Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

[NerveDamage 4,176]

Top forwards from 2007-2016

[TheXym 2,606]

I agree with Larkin and Neilsen ideally being 1A/1B. If Larkin can handle that and put up numbers like the first half of last season, it will be huge. It would also free up Hank to play wing, which means his back will likely hold up better. If Vanek can produce, it makes things really interesting. I have a feeling getting out of Minnesota is going to rejuvenate him. (Plus, if he tanks this year he is likely done in the NHL). How much did Vanek and Nielsen play as line mates when they were both on the Island? If they had chemistry and can reignite that, look out.

LW- Nyquist and Pulkkinen are my trade bait, but I'd gladly give up Jurco as well to keep Mantha and AA. If absolutely forced to choose, I think AA is the one I'd keep. I'd also consider Tatar as well depending on the return.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Zetterberg Larkin Nyquist

Tatar AA Vanek

Martha Sheahan Abdelkader

Miller Glendening Jurco/rookie

Zetterberg Larkin Nyquist

Tatar Nielsen Vanek

Helm Sheahan Abdelkader

Miller Glendening Ott/Jurco

Group one isn't any worse and might even be better, plus it gives players who will be needed soon to play. Group 2 isn't a contender, it just keeps young players out of the lineup

[DatsyukianDekes 2,428]

Hey guys, apparently one player is going to make a difference on this team, Especially one that is unproven and has only played 20 games.

lol

[kickazz 5,459]

Zetterberg Larkin Nyquist

Tatar AA Vanek

Martha Sheahan Abdelkader

Miller Glendening Jurco/rookie

Zetterberg Larkin Nyquist

Tatar Nielsen Vanek

Helm Sheahan Abdelkader

Miller Glendening Ott/Jurco

Group one isn't any worse and might even be better, plus it gives players who will be needed soon to play. Group 2 isn't a contender, it just keeps young players out of the lineup

AA was 41% on faceoffs while Neilsen is 50%

Neilsen takes on tougher matchups which AA can't handle. In group 1, Zetterberg's line would be forced to handle the opposing team toughest matchups and once again by December Zetterberg would decline.

Also our PK would be s*** with group one.

When used, AA should continue on the 3rd line for this year. I don't think he's ready for top 6 quiet yet. His minutes were way too sheltered last year for him to be thrown into top 6.

Edited July 4, 2016 by kickazz

[DickieDunn 2,571]

So move players around. Also, players do improve from one year to the next. Allowing them to actually play helps them improve.

Hey guys, apparently one player is going to make a difference on this team, Especially one that is unproven and has only played 20 games.

lol

And a 32 year old second line center will put them over the top?

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

So of the pairs below which one player of the two would you rather give up to land that top 2 defender? You can only choose one from the pair(s.)

1. Nyquist or Tatar

2. Pulkkinen or Jurco

3. Athanasiou or Mantha

....first two not so tough, but the 3rd pair I am torn.

I trade:

1. Nyquist

2. Pulkkinen

3. Mantha...I just like AA a lot, but I'd trade BOTH Nyquist and Tatar to keep AA and Mantha!

Id try and put in a 2nd or 3rd rather than include that 3rd option and add a ouellet , as bad as our need for defensmen are I'm not sold on fowler , shattenkirk has one year left, and trouba as much as I want him he still hasn't proven he's a top pairing dman with big offensive numbers although I think he'll get there

Nyquist+jurco+2nd rounder + ouellet. For trouba but I don't think jets would do this cause they have a ton of forwards and would want a good dman back and we don't have any unless we ship a dekeyser or kronwall (not kronwall alone but in a package I think jets would listen)

Nyquist +pulkkinen +3rd rounder "should" be more then enough and probably is , say what you will about nyquist but put him with getzlaf and he's getting 25-30

Anyways I think we got the whole summer to relax and unwind cause I don't think holland will be in a hurry, if the ducks really want to move fowler they'll have to go with the best option, they won't get a first rounder or a teams top prospect for him

Brad montour is also another player from the ducks we should target , they are stacked at d and might be willing to part with him as well

[Dabura 12,207]

So move players around. Also, players do improve from one year to the next. Allowing them to actually play helps them improve.

