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WeBleedRed

Detroit trades Datsyuk to Arizona

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Well Arizona would have been with Svech or whatever his name is or AA too...both positions than wings are better at than at defense. This trades evaluation will depend on 2 things;

1. Can the Wings convince Stamkos to come here? Yes, the cap space is there but others can offer equal money and th ability to play with Eichel. This reminds me too much of the Suter Parise situation. Although I think Toronto would be the wrong choice for him.

2. Chychrun's development. A physical beast being compared to Scott Stevens falls into the Wings lap and they trade him. Did it ever occur to people that that is a reason, why the Coyotes where so eager to get this guy? The kid the Wings drafted is yet again undersized (wouldn't be a problem if this was a heavy team but it isn't), and known for questionable defensive abilities .. So I just hope Hakan saw something in him..because frankly most experts didn't.

A lot of people seem to think Stammer is a given which is far from the truth and if not him, then what? There is no other number 1 center available. Cap space is great if a team can use to get the best possible player otherwise use less. Back in the days I would've said oh great no bring in Stammer...but after getting passed over by Suter, Parise, Niskanen and with an unknown future Stammer to Detroit is far from a given...and I shudder at the thought of signing Eriksson, Vanek or anyone of that "caliber"

Did it ever occur to you that there is a reason about 10 other teams after the initial top picks passed on him as well?

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Did it ever occur to you that there is a reason about 10 other teams after the initial top picks passed on him as well?

Did it ever occur to people that some guy on a message board read 2 paragraphs of a scouting report and decided that this kid is the next Scott Stevens and therefore Holland screwed up yet again and now this franchise is doomed forevarz?!?!

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Must be from all that success they've had

Don't forget that their biggest issue is money. They did pretty well with what they got so far.

Whether they're right or wrong on Chychrun remains to be seen. It was a decision based on analytics and maybe other teams didn't look at him that way. It was also based on their need of defensive prospects. They have tons of offensive prospects but are thin on defense.

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Number 2 is a big assumption by you and many others, people are trying to create the definitive narrative that Detroit passed over Chychrun in order to make this trade, there is no guarantee that Detroit ever wanted him and if they picked at 16 they very well could have picked someone else just like the 15 teams before them. If you are Detroit, and you are not planning on drafting Chychrun due to his injury history, what better move to make then to trade the pick to a team that does want him, add a second, and get rid of Datsyuk's contract.

Now, is that what happened? Who knows, only a hand fill of people could answer that question. But my point is you cant say that trade cost us Chychrun as we have no clue who they would have drafted at 16 had they picked.

I'm not trying to create anything. Fact is, Chychrun was the consensus number 1 defenseman before having his shoulder surgery and by his standards a below average season. Detroit needed a defenseman he was there at 16 so it made too much sense. We might never know how high he was on the Wings list but I doubt that Cholowski kid has been above him, maybe I'm wrong.

I mean, if the Wings don't get Stamkos there are still 2 massive holes. Like I said I'd rather trade AA or Svech. The good thing is, we won't know untill next year at the earliest how good Chychrun can become because I don't think Chaika is going to rush him.

+1

I guess the Coyotes have the best scouting department according to Frank.

Nope, Wings are right there with Tampa, Chicago when it comes down to forwards.

Defense it's Nashville by far

Goaltending I guess the caps

Edited by frankgrimes

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there is no possible way Holland knows what is going to happen.

Yes, that's why he sucks as has to go. How is this hard to understand?

(I'm being facetious)

Nope, Wings are right there with Tampa, Chicago when it comes down to forwards.

I can't tell if you're serious. Who is our equivalent of Toews, Kane, and Hossa?

Edited by Z and D for the C

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I can't tell if you're serious. Who is our equivalent of Toews, Kane, and Hossa?

I think he is referring to our ability to draft forwards in the past. I wouldn't even put Chicago in the same category as us because Kane and Toews were both drafted high. Easy to hit on those players. I think we have been consistently the best at drafting forwards when you look at the past 20 years.

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I keep reading that Buffalo and Toronto are both serious contenders for Stamkos, as are the Islanders. Maybe I'm a little biased, but... what?? I'm sorry, but how can these franchises be compared to the Wings. Toronto, despite all the money and fame that goes with playing for the Leafs in Canada, hasn't been a serious contender for decades. I don't know its the pressure from the Toronto media, a bad string of coaches and GMs or simply bad luck, but why would commit to a team, long term, that hasn't done anything in most of our lifetimes. Buffalo is another I don't understand. The best team they've ever had was above average at best. That's not to say that they won't ever become great, they have a few good young guys that will most likely develop into stars, but if management is offering Stamkos $12 mil per year, what are the odds they'll be able to keep that core together? Meanwhile, here's the Wings potentially throwing big money his way, they have been the epitome of excellence these past 25 years. While winning championships, management and scouts have been able to rebuild, using low draft picks, another championship team. The Wings have a deep history of winning and greatness. Some of the greatest players to ever play the game have worn the Winged Wheel. The team, while not impressive at the end of the year, made great strides throughout the majority of the year with younger players like Larkin, Athanasiou, Mantha, DeKeyser and Mrazek. Holland basically needs to ask Stamkos this question, does he want to be the next Steve Yzerman or does he want to be the next Marcel Dionne. Again, I'm biased because I'm a (huge) Wings fan, but if its my life and I'm trying to make a decision on where I spend to spend the next 7-8 years of my life, I'm going with the organization that has proven it knows how to win and has made its great players into legendary ones.

