Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

[e_prime 1,936]

You may value Backes PIMs as a negative I see them as a positive because it shows the guy cares and does it all.

...5 years at $6 million per season. Anybody that doesn't think that's too much for too long is crazy.

All 25 minutes of your "quality" PIMs or not... Backes is going to be a broken down shell of his former self by next season.

If not by mid-season.

Edited October 1, 2016 by e_prime

[brett 1,029]

trouba or bust

[chaps80 1,591]

trouba or bust

NM..Was posted earlier.

Edited October 2, 2016 by chaps80

[chaps80 1,591]

I do think next summer is when Howard gets moved as a 2 year contract should not be a hard sell if he doesn't decline anymore this year. E is not going anywhere unfortunately, unless he turns his game around, but if he does that I see Holland keeping him anyways.

If you don't think E can be moved, then why do you think Howard can be? Even for two years, that's a combined $10+ million for a HUGE question mark at the position you don't want questions at, especially bringing it in voluntarily. Then again, maybe he'll be able to turn his problems around this season with the time and the low pressure having a backup role allows, and teams will come calling. I think the likely scenario is he gets claimed in the expansion draft if anything though.

[chaps80 1,591]

Yes he will. He's no longer waiver eligible.

Wow, that really sucks. Didn't realize this. Damn Holland, you just HAD to give Jimmy an NTC, didn't you? Was there ever anything to that rumour Carolina wanted to start to move away from Cam Ward and were interested in Howard? Haven't been keeping up on things over the summer. How would waivers work with Jimmy? I've read multiple times that he can't be waived because of the NTC, but what if he's not cutting it and they want Coreau up? They must be able to waive him and send him to GR, no? Waiver rules have always confused me. haha

[krsmith17 7,191]

Yes, Howard could be sent down to Grand Rapids in favor of Coreau, but that would never happen. We would save money by doing so but assuming Howard went unclaimed, we'd still be on the hook for most of that contract. You can waive players with NTC's, you just can't with NMC's, and the only player on our roster with a NMC is Nielsen. Howard has a modified NTC, which he would have to give a list of 10 teams he would be willing to waive for, and I highly doubt Carolina would be on that list. Although I guess you never know. If he felt he had a good shot in taking the number one spot there, he might be willing to go there...

[LeftWinger 4,951]

bottom line, if they cannot move Howard and E by next season, buy them both out. Its the only way.

[krsmith17 7,191]

Both Howard and Ericsson CAN be traded, it just involves the will / want to make it happen. Unfortunately, I don't think Holland really wants to move either bad enough. Although Howard was "available" this summer, I'm not so sure Holland really wanted to move him. And I think he still believes Ericsson is a solid top 4 defenseman. I do think Howard will be moved after this season (if not before) and Coreau will be our backup next season (hopefully). But unfortunately I don't see Ericsson going anywhere. He will either finish that contract in Detroit or go on LTIR at some point over the next 4 seasons...

[e_prime 1,936]

While I don't disagree Lefty, I think buying out both is an unlikely move by Holland.

Especially when we're carrying Weiss' buyout cap number until 2021 and it's at it's most expensive cost NEXT YEAR.

krsmith's assessment of Holland's thinking of those two is pretty spot on.

I would love to think that one of either Howard or Ericsson would be picked up in the expansion draft, but as I'm not really sure of all the details on the rules of the expansion draft, that might be wishful thinking on my part.

[LeftWinger 4,951]

as we stand, they only have $6.7M available cap next season. Tatar will get Nyquist money, Smith will get at least $4M, not even counting Jurco, Pulkkinen or any other "kid" they bring up. Unless they dump Howard AND Ericsson they will have no room to do even have the same team they have now.

Buyout would have E at a cap hit of $1.6M, $1.3M, $1.3M, $1.3M, $1.3M, $1.3M and Howard at $1.8M, $2.3M, $1.5M, $1.5M.

Thats a lot of years to pay someone to not be here, but if neither are claimed and we cannot trade them, in order to be able to have a team and not waive ALL the kids without exemptions, this is the only choice.

Of course that's still counting Franzen's money, but it would be the most beneficial to rid ourselves of E and Howard. Nyquist would help too, but that would most likely involve cap coming back in trade, so that would wash.

We also have to make sure we hold some money for two years from now when Larkin is going to get every bit of at least $5M and Mrazek will get $6M....s*** man, I didn't even real all the contracts due up the next couple of years, Holland better hope his "kids" are the answer because with the god awful contracts he has given out, and will no doubt give again, he will have ZERO room for UFA upgrades the next couple of seasons. We already know he won't trade players away for upgrades, so that's out the window.