And a 32 year old second line center will put them over the top?

I believe Larkin and Athanasiou are future cornerstone centermen. At the same time, though, I don't think Larkin or Athanasiou is ready to play the kind of role that Frans Nielsen has been playing for years. This is a case where, in terms of pure positional primacy and experience, the tie truly ought to go to the vereran. Nielsen can be hard-matched against anyone in the league and hold his own. He can center a top PP unit and a top PK unit. He can start a lot of his shifts in the defensive zone -- against elite players -- and still find a way to drive possession in the right direction. He can win key faceoffs. These are things that Larkin and Athanasiou haven't proven they can do as top-six bus-driving NHL centermen. (Which, yeah, is kind of an unfair statement. But it is what it is.) Expecting them to do so, straight away, in 2016-17 helps neither the team nor the two players' respective development paths.

[Datsyukian-Deke 722]

Zetterberg Larkin Nyquist

Tatar AA Vanek

Martha Sheahan Abdelkader

Miller Glendening Jurco/rookie

Zetterberg Larkin Nyquist

Tatar Nielsen Vanek

Helm Sheahan Abdelkader

Miller Glendening Ott/Jurco

Group one isn't any worse and might even be better, plus it gives players who will be needed soon to play. Group 2 isn't a contender, it just keeps young players out of the lineup

Both lineups have issues. We absolutely need to make a trade. AA has to be in the lineup. And so does Mantha but I don't want to see Mantha on the 4th line. Especially with him having issues with confidence. He needs to be in a position to succeed. The more I look at the lineup, the angrier I get that we re-signed Helm and Miller. I think we would have been better off in the long run without them. Edited July 4, 2016 by Datsyukian-Deke

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Miller isn't blocking anyone from a scoring line, Helm, Vanek, and Nielsen are.

[Datsyukian-Deke 722]

Miller isn't blocking anyone from a scoring line, Helm, Vanek, and Nielsen are.

Ye but I'd rather see Ott on the 4th line because toughness is something we desperately lack. Miller's job can be passed on to someone else in the lineup. The Helm signing was the worst of the off-season.

[MrazekFanBoy 223]

Yeah we should've let Helm walk, this playoff streak is a curse

AA and Mantha should both be on the third line to atleast start the year

[LeftWinger 4,949]

We definitely should've said goodbye to Helm. Especially if they were going to sign 3 new forwards. This just tells me that they have no confidence in Pulkkinen or Jurco and feel they can lose Nyquist or Tatar in a deal and miss them. Same goes for Sproul and Jensen.

[VM1138 1,921]

Everyone keeps mentioning Zetterberg's back. Last I heard his back is totally fine ever since he had that surgery. He's just slowing down naturally.

Everyone keeps mentioning Zetterberg's back. Last I heard his back is totally fine ever since he had that surgery. He's just slowing down naturally.

[LeftWinger 4,949]

Help, I'm stepping into the Twilight Zone....

[kickazz 5,459]

Everyone keeps mentioning Zetterberg's back. Last I heard his back is totally fine ever since he had that surgery. He's just slowing down naturally.

You can't possibly think he's the same player pre and post surgery. Watch some of his highlights from pre surgery in 2014 and then in the 2015 season. His speed probably reduced by 50% it's pretty nasty. I can't remember the last time he actually took a slap shot (which he took plenty of before his surgery). Herniated discs come with life long issues and/or constraints. Surgery only removed bone chips impinging on the nerve.He went from being a 300 shots per season guy to around 220, that's a significant change in style of play and directly correlates to surgery.

Overall I'd say it's a combination of aging and trying to play out the contract with conservative measures on ice.

So move players around. Also, players do improve from one year to the next. Allowing them to actually play helps them improve.

And a 32 year old second line center will put them over the top?

Sure, but group 1 still isn't better than group 2 as you indicated.

Edited July 4, 2016 by kickazz

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Ye but I'd rather see Ott on the 4th line because toughness is something we desperately lack. Miller's job can be passed on to someone else in the lineup. The Helm signing was the worst of the off-season.

Ott is useless. Threw as many hits a game as Miller last year and is worse in every other aspect.

