was for 1 season. If we are talking long term contract year, being under the floor one year means nothing.

The fact that you are bringing up that the Winnipeg owner has deep pockets just reinforces to me that you don't get it. Its not about how much money an owner has, its about managing a team in a salary cap system for the short term, and the long term. Giving one player 13 million for a long time could absolutely screw a team over if that player doesn't produce, or even if he does produce, handicap that team.

I still don't get your "pay-cut" logic. You are saying that because he is allowed to get paid 13mil, if he signs for anything less its a "pay-cut". He is literally the highest paid player in the league, and his salary is constantly rising, not a pay-cut. If he signed for 13mil x 8 it would do Chicago more harm then good, hence he is not worth it.

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I would be shocked if we gave Nyquist north of 4.5 million. If we did, it better be no more than 5.5 for 5-6 years where the 4th 5th and 6th year would look like bargains. Nyquist isn't good enough defensively to demand that much money, especially playing on a two way line with Z and Abby

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The sad part of Nyquist getting a new deal is that this will probably be the last year of him being a fan favorite, unless of course he significantly improves.

We as a fan base love guys who overproduce for their salary but when they get a salary that's more in line with their production we heap unrealistic expectations on them.

Gus could put up the exact same numbers he's put up the past 2 years and because he'd be making 4-5 million a season instead of his current .95 million a year it will be seen as not good enough.

If he has another couple playoffs like his first couple, he'll be in the doghouse with Franzen.

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The sad part of Nyquist getting a new deal is that this will probably be the last year of him being a fan favorite, unless of course he significantly improves.

We as a fan base love guys who overproduce for their salary but when they get a salary that's more in line with their production we heap unrealistic expectations on them.

Gus could put up the exact same numbers he's put up the past 2 years and because he'd be making 4-5 million a season instead of his current .95 million a year it will be seen as not good enough

If he has another couple playoffs like his first couple, he'll be in the doghouse with Franzen.

Well said and very true.

But I remember Datsyuk getting railed for sub-par playoffs early in his career. Even after he had won a cup in 2002. The criticism was justified. He and Zetterberg were both too easy to handle vs Anaheim in 03, Calgary in 04, and Edmonton in 06. They never really figured out how to score on the road until 08.

I have no problem with Goose making 4-5M. I expect him to start showing sings adjusting to the playoffs during one of his next two appearances in the post season. It took Zetterberg and Datsyuk three and four tries, respectively, to really figure out the playoffs.

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Well said and very true.

But I remember Datsyuk getting railed for sub-par playoffs early in his career. Even after he had won a cup in 2002. The criticism was justified. He and Zetterberg were both too easy to handle vs Anaheim in 03, Calgary in 04, and Edmonton in 06. They never really figured out how to score on the road until 08.

I have no problem with Goose making 4-5M. I expect him to start showing sings adjusting to the playoffs during one of his next two appearances in the post season. It took Zetterberg and Datsyuk three and four tries, respectively, to really figure out the playoffs.

What you talking about!

Good point tho, I agree that playoff skill takes time.

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I don't understand this talk about Nyquist not being very good defensively...? I think he is one of our top defensive forwards, at least when it comes to stripping opposition of the puck. He's very Datsyukien when it comes to pickpocketing opponents. No, he doesn't play on the penalty-kill, nor should he, with the likes of Glendening, Miller, Helm, Abdelkader, Ferraro / Callahan / Andersson in the lineup. I'm not sure what Nyquist will get, I think some people are over shooting what he should get / will get and others are under shooting. I have full confidence in Ken that he will get a fair deal done over the next week or so...

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Nyquist update: Negotiations are underway on a shorter-term contract (2-3 years) with restricted free agent Gustav Nyquist. With two near-30 goal regular seasons to his credit, the 25-year-old forward will command in the $4-million range. Nyquist filed for arbitration, which runs July 20-Aug. 4. If it gets to that (unlikely), the club has the choice of electing a one- or two-year contract.

Oh boy looks like Nyquist is commanding for 4 mill range. Puts the whole "upwards of 5 mill" and "he's worth 6 mill" theory in the garbage dont it.

Sounds like a guess to me. Similar to how Khan stated Nyquist would get a Tatar type deal (money) in his article, but later in the comments section stated he would get more.

Edited by dragonballgtz

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Again, if indeed he is looking in the $4M range, will ok with that (like I have a choice! :lol: ) as long as Franzen stays on LTIR. I don't want to see Nyquist get $4M of our $5.4M and then we have to low ball Jurco and Pulk, PLUS be forced to send players down to GR that most likely will not clear waivers again. If Franzen is not 1000%, then his $3.9M will help tremendously!

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Again, if indeed he is looking in the $4M range, will ok with that (like I have a choice! :lol: ) as long as Franzen stays on LTIR. I don't want to see Nyquist get $4M of our $5.4M and then we have to low ball Jurco and Pulk, PLUS be forced to send players down to GR that most likely will not clear waivers again. If Franzen is not 1000%, then his $3.9M will help tremendously!

Jurco and pulk both haven't done anything to garner a big pay raise...

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I know Euro_Twins, but they will get about $800,000 a piece which won't be available unless we trade folks or lose them to waivers. Franzen continues to haunt this team's development and hindering the kids from their rightful roster spot. I know Ferraro and Callahan are mid tier talent, if that, but no way do I want to lose anyone else (Nestrasil) for free. If they deal and get picks or something to make room, then so be it, but again, unless Franzen is absolutely free of any symptoms, he needs to stay on LTIR. Hate to trade a kid for one more body check that puts Franzen out again, for good this time.

It's best to find a suitor who may want to take on the Franzen project in exchange for a conditional pick. Which could very well be anywhere from a 2nd to a 7th depending on his health and performance. If he got dealt, got healthy and had a 30 goal season for someone, then a 2nd would be nice compensation. If he never got healthy, then a 7th or cash, who knows.

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I know Euro_Twins, but they will get about $800,000 a piece which won't be available unless we trade folks or lose them to waivers. Franzen continues to haunt this team's development and hindering the kids from their rightful roster spot. I know Ferraro and Callahan are mid tier talent, if that, but no way do I want to lose anyone else (Nestrasil) for free. If they deal and get picks or something to make room, then so be it, but again, unless Franzen is absolutely free of any symptoms, he needs to stay on LTIR. Hate to trade a kid for one more body check that puts Franzen out again, for good this time.

It's best to find a suitor who may want to take on the Franzen project in exchange for a conditional pick. Which could very well be anywhere from a 2nd to a 7th depending on his health and performance. If he got dealt, got healthy and had a 30 goal season for someone, then a 2nd would be nice compensation. If he never got healthy, then a 7th or cash, who knows.

Don't think you can trade cash anymore

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