Goalie Battle

[kickazz 5,459]

HAHA did they ACTUALLY say that>?!

Yep.

Darren Elliot said it and Chris Osgood thinks Jimmy has to earn the spot from Mrazek now. Which means he thinks Mrazek is number 1. For now.

[wings_fanatic 677]

Yep.

Darren Elliot said it and Chris Osgood thinks Jimmy has to earn the spot from Mrazek now. Which means he thinks Mrazek is number 1. For now.

Excellent! About frickin time. Lets just hope Blashill does that. At least Mrazek is going to play New Years Eve since I am there haha.

[joesuffP 1,746]

I've been happy with the decisions Blash has made on the goalie tandem so far but Mrazek should get a few starts in a row just to keep the tandem fair based on performance. Give Howard another shot soon but not after Mrazek gets a few starts to himself

But remember last year? Howard was being a turd in net and Babs decided to keep going with Mrazek and in a key game where all the pressure was on, he flubbed and lost the game for us against Boston. Then Babs went back to Howard. Mrazek is not as consistent as everyone makes him out to be. He hasn't really had a chance to this year but he still has a lot to prove

[wings_fanatic 677]

I've been happy with the decisions Blash has made on the goalie tandem so far but Mrazek should get a few starts in a row just to keep the tandem fair based on performance. Give Howard another shot soon but not after Mrazek gets a few starts to himself

But remember last year? Howard was being a turd in net and Babs decided to keep going with Mrazek and in a key game where all the pressure was on, he flubbed and lost the game for us against Boston. Then Babs went back to Howard. Mrazek is not as consistent as everyone makes him out to be. He hasn't really had a chance to this year but he still has a lot to prove

He was pretty consistent in the playoffs. One of our best players actually...

[kickazz 5,459]

I've been happy with the decisions Blash has made on the goalie tandem so far but Mrazek should get a few starts in a row just to keep the tandem fair based on performance. Give Howard another shot soon but not after Mrazek gets a few starts to himself

But remember last year? Howard was being a turd in net and Babs decided to keep going with Mrazek and in a key game where all the pressure was on, he flubbed and lost the game for us against Boston. Then Babs went back to Howard. Mrazek is not as consistent as everyone makes him out to be. He hasn't really had a chance to this year but he still has a lot to prove

I agree that last year he had major consistency issues. This year he's gotten better. It's just part of the rookie process. He's being eased in. That's probably one of the main reasons Blash favored the tandem strategy.

He was pretty consistent in the playoffs. One of our best players actually...

He was not consistent in the playoffs. He gave up 5 goals in 2 different playoff games. One in which we had a 3-2 series lead. Which Tampa ended up going 3-3 and then Tampa won it all in game 7. Rookies are rookies, it happens.

Edited December 30, 2015 by kickazz

[joesuffP 1,746]

He was pretty consistent in the playoffs. One of our best players actually...

Yes for 7 games. Just some food for thought, obviously I'm wishing for the best

At this point everyone has to accept what Howard is. He's had pretty much the exact same season 3 and half years in a row. He can provide you with top notch goaltending, top 5 in the league, but will have problem stretches that that don't allow you to win hockey games

I agree that last year he had major consistency issues. This year he's gotten better. It's just part of the rookie process. He's being eased in. That's probably one of the main reasons Blash favored the tandem strategy.

He was not consistent in the playoffs. He gave up 5 goals in 2 different playoff games. One in which we had a 3-2 series lead. Which Tampa ended up going 3-3 and then Tampa won it all in game 7. Rookies are rookies, it happens.

I actually agree with this. Everyone thinks Mtazek played amazing for us all series, which he did in a number of games, but he was flawed. I think the goal he gave up on Johnson when we were up 2-0 with a 2-1 series lead was the major turning point of the series and could have been stopped by any goalie

[frankgrimes 1,836]

What game were you watching last night?! Mrazek was SOLID against the Wild, by far the best Wings player on the ice. HE GAVE THE TEAM A CHANCE TO WIN. Something Howard has trouble doing. I think Blash needs to stick with Mrazek. In fact, if he would have been sticking with Mrazek and if he used half decent lines, I think we would be solidly in 1st place right now. The longer this season goes on, the more I question Blash and his ability to coach.