You can't possibly think he's the same player pre and post surgery. Watch some of his highlights from pre surgery in 2014 and then in the 2015 season. His speed probably reduced by 50% it's pretty nasty. I can't remember the last time he actually took a slap shot (which he took plenty of before his surgery). Herniated discs come with life long issues and/or constraints. Surgery only removed bone chips impinging on the nerve.He went from being a 300 shots per season guy to around 220, that's a significant change in style of play and directly correlates to surgery.

Overall I'd say it's a combination of aging and trying to play out the contract with conservative measures on ice.

Sure, but group 1 still isn't better than group 2 as you indicated.

If it's worse then not by much.

[Internet.Unknown 422]

In simple terms, it means that Tatar likes to shoot a lot and scores more often than Nyquist does. Nyquist is a better set up guy. It also means that Tatar does a better job of keeping the puck on the opposing teams net and a better job of keeping the puck away from our net.

Thanks for the translation!

[Dabura 12,207]

Miller isn't blocking anyone from a scoring line, Helm, Vanek, and Nielsen are.

Our fourth line could be a scoring line. There's no law against it. Pulkkinen-Sheahan-Jurco?

[kiwi wingnut 33]

Our fourth line could be a scoring line. There's no law against it. Pulkkinen-Sheahan-Jurco?

Well - there would be scoring. This much is true.

[Dabura 12,207]

Ye but I'd rather see Ott on the 4th line because toughness is something we desperately lack.

"Toughness" (whatever that is) is not something we desperately need. We didn't beat Anaheim in 2013 because we were "tougher" than them. Chicago didn't beat us in 2013 because they were "tougher" than us. Boston didn't beat us in 2014 because they were "tougher" than us. Tampa didn't beat us in 2015 because they were "tougher" than us. Tampa didn't beat us this year because they were "tougher" than us. Not a single one of these teams was "tougher" than us.

We can't score to save our playoff lives, mainly because we lack elite talent at the top of our lineup. That's the big problem we're facing. Neither Miller nor Ott is going to help that cause. Using a "gritty, defensive" fourth line is an outdated strategy. You win with skill and by scoring goals. We need more goals. We need more skill, talent.

[Dabura 12,207]

Well - there would be scoring. This much is true.

A line of Pulkkinen-Sheahan-Jurco would outperform a line that features the possession black holes that are Drew Miller and Luke Glendening. Ken Holland and Jeff Blashill and Mike Babcock would say, "Not good enough defensively." And therein lies the problem. This organization fetishizes defending, fetishizes playing without the puck, fetishizes a fundamentally flawed brand of hockey.

[kiwi wingnut 33]

A line of Pulkkinen-Sheahan-Jurco would outperform a line that features the possession black holes that are Drew Miller and Luke Glendening. Ken Holland and Jeff Blashill and Mike Babcock would say, "Not good enough defensively." And therein lies the problem. This organization fetishizes defending, fetishizes playing without the puck, fetishizes a fundamentally flawed brand of hockey.

You'd happily put that line out for a D-zone start at an away game, knowing the home team have last change?

[marcaractac 3,962]

A line of Pulkkinen-Sheahan-Jurco would outperform a line that features the possession black holes that are Drew Miller and Luke Glendening. Ken Holland and Jeff Blashill and Mike Babcock would say, "Not good enough defensively." And therein lies the problem. This organization fetishizes defending, fetishizes playing without the puck, fetishizes a fundamentally flawed brand of hockey.

Your answer to getting rid of black holes of possession on the roster is to play Pulkkinen? Really? When the puck touches his stick specifically, the other team is the next to have it.

[amato 3,210]

Free press:

"Going to camp, we expect Andreas Athanasiou, Anthony Mantha, Tomas Nosek, Tyler Bertuzzi some of those kids are going to make the team," general manager Ken Holland told the Free Press. "Were holding a spot or two for the kids if they can make it."

"We believe we have a good mix of veterans and kids. We wanted to see a push from beneath for jobs. They have to earn it."

http://www.freep.com/story/sports/nhl/red-wings/2016/07/02/detroit-red-wings-nhl-free-agency-pavel-datsyuk-void/86645370/

Edited July 5, 2016 by amato