So you are a big Wings fan? Well, don't forget that Stamkos grew up in the Toronto area cheering for the Leafs as a child so he felt the same way about the Leafs growing up and I fear they may offer a nostalgia factor that we can't match. Liken it to a hometown kid like Larkin choosing Toronto over Detroit... he might, but it seems unlikely knowing how cool it must be for him to play for the team he idolized just a few years ago. Like someone else said it reminds me a lot of the Parise/Suter who chose to go home as much as I hope I am wrong. I really want him to sign here as much as anyone else and whereas you are wondering why he wouldn't not sign here I am stuck wondering why he would.

It is hard to say what Stamkos wants on a personal level so at this point it is merely speculating. If it is only about money he will go to Buffalo for like 12 per and play with Eichel. Also is pretty close to home for him and is a good hockey city with a lot to be optimistic about. If its about nostalgia he will go home and play for Toronto with Mathews and be a part of bring success back to his hometown organization. I think most players are aware of the higher pressure that comes with playing in Toronto and especially when you're the hometown kid who signed there and are viewed as the "savior" for the organization. I think the additional pressure of playing Toronto is the ONLY chance the Wings could potentially have in being a true destination for him and I just hope his concern of the media pressure outweighs the nostalgia factor... Also that he saw what happened to Kessel lol

It wont be easy for him playing there. The clock will start ticking as soon as he signs and from there on out every bad game or turnover will be highly scrutinized until he brings a cup there and you know damn well he knows this too. The other angle is that if he does bring them a cup home he will be a hero there for the rest of his life and will be viewed as the guy who brought the cup back to Toronto after such a long wait. I envy the contract he will be receiving but I do not envy his decision as it is a difficult one. I just am not sure I see Detroit as much of a favorite here as much as you do but I do love your optimism! :)

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Seriously?

My sarcasm meter is broken.

EDIT - did a little search...Dylan's father is from Scarborough, Ont, and apparently came to Michigan to play college soccer...Dad was a Leafs fan, but not Dylan.

There's a picture of Dylan at the winter classic wearing leafs Apparel.

PA3uYFk.jpg

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I guess he was a Leaf a fan? Could have been a fan of both? Seems weird to wear a leafs hat as a red wings fan at a game against the leafs if he was a bigger red wings fan than leafs fan. Maybe his head was just cold =)

Pretty interesting to be honest, but my point was not to speculate which team lark was a bigger fan of lol.. assumed he was a wings fan.

Point was stamkos is a hometown kid and he was a leafs fan growing up so for that reason I just kind of feel like he will probably go there unfortunately. I think Okposo would still be sweet though and would be a nice addition to this team. He has a nasty wrister and he just battles his ass off around the net. Would be fun to have a player like that even if he isn't quite as electrifying as stammer is.

Edited by DangleDangleBeach

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Let's not forget that while Toronto has made significant changes, there's still no evidence they're headed in the right direction. Last year they just tanked, and Babs was playing guys he liked over guys with talent. Think of a team full of Glendening's. We can rave about all their prospects but they still haven't shown they know what to do with them. After all, under Babcock only two kids ever really thrived, Nyquist and Tatar, in ten years. If I'm a player I'm still leaning toward a team who has proven they know what to do to win (even though we've stumbled for a few years) over a team that's hasn't done anything right in 50 years and is now promising they will start doing the right things now.

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Let's not forget that while Toronto has made significant changes, there's still no evidence they're headed in the right direction. Last year they just tanked, and Babs was playing guys he liked over guys with talent. Think of a team full of Glendening's. We can rave about all their prospects but they still haven't shown they know what to do with them. After all, under Babcock only two kids ever really thrived, Nyquist and Tatar, in ten years. If I'm a player I'm still leaning toward a team who has proven they know what to do to win (even though we've stumbled for a few years) over a team that's hasn't done anything right in 50 years and is now promising they will start doing the right things now.

...which isn't true. Only thinking about recent years...DeKeyser improved a lot. Also Smith played an important role under Babcock...he either played terrible or didn't even crack the lineup ever since he left. The best example is Abdelkader. He was a typical bottom six player...it was Babcock who played him with Datsyuk and continued to do so even though he didn't do well at first. I always liked Abdelkader but he took a lot of heat from the fans...at times some didn't even want him in the lineup. He now is by far our best winger. He really does it all. If you ask me it's all thanks to Babcock who believed in him when nobody did.

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There is no way of knowing who the Wings would have taken.  They may have wanted Cholowski, knew they could probably get him a few picks later, so they were ok with that move.  Or they might ahve just not thought highly of Chychurn

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