Frankly I don't care WHO is starting but so far neither Mrazek nor Howard are worth of any hype. They both have had solid to great games and then not so good ones. Unless someone is emerging as the true number 1 there really is no point in arguing over semantics. Wheter people want to admit it or not but Mrazek needs to work on his consistency because a number 1 goaltender is expected to start around 70 games a season and if you aren't consistent doing that, you'll find yourself in a backup role.

If people want to give Mrazek 4 games and then Howard 4 games that's also fine but making an inconsistent goalie the number 1 is not going to help matters. The definition of an average team is winning a bunch of games followed by losing a bunch of games that's exactly what this team is and my mind the goaltending is not problem number 1. That still is the defense and the absolutely unwillingness to box players out of the crease.

[kickazz 5,459]

I actually agree with this. Everyone thinks Mtazek played amazing for us all series, which he did in a number of games, but he was flawed. I think the goal he gave up on Johnson when we were up 2-0 with a 2-1 series lead was the major turning point of the series and could have been stopped by any goalie

Kid got pulled game 3 of that series and Howard went in. Mrazek ALSO got pulled 4 or 5 times during the season last year.

It's true people are hyping up Mrazek more than needed. He was OKAY last year but still better than Jimmy.

Right now imo Jimmy needs to be sat for a bit. Mrazek should be number 1 for a bit unless he himself screws it up.

That's that.

Edited December 30, 2015 by kickazz

[chaps80 1,591]

Jimmy absolutely needs to sit. He's been horrid lately. I don't see the issue with Mrazek getting the reigns for awhile. It happens a lot around the league. Veteran falters, young upstart takes over as long as he keeps playing well. Just because Jimmy "needs starts" in case they want to trade him for a good return makes no sense. They should be playing who gives the best chance to win no matter what. Right now that's Mrazek.

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

Frankly I don't care WHO is starting but so far neither Mrazek nor Howard are worth of any hype. They both have had solid to great games and then not so good ones. Unless someone is emerging as the true number 1 there really is no point in arguing over semantics. Wheter people want to admit it or not but Mrazek needs to work on his consistency because a number 1 goaltender is expected to start around 70 games a season and if you aren't consistent doing that, you'll find yourself in a backup role.

If people want to give Mrazek 4 games and then Howard 4 games that's also fine but making an inconsistent goalie the number 1 is not going to help matters. The definition of an average team is winning a bunch of games followed by losing a bunch of games that's exactly what this team is and my mind the goaltending is not problem number 1. That still is the defense and the absolutely unwillingness to box players out of the crease.

I don't get this. Both goalies have been very good this year. Howard has just recently hit this bad patch with 2 bad games.

Mrazek has had about 2 or 3 bad goals, but I haven't really seen him have a bad game. His save percentage is tied for 6th in the league. His GAA is 16th - just behind Quick and Schneider. He's played pretty much as good as anyone can realistically expect from a goalie in their 1st full season. If you're not excited about him I don't what to tell you. He was inconsistent last year, but I think all goalies not named Lundquist need time to get used to the league and be solid consistently. The much vaunted Price struggled 08-10 and many (idiots) here in Montreal wanted him gone (The Halak story). Holtby's develop is probably closest to Petr's since they both were eased into the league. Holtby only took the full load last year after 4 years (14g, 7g, 36g,48) If Petr continues to mirror that path, then he would take the full load next year. Anyway, with Howard around we have a safeguard as he gets to that point.

70 games is high for a starting goalie. Only goalies like Price and Lundquist do that as their usual year load. From a quick incomplete search: Fleury, Scheinder, Niemi, Varly, Bishop have never played 70. Crawford, Bobrovsky have never even started 60. For an undisputed #1 it's around 60.

[RusDRW 155]

I'm surprised there is discussion in this thread. We have one goalie who consistently keeps us in games and another one who consistently allows 2-3 goals in less than 10 shots. We have no goalie tandem. It is Mrazek and his inconsistent 5M per year backup.

[Hockeymom1960 5,107]

Some of you are ridiculous. Mrazek is still a baby. He was up last year only because Monster was always hurt and he was playing in the playoffs because he was better than Jimmy. This year is his first real year and was suppose to be the back up but will probably be the number 1 and he's been a pretty damn good. You guys are focusing on the wrong place. Our offense SUCKS big time. I didn't look it up but how many goals do we actually have since the start of the season. We can't win only scoring one goal a game.

