• Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

LeftWinger

Wings Need on D and Glaring Inconsistencies

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

OK, so it seems that every GDT and or any other thread eventually turns away from the subject and gets into a debate about what the Wings may need to get better on D and who is or isn't good anymore, who makes more mistakes or who seems to be taking the lead of this D Corps. It gets tiresome jumping from thread to thread in order to keep up with a conversation, so I created this topic to direct all that talk into one place....have at it!

Mods, if you feel this thread is not a good idea, please feel free to dump it.

Edited by LeftWinger

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kindl has the best Corsi for % of all our D, and is tied for the best +/- on our D squad

Meanwhile Ericsson has the worst Corsi For % on our D, and leads the D with 20 giveaways (more than double the next guy)

Kronwall also needs to be better

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really haven't liked E too much, and the facts you bring up now makes me dislike him more. Unfortunately I don't think Holland will trade him.

I've said it many times before I believe that E, K and Smith are very replaceable within our system. It is nice to see K doing bettter under Blashill, and maybe if Holland moves E and Smith, Kindl can slot in #6 even next season...and his cap hit is good.

I am most disapointed in Smith. I remember, back when Suter got P-Whipped into going to Minny, I remember predicting (or maybe hoping because I felt dissed) that Smith will end up better than Suter....what? Ugh! Boy was I wrong. I had high hopes for him...

Edited by LeftWinger

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kindl is probably one of the best third pair defensemen in the league tbh

Imo just by the eyeball test E has looked fine and is strong in front of the net. No offense to his game whatsoever same with Dekeseyer. Those fancy stats don't flatter defense only guys

Edited by joesuffP

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kindl is probably one of the best third pair defensemen in the league tbh

Imo just by the eyeball test E has looked fine and is strong in front of the net. No offense to his game whatsoever same with Dekeseyer. Those fancy stats don't flatter defense only guys

They don't. E is here for his size and reach in front of the net. That's about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ya, but if he gives the puck away so much, then whether or not his size helps, he is becoming a liabilty. During the SJC game, he seemed to make a mistake everytime he was on the ice...but it could've been me just magnifying everything he did, but man it seemed like he was botching the play a ton that game...and more so recently.


That give and go that Kronwall made late in the game to set up Abby with a grade A scoring chance that he flubbed was something Kronwall should be doing game in game out. Those plays are so far and few between with him

Also, did you see, I think it was the Boston game, that he had a huge hit at the blueline, not a Kronwalling, but just a nice standup hit that rocked the opponent. I like that side of him as well! He seems to play better when he hits more like that! He needs to dump the Kronwalling due to the league eyeballing him now, but man, if he can hit at a standstill like the other night, we just may re-define Kronwalling.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

LW you asked a very good question. What do the RW's need? if you look at the entire organization there are 2 types of players completely missing at every level: big rugged F's that play in front of the other teams net and pound on the other teams D in the corners and behind the net. The second is the reverse of that type: big rugged Dmen that knock over F's in front of our net and pound on the other teams forwards in the corners and behind our net. There is no one in our organization from Detroit through Toledo and the amauter ranks that do those things.

Abby is a good all round player and gives his all, but he should be the front of net guy on the second PP with someone great at it on the 1st unit. Kronwall needs a tough defensive Dman to pair with so green and be paired with dekeyser-another strong defensive player.

The examples of each would be Backes-a personnel fav at F and Burns on the BL. Guys like them fill in the holes on our team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think we're going to be a dominant perennial contender until Larkin, AA and Mrazek are the core of this team. I think Holland has a long term plan where they will be aiming at a new dynasty of red wings. Be patient, I've accepted this and it feels a lot better

It's the difference between us and other teams that continue to fail rebuilding. We treated our vets with respect and allowed them to teach and nurture the future leaders while making necessary improvements to keep the team competitive which allows our prospects to transition from good to great a lot easier

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Continuing on with my earlier post. In the end what I posted in the solution IMHO. It is the solution because we currently are playing guys and putting guys into positions they are not able to perform at. Go back the the Sharks game. Helm was the front of net F on the 2nd PP. That is not something Helm can do. The past few games we have been playing Green and Kronwall together. That is a TERRIBLE defensive pair. Yes they are good when we have the puck, the moument the other team has it, we are in trouble. Neither is a good defensive player.

Some want to blame Blashill for this. Ok fine. But he isn't the one that has constructed the roster. When you have holes that is the GM's job to fill the holes. We are now 1/4 the way through the system. we know what we have and don't have. Now is the time for Holland to start kicking the tires and try to make a deal or 2. The advantage we now have is we have enough depth to make deals. Time to start working through the bottom ten teams and see what we can find to help ourselves out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kindl has the best Corsi for % of all our D, and is tied for the best +/- on our D squad

Meanwhile Ericsson has the worst Corsi For % on our D, and leads the D with 20 giveaways (more than double the next guy)

Kronwall also needs to be better

Big E has been a huge disappointment this year. To my naked eye (IMO), he lacks "heart" and intensity. Has he caught a severe case of the "Robert Lang" syndrome?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Continuing on with my earlier post. In the end what I posted in the solution IMHO. It is the solution because we currently are playing guys and putting guys into positions they are not able to perform at. Go back the the Sharks game. Helm was the front of net F on the 2nd PP. That is not something Helm can do. The past few games we have been playing Green and Kronwall together. That is a TERRIBLE defensive pair. Yes they are good when we have the puck, the moument the other team has it, we are in trouble. Neither is a good defensive player.