Edited October 2, 2016 by LeftWinger

[frankgrimes 1,836]

...5 years at $6 million per season. Anybody that doesn't think that's too much for too long is crazy.

All 25 minutes of your "quality" PIMs or not... Backes is going to be a broken down shell of his former self by next season.

If not by mid-season.

is it long yes? Guy will be 36 by then but Nielsen will be 38.

It's still funny because Boston needs to rebuild the defense big Z won't tower it forever.

[krsmith17 7,191]

Yeah, ideally Vegas would take Howard or Ericsson, but unfortunately I doubt they will. I see them taking a Sheahan or Helm (if not protected). If we could somehow manage to get Vegas to take one and trade the other (retaining $1-1.5M in salary), that would be huge for this team going forward...

[LeftWinger 4,951]

Ya, Trouba and Fowler will somehow get traded to Pitt or Chicago or Tampa and we'll be stuck with E, Nyquist, Howard, Helm and the rest of the average and broken players again....oh ya, and at the highest payroll in the league to boot! Holland is the best GM?

Funny fact, Detroit had two 3rd rounds picks for 2017 and traded one for Sadowy. The opted to trade their pick and keep Toronto's because they figured it would be a higher pick in the 3rd round. Guarantee, Toronto finishes higher than us, and even that idea backfires!

Face it guys, unless our kids get a shot and become above average to great players, we are in for some s***ty season's. Unless Holland has a fire sale at the deadline and just dumps all these stupid ass overpaid salaries for picks and then has room for UFA upgrades. If we are out of the playoffs, and I mean OUT, not battling for a spot around deadline, there better be a fire sale of these stupid contracts...Nyquist, Helm, Howard, Ericsson, I'd even offer disney.com up to Babcock for a pick...

[LeftWinger 4,951]

Speaking of Vegas, this is my protected list as our roster stands right now:

Nielsen (obviously)

Zetterberg (because he is the Captain, I honestly wouldn't waste it on him, but I know he will be protected)

Abby

Tatar

Sheahan

Mantha

AA

DD

XO

Marchy

Mrazek

...that's it. Some may argue Nyquist or Helm over Sheahan, I guess if Helm were protected (which Holland loves him so he probably will be) over Sheahan, no biggie, but I guess the bigger debate is Nyquist or Helm. NO WAY I leave either one of AA or Mantha unprotected. By knowing Holland's dumb ass this will be his list:

Nielsen

Z

Helm

Nyquist

Abby

Tatar

Glendening

DD

Kronwall

Ericsson

Mrazek

[krsmith17 7,191]

Leafs will finish higher than us this season? Not a chance. I'll take that bet any day...

Also, please stop lumping Nyquist in with the useless and / or overpaid players. He's neither and you're the only person that would suggest that he is. Just another player you're going to inexplicably hate on forever I guess...

[Andy Pred 48 337]

For all our worries going into the season on D my biggest fear is that Kronner may be done, and we will be in the mire on the back end if he is. Too many injuries lately and I fear they are catching up with him.

[kliq 3,755]

If you don't think E can be moved, then why do you think Howard can be? Even for two years, that's a combined $10+ million for a HUGE question mark at the position you don't want questions at, especially bringing it in voluntarily. Then again, maybe he'll be able to turn his problems around this season with the time and the low pressure having a backup role allows, and teams will come calling. I think the likely scenario is he gets claimed in the expansion draft if anything though.

I believe Howard is a much better goalie then E is a D-man in 2016, plus after this season Howard will have 2 years left on his contract opposed to E having 3 years left. If Howard shows this year that he is still a legit starting goalie, I could easily see a team taking a chance on him. Secondly, with Mrazek, we just don't need him, so if Howard has a great year, that increases his value. E on the other hand IMO is going to keep regressing and I cant see a team trading for a guy who by that time will likely be solidified as a third pairing guy with a 4mil+ cap hit for 3 years, it's just a completely different situation. Not to mention, if E proves me wrong and becomes a top pairing guy again which could happen, unlike Howard, Holland will keep him. E plays good we keep him, E plays bad we have to keep him. That's why I don't see E being moved.

Also, when I say I see him being moved, I do include the expansion draft in that statement. Las Vegas will need to hit the cap floor, and if they bring on a young goalie, they are going to want a vet to play along side him. Howard gives them cap for a short period of time, and I think he could really help a youngster.

[e_prime 1,936]

is it long yes? Guy will be 36 by then but Nielsen will be 38.

It's still funny because Boston needs to rebuild the defense big Z won't tower it forever.

...but Nielsen doesn't play the game that Backes still plays, despite being broken. So, Nielsen will probably still have some legs.

Chara is also ALREADY a former shell of himself. Lucky for Boston, he only has this year and next left on his contract.

Also, how many more days before this season starts... Lefty's starting to get salty.

He needs some games STAT.

Edited October 2, 2016 by e_prime

[kliq 3,755]

there better be a fire sale of these stupid contracts...Nyquist, Helm, Howard, Ericsson, I'd even offer disney.com up to Babcock for a pick...

Can you explain your hate for Nyquist? I really don't get it. They guy has been one of our best offensive players over the past 3 years, and he has a pretty small cap-hit for what he does. If he was getting 7 or 8 mil per year, then I would get it.

He had a down year last year, but its not like he was garbage or anything. Pretty much every fantasy magazine I have read this year have him as our leading scorer getting around 30 goals. Not bad for a 4.5 mil cap hit. Is it the Swedish thing?

[LeftWinger 4,951]

Leafs will finish higher than us this season? Not a chance. I'll take that bet any day...

Also, please stop lumping Nyquist in with the useless and / or overpaid players. He's neither and you're the only person that would suggest that he is. Just another player you're going to inexplicably hate on forever I guess...

I always lump Nyquist in there because Tatar is better than he is and of the two Nyquist should be traded to clear cap space. Tatar will get a very similar contract and we cannot have both of them making nearly $5M each. And yes he is just average, he is nowhere near above average or great. But most of the team is average at best, yet we have the highest payroll for average, broken and below average players. That is why Nielsen and Vanek will be among the leaders in scoring. Beyond those two and Larkin and Abby for what he brings to the table, we don't have much to chew on. AA and Mantha aren't going to see enough ice to even show what they really are. Here's what our lineup should be:

Tatar - Nielsen - Abby

Z - Larkin - Vanek

Nyquist - AA - Mantha

Jurco - Glenny - Sheahan

Frk

DD - Smith

XO - Green

Kronwall - Marchenko

Sproul

Mrazek

Coreau

[kickazz 5,459]

Can you explain your hate for Nyquist? I really don't get it. They guy has been one of our best offensive players over the past 3 years, and he has a pretty small cap-hit for what he does. If he was getting 7 or 8 mil per year, then I would get it.

He had a down year last year, but its not like he was garbage or anything. Pretty much every fantasy magazine I have read this year have him as our leading scorer getting around 30 goals. Not bad for a 4.5 mil cap hit. Is it the Swedish thing?

It's because he's Swedish.

[LeftWinger 4,951]

For all our worries going into the season on D my biggest fear is that Kronner may be done, and we will be in the mire on the back end if he is. Too many injuries lately and I fear they are catching up with him.

well at least with that, nothing a little LTIR won't fix...for him personally and us cap-wise.

[LeftWinger 4,951]

It's because he's Swedish.

Ya and that's why I hate Howard and Helm.

He's been an ok scorer, sure, but he is just average, as is most the team, yet we have the highest payroll in the NHL and his contract is part of that. I believe Abby is overpaid too, but he bring other aspects to the team that Nyquist doesn't. Gus isn't the only one overpaid, there are plenty, but when it comes to clearing space to improve the team, Nyquist is on that list to go in my opinion. Tatar, used properly, is better and of the two, he gets to stay. If they could cut other fat and afford to keep both PLUS upgrade our D? I'm all for it. I'd rather have Nyquist at $4.75 than Helm at $3.8M...how's that for being bias towards Swedes?

[kickazz 5,459]

Because you have a history of bs arguments against Swedes. That's why.

Ok scorer?? 28 goals, 27 goals and 17 goals in a year where entire teams scoring was down. Lmao at "ok scorer". When was the last time we had players score 28 and 27 goals two years in a row on our team?

And you do realize Tatar is about to get a fatter check than Nyquist is when his contract renews right?

And Abdekader isn't overpaid. This has been disproved in these forums time and again. Do we need to do it again?

Edited October 2, 2016 by kickazz

[LeftWinger 4,951]

I know Tatar is going to get paid, thus the reason to trim more fat! I already said, if they could trim it and keep both, that'd be Jim Dandy. But if one of those two are to be traded, I think Nyquist should go because Tatar is better.

Also, like I just said, I'd keep Nyquist and dump Helm in an instant.

It has nothing to do with being Swedish, I never had an issue with Lidstrom or Holmstrom, Samuelsson (the first time) or even Gustavsson in net. I have no issue with a healthy Kronwall. It just happens that three of my least favorite players on this team are Nyquist, Ericsson and Franzen. But, they aren't the only players I think we could dump and not miss a beat, Helm and Howard and sometimes Smith as well.

I have a history of arguments against Franzen, Nyquist and Ericsson along with Hudler, Helm, Ericsson, Howard, Smith, Cleary, KFQ and Kindl. Not just Swedes, not just Euro's...

Edited October 2, 2016 by LeftWinger