[RusDRW 155]

Some of you are ridiculous. Mrazek is still a baby. He was up last year only because Monster was always hurt and he was playing in the playoffs because he was better than Jimmy. This year is his first real year and was suppose to be the back up but will probably be the number 1 and he's been a pretty damn good. You guys are focusing on the wrong place. Our offense SUCKS big time. I didn't look it up but how many goals do we actually have since the start of the season. We can't win only scoring one goal a game.

We are not Dallas Stars. For more than 10 years Detroit plays defense first game. We are supposed to win 3-2 and 2-1 not 7-5. You cannot win 3-2 if your goalie allows unscreened 30ft goals.

[kickazz 5,459]

I don't get this. Both goalies have been very good this year. Howard has just recently hit this bad patch with 2 bad games.

Mrazek has had about 2 or 3 bad goals, but I haven't really seen him have a bad game. His save percentage is tied for 6th in the league. His GAA is 16th - just behind Quick and Schneider. He's played pretty much as good as anyone can realistically expect from a goalie in their 1st full season. If you're not excited about him I don't what to tell you. He was inconsistent last year, but I think all goalies not named Lundquist need time to get used to the league and be solid consistently. The much vaunted Price struggled 08-10 and many (idiots) here in Montreal wanted him gone (The Halak story). Holtby's develop is probably closest to Petr's since they both were eased into the league. Holtby only took the full load last year after 4 years (14g, 7g, 36g,48) If Petr continues to mirror that path, then he would take the full load next year. Anyway, with Howard around we have a safeguard as he gets to that point.

70 games is high for a starting goalie. Only goalies like Price and Lundquist do that as their usual year load. From a quick incomplete search: Fleury, Scheinder, Niemi, Varly, Bishop have never played 70. Crawford, Bobrovsky have never even started 60. For an undisputed #1 it's around 60.

I remember this actually. A lot of my Canadian friends who live in Michigan (originally from Montreal) hated Price in the beginning.

[Barrie 900]

I felt bad for Howard last night. I don't think he had a chance on 3 of those goals. We need Howard to shake his last 2 starts off, because we're still not sure if Mrazek can handle the number of games a #1 goalie plays.

[puckloo39 5,686]

http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2015/12/red_wings_jimmy_howard_says_hi.html

All you can do as a goalie: try to do better. I wonder if the Wings would do better starting Mrazek for a few games in a row, just to give Jimmy a break. Slumps are not uncommon, happens to the best. The real issue is offense (lack there-of) and D when it matters. The entire team is inconsistent if you ask me - which you didn't... but, they are.

[Bill Berzeench 310]

I'm surprised there is discussion in this thread. We have one goalie who consistently keeps us in games and another one who consistently allows 2-3 goals in less than 10 shots. We have no goalie tandem. It is Mrazek and his inconsistent 5M per year backup.

I feel the same way. Howard KILLS this team.

I felt bad for Howard last night. I don't think he had a chance on 3 of those goals. We need Howard to shake his last 2 starts off, because we're still not sure if Mrazek can handle the number of games a #1 goalie plays.

I felt bad for the other 19 players. All 4 goals were saves for a top 10 goalie. Ben Bishop wouldn't even consider any of those shots difficult to stop. They were well placed shots, but all but one were from distance. Our goalie has to have at least 3 of those.

[Z and D for the C 712]

I feel the same way. Howard KILLS this team.

What is Howard doing that makes his team not score any goals? When he was pulled it was 0-4 and the team was playing like complete s***. Saying that all four of those goals are saves from a "top 10" goalie is completely ridiculous. A) Like you're psychic and B) All goals let in goals like Howard let in. Sure he wasn't amazing but his team was terrible in front of him.

I think Mrazek has been slightly better but jesus some of you blow everything out of proportion.

[Bill Berzeench 310]

What is Howard doing that makes his team not score any goals? When he was pulled it was 0-4 and the team was playing like complete s***. Saying that all four of those goals are saves from a "top 10" goalie is completely ridiculous. A) Like you're psychic and B) All goals let in goals like Howard let in. Sure he wasn't amazing but his team was terrible in front of him.

I think Mrazek has been slightly better but jesus some of you blow everything out of proportion.

Their pp goal last night was legit. Low slot prime scoring area. The other 3 were atrocious.

[roboturner 562]

I think Mrazek has been slightly better but jesus some of you blow everything out of proportion.

I think it has more to due with watching Howard for the whole of his now 7 years as a starter, knowing this is pretty much what you're going to get from him, and then watching Mrazek get called up last year and 1) slide into the backup role 2) Play well enough to make it a 1A/1B situation 3) Win the starting job for the playoffs and now 4) Playing slightly better than Howard and giving the team a slightly better chance at winning. Add in that this is his first full year in the league and well....(I mean Howard did the same thing to Osgood. First full year in the league was backing up Ozzy, but halfway through the season he had become the number 1. The only difference is Ozzy was clearly at the end of his career, whereas Howard is not.)

If you had two pitchers that were both pretty good (like either one would be the ace of the pitching staff if they were on different teams), you're still going to want to start the one who is slightly better (or at least playing slightly better at the time).

It doesn't matter how much better

Slightly better is still better, and the one who's better should be given preference. Mrazek is slightly better. That's all there is to it.

[wings_fanatic 677]

I think it has more to due with watching Howard for the whole of his now 7 years as a starter, knowing this is pretty much what you're going to get from him, and then watching Mrazek get called up last year and 1) slide into the backup role 2) Play well enough to make it a 1A/1B situation 3) Win the starting job for the playoffs and now 4) Playing slightly better than Howard and giving the team a slightly better chance at winning. Add in that this is his first full year in the league and well....(I mean Howard did the same thing to Osgood. First full year in the league was backing up Ozzy, but halfway through the season he had become the number 1. The only difference is Ozzy was clearly at the end of his career, whereas Howard is not.)

If you had two pitchers that were both pretty good (like either one would be the ace of the pitching staff if they were on different teams), you're still going to want to start the one who is slightly better (or at least playing slightly better at the time).

It doesn't matter how much better

Slightly better is still better, and the one who's better should be given preference. Mrazek is slightly better. That's all there is to it.

Could not have said it better myself. When was the last time Howard even won a game? I looked and he has not won any of his previous 5 games, but the website only showed that stat, so maybe it is even more than 5?

I don't like that Kenny in general seems too loyal these past few years. He is afraid to trade anyone away because of this loyalty. He needs to be reminded that this is a business. In this business, Howard is not going to bring us over the top- best move him in a package to require pieces to make our team better. I think it is growing more and more obvious that Howard has no future here as a starter.

[RusDRW 155]

What is Howard doing that makes his team not score any goals? When he was pulled it was 0-4 and the team was playing like complete s***.

Letting in few soft goals in the beginning of the games Howard affects the way the games are played further. Playing from behind is tough in this league, especially, when there is so much parity between the teams. I don't really have statistics to back up my words but something tells me that falling down by two goals is basically equals to loosing the game.

And I'm not even talking about confidence of players who are well aware that each and every shot is a potential goal. Have you noticed how our defenseman try to block every 30ft shot if we have Howard in net? Completely different story with Mrazek in net. They just let him see these shots.

[LeftWinger 4,951]

Howard has hit that point in the season (which he does every season) where his confidence is shot. We all knew who was going to win the goalie battle, I think now, that victory is obvious. It's time to ride Mrazek every game possible to see if he can be that iron man goalie to carry us into the playoffs and beyond. It may be too early to make a trade involving Howard, but it may be time to start entertaining the idea and fielding some calls...

[dirtydangles 1,328]

Psychologically it must be tough for the team to play in front of Howard when he consistently loses games.

Mrazek rules Howard drools.

[greenrebellion 415]

Let's face it, Mrazek has more than proven that he is capable of a full time starting gig in the NHL. Howard is, and always has been, a merely average goalie. And while it never hurts to have two NHL caliber goalies on a roster, it does suck to be paying the backup $5 million+ with multiple seasons remaining.

Ideally, we'll find a trade partner, but honestly, what team is going to take an average (at best) goalie for the kind of contract he is on. I just don't think any contending team would ever be that desperate for goaltending.