Some want to blame Blashill for this. Ok fine. But he isn't the one that has constructed the roster. When you have holes that is the GM's job to fill the holes. We are now 1/4 the way through the system. we know what we have and don't have. Now is the time for Holland to start kicking the tires and try to make a deal or 2. The advantage we now have is we have enough depth to make deals. Time to start working through the bottom ten teams and see what we can find to help ourselves out.

Agreed that Kronwall-Green is bad, but we don't have to have Green and Kronwall together so I would say that's Blashill's doing. Especially if Q was healthy there would be other options. Dk-Green and Kronwall-Q could have worked for me.

I do think that we lack a #2 guy and it would be great if Holland wheel and deal (just don't kick those wheels Mr. Holland). I wonder whether the Jets would see Ericsson as pretty good value for Buff since he's only a rental. I wouldn't feel so bad about losing him for nothing if Buff didn't re-sign - we could just use the extra space to re-sign Quincey if that were the case or maybe some other UFA.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Big E has been a huge disappointment this year. To my naked eye (IMO), he lacks "heart" and intensity. Has he caught a severe case of the "Robert Lang" syndrome?

This is nothing new. He's big and not physical, thus everyone sees him as lacking heart/intensity. He's a good pylon to place in front of the net and clear the crease, but that's about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Agreed that Kronwall-Green is bad, but we don't have to have Green and Kronwall together so I would say that's Blashill's doing. Especially if Q was healthy there would be other options. Dk-Green and Kronwall-Q could have worked for me.

I do think that we lack a #2 guy and it would be great if Holland wheel and deal (just don't kick those wheels Mr. Holland). I wonder whether the Jets would see Ericsson as pretty good value for Buff since he's only a rental. I wouldn't feel so bad about losing him for nothing if Buff didn't re-sign - we could just use the extra space to re-sign Quincey if that were the case or maybe some other UFA.

Buff doesn't play D either. Plus Ericsson has a full NMC in his long term big money deal. We can't trade him even if we wanted to. So for now he should be on the 3rd pair with Marchenko. Green and DK on a pair and then find someone to pair with Kronwall. That means Kindl and Smith are 2 pieces we can move. Helm is another piece. He is a UFA and has clones in the system to replace him. We need a Burns type or at worst a M Staal type to pair with Kronwall.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Buff doesn't play D either. Plus Ericsson has a full NMC in his long term big money deal. We can't trade him even if we wanted to. So for now he should be on the 3rd pair with Marchenko. Green and DK on a pair and then find someone to pair with Kronwall. That means Kindl and Smith are 2 pieces we can move. Helm is another piece. He is a UFA and has clones in the system to replace him. We need a Burns type or at worst a M Staal type to pair with Kronwall.

E has a modified NTC. Never seen the details anywhere, but I'd assume it's the typical "supply a list of teams" variety.

Adding a top defenseman isn't a very realistic option. Probably not feasible unless we move all of E, Smith, and Kindl, or Howard in lieu of one of them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Buff doesn't play D either. Plus Ericsson has a full NMC in his long term big money deal. We can't trade him even if we wanted to. So for now he should be on the 3rd pair with Marchenko. Green and DK on a pair and then find someone to pair with Kronwall. That means Kindl and Smith are 2 pieces we can move. Helm is another piece. He is a UFA and has clones in the system to replace him. We need a Burns type or at worst a M Staal type to pair with Kronwall.

Foiled again! Yeah, I should have known that E had a NMC.

Agreed on using Kindl and Smith+ to get a good partner for Kronwall, but I doubt they'd bring much by themselves. I'd like to keep Helm, but it would depend on what the deal is

Edited by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't believe that we have a "need on D". We're top ten in the league in 5 on 5 goals against AND top ten in the league on the PK. Plus out goalies are playing well. Defensively we're fine.

You could argue that we need better puck movers, but I'm not really sure that's true either. While Kronwall isn't playing well, there's no reason to believe that he won't pick it up at some point. He's consistently produced points throughout his career. Likewise Green and Kindl are moving the puck well given our offensive woes. Even Dekeyser is a capable puck mover, albeit not his specialty. I think a lot of the lack of production from the back end (as well as the forwards) was the result of learning to get comfortable in a new system which asks more of our defensemen than they've previously been expected to contribute. As the offense picks up steam, and our shot differential improves, so will the defensemen's numbers.

I do think that it wouldn't hurt to have a power forward type who can bang and crash around the net. But even that seems less necessary when you consider that Richards' return will likely push AA to the wing and given that Sheahan is currently playing wing (and looking good). That gives us decent size on the wings for the first time all year.

However, if we are absolutely sold on acquiring a big, gritty, forward, I'd take a look at Kerby Rychel for Columbus. He was drafted one spot ahead of Mantha, plays a physical game, and is rumored to be on the block. Columbus is also rumored to want a defenseman in return, and lord knows we've got a bunch of those. It's a pretty low risk move even if the kid doesn't pan out.

Otherwise I'd say stand pat. We've looked better the last 5-6 games against better competition, we're not slipping in the standings, and I think there's every reason to believe our guys (and coach) are finally finding the right fit for the system they're